First PH run ever. Thoughts?

[drejb]

Hey guys,

With the help of yates84 Woody and The_Old_Guy I put together a short but sweet beginner PH cycle.

Sup3r-1 Elite

220mg 6 weeks

Super-4 Elite

220mg 6 weeks

PCT

My buddy has some Nolva lying around so I'm going to run

20/20/10/10 stacked with alphamax XT

Still on the fence to dip into the PH game but when the time comes I'll most likely give this a go

 

[cubsfan815]

I like the addition of Alphamax XT to your PCT. It's a great product to help in the prolactin, cortisol, and estrogen area.

 

[drejb]

I like the addition of Alphamax XT to your PCT. It's a great product to help in the prolactin, cortisol, and estrogen area.

Yeah I love the stuff. I'm currently using it on an 8 week run right now on its own. I'm only looking to dip into the PH in the new year

 

[The_Old_Guy]

This differs a bit from what we talked about, but the other guys have more experience. Even as a first cycle, I'd go 330mg for the 1-Andro, I'd go 8 weeks, and I'd use Clomid if I only had to choose 1 SERM. There's a reason Doctors Off Label prescribe Clomid, and not Nolva, for low Testosterone symptoms. There's no need for a natty product when taking a SERM - you'll probably be above 1000ng/dl. If you want to take it for a reason unrelated to Testosterone, that's fine I guess - but I'd rather put the money toward another SERM (or Aromasin/Exemestane in the unlikely event you have an Estrogen problem from the DHEAs). You need to have both a SERM and an AI (for emergencies) on hand, before taking your first pill. My 2 Dinars anyway...

Of course, if money is the issue, disregard (except for the SERM and AI).

 

[drejb]

This differs a bit from what we talked about, but the other guys have more experience. Even as a first cycle, I'd go 330mg for the 1-Andro, I'd go 8 weeks, and I'd use Clomid if I only had to choose 1 SERM. There's a reason Doctors Off Label prescribe Clomid, and not Nolva, for low Testosterone symptoms. There's no need for a natty product when taking a SERM - you'll probably be above 1000ng/dl. If you want to take it for a reason unrelated to Testosterone, that's fine I guess - but I'd rather put the money toward another SERM (or Aromasin/Exemestane in the unlikely event you have an Estrogen problem from the DHEAs). You need to have both a SERM and an AI (for emergencies) on hand, before taking your first pill. My 2 Dinars anyway...

Of course, if money is the issue, disregard (except for the SERM and AI).

Good call. Better to be safe. I had gyno as a teen from puberty so I'm assuming my body is b!tch tit prone

 

[AnabolicGuru]

Good call. Better to be safe. I had gyno as a teen from puberty so I'm assuming my body is b!tch tit prone

Have exemestane or anastrozol on hand in case gyno flares up

 

[Volvo140G]

http://anabolicminds.com/forum/supplement-deals/286416-mid-october-savings.html#post5537687

OL Andros would be a great choice, plus they're 20% off (as well as support supps) at Nutriverse if you havent bought em yet

 

[gagandugan]

I would probably up the 1-Andro dose to 330 if possible, and Nolva is actually perfect for this. I used it on a similar cycle, worked like a charm. Don't want to start Nolva vs Clomid discussion here, they both work. Everything looks really good! Good luck man.

 

[Toren]

Good call. Better to be safe. I had gyno as a teen from puberty so I'm assuming my body is b!tch tit prone

Nolva is want you want for PCT and what you want to have for emergency on-cycle protection if gyno flares up! It's not even close how much better Nolva is at controling gyno when compared to Clomid. After a 6-8 week mild DHEA PH cycle, 4 weeks of legit Nolva should also have your Test levels above baseline, just as clomid should.

Also keep in mind, sometimes an AI is not enough to control on cycle gyno, especially in those that may be prone to it. This is where Nolva (or Raloxifene) will have you covered.

 

[The_Old_Guy]

In my defense, he mentioned Pubertal Gyno *after* I posted I agree - if you can only afford one SERM, and you had Gyno - use Nolva instead. I personally would deliver a few more pizzas, and save up for both Clomid and Nolva - I like over-killing everything.

 

[Woody]

If you can afford it, 330 mg of Andros will treat you better but 220 on your first run should still yield solid results.

Cycle looks good. You gonna log it?

 

[drejb]

Have exemestane or anastrozol on hand in case gyno flares up

Where can I purchase this? Do I have to find someone in my area that sells it?

 

[drejb]

If you can afford it, 330 mg of Andros will treat you better but 220 on your first run should still yield solid results.

Cycle looks good. You gonna log it?

Ahhhh maybe haven't decided yet.

 

[drejb]

Thanks for the advice fellas. Super helpful as always. Gonna run this for a bulk and come spring I'll prob hit my first pin with a test/var cycle in may. Right now my focus is to just get swole af

 

[The_Old_Guy]

Where can I purchase this? Do I have to find someone in my area that sells it?

Can't source on here, and unless I am blind, there aren't sponsors in this area any more either (am I blind guys?).

Google

 

[Alpha1a]

I ran the OL andros with great results bro but just to echo what everyone's said 330 big difference over 220. I ran 220 the first week but jumped up to 330 and even 440 the last couple days. Total cycle was 7 weeks. Alphamax xt was my pct as well with Sustain Alpha and nolva and I felt perfectly back to normal after a week. Have the AI on hand just to be on the safe side. And enjoy the ride, I went from 187-206 deffinitely had the "bulk" look going on and strength gains were great. I logged it on here somewhere if you'd like I can find it and post it here.

 

[drejb]

I've also been reading some scary stuff suggesting that Andros increase likeliness of prostate and pancreatic cancers. Does anyone know much about this? Have studies been done?

 

[The_Old_Guy]

I've also been reading some scary stuff suggesting that Andros increase likeliness of prostate and pancreatic cancers. Does anyone know much about this? Have studies been done?

Bah Humbug - if injectable T doesn't do it (and the properly conducted research in this area pretty much says it doesn't) - than some 2 step DHEAs for 8 weeks aren't going to do it. My opinion anyway. Eat a 1/4 cup of Walnuts every day if your worried

 

[Alpha1a]

Oh two more things forgot to add.
If I end up doing a 3rd andro run, I'd probably go 1 andro with epiandro and/or dermacrine as I feel they'd be better to have a lean gain cycle then the 4 andro I think that's what had me walking around "chubby-swole" lol and didn't fight the lethargy too much as I was falling asleep infront of customers half way through the day.
Number 2 make sure u split the doses, lethargy was at its worst when I tried dosing 2 caps am one cap pm

 

[Toren]

In my defense, he mentioned Pubertal Gyno *after* I posted I agree - if you can only afford one SERM, and you had Gyno - use Nolva instead. I personally would deliver a few more pizzas, and save up for both Clomid and Nolva - I like over-killing everything.

Speaking of pizza. I had an extra large pizza last night that was like a slice (or many slices) of heaven. Thin crust, spicy tomato sauce, extra cheese, pepperoni, green peppers, and mushroom. The homemade creamy garlic sauce was like nothing you could imagine.

BRB, I think I have one slice left in the fridge...

 

[mmorso]

Speaking of pizza. I had an extra large pizza last night that was like a slice (or many slices) of heaven. Thin crust, spicy tomato sauce, extra cheese, pepperoni, green peppers, and mushroom. The homemade creamy garlic sauce was like nothing you could imagine.

BRB, I think I have one slice left in the fridge...

Sorry to hijack the thread but Toren do you ever make your own pizza? I got some crazy recipes for ya if your interested.. I grew up in Chicago and have some real deal deep dish recipes along with some b1tchin Neapolitan recipes. Let me know and I'll pm them to ya.

 

[drejb]

Sorry to hijack the thread but Toren do you ever make your own pizza? I got some crazy recipes for ya if your interested.. I grew up in Chicago and have some real deal deep dish recipes along with some b1tchin Neapolitan recipes. Let me know and I'll pm them to ya.

Never have to apologize for pizza talk.

 

[mmorso]

Bah Humbug - if injectable T doesn't do it (and the properly conducted research in this area pretty much says it doesn't) - than some 2 step DHEAs for 8 weeks aren't going to do it. My opinion anyway. Eat a 1/4 cup of Walnuts every day if your worried

I think The_Old_Guy has a good point and you should just run a test only cycle.. I didn't know that test had no impact on the prostate.. I actually thought the opposite

 

[drejb]

I think The_Old_Guy has a good point and you should just run a test only cycle.. I didn't know that test had no impact on the prostate.. I actually thought the opposite

8 weeks 2cc a week test E it is!

 

[mmorso]

8 weeks 2cc a week test E it is!

Run 500mg of test e for 12 wks if your going that route... hopefully more experienced guys can chime in to help layout your cycle with supports and PCT.. good luck bro!!

 

[drejb]

Run 500mg of test e for 12 wks if your going that route... hopefully more experienced guys can chime in to help layout your cycle with supports and PCT.. good luck bro!!

Thanks man. I'm all over the place right now. Just happy I'm learning as much as I can! I have about 5 months to make a decision so research every day.

Cheers!

 

[Alpha1a]

Yeah 12 weeks for sure I'm at week 4 and haven't seen the full potential yet

 

[mmorso]

Yeah 12 weeks for sure I'm at week 4 and haven't seen the full potential yet

Alpha that's cuz your a manic and run on c@ck diesel anyway..

Lol "haven't seen the full potential.."

 

[drejb]

Alpha that's cuz your a manic and run on c@ck diesel anyway..

Lol "haven't seen the full potential.."

Where do I pick up some c@ck diesel, sounds potent af

 

[mmorso]

Thanks man. I'm all over the place right now. Just happy I'm learning as much as I can! I have about 5 months to make a decision so research every day.

Cheers!

I haven't run test yet and have been doing extensive research on it and have concluded that it is the healthiest option.. I gotta wait 6 months to run a cycle cuz I did a 16wk PH/SARM bridge and wish I wasn't scared of running steroids before I started my last cycle, cuz i woulda gotten better gainz, it would have been a sh1t load cheaper, and better on my liver..

Anyway, search the forum and ask as many questions as possible to some of the experienced guys... there are some solid solid people on here that will hook you up with a lot of knowledge.

 

[unreal89]

2 serms for andros very bad advice just more sides... Choose 1 or the other drop the test booster and have exem on hand incase of rebound highly unlikely but better safe then sorry

 

[unreal89]

And test is the safest for liver and your body naturally produces it so... You get my logic right its a natural occuring hormone .

 

[drejb]

And test is the safest for liver and your body naturally produces it so... You get my logic right its a natural occuring hormone .

What kind of results will 8-12 weeks of 500mg test yield? This question is for anyone with experience

 

[unreal89]

That all depends on your diet and how much surplus calories you put in your looking at up to 8 lb lean muscle gain after water weight.

 

[unreal89]

Im midway throigh pct and still up 15 lbs minimal fat gain if that helps diet was not in check was broke so you know

 

[drejb]

Im midway throigh pct and still up 15 lbs minimal fat gain if that helps diet was not in check was broke so you know

Awesome. Curious to see how I'll do. Diets been perfect for months, I track all meals and calories daily at about a 400-500 surplus 45-30-25

Gonna probably run it in march and look jacked up for summer

 

[unreal89]

You would love it so much more than andros and much safer.

 

[The_Old_Guy]

I think The_Old_Guy has a good point and you should just run a test only cycle.. I didn't know that test had no impact on the prostate.. I actually thought the opposite

Huh? I meant 8 weeks of 2 step DHEAs won't give you cancer. I didn't say Test won't affect the Prostate - I said there's no causal relationship to cancer and 'sane' (or even insane) amounts of real AAS. I don't know Jack Sh*t about injectable anything.

 

[The_Old_Guy]

2 serms for andros very bad advice just more sides... Choose 1 or the other drop the test booster and have exem on hand incase of rebound highly unlikely but better safe then sorry

Some doctors disagree. Never had sides from 1, let alone 2 SERMs (other than 'Hot Flashes'), but N=1 YMMV. Nolva is better at guarding against breast tissue related issues, Clomid is better at getting T production maxed out as high and as fast as possible (which is why it can be prescribed by MDs Off Label for Hypogonadism). Overkill for Andros? Probably. But I like overkill. I guess if someone followed some of those crazy protocols that have people taking 100mg of C and 50mg of N... but I'm talking something like 25mg C and 10mg N for 6 to 8 weeks. Anyway, Big Boy Rules, Due Diligence, and all that

 

[unreal89]

Then u might as well just run nolva and clomid for 8 weekz would be better than a cycle imo..

 

[The_Old_Guy]

Then u might as well just run nolva and clomid for 8 weekz would be better than a cycle imo..

I don't know - you think? Highest I've seen (in others bloodwork) was in the 1300's. Not exactly in the usual Super Physiologic range for Testosterone gains I wouldn't think. And with something like the conversion to 1-Test that 1-Andro confers and it's high Anobolic vs Androgenic characteristic - I think that is better than just a 1300 Test level? I don't know, this is getting out of my knowledge level now

 

[unreal89]

I know that running andros and restarting yourself with 2 serms is a waste and asking for more sides. I dont care how strong.andros are its all trash to me

 

[The_Old_Guy]

I know that running andros and restarting yourself with 2 serms is a waste and asking for more sides. I dont care how strong.andros are its all trash to me

Fair enough :thumbsup:

 

[unreal89]

Fair enough :thumbsup:

Not being a dick but come on common sense more is not always better.

 

[The_Old_Guy]

Not being a dick but come on common sense more is not always better.

I didn't think you were being a dick. I think Scally recco'd 2 SERMs and I know Blergs and StanleyG do too. There's some good reasoning on the reddit PCT page that makes sense to me as well. I don't get sides from SERMs, so I do it. I agree it may not (or probably not) be needed for 2 Step DHEA compounds, but I go by "If it definitely doesn't hurt, and may help..." - and for me, that is the case.

 

[unreal89]

I agree but others are diff so i wouldnt recommend 2 substances they have never had. Anyways rant over my drunk asz needs sleep

 

[Toren]

Sorry to hijack the thread but Toren do you ever make your own pizza? I got some crazy recipes for ya if your interested.. I grew up in Chicago and have some real deal deep dish recipes along with some b1tchin Neapolitan recipes. Let me know and I'll pm them to ya.

That's a very generous offer! Fire away with a PM when ever you have the time. I used to make my own pizzas but to be honest, I haven't in quite a while. The convenience of picking up a fresh walk-in is too good sometimes. Having said that, I'd love to start making my own pizzas again. Food always tastes better when you make it yourself.

I will however continue to sneek over to my ex-gf's mother's house to pick-up her homemade creamy garlic sauce (without my ex's knowledge). That makes me feel oh soo good!

 

[mmorso]

That's a very generous offer! Fire away with a PM when ever you have the time. I used to make my own pizzas but to be honest, I haven't in quite a while. The convenience of picking up a fresh walk-in is too good sometimes. Having said that, I'd love to start making my own pizzas again. Food always tastes better when you make it yourself.

I will however continue to sneek over to my ex-gf's mother's house to pick-up her homemade creamy garlic sauce (without my ex's knowledge). That makes me feel oh soo good!

lol.. I keep reading you talk about pizza so figured you might appreciate some good Chicago style pie.. I'll send ya the recipes in a lil.

 

[yates84]

That's a very generous offer! Fire away with a PM when ever you have the time. I used to make my own pizzas but to be honest, I haven't in quite a while. The convenience of picking up a fresh walk-in is too good sometimes. Having said that, I'd love to start making my own pizzas again. Food always tastes better when you make it yourself.

I will however continue to sneek over to my ex-gf's mother's house to pick-up her homemade creamy garlic sauce (without my ex's knowledge). That makes me feel oh soo good!

Is that a euphemism for something? Lol

 

[Toren]

Is that a euphemism for something? Lol

Lol. Not gong to lie, the thought crossed my mind once or 50 times. If only I could manage some sort of lay-down, I mean sit-down, with the three of us. There's no reason we all can't be 'friends'.