Long Term Clomid Use

[InItForGainz]

We all know that Clomid is usually the number one Go-To SERM for PCT with the popular 50/50/25/25, but is there any research regarding long term use?
In short Clomid works to both block Estrogen Receptors and to increase testosterone production through the LH pathway. Considering the "possible" side effects of HRT/TRT wouldn't a regular dose of Clomid be a safer option for men with naturally low testosterone?

 

[dave39]

There are trt patients who are currently using clomid only daily to increase their test levels. There is some concern around long term sides and blurred vision but everyone is different.
Are you thinking about using it long term?

 

[InItForGainz]

There are trt patients who are currently using clomid only daily to increase their test levels. There is some concern around long term sides and blurred vision but everyone is different.
Are you thinking about using it long term?

I've heard of some users experiencing vision issues, although it does seem to be rare and during overkill or true AAS PCT dosages. I was just thinking of a small daily dose for another month after my PCT, a little something like this...
50/50/25/25 and then 12.5/12.5/12.5/12.5

 

[dave39]

I've heard of some users experiencing vision issues, although it does seem to be rare and during overkill or true AAS PCT dosages. I was just thinking of a small daily dose for another month after my PCT, a little something like this...
50/50/25/25 and then 12.5/12.5/12.5/12.5

I think it would be a good experiment for sure. I'd be curious to hear about blood work results. Without bloods you really won't know if it's doing anything for you though. Do you have low T ?

 

[YoungBodyBuil]

There are many studies on its safety and efficacy for up to 6 months of use at 25mg eod. So 12.5mg for 6 months would give a great boost and TBH probably no sides, it's very safe when not megadosed and it's very well researched, women go on CLOMID for months at times, dr.scally has talked about this aswell

 

[InItForGainz]

I think it would be a good experiment for sure. I'd be curious to hear about blood work results. Without bloods you really won't know if it's doing anything for you though. Do you have low T ?

Was diagnosed with "Less than desirable" but "Not low enough to warrant exogenous treatment" levels when I was 20. They only tested my overall, which came back at an average of 170-200 ng/dl. Which is why I've turned to Prohormones.

 

[YoungBodyBuil]

Was diagnosed with "Less than desirable" but "Not low enough to warrant exogenous treatment" levels when I was 20. They only tested my overall, which came back at an average of 170-200 ng/dl. Which is why I've turned to Prohormones.

How are pro hormones the go to when you have low t????

 

[InItForGainz]

How are pro hormones the go to when you have low t????

I've tried everything else that's worth trying, and to no avail. I have this vision of the physique and life that I want and I work my ass off trying to achieve it. Prohormones are legal and they work. They're not going to solve my problem but they're hopefully going to help me progress.

 

[YoungBodyBuil]

I've tried everything else that's worth trying, and to no avail. I have this vision of the physique and life that I want and I work my ass off trying to achieve it. Prohormones are legal and they work.

Had you just used clomid 50/50/25/25 bought from an over seas pharmacy you could've EASILY solved your Low T problem so you clearly didnt try "everything else"

 

[InItForGainz]

Had you just used clomid 50/50/25/25 bought from an over seas pharmacy you could've EASILY solved your Low T problem so you clearly didnt try "everything else"

Admittedly yes, I only learned about Clomid whilst researching about prohormones. I know it can kickstart testosterone production after a cycle but not if it could be used over a longer period of time to help with low T levels, which is why I'm asking.

 

[YoungBodyBuil]

Admittedly yes, I only learned about Clomid whilst researching about prohormones. I know it can kickstart testosterone production after a cycle but not if it could be used over a longer period of time to help with low T levels, which is why I'm asking.

You don't need to use it over time.. If you do a 4-6 week cycle of clomid and attempt what's called a "Restart" You could sk rocket your t- levels and manage to get them to stay high after the clomid cessation, as that's why fertility doctors give it to men with Low T before going on TRT. If you're one of the many that get their levels to stick then boom your low T is fixed. If not then that's when they put you on TRT.

Here's what i'd do if you want to ive long and have your T levels stay high for good-
Clomid
50/25/25/25/25/25 (6 weeks)
Nolva
40/20/20/10/10/10
Exemestane STARTING WEEK 4 OF CLOMID AND NOLVA-
12.5mg eod or 25mg e3d extend exemestane 2 weeks past SERMs-

That's a restart protocol. Now after the 6 weeks of SERMs/ exemestane(remember use exemestane 2 weeks past SERM cessation to prevent rebound estro problems)
From there on out i'd cycle natty test boosters 1 month on 1 month off for life.

Should get that t very high and keep it there for good well making your testicles healthier.

It is a very well known restart program and has brought back HPTA function to body builders on gear for years and just average men who were on TRT and can easily come back.

Im surprised you did so much "research" and didn't come across this. I believe you went more towards the "Gains" research rather than "Health" research. However if you'd like more gains you can do a prohormone cycle then use this protocol and should be able to recover. If you're younger (like myself as im 24) it's much easier for us to recover than older men. So until im 30 going to do 2-3 cycles per year with proper PCT. Then once im 30 stop cycling for good and do one final restart program then cycle test boosters for life to keep my hormones optimal.

 

[dave39]

Was diagnosed with "Less than desirable" but "Not low enough to warrant exogenous treatment" levels when I was 20. They only tested my overall, which came back at an average of 170-200 ng/dl. Which is why I've turned to Prohormones.

I would do some research for Doctors in your area (or anti aging clinics) and find a doctor who will work with you.
Do you have low T symptoms?

 

[InItForGainz]

You don't need to use it over time.. If you do a 4-6 week cycle of clomid and attempt what's called a "Restart" You could sk rocket your t- levels and manage to get them to stay high after the clomid cessation, as that's why fertility doctors give it to men with Low T before going on TRT. If you're one of the many that get their levels to stick then boom your low T is fixed. If not then that's when they put you on TRT.

Here's what i'd do if you want to ive long and have your T levels stay high for good-
Clomid
50/25/25/25/25/25 (6 weeks)
Nolva
40/20/20/10/10/10
Exemestane STARTING WEEK 4 OF CLOMID AND NOLVA-
12.5mg eod or 25mg e3d extend exemestane 2 weeks past SERMs-

That's a restart protocol. Now after the 6 weeks of SERMs/ exemestane(remember use exemestane 2 weeks past SERM cessation to prevent rebound estro problems)
From there on out i'd cycle natty test boosters 1 month on 1 month off for life.

Should get that t very high and keep it there for good well making your testicles healthier.

It is a very well known restart program and has brought back HPTA function to body builders on gear for years and just average men who were on TRT and can easily come back.

Im surprised you did so much "research" and didn't come across this. I believe you went more towards the "Gains" research rather than "Health" research. However if you'd like more gains you can do a prohormone cycle then use this protocol and should be able to recover. If you're younger (like myself as im 24) it's much easier for us to recover than older men. So until im 30 going to do 2-3 cycles per year with proper PCT. Then once im 30 stop cycling for good and do one final restart program then cycle test boosters for life to keep my hormones optimal.

That's the help and advice I was looking for.
Thank you SO much! Like genuinely Thank You

 

[InItForGainz]

I would do some research for Doctors in your area (or anti aging clinics) and find a doctor who will work with you.
Do you have low T symptoms?

Yup,
No libido, don't even have the erge to go and find a girl.
Lethargy, really bad.
Embarrassingly infrequent and non substantial erections.
General low mood and fatigue.

The doctors agreed I had Low T, and the tests reflected this. Just wasn't considered low enough over here in the U.K to warrant treating.

 

[dave39]

Some supporting info for long term use http://shiramillermd.com/learning-center/ed--testosterone--hypogonadism--and-clomid-in-men/clomiphene-citrate-is-safe-and-effective-for-long-term-management-of-hypogonadism..html

 

[dave39]

Yup,
No libido, don't even have the erge to go and find a girl.
Lethargy, really bad.
Embarrassingly infrequent and non substantial erections.
General low mood and fatigue.

The doctors agreed I had Low T, and the tests reflected this. Just wasn't considered low enough over here in the U.K to warrant treating.

That's no way to live man. Good luck with the restart protocol. If it doesn't work than definitely consider the long term use. Lots of people have success increasing test levels while on clomid but their levels typically drop when they stop taking it.

 

[YoungBodyBuil]

That's no way to live man. Good luck with the restart protocol. If it doesn't work than definitely consider the long term use. Lots of people have success increasing test levels while on clomid but their levels typically drop when they stop taking it.

While this is true because they work so well... The level they end up dropping to are substantially higher prior to use.

 

[YoungBodyBuil]

Also people only do 4 week pct... If I'm doing an 8 week cycle so basically 8 weeks of shutting myself down.... You can be damn sure I'm doing 8 weeks to recover myself. Then 16 weeks off till my next cycle. Now, if you're doing this restart, then sleep enough, eat good, and take antioxidants daily, your test should be able to easily stay between 5-800. I know many people who've done 16 week cycles and recover fine from restart programs, your body has an amazing ability to repair itself if you give it the right tools... But using pro hormones in place of your natural testosterone is not a way to live or be healthy. Also, cycling natural test boosters after the SERM cessation will help solidify those numbers. Many people say f-UCK it and hop on TRT but there are other much healthier/long term options.

 

[Vikingbro]

Subbed for info

 

[InItForGainz]

Also people only do 4 week pct... If I'm doing an 8 week cycle so basically 8 weeks of shutting myself down.... You can be damn sure I'm doing 8 weeks to recover myself. Then 16 weeks off till my next cycle. Now, if you're doing this restart, then sleep enough, eat good, and take antioxidants daily, your test should be able to easily stay between 5-800. I know many people who've done 16 week cycles and recover fine from restart programs, your body has an amazing ability to repair itself if you give it the right tools... But using pro hormones in place of your natural testosterone is not a way to live or be healthy. Also, cycling natural test boosters after the SERM cessation will help solidify those numbers. Many people say f-UCK it and hop on TRT but there are other much healthier/long term options.

My diet and supplementation are pretty good anyway. I'm healthy in all other aspects, don't drink, don't smoke etc. The prohormones were to help with some extra gains and it's the best I've felt in, well, I can't even remember how long it's been.
My original PCT was going to be 8 weeks anyway, I just wanted to know if I could carry on the Clomid for longer than the four week 50/50/25/25 protocol. And now I know

 

[dave39]

Also people only do 4 week pct... If I'm doing an 8 week cycle so basically 8 weeks of shutting myself down.... You can be damn sure I'm doing 8 weeks to recover myself.

Although I don't disagree with what you're saying here man, I would let blood work do the talking. There may be no harm in extending PCT but there may also be no benefit, depending on the individual.

 

[YoungBodyBuil]

Although I don't disagree with what you're saying here man, I would let blood work do the talking. There may be no harm in extending PCT but there may also be no benefit, depending on the individual.

Exactly, depending on the individual, he has naturally low t according to blood work he said, that's why I recommended a longer pct.

 

[619sss]

Can someone be dependent on clomid to raise test? Long term?

 

[InItForGainz]

Can someone be dependent on clomid to raise test? Long term?

Supposedly not with YoungBodyBuil 's Restart protocol outlined above.

 

[YoungBodyBuil]

Supposedly not with YoungBodyBuil 's Restart protocol outlined above.

Not true, I said in a previous post its an option you should take before going on TRT because if you're one of the many people who successfully restart you're fine but if you go right back to wherever you were prior to treatment you can either try again, do long term CLOMID or TRT

 

[Joe12]

I would do some research for Doctors in your area (or anti aging clinics) and find a doctor who will work with you.
Do you have low T symptoms?

I would agree with this. If your doc already knows your situation, he would probably provide you an RX, take blood, and monitor you. I would recommend letting him/her know you were taking PH. If you cycle, and tank your T levels, it will just confuse your doc if they don't know what else you are taking.

 

[InItForGainz]

I would agree with this. If your doc already knows your situation, he would probably provide you an RX, take blood, and monitor you. I would recommend letting him/her know you were taking PH. If you cycle, and tank your T levels, it will just confuse your doc if they don't know what else you are taking.

He didn't provide me with anything. It was two rounds of three months worth of tests, examinations and appointments and once I got the result that was it. He said himself "Not low enough to warrent treatment"

 

[619sss]

He didn't provide me with anything. It was two rounds of three months worth of tests, examinations and appointments and once I got the result that was it. He said himself "Not low enough to warrent treatment"

When I went to 2 doctors when I had my test at 350 when I took some steroids, both didn't let me take anything, I said to them if I took HCG I will recover well, they said wait 1 year, after 4 months it went to 410ish. They said we can't let you take hormones or serms. I'm not sure if they lack knowledge on pct or they care about our livers and kidneys?

 

[619sss]

Used clomid test from 400 to 1268 in 5 days of 50mg daily

 

[JP11]

I was diagnosed with low T. And my doctor prescribed 50mg daily. I experienced a honeymoon phase for about 10 days, my libido was amazing and I was feeling great. I completely lost my libido during my second week on clomid, had really bad mod swings and terrible headaches. I spoke to my doctor and he suggested to drop to 25mg a day. I started feeling better and my libido is back (not 100%). I've been doing some research and a lot of people have experienced great results on 25mg EOD or even 12.5mg EOD as a long term option. Does anyone think 25mg daily is too much? Should I drop to 25mg EOD?

 

[bighulksmash]

I think your testosterone level went up fast . How long you been on it ? Any bloodwork on t to e ratio?

 

[Joe12]

He didn't provide me with anything. It was two rounds of three months worth of tests, examinations and appointments and once I got the result that was it. He said himself "Not low enough to warrent treatment"

Just my personal thoughts, take it with a grain of salt. I would be cautious of long term experimentation with a peptide/SERM. While there are many knowledgeable people and reps on this form, none of them are your doctor. If your doc says your not low enough, id roll with his advice, and maybe just use a natty test boosters. If you are experiencing low t sides, and he wont provide an RX, you could always go to another doc.

 

[InItForGainz]

Just my personal thoughts, take it with a grain of salt. I would be cautious of long term experimentation with a peptide/SERM. While there are many knowledgeable people and reps on this form, none of them are your doctor. If your doc says your not low enough, id roll with his advice, and maybe just use a natty test boosters. If you are experiencing low t sides, and he wont provide an RX, you could always go to another doc.

You get assigned to a GP over here in the U.K. It was always the same Endocrinologist when I went for appoinments too. A healthy range is between 300ng/dl-1400ng/dl, mine was 170-200ng/dl at 22 years old.

 

[Joe12]

You get assigned to a GP over here in the U.K. It was always the same Endocrinologist when I went for appoinments too. A healthy range is between 300ng/dl-1400ng/dl, mine was 170-200ng/dl at 22 years old.

Dang, that is low. Sorry man, I can understand why you are looking for alternatives.

 

[YoungBodyBuil]

Dang, that is low. Sorry man, I can understand why you are looking for alternatives.

Any doctor that doesn't see 170ng/dl as DISGUSTING for a 22 year old man should be executed. Hands down. That is NO way to live. That's why I gave him the comprehensive restart protocol, and if he does it right he can get his test to stick between 500-900 and just keep cycling natty t booster as you come off the SERM's, we may not be doctors but we know a lot about endocrinology as we f-uck with out own 24/7. Sometimes you need to take things into your own hands in life, especially when people are too "Busy to help"

 

[Joe12]

Execution might be a little overkill, lol.
I understand where you are coming from, I was shocked to see his test at 170 at his age, and to see the doc turn him away. I have seen guys hovering around 300s get an rx from their docs.

 

[JP11]

I have been taking it for almost a month. I only had bloodwork done before I started on clomid:

LH - 2.7
Estradiol - 9.44
Test - 248

 

[YoungBodyBuil]

I have been taking it for almost a month. I only had bloodwork done before I started on clomid:

LH - 2.7
Estradiol - 9.44
Test - 248

Get blood work after clomid, guarantee it'll be between 800-1300 with a month on. Now the reason why we taper and i recommend 6 week clomid cycles over 4 week is you're getting your body used to those high test levels so it can hopefully maintain them. Also starting week 4 i recommend the AI and extend 2 weeks past as when you come off the SERM your estrogen will be high if you dont use an AI and high estro will drive test down. So if you use the AI clear up estrogen from the SERM further elevating test you'll have low E allowing for better recovery and allowing T to stay high. There's a lot of hope and safer options than TRT just need to do it right and get blood work privately to see where you're at.

 

[InItForGainz]

Get blood work after clomid, guarantee it'll be between 800-1300 with a month on. Now the reason why we taper and i recommend 6 week clomid cycles over 4 week is you're getting your body used to those high test levels so it can hopefully maintain them. Also starting week 4 i recommend the AI and extend 2 weeks past as when you come off the SERM your estrogen will be high if you dont use an AI and high estro will drive test down. So if you use the AI clear up estrogen from the SERM further elevating test you'll have low E allowing for better recovery and allowing T to stay high. There's a lot of hope and safer options than TRT just need to do it right and get blood work privately to see where you're at.

Got any AI preferences or recommendations?

 

[YoungBodyBuil]

Got any AI preferences or recommendations?

Aromasin hands down, very safe when used right. Start week 4 of a 6 week clomid cycle. it's suicidal AI so rebound estrogen is not to worry.

 

[GreekTheBrick]

Start low with pharma exemestane, its quite strong. 6.25mg ED dropped E2 to 12 which made me kinda tired. Now Im at 6.25mg EOD

 

[Spurfy]

We all know that Clomid is usually the number one Go-To SERM for PCT with the popular 50/50/25/25, but is there any research regarding long term use?
In short Clomid works to both block Estrogen Receptors and to increase testosterone production through the LH pathway. Considering the "possible" side effects of HRT/TRT wouldn't a regular dose of Clomid be a safer option for men with naturally low testosterone?

Yes, but at much, much lower doses and it must be run with an aromatase inhibitor, preferably exemestane (Aromasin).

12.5 mg EOD or E3D along with 12.5-25 mg of exemestane EOD or E3D works very, very well. I have seen this combination take T levels from the 200 range to the 900 range in only a few weeks.

You could also just run exemestane, but with very low T levels you're probably going to also have very low E2, and adding an aromatase inhibitor will only make things worse. Research suggests that the mood-boosting effects of testosterone are estrogen dependent, and that low T guys feel awful because of low E2. Exemestane monotherapy is good for guys with low-normal T levels who want to get into the high-normal range.

 

[InItForGainz]

Aromasin hands down, very safe when used right. Start week 4 of a 6 week clomid cycle. it's suicidal AI so rebound estrogen is not to worry.

Start low with pharma exemestane, its quite strong. 6.25mg ED dropped E2 to 12 which made me kinda tired. Now Im at 6.25mg EOD

Yes, but at much, much lower doses and it must be run with an aromatase inhibitor, preferably exemestane (Aromasin).

12.5 mg EOD or E3D along with 12.5-25 mg of exemestane EOD or E3D works very, very well. I have seen this combination take T levels from the 200 range to the 900 range in only a few weeks.

You could also just run exemestane, but with very low T levels you're probably going to also have very low E2, and adding an aromatase inhibitor will only make things worse. Research suggests that the mood-boosting effects of testosterone are estrogen dependent, and that low T guys feel awful because of low E2. Exemestane monotherapy is good for guys with low-normal T levels who want to get into the high-normal range.

Would Formestane work just as well, seeing as that too is a suicidal aromatase inhibitor?

 

[bighulksmash]

Would Formestane work just as well, seeing as that too is a suicidal aromatase inhibitor?

.....

 

[YoungBodyBuil]

Would Formestane work just as well, seeing as that too is a suicidal aromatase inhibitor?

Formestane is suppressive never use something suppressive in PCT unless you like Peanuts and an erection that looks like the foam noodles kids play with in pools.

 

[Spurfy]

Would Formestane work just as well, seeing as that too is a suicidal aromatase inhibitor?

Probably, although I'll freely admit I haven't studied it to the degree that I have exemestane. Nevertheless, on paper, they should be quite similar.

 

[Spurfy]

Formestane is suppressive never use something suppressive in PCT unless you like Peanuts and an erection that looks like the foam noodles kids play with in pools.

How is formestane suppressive? Please cite sources -- published studies, not opinions.

 

[YoungBodyBuil]

Probably, although I'll freely admit I haven't studied it to the degree that I have exemestane. Nevertheless, on paper, they should be quite similar.

Formestane can convert to androgenic hormones in the body, hence why it used to be cycled solo. Anything that can be suppressive AT ALL i would not put anywhere near my PCT. Stick with the tried and true methods.

 

[Spurfy]

Formestane can convert to androgenic hormones in the body, hence why it used to be cycled solo. Anything that can be suppressive AT ALL i would not put anywhere near my PCT. Stick with the tried and true methods.

This makes no sense at all. None. Zero.

 

[YoungBodyBuil]

How is formestane suppressive? Please cite sources -- published studies, not opinions.

Formestane(4-Hyroxyandrostenedione) is a steroial aromatase inhibitor and a prohormone to the anabolic steroid 4-Hydroxytestosterone. It is not only effective for estrogen reduction, it is also a mild anabolic steroid. It was first patented by G.D. Searle & Co. in 1955, but it never hit the commercial market. Structurally, 4-Hydroxytestosterone is simply testosterone with a hydroxy group at the four position, making it most similar to the steroid clostebol, which has a chloro group at the four position. Formestane and Clostebol(and Halodrol/Promagnon) are very similar in effect.

4-Hydroxytestosterone is .65 times as anabolic and .25 times as androgenic as testosterone propionate. The reason that Formestane has such low androgenic activity is that the modification at the 4th position prevents DHT conversion. In vitro, 4-Hydroxytestosterone is actually a weak inhibitor of 5-alpha reductase.