6 weeks to lean... what would you choose?

booneman77

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6 weeks... cant decide what I want to research from the stash...(for anyone who doesn't know, ive researched plenty of cycles so we can skip this portion ha)

Goal - max leanness. strength and adding mass (maintaining is important) are far secondary.

Current best estimate stats (havent been home in a week and a half so best guess):
Wt - 180lb
Bf - 11%
Training 6 days a week (PPL/PHAT style - my own design)
Currently losing about 1/2lb max per week at 1700-1800cals/day

so here's the stash (i actaully think theres a few other things but since im not home I forgot ha), what would you choose (stacking welcome)?:
Epi
DMZ
Msten
Halo
Dimethadrol
Sparta Lean (11/7dhea)

Dermacrine
Transform

Also, feel free to suggest something else that might go really well with something above... Not looking to buy something new, but for the perfect stack... things could change. Just don't suggest a completely new setup to buy ha.

Dma378 yates84 Jebrook MrKleen73 Toren smith_69 DreamWeaver and you know, everyone else I forgot that knows their shiit. feel free to tag more to annoy them.
 
Joedoubledose

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Epi trenavar( go buy some boone) Sparta lean and dermacrine . Boom shred city, oh and stack with Justin bieber tears
 
Woody

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Awwh damn I forgot about Tren. Yeah add that too
 
booneman77

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Epi trenavar( go buy some boone) Sparta lean and dermacrine . Boom shred city, oh and stack with Justin bieber tears
do you have a discount code or hookup for the jb tears? i hear they're expensive and rare since all the tweenage girls buy them up
 
booneman77

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Epi, Triumphalis, 11-KT, and strippers gets my vote.
strippers... i like your style.

they're always "motivational"
 
Jebrook

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Epistane 40/45 mg 6 weeks
Trenavar at 120 mg 6 weeks
11-KT at 250 4-6 weeks
=Shredded like lettuce

Without purchasing anything, then possibly Epistane 6 weeks and 4 weeks of Msten 20-30 on a major deficit. Two DHT compounds would kill my joints though but it would be seriously dry and preserve lots of muscle mass. Pumps, fullness, and vascularity would be unreal even on a big deficit IMO.

Regardless of the option you choose strippers and Bieber tears go without saying basically like an über test base. Licking Bieber tears off said strippers is highly synergistic and clinically proven to be the most efficacious delivery method. Just happens to be the most fun too;).
 
booneman77

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booneman77

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Epistane 40/45 mg 6 weeks
Trenavar at 120 mg 6 weeks
11-KT at 250 4-6 weeks
=Shredded like lettuce

Without purchasing anything, then possibly Epistane 6 weeks and 4 weeks of Msten 20-30 on a major deficit. Two DHT compounds would kill my joints though but it would be seriously dry and preserve lots of muscle mass. Pumps, fullness, and vascularity would be unreal even on a big deficit IMO.

Regardless of the option you choose strippers and Bieber tears go without saying basically like an über test base. Licking Bieber tears off said strippers is highly synergistic and clinically proven to be the most efficacious delivery method. Just happens to be the most fun too;).
I think we might have a winner here with that delivery method ha.
 
Woody

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Jebrook stack is what I'll be running next. Adding Dermacrine as a base too bc Epi makes me feel like dog ass
 
Toren

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I'm diggin' the Epistane/Spartan Lean/Dermacrine idea. I would add some 11-KT on top too. I think the 11-KT and Trenavar are somewhat interchangeable and you probably don't need to use both on top of Epi/11-oxo/7-Keto. You certainly could, but I think more is not necessarily better. I'd also keep an eye on your joints with this combo.

Another option would be Epistane/DermaTrest/11-KT. That would be crazy in a deficit! I wouldn't go above 75-100mg of DermaTrest and I would use Ralox or Nolva on cycle (if necessary), along with a low dose of Transform. I'd save the exemestane for PCT to help kickstart the HPTA along with your SERM(s). Definitely watch your sodium on this one and keep plenty of Taurine on hand. This one would be much better on your joints than the first option.

You may also want to get some natural appetite suppressants if you are running that much gear in a large deficit. I know I wouldn't survive eating 1800 calories a day with Epi/Trest/11-KT. I'd be stumbling around in alleys licking old pizza boxes from dumpsters. :]
 
booneman77

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I'm diggin' the Epistane/Spartan Lean/Dermacrine idea. I would add some 11-KT on top too. I think the 11-KT and Trenavar are somewhat interchangeable and you probably don't need to use both on top of Epi/11-oxo/7-Keto. You certainly could, but I think more is not necessarily better. I'd also keep an eye on your joints with this combo.

Another option would be Epistane/DermaTrest/11-KT. That would be crazy in a deficit! I wouldn't go above 75-100mg of DermaTrest and I would use Ralox or Nolva on cycle (if necessary), along with a low dose of Transform. I'd save the exemestane for PCT to help kickstart the HPTA along with your SERM(s). Definitely watch your sodium on this one and keep plenty of Taurine on hand. This one would be much better on your joints than the first option.

You may also want to get some natural appetite suppressants if you are running that much gear in a large deficit. I know I wouldn't survive eating 1800 calories a day with Epi/Trest/11-KT. I'd be stumbling around in alleys licking old pizza boxes from dumpsters. :]
You really think it'd be worth adding 11kt on top of the lean? Seems redundant to me?

And just for info:

Lethargy has never been an issue on any cycle for me, epi/tren was just fine with no base.

Appetite is always ravenous so I'm just used to it ha. Nothing actually suppresses it for me so I just deal.
 
Jebrook

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You really think it'd be worth adding 11kt on top of the lean? Seems redundant to me?
I thought the same although I haven't looked too closely at the Lean formula. I also don't see Trenavar and 11-KT as interchangeable. Quite a bit of difference between the two in MOA and also strength/potency.
 
smith_69

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Toren

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You really think it'd be worth adding 11kt on top of the lean? Seems redundant to me?

And just for info:

Lethargy has never been an issue on any cycle for me, epi/tren was just fine with no base.

Appetite is always ravenous so I'm just used to it ha. Nothing actually suppresses it for me so I just deal.
I definitely think it would be beneficial to add some 11-KT on top. Spartan Lean, from my understanding, is meant to be a mild formula that can aid in fatloss while not necessarily requiring a legit PCT. In order to accomplish this, the 11-DHEA dose is on the milder side of things. I see adding 75-100mg of 11-KT on top to be a great addition to a novel product. Also, not all of 11-Oxo or 11-DHEA is going to be converted into 11-KT.

I thought the same although I haven't looked too closely at the Lean formula. I also don't see Trenavar and 11-KT as interchangeable. Quite a bit of difference between the two in MOA and also strength/potency.
I knew this comment would draw some attention. :] Let me first say that I have never used Trenavar, so my assertions are all second-hand. The reason I said they are "somewhat interchangeable" is because of the end result they impart. When one thinks of Tren/Trenavar, mostly people think of a PH/steroid that can help to add some aggression (androgenic nature), vascularity, libido boost (this can definitely vary), increase strength, as well as the ability to lean out the midsection. The same can also be said for 11-KT but with generally a more positive effect on libido. I understand that the degree to which each compound will affect the particular attribute will be different. The potency comparison (mg to mg) would definitely favor Trenavar over 11-KT, although I don't see it as being dramatically greater. I regulary see people running 90-150 mg of Trenavar to see results they are happy with, while 150+ mg of TD 11-KT can impart some dramatic results for some people. I think if we were to compare real Trenbolone, the story would be much different. At the end of the day, I do think that Trenavar could work quite well with 11-KT, it's just that I didn't think it made sense to include it in a stack that already had - as I outlined - Epistane/11-DHEA/7-DHEA/11-KT/Dermacrine. I guess it kind of goes to the argument of how much is enough? I don't think the guy stacking 5-6 compounds is necessarily going to see dramatically (or even mildly) better results than the guy stacking 2-3 complimentary compounds. Personally, I see Epistane and 11-KT, by itself, being enough to maintain muscle mass while on a cut. Adding in 11-Oxo/7-Keto/Dermacrine is a mild addition to that cycle and will aid directly in fatloss with minimal impact on the body. I guess at the end of the day, it really just depends on how hard the user wants to go. I could certainly see all of the compounds used on a longer 14-16 week IM Test cycle.

The second layout that I mentioned, to me, has the best synergism. You have Epistane, a dry compound with some reported "AI-like" properties. You have 11-KT, a known fat-loss agent with other great attributes such as libido enhancement, vasularity, strength etc. Lastly, you have Trestolone, a "wet compound" than would give you libido (for most), strength, muscle retention, and joint health. On my last run, I used DermaTrest and my joints showed an immediate improvement over how they felt on LGD. As far as joints go, I would put Trest at #1, over Ostarine, when discussing the positive-effect on joint comfort. The other two compounds, Epistane and 11-KT should help to offset some of the "wetness" of Trestolone. For me, Trest was dry overall and if memory serves me, I believe booneman77 has had the same response from Trest.

So there's just a bit of the thought process from this overactive brain of mine. There are certainly plenty of good options and opinions in here though.
 
booneman77

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I definitely think it would be beneficial to add some 11-KT on top. Spartan Lean, from my understanding, is meant to be a mild formula that can aid in fatloss while not necessarily requiring a legit PCT. In order to accomplish this, the 11-DHEA dose is on the milder side of things. I see adding 75-100mg of 11-KT on top to be a great addition to a novel product. Also, not all of 11-Oxo or 11-DHEA is going to be converted into 11-KT.



I knew this comment would draw some attention. :] Let me first say that I have never used Trenavar, so my assertions are all second-hand. The reason I said they are "somewhat interchangeable" is because of the end result they impart. When one thinks of Tren/Trenavar, mostly people think of a PH/steroid that can help to add some aggression (androgenic nature), vascularity, libido boost (this can definitely vary), increase strength, as well as the ability to lean out the midsection. The same can also be said for 11-KT but with generally a more positive effect on libido. I understand that the degree to which each compound will affect the particular attribute will be different. The potency comparison (mg to mg) would definitely favor Trenavar over 11-KT, although I don't see it as being dramatically greater. I regulary see people running 90-150 mg of Trenavar to see results they are happy with, while 150+ mg of TD 11-KT can impart some dramatic results for some people. I think if we were to compare real Trenbolone, the story would be much different. At the end of the day, I do think that Trenavar could work quite well with 11-KT, it's just that I didn't think it made sense to include it in a stack that already had - as I outlined - Epistane/11-DHEA/7-DHEA/11-KT/Dermacrine. I guess it kind of goes to the argument of how much is enough? I don't think the guy stacking 5-6 compounds is necessarily going to see dramatically (or even mildly) better results than the guy stacking 2-3 complimentary compounds. Personally, I see Epistane and 11-KT, by itself, being enough to maintain muscle mass while on a cut. Adding in 11-Oxo/7-Keto/Dermacrine is a mild addition to that cycle and will aid directly in fatloss with minimal impact on the body. I guess at the end of the day, it really just depends on how hard the user wants to go. I could certainly see all of the compounds used on a longer 14-16 week IM Test cycle.

The second layout that I mentioned, to me, has the best synergism. You have Epistane, a dry compound with some reported "AI-like" properties. You have 11-KT, a known fat-loss agent with other great attributes such as libido enhancement, vasularity, strength etc. Lastly, you have Trestolone, a "wet compound" than would give you libido (for most), strength, muscle retention, and joint health. On my last run, I used DermaTrest and my joints showed an immediate improvement over how they felt on LGD. As far as joints go, I would put Trest at #1, over Ostarine, when discussing the positive-effect on joint comfort. The other two compounds, Epistane and 11-KT should help to offset some of the "wetness" of Trestolone. For me, Trest was dry overall and if memory serves me, I believe booneman77 has had the same response from Trest.

So there's just a bit of the thought process from this overactive brain of mine. There are certainly plenty of good options and opinions in here though.
Great explanation.

And yes, for me trest (IM) was totally dry, just had to battle the methylestro issues. Trest and epi was just amazing together.

My only two issues are a) I'm skeptical that TD will be anywhere near as fun/good as IM which spoiled me. And b) I don't want to have to stack more than 3 compounds as that's a ton of stuff to have to tote with me on the road every week. Would need a separate suitcase just for ph's and ancillaries ha.

Epi seems to be the one consensus (was my favorite too) and lean maybe a close second.

Surprised no love for the halo tho?
 
Toren

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Great explanation.

And yes, for me trest (IM) was totally dry, just had to battle the methylestro issues. Trest and epi was just amazing together.

My only two issues are a) I'm skeptical that TD will be anywhere near as fun/good as IM which spoiled me. And b) I don't want to have to stack more than 3 compounds as that's a ton of stuff to have to tote with me on the road every week. Would need a separate suitcase just for ph's and ancillaries ha.

Epi seems to be the one consensus (was my favorite too) and lean maybe a close second.

Surprised no love for the halo tho?
I can't compare IM Trest but OL TD was very potent for me. While on Trest, my aggression was high and my temper was short. Dry weight gain/glycogen retention was also on point.

Halo is my favourite compound, but for me, the strength gains are awesome and I would prefer to use it while in a caloric surplus.

Shiit, I'm not scheduled to cycle again until Sept. 1st and I'm already wanting to scratch that itch. I need to stay out of these threads. Lol.
 

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You should get yourself some really good joint support but for the goal it would be spartan lean, epi and dimeth.
Maybe get some tren but then again if strength isn't your goal that would be overkill.


Wouldn't want to run DMZ or Halo without caloric surplus.
 
booneman77

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You should get yourself some really good joint support but for the goal it would be spartan lean, epi and dimeth.
Maybe get some tren but then again if strength isn't your goal that would be overkill.


Wouldn't want to run DMZ or Halo without caloric surplus.
Never had any joint issues before so I should be ok but I have a bunch of joint support xt in my closet anyways in case.

I've always kinda seen epi and dimethadrol used one or the other tho, they're pretty similar
 
booneman77

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I can't compare IM Trest but OL TD was very potent for me. While on Trest, my aggression was high and my temper was short. Dry weight gain/glycogen retention was also on point.

Halo is my favourite compound, but for me, the strength gains are awesome and I would prefer to use it while in a caloric surplus.

Shiit, I'm not scheduled to cycle again until Sept. 1st and I'm already wanting to scratch that itch. I need to stay out of these threads. Lol.
Haha technically I should be off for another week or two as well but I'm trying to squeeze one in before the beach. Might just wait tho and do it a bit longer and not rushed.
 
DreamWeaver

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Epi and Sparta lean would be good. If you added in something it would be a stronger kickstart type ph. Whatever you prefer in this case. I shy away from the harder ph's now as I have good reaction to sarms and milder ph's combined with almost no sides.
 

Bunshichi

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Before running them I would have thought they would be far more similar.
They have some similaritys but I would guess they stack nearly as good as methyldiaz and dimeth.
I would have sugested getting some methyldiaz but I would not run it without really much carbs as without I had some nasty sides like pretty bad headaches.
 
booneman77

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Which two are you referring to here? Epi/dimeth?
 
booneman77

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Stack them all for maximum effectiveness, don't be a baby.
Don't think I could handle the gains. I'd be afraid I wouldn't fit through doors by the end which would be a problem getting in my house.
 
jakecake

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Epistane 40/45 mg 6 weeks
Trenavar at 120 mg 6 weeks
11-KT at 250 4-6 weeks
=Shredded like lettuce

Without purchasing anything, then possibly Epistane 6 weeks and 4 weeks of Msten 20-30 on a major deficit. Two DHT compounds would kill my joints though but it would be seriously dry and preserve lots of muscle mass. Pumps, fullness, and vascularity would be unreal even on a big deficit IMO.

Regardless of the option you choose strippers and Bieber tears go without saying basically like an über test base. Licking Bieber tears off said strippers is highly synergistic and clinically proven to be the most efficacious delivery method. Just happens to be the most fun too;).
This will work wonders
 

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