1 andro 4 andro stack advice?!?

[Jhowe73]

Hi all, this is my first time ever posting in a forum so please be patient with me .

Tomorrow I am about to start my 1andro/4andro stack (super mandro and andro the giant by hard rock supps). I plan on running this course for 4 weeks as its my first ever ph course and I haven't taken anything else before either. I'm running it at the recommended dosage of 330mg of each a day (3 tabs of each). I also have protex on cycle support, the usual omega3, multi-vit, creatine, cod liver oil, Zma etc, and bsl eradicate on hand if any gyno symptoms occur. I don't plan on running my ai providing I don't get any symptoms, at least until I start my pct. I have done some research and I have gone with nolva as my serm 20/20/10/10 which I will be running with DAA.

Should I also run my AI along side the nolva? And taper the dosage? Or shall I save this purely for symptoms of gyno?

My current stats are:

Height: 6ft
Weight: 198lbs
Bodyfat: haven't had this properly measured but I am roughly 15%, probably just under.

I aim to do a lean bulk, hitting about 3000 cals a day, 280p, 250c, 80f.

How does this look? Any advice/constructive criticism greatly appreciated. Especially with regards to the AI.

 

[Best]

i'm not an expert by any means ive only done 2 cycles working on my 3rd as we speak. I ran 1 and 4 as my first cycle and tried to do everything right as i did all my research as you have it looks like. I did not run an AI with mine but I did have it on hand in case i felt anything weird with the cycle. I was kinda worried about it because it was my first cycle kinda like yours.

Also I ran mine for 4 weeks as i was playing it on the safe side. If i could re do it i would run it for a full 6 weeks, when i ran it for 4 weeks i had absolutely no sides at all, around 6 pounds of gains over the 4 weeks. I think 6 weeks would have yielded a little better results.

 

[LeanEngineer]

It looks fine for your first cycle imo. I would skip the DAA and pick up an otc test booster like viron or something. You have a serm for pct which is the main thing. Just keep the AI on hand in case but my guess is you probably won't need it but its definitely good to have since its your first cycle.

 

[Jhowe73]

Hey man, glad to hear it worked well for you. I can't wait to get started.

What was your pct like?

Did you use a serm? And did you use your ai alongside the serm?

That's the only thing I'm finding confusing at the moment, I know the dosage is pretty mild and the 4andro has only a small chance of aromatisation, which is why I've chose to run nolva at 20/20/10/10. I don't want to go overboard with the pct in case I end up with rebound symptoms.

 

[Jhowe73]

Thanks Leanengineer!

If I was to just use the nolva for pct, at what point should I throw in the ai? Just if my nips start itching? ��
And at what dosages? I have gone with bsl eradicate which is dosed at 25mg of arimistane per cap.

 

[jgntyce]

Don't forget that cortisol will rise during PCT. SNS Reduce XT would be ideal to control cortisol. Run it at 0/0/3/3/3.

Another great PCT addition is CEL PCT ASSIST. It's not really brought up here on AM, but it is a very cost effective product with standardized potencies, and is adequately dosed. Optimizes natural testosterone, improved estrogen management, improved libido, and of course, helps retain your hard worked gains.

You can find PCT ASSIST at Strong Supplement Shop.

http://www.strongsupplementshop.com/cel-pct-assist-natural-testosterone-support-solution#tabcontent-description

 

[AnabolicGuru]

I would extend the cycle to 6-8 weeks, everything else looks great...Like leanengineer said, I would forget the daa and throw in an otc test booster or otc pct like sup3r pct

 

[Best]

Hey man, glad to hear it worked well for you. I can't wait to get started.

What was your pct like?

Did you use a serm? And did you use your ai alongside the serm?

That's the only thing I'm finding confusing at the moment, I know the dosage is pretty mild and the 4andro has only a small chance of aromatisation, which is why I've chose to run nolva at 20/20/10/10. I don't want to go overboard with the pct in case I end up with rebound symptoms.

Yes did clomid at 20/20/10/10, i didnt even feel like it really shut me down any but i did take it either way. And no I did not take an AI at all during the cycle I waited for any rebounds but never felt anything of the sort.

 

[Jhowe73]

I would extend the cycle to 6-8 weeks, everything else looks great...Like leanengineer said, I would forget the daa and throw in an otc test booster or otc pct like sup3r pct

I'd like to run it at 6 weeks but ive chosen 4 weeks mainly just to see how I react to the stuff first since it's my first cycle.

Just out of interest, why get ditch the DAA in place of an otc test booster?

 

[Best]

I'd like to run it at 6 weeks but ive chosen 4 weeks mainly just to see how I react to the stuff first since it's my first cycle.

Just out of interest, why get ditch the DAA in place of an otc test booster?

What I would do is run it for 4 weeks and near the end of the 4 weeks if your feeling good extended it another 2 weeks. If your not feeling it just go ahead and start your pct.

 

[AnabolicGuru]

I'd like to run it at 6 weeks but ive chosen 4 weeks mainly just to see how I react to the stuff first since it's my first cycle.

Just out of interest, why get ditch the DAA in place of an otc test booster?

Andros are best when ran 6-8 weeks...Sup3r Pct would just be far more beneficial than daa alone

 

[Jhowe73]

Just thought I'd do a quick update here and see if anyone else has experienced this?

It's only day 4 on cycle but the last couple of days I've felt like sh1t on a morning and improved as the days gone on. Nothing else to report really other than that. Coincidence or is it the ph?

 

[Mikeopsycho]

Just a quick question I'm in my sixth week of running 1-andro , 4-andro , Epi andro , I did up my dosing of 1-andro to 440 from 330 and running 4-andro at 330 and epiandro at 500 , just wondering my chest has been feeling really tight left side like pressure on it everyday for about a week now . I have another week and half to go , but what could be causing this ? Not really pain just a dull tight pressure feeling left side to mid chest . In the beginning was hard to breath a bit and i think it boosted my anxiety way up , maybe it's growing pains in the chest or I pulled something ?

 

[Brandaddy]

Just thought I'd do a quick update here and see if anyone else has experienced this?

It's only day 4 on cycle but the last couple of days I've felt like sh1t on a morning and improved as the days gone on. Nothing else to report really other than that. Coincidence or is it the ph?

I know I get that feeling if I overdose a cortisol and estrogen suppressor. Are you taking any supps that effect your cortisol or estrogen?

 

[NewAgeMayan]

Just a quick question I'm in my sixth week of running 1-andro , 4-andro , Epi andro , I did up my dosing of 1-andro to 440 from 330 and running 4-andro at 330 and epiandro at 500 , just wondering my chest has been feeling really tight left side like pressure on it everyday for about a week now . I have another week and half to go , but what could be causing this ? Not really pain just a dull tight pressure feeling left side to mid chest . In the beginning was hard to breath a bit and i think it boosted my anxiety way up , maybe it's growing pains in the chest or I pulled something ?

Damn, dude, Id be going straight to my doctor to be assessed!

 

[Brandaddy]

Just a quick question I'm in my sixth week of running 1-andro , 4-andro , Epi andro , I did up my dosing of 1-andro to 440 from 330 and running 4-andro at 330 and epiandro at 500 , just wondering my chest has been feeling really tight left side like pressure on it everyday for about a week now . I have another week and half to go , but what could be causing this ? Not really pain just a dull tight pressure feeling left side to mid chest . In the beginning was hard to breath a bit and i think it boosted my anxiety way up , maybe it's growing pains in the chest or I pulled something ?

Yeah, this doesn't sound like something to play with. Almost sounds like your bp is sky rocketed and your heart is under a lot of stress.

 

[Mikeopsycho]

Yeah, this doesn't sound like something to play with. Almost sounds like your bp is sky rocketed and your heart is under a lot of stress.

Really ? Even if my heart isn't pounding at the time ? I am gonna get my blood pressure checked tommorow . When this happens and I take chamomile tea or relaxes me and mostly goes away so you guys think this is more then anxiety ?! Off cycle I am prone to anxiety .

 

[Mikeopsycho]

It's mainly under the left nipple like two ribs down . I also notice if I push on that area it's hard so it's the bone and there's pain at the bone on pressure

 

[Jhowe73]

I know I get that feeling if I overdose a cortisol and estrogen suppressor. Are you taking any supps that effect your cortisol or estrogen?

The only thing I can think of is the 4 andro which has a slight chance of aromatisation, but it is also supposed to help with the lethargy from the 1 andro. Feel better than I have been today, maybe my body just needed to adjust.

 

[Volvo140G]

It's mainly under the left nipple like two ribs down . I also notice if I push on that area it's hard so it's the bone and there's pain at the bone on pressure

Sounds unnatural

 

[Mikeopsycho]

Sounds unnatural

I took two Prilosec and two simethecone(gas tabs) every day now , everything has subsided , I do have a history with acid reflux but I guess the andros enhanced it . Now I feel good .

 

[Volvo140G]

Acid reflux is normal on cycle imo... good to hear it's been resolved

 

[Jhowe73]

Thought I may as well update this since am not doing much today. Onto day 7 now, haven't noticed much visual difference personally but a couple of people have commented that I look bigger. Weights up slightly, 2lbs but probably water weight, been eating really clean and meeting my calorie targets. I suppose I will find out tomorrow if there has been any strength changes when I go back to the gym (had the weekend off), but I don't expect much from what I've read in other logs. Apparently it's not until the 3rd week the andros really kick in so I'm also considering going for 6 weeks instead of 4 cash depending.

No gyno, no hair loss, no acne, no loss of libido, in fact I've woken up with a rock on every morning ha. Only negatives so far, I have been struggling to get out of bed on a morning and appetite has been a bit suppressed but other than that I just can't wait to get back in the gym!

 

[dave39]

Hi all, this is my first time ever posting in a forum so please be patient with me .

Tomorrow I am about to start my 1andro/4andro stack (super mandro and andro the giant by hard rock supps). I plan on running this course for 4 weeks as its my first ever ph course and I haven't taken anything else before either. I'm running it at the recommended dosage of 330mg of each a day (3 tabs of each). I also have protex on cycle support, the usual omega3, multi-vit, creatine, cod liver oil, Zma etc, and bsl eradicate on hand if any gyno symptoms occur. I don't plan on running my ai providing I don't get any symptoms, at least until I start my pct. I have done some research and I have gone with nolva as my serm 20/20/10/10 which I will be running with DAA.

Should I also run my AI along side the nolva? And taper the dosage? Or shall I save this purely for symptoms of gyno?

My current stats are:

Height: 6ft
Weight: 198lbs
Bodyfat: haven't had this properly measured but I am roughly 15%, probably just under.

I aim to do a lean bulk, hitting about 3000 cals a day, 280p, 250c, 80f.

How does this look? Any advice/constructive criticism greatly appreciated. Especially with regards to the AI.

http://anabolicminds.com/forum/steroids/275427-andros-users-guide.html

 

[Jhowe73]

So I'm now 12 days into my 1 andro 4 andro stack, no negatives so far but not really any significant positives either. I would say my muscles are harder and my weight is up to 202lbs (4lb increase), but I feel like I am a bit softer and wobbly around the middle. I can't understand how this could be fat gain because I've been quite strict with my diet. I don't really do any cardio but I do include fat burning compound movements into my workout such as; squats, deadlifts, bench etc and the 1 andro is also supposed to have fat burning properties.

Could this be water retention?
How do you tell the difference between water and fat?
Shall I start doing some cardio?

 

[Jhowe73]

Any help is appreciated

 

[Mikeopsycho]

The same did happen to me
In the beginning but it did subside , I did drink a ton more water at that time as well . I think it was bloating for me from a lot of food and gas as well , eventually I got stomach pains (gas) so I took simethicone and it went away . But it is a good question what originally caused it .

 

[Jhowe73]

The same did happen to me
In the beginning but it did subside , I did drink a ton more water at that time as well . I think it was bloating for me from a lot of food and gas as well , eventually I got stomach pains (gas) so I took simethicone and it went away . But it is a good question what originally caused it .

I have been drinking tons of water as well but I don't feel bloated. Just not as firm around the abdominals or lower back. It feels like fat to me

 

[Jhowe73]

Approaching the end of my 4th week on the andros now, quite pleased with the results so far but I've decided to do another 2 weeks haha. Reckon I should keep the doses at 330 of each or shall I bump it up?

 

[Mikeopsycho]

Approaching the end of my 4th week on the andros now, quite pleased with the results so far but I've decided to do another 2 weeks haha. Reckon I should keep the doses at 330 of each or shall I bump it up?

Just finished my cycle on pct now feeling awesome great gains and they seem to be staying as well. If u have extra pills bump to 440 ur at th point ur about to feel it the best brother good stuff keep on goin

 

[JMark]

Approaching the end of my 4th week on the andros now, quite pleased with the results so far but I've decided to do another 2 weeks haha. Reckon I should keep the doses at 330 of each or shall I bump it up?

Keep it at 330 and extend it another 4 weeks. If it's treating you good, why not?

 

[NewAgeMayan]

Approaching the end of my 4th week on the andros now, quite pleased with the results so far but I've decided to do another 2 weeks haha. Reckon I should keep the doses at 330 of each or shall I bump it up?

I cant say Ive come across much feedback indicating 440 to be appreciably better than 330, at least of our stuff.

You could certainly try, but Id be reluctant if doing so had an impact on your cycle length ie you lose a week due to going through your stash quicker.

 

[Jhowe73]

Keep it at 330 and extend it another 4 weeks. If it's treating you good, why not?

It is treating me very good. Up 8lbs to 206 at the end of my 4th week. Back is wider, Chest is fuller, got some nice separation on my quads which I struggled with before. Feel generally better and more focused in the gym and quite a few people have noticed a difference and started asking me what I'm taking lol. Only downside is a couple of spots, a bit of bloating early on (which I got rid of with a couple of doses of bsl eradicate (arimistane)) and the hellish amount of sweat that pours out of me when I'm working out haha.

So I think I'll take your advice and extend to 8 weeks total at 330mg.

 

[Mikeopsycho]

It is treating me very good. Up 8lbs to 206 at the end of my 4th week. Back is wider, Chest is fuller, got some nice separation on my quads which I struggled with before. Feel generally better and more focused in the gym and quite a few people have noticed a difference and started asking me what I'm taking lol. Only downside is a couple of spots, a bit of bloating early on (which I got rid of with a couple of doses of bsl eradicate (arimistane)) and the hellish amount of sweat that pours out of me when I'm working out haha.

So I think I'll take your advice and extend to 8 weeks total at 330mg.

Yeah the only side effect I got from a long cycl was acne and really oily skin(but that could be from the ostarine I had as well) here and there but I'm five days into pct and its clearing up .

 

[Jhowe73]

Yeah the only side effect I got from a long cycl was acne and really oily skin(but that could be from the ostarine I had as well) here and there but I'm five days into pct and its clearing up .

What you using for pct?

 

[Mikeopsycho]

Just wondering , I'm in pct with the nolvadex and alpha max xt and cremax xt , low dose ostarine and cardarine . What do you guys take in PCT to stop lethargy? I am so shot LOL

 

[Woody]

Just wondering , I'm in pct with the nolvadex and alpha max xt and cremax xt , low dose ostarine and cardarine . What do you guys take in PCT to stop lethargy? I am so shot LOL

Drop your osta. It's suppressive and does not belong in PCT

 

[AnabolicGuru]

Drop your osta. It's suppressive and does not belong in PCT

110% agree with this

 

[Canes325]

110% agree with this

I 3rd this. I've seen labs from users that even 5mg/day has suppressed LH and FSH.

 

[Mikeopsycho]

What if I keep osta/gw low dose with the nolva , alpha max xt, on cycle support for the next three weeks then I have a bottle of pct revolution test by FINAFLEX which has natty test boost as well and run that afterwards with nolvadren xt

 

[Jhowe73]

I'm onto the 5th week of my cycle And I've noticed my nips have gone a bit wobbly, I've looked up how to check if you have gyno and there doesn't seem to be any sign of a gland behind the nipple and it's not sensitive. Could this be water retention or is it fat?

 

[Mikeopsycho]

I'm onto the 5th week of my cycle And I've noticed my nips have gone a bit wobbly, I've looked up how to check if you have gyno and there doesn't seem to be any sign of a gland behind the nipple and it's not sensitive. Could this be water retention or is it fat?

I have the same thing wondering what it could be , no Gyno symptoms either .

 

[Canes325]

Define wobbly? Maybe post a pic?

 

[Jhowe73]

Define wobbly? Maybe post a pic?

Well I've woken up this morning and it appears to have vanished haha. Must have been water retention. By wobbly I meant when I tense my chest the area around my nipple would still be soft and would wobble slightly. I'm convinced it's not gyno cos there's no sensitivity or hard lumps behind the nipple.

 

[Mikeopsycho]

Well I've woken up this morning and it appears to have vanished haha. Must have been water retention. By wobbly I meant when I tense my chest the area around my nipple would still be soft and would wobble slightly. I'm convinced it's not gyno cos there's no sensitivity or hard lumps behind the nipple.

Pretty much the same thing here .

 

[Jhowe73]

Pretty much the same thing here .

You dosing your andros the same as me?

 

[Mikeopsycho]

You dosing your andros the same as me?

I am
In PCT now, I was running 1andro 440mg, 4andro 330mg and epiandro 500mg

Ran for 8and half week cycle

 

[Jhowe73]

Well, today is the start of my 6th week. Still no negative sides, apart from a tiny bit of acne and back pumps. I seem to be stuck around the 206lb mark. My diet and training have stayed the same since the beginning of the course and I've gained 8lbs so I'm still quite pleased with that. I chose the andros as my first cycle because I thought it would be a subtle difference and it's been highly praised for a beginner cycle, but a lot of people have been asking me what I've been taking and saying I've "blew up" in the last few weeks haha. Having to start buying new clothes because a lot of my t shirts are uncomfortably right now. It's a shame you're only supposed to run these for 8 weeks cos now I feel like I don't want to come off them ha.

 

[Jhowe73]

Tight* not right