Thanks for all the replies. I have been on finasteride for 11 years. I've been researching 11-Kt and have a couple of questions. Is it ok to take 11-kt while on finasteride and can you bulk on this product? Thanks again!
I've actuallly been doing quite a bit of research on 11KT recently, including how it might interact with 5aR inhibitors like finasteride. I still have more research to do but here is what I have gathered so far.
11-Ketotestosterone (11KT) is actually somewhat similar to Testosterone (T), and as such, it can be 5-alpha reduced in a similar fashion. T gets reduced via 5aR1 and 5aR2 into a more potent androgen, dihydrotestosterone (DHT). 11KT will be 5-alpha reduced (by the same enzymatic process), into a more potent androgen known as11-keto-dihydrotestosterone (11KDHT). Both DHT and 11KDHT are notably more androgenic than their precursor hormones. Using finasteride will block the 5aR2 enzyme from converting 11KT to 11KDHT, just as it stops the 5aR2 enzyme from reducing T into DHT. Finasteride wll not, however, block the 5aR1 enzyme from converting both parent hormones into their more androgenic metabolites. Dutasteride would prevent that reduction, but would increase potential side-effects by lowering DHT even more in the body.
* Note: T and 11KT can also be 5-alpha reduced into other androgens, but DHT and 11KDHT will be the most prominent metabolites and will also be the most androgenic.
So, we know that blocking the 5aR enzyme will slow the conversion into a more potent androgen but that isn't the whole story. Just as T can be 5-alpha reduced into a potent androgen, it can also be 5-beta reduced into
somewhat inactive metabolites. One might worry that by using finasteride we are also blocking the conversion into these inactive metabolitess and thus making T more prominent. (Keep in mind that T would be far more androgenic than 5b-DHT) This is true to an extent as we know that men who take finasteride generaly see an increase in total T because less of it gets reduced by the alpha and beta reductase enzymes. Now, the rate of conversion to either a-H or b-H metabolites depends on many factors but what we do know is that using a 5-a/b-R inhibitor such as finasteride will ultimately lower serum levels of the most potent androgen in the human body, DHT. This means that finasteride will
usually do more good than it will harm in the fight against hair loss, when used in combination with naturally produced or exogenously supplied T.
Now, how does this relate to 11KT? Based upon the A-ring of the11KT steroid structure, it can also be 5-alpha and 5-beta reduced. This means that the outcome of using finasteride in combination with 11KT
should yield a
similar result to the T/Finasteride combo. I can't tell you if the rate of conversion to alpha and beta metabolites would be the same, or more for one over the other, I can only tell you that both metabolites are produced for both T and 11KT. (I am still doing some research on this last point)
To summarize, I believe that the co-use of finasteride and 11KT
should be neutral at worst. Of course, 11KT has been shown to be a potent androgen in it's own right, so using high amounts of 11KT may still accelarate the balding process more so than if you had never used it at all. Not to mention the fact that we all metabolize these hormones differently. The increase in 11KT within the body
may be offset
somewhat by the decrease in T that will be seen when introducing exogenous forms of 11KT.
* Note: T and 11KT share a similar level of androgenicity (in specific prostate cells), when compared to DHT, measuring an approximate AR agonism rate of 60% of that of DHT.
I will be using 11KT and finasteride in a few months so I will know for sure how it affects me. As always, the use of topical AR antagonists such as ketoconazole, and to a lesser extent spironolactone, will help locally to prevent some AR binding.
