basic Test questions

[UNDERTAKER]

If one were to run a newbie cycle...say a 3 monther with either drol/dbol at front and ending with either winny/anavar. Whats the best test for a newbie with the least pain and the least injections per week?

 

[UNDERTAKER]

easiest too, no homebrew/conversion type stuff.

 

[Jblake]

You could inject test cypionate once a week. Same for enanthate.

 

[UNDERTAKER]

which one is superior? for mass?

 

[WATERLOGGED]

enan

 

[UNDERTAKER]

what is the average dose for the week?

 

[kwantam]

what is the average dose for the week?

500mg/week is probably going to provide decent results. Enan and cyp are substantially similar in their effects.

On the whole, it's probably slightly more pleasant to pin 250mg 2x/wk. The marginal difference between 2x/wk and 1x/wk is small, especially considering that 500mg/wk in one injection is going to be a large volume. Moreover, the resulting steadier blood levels from 2x/wk will probably reduce sides somewhat.

-kwantam

 

[UNDERTAKER]

what is the ml to mg ratio? For instance a 10ml vial of test cyp has how many mg?

 

[Skye]

If one were to run a newbie cycle...say a 3 monther with either drol/dbol at front and ending with either winny/anavar. Whats the best test for a newbie with the least pain and the least injections per week?

no homebrew? that does limit it somewhat but neo-test (test deca) would be the easiest and least amount of injecitons. test e and test cyp are equal in results and both require twice a week shots (rule of thumb, injects should be 1/2 the half life, so for test e that is every 5 days and cyp ever 6 days, not once a week) As test cyp and e are easier to find I would use one of them at 500mg a week split into mon 250mg and thurs 250mg.

how many mg/ml depends on the brand. 200 to 250 is common but humen grade can be 100mg/ml to 250 I believe

 

[jminis]

what is the ml to mg ratio? For instance a 10ml vial of test cyp has how many mg?

that depends there's no one set dosage for test. They could be 250mg/mL or 300mg/mL or whatever. It depends on who makes it.

 

[UNDERTAKER]

well...then how do you know if it doesnt say on the vial/box it comes in? Another question.... don't pins measure in cc's? How many cc's is 250mg?

 

[Cuffs]

Test Enan and Test Cyp can both be injected once a week. They are much in the same structure wise. So, neither is "more" superior.

If the box/vial doesn't say the ratio of compound to oil, then you'd need to have it tested at a lab.

Pins measure in CC's, but the oils do not. The oils typically measure in ML's...such as 250mgs per ML, 300mgs per ML...and so on. That's why it is important to know how many Mgs per ML your oil has in it. Otherwise, you can really **** yourself up using certain compounds.

 

[UNDERTAKER]

then how are you supposed to know how much to suck out of the vial and into the pin?

 

[Cuffs]

then how are you supposed to know how much to suck out of the vial and into the pin?

Well, you won't know if you don't know how many mgs per ML you have.

Test E usually comes 250mgs per ML. Which is 2.5 grams of Test E per 10ml vial. This would give one a 5 week cycle if they use 500mgs ew. However, there are some UG labs that make 300mgs per ML, and some blends that have 400mgs per ML. I've even heard as high as 500mgs per ML (ouch!).

 

[glenihan]

cc=ml

...sounds like you might need to do a ton more research before you stick yourself

 

[Beelzebub]

cc=ml

...sounds like you might need to do a ton more research before you stick yourself

agreed.

 

[UNDERTAKER]

I agreed as well, research is what I am trying to do....any suggested reads?

 

[UNDERTAKER]

cuffs---that is what I thought...thanks for the help.

glen---yea I heard 1ml=1cc, but I wanted to hear it from you guys

 

[kwantam]

cuffs---that is what I thought...thanks for the help.

glen---yea I heard 1ml=1cc, but I wanted to hear it from you guys

When in doubt, google will perform unit conversions. Just one more reason google kicks my ass.

-kwantam

 

[UNDERTAKER]

so.....if one had 250mg per ml test e. One would, per say, inject 1cc on a monday and 1cc on a thursday? And, if injecting into quads maybe inject into the left quad on monday and the right quad on thursday? Sound good?

 

[glenihan]

yes

 

[UNDERTAKER]

excellent

 

[Cuffs]

so.....if one had 250mg per ml test e. One would, per say, inject 1cc on a monday and 1cc on a thursday? And, if injecting into quads maybe inject into the left quad on monday and the right quad on thursday? Sound good?

Yes. However, if this is your first time pinning, I'd stay away from quad injections until you get your techniquet down first. A lot of veins/nerves in this area. Plus, if you get a painful batch, it'll cripple you for a few days. Go with Glutes and Delts. Good rotation for the few injects you'd be doing.

 

[houseman]

enan

There is relatively NO difference between enan and cyp.

Personal preference is the only difference. Twice a week injects with enan vs. once a week with cyp.

As for it being pain free... all in how it's brewed, for the most part.

 

[UNDERTAKER]

as you can see by my questions I am no where near doing aas yet. The delts and gluts have less blood vessels? I would personally be afraid to inject in those places just cuz there so much smaller than the quads.

 

[UNDERTAKER]

I meant just the delts are smaller.....how could you even see what your doing injecting into your glutes?

 

[glenihan]

There is relatively NO difference between enan and cyp.

Personal preference is the only difference. Twice a week injects with enan vs. once a week with cyp.

As for it being pain free... all in how it's brewed, for the most part.

BOTH enan and cyp need to be injected 2x a week

 

[houseman]

BOTH enan and cyp need to be injected 2x a week

I know PLENTY who inject cyp once a week and they choose it for THAT specific reason.

I, personally, don't buy you can only get away with once a week but I looking at them proof seems to be in the pudding.

 

[kwantam]

The ventrogluteal site is becoming more popular among nurses because it's easy to find, has few nerves and blood vessels, and can hold several mLs. I can't personally recommend it because I haven't tried it, but I certainly intend to give it a go at some point.

(There's a diagram for finding the ventrogluteal site in the PDF linked from the pinning sticky.)

-kwantam

 

[kwantam]

I know PLENTY who inject cyp once a week and they choose it for THAT specific reason.

There's only a one day difference between the half-lives of cyp and enan, so they're almost equally (un?)suitable for once-weekly injects.

Having said that, I'd still go with Mon/Thurs, especially if it's in a big stack---who the hell (other than exnihilo ) wants to pin several mL at once?

-kwantam

 

[Cuffs]

I know PLENTY who inject cyp once a week and they choose it for THAT specific reason.

I, personally, don't buy you can only get away with once a week but I looking at them proof seems to be in the pudding.

No difference between Cyp and Enan. I did a study on the two and posted a thread about it. Enan was made in Europe and used for its athletes, while Cyp was in the U.S. The structure are almost identical. One can get away with injecting once a week with both, however, twice a week for more even blood elevations is preferred.

 

[Cuffs]

Ahhh, I found my post on the Enan/Cyp profiles. I'll just cut and paste it, instead of linking it. Here you go:

Here's a read on Test Enan:

One of the many testosterone substances available today is the testosterone enanthate. Testosterone enanthate is an oil based injectable steroid, designed to release testosterone slowly from the injection site (depot). Once administered, serum concentrations of this hormone will rise for several days, and remain markedly elevated for approximately two weeks. It may actually take three weeks for the action of this drug to fully diminish. For medical purposes this is the most widely prescribed testosterone. In men it is normally used to treat hypogonadism resulting from androgen deficiency and anemia.

Testosterone enanthate is the European answer to Testosterone cypionate which is predominantly available in the U.S. Testosterone enanthate, as most trade names already suggest, is a long-acting depot steroid. Depending on the metabolism and the body's initial hormone level it’s duration is two to three weeks so that theoretically very long intervals between injections are possible. Although Testosterone enanthate is effective for several weeks, it is injected at least once a week in body-building, powerlifting, and weightlifting. This, by all means, makes sense since Testosterone enanthate has a plasma half-life time in the blood of only slightly longer than one week.

The decisive advantage of Testosterone enanthate, however, is that this substance has a very strong androgenic effect and is coupled with an intense anabolic component. This allows almost everyone, within a short time, to build up a lot of strength and mass. The rapid and strong weight gain is combined with a distinct retention of electrolytes and water. A pleasant effect is that the enormous strength gain goes hand in hand with the water retention. Weightlifters and powerlifters, especially in the higher weight classes, appreciate this characteristic. In this group, Testosterone enanthate, Testosterone cypionate, and Sustanon are the number one steroids; this is also clearly reflected in the dosages. Dosages of 500 mg, 1000 mg or even 2000 mg PER DAY, not per week, are no rarity. Sports disciplines requiring a high degree of raw power, aggressiveness, and stamina offer an excellent application for Depot-Testosterone. The distinct water retention has also other advantages. Those who have problems with their joints, shoulder cartilages or whose intervertebral disks, due to years of heavy training, show the first signs of wear, can get temporary relief by taking testosterone.

An additional problem when taking Testosterone enanthate is that the conversion rate to estrogen is very high. This, on one hand, leads the body to store more fat; on the other hand, feminization symptoms (gynecomastia) are not unusual. However, it must be clearly stated that this depends on the athlete's predisposition. There are athletes who show no feminization symptoms or fat deposits and who suffer very low water retention even with 1000 mg +/week. Others, however, develop pain in their nipples at even the lowest dose. The use of Nolvadex and Proviron should be considered at a dosage level of 500 mg+ /week. Testosterone enanthate also strongly promotes the regeneration process. This leads to distinctly shorter overcompensation phases, an increased feeling of well-being, and a distinct energy increase. This is also the reason why several athletes are able to work out twice daily for several hours six times a week and continue to build up mass and strength. Athletes who take Testosterone enanthate report an excessively strong pump effect during training. This "steroid pump" is attributed to an increased blood volume with a higher oxygen supply and a higher quantity of red blood cells. Those who take megadoses of Testosterone enanthate will already feel an enormous pump in their upper thighs and calves when climbing stairs.

For adding mass Testosterone enanthate combines very well with Anadrol 50, Dianabol and Deca-Durabolin. As an example, a stack of 100 mg Anadrol 50/day, 200 mgs Deca-Durabolin/ week, and 500 mgs Testosterone enanthate/week works well. After six weeks of intake the Anadrol 50, for example, could be replaced by 40 mg Dianabol/day. Principally, Testosterone enanthate can be combined with any steroid in order to gain mass. Apparently a synergetic effect between the androgen, Testosterone enanthate, and the anabolic steroids occurs which results in their bonding witli several receptors.Those who draw too much water with Testosterone enanthate and Dianabol or Anadrol, or who are more interested in strength without gaining 20 pounds of body weight should take Testosterone enanthate together with Oxandrolone and Trenl. The generally taken dose-as already mentioned-varies from 250 mg/ week up to 2000 mg/day. In our opinion the most sensible dosage for most athletes is between 250-1000 mg/week. Normally a higher dosage should not be necessary When taking up to 500 mg/week the dosage is normally taken all at once, thus 2 ml of solution are injected. A higher dosage should be divided into two injections per week. The quantity of the dose should be determined by the athlete's developmental stage, his goals, and the quantity of his previous steroid intake. The so called beach- and disco bodybuilders do not need 1000 mg of Testosterone enanthate/week. Our experience is that the Testosterone enanthate dosage for many, above all, depends on their financial resources.

The side effects of Testosterone enanthate are mostly the distinct androgenic effect and the increased water retention. This is usually the reason for the frequent occurrence of hypertony. Those who have a predisposition for high blood pressure or whose blood pressure is elevated when they begin taking Testosterone enanthate should have it periodically checked by a physician. If necessary the intake of an antihypertensive drug such as Catapresan is advisable. Many athletes experience a strong acne with Testosterone enanthate which manifests itself on the back, chest, shoulders, and arms more than on the face. Athletes who take large quantities of Testo can often be easily recognized because of these characteristics. It is interesting to note that in some athletes these characteristics only occur after use of the compound has been discontinued, which implies a rebound effect. Sexual overstimulation with frequent erections at the beginning of intake is normal. In young athletes, "in addition to virilization,testosterone can also lead to an accelerated growth and bone maturation, to a premature epiphysial closing of the growth plates and thus a lower height" (Jenapharm GmbH, package insert for Testosteron-Depot).'

Other possible side effects are testicular atrophy, reduced spermatogenesis, and especially an increased aggressiveness. Those who transfer this aggressiveness to their training and not their environment do not have to worry. Unfortunately this is not the case in some athletes who take Testosterone enanthate. Testoster-one and Finaject are both primary reasons for some eruptions. In particular, high doses are in part responsible for anti-social behavior among its users. One can talk here of a sort of "superman syndrome" that occurs in some users. Although Testosterone enanthate is broken down through the liver, this compound is only slightly toxic when taken in a reasonable dose; therefore, changes of the liver values do not occur as often as with the oral 17-alpha alkylated steroids. Further potential side effects can be deep voice and accelerated hair loss.

Here's a read on Test Cyp:

American athletes have a long, fond relationship with Testosterone cypionate. While Testosterone enanthate is manufactured widely throughout the world, Testosterone cypionate seems to be predominantly an American item. It is therefore not surprising that American athletes particularly favor this Testosterone ester. But many claim this is not just a matter of simple pride, often swearing Testosterone cypionate to be a superior product, providing a bit more of a “kick� than Testosterone enanthate. At the same time it is said to produce a slightly higher level of water retention, but not enough for it to be easily discerned, of course when we look at the situation objectively, we see these two steroids are really interchangeable, and Testosterone cypionate is not at all superior. Both Testosterone products are long acting oil-based injectables, which will keep Testosterone levels sufficiently elevated for approximately two weeks. Testosterone enanthate may be slightly better in terms of Testosterone release, as this ester is one carbon atom lighter than Testosterone cypionate. The difference is so insignificant however that no one can rightly claim it to be noticeable.

Testosterone is the prime male androgen in the body, and as such still the best possible mass builder in the world. It has a high risk of side-effects because it readily converts to a more androgenic form (DHT) in androgen responsive tissues and forms estrogen quite easily. But these characteristics also provide it with its extreme anabolic tendencies. On the one hand estrogen increases growth hormone output, glucose utilization, improves immunity and upgrades the androgen receptor, while on the other hand a testosterone/DHT combination is extremely potent at activating the androgen receptor and eliciting major strength and size gains. While not always the most visually appealing result, there is no steroid on earth that packs on mass like testosterone does.

Testosterone Cypionate is a single-ester, long-acting form of testosterone. Due to the length of its ester (8 carbons) it is stored mostly in the adipose tissue upon intra-musuclar injection, and then slowly but very steadily released over a certain period of time. A peak is noted after 24-48 hours of injection and then a slow decline, reaching a steady point after 12 days and staying there for over 3 weeks time. Users will not find adequate benefit in the use of this steady-point dose, so this product is normally injected once a week, making the very lowest dose higher than half the peak dose at any given time.

Testosterone cypionate can be combined with many steroids and thus making it an excellent mass steroid. As with enanthate the dosage range is 250-1000 mg/week.

It is also important to remember that the use of an injectable Testosterone will quickly suppress endogenous Testosterone production. It may therefore be good advice to use a Testosterone stimulating drug like HCG and/or Clomid/Nolvadex at the conclusion of a cycle. This should help the user avoid a strong Testosterone “crash� due to hormonal imbalance, which can strip away much of the new muscle mass and strength.

Side effects with this product are the same as with any other testosterone (ie. Water retention and related hypertension, male pattern baldness, acne, etc)

 

[sesso]

undertaker.... make sure you go t spotinjections.com also before doing any poking . you cann also have someone poke ur glutes for u

 

[Poobah]

I meant just the delts are smaller.....how could you even see what your doing injecting into your glutes?

Honestly I find my glutes bleed like a stuck pig.. (compared to other locations..) But I agree, quads shots are much more needle sensitive when your actually pushing the needle... and glute you rarely feel a thing. ANd I also agree that depending on the gear, the quads can hurt quite a bit, even with human grade test prop, my thighs sometimes Aren't all that happy.. Delts are the best of both worlds, and call me weird but traps are fairly comfortable post injection, but sting a bit on entry. Tri-ceps are comfortable for both pinning and post injection for me at least.

And undertaker, I got a hand it to you... You ask a hell of alot of questions.. but at least your asking them before you go and start.. Unlike some people who don't think nearly enough about it. Although i'm surprised you haven't picked up alot of the answers during your time here already.

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[sesso]

i feel that anywhere but the glutes affects the quality of my workout

 

[UNDERTAKER]

I actually posted this along time ago, it just resurfaced

 

[Poobah]

I actually posted this along time ago, it just resurfaced

lol.. that would explain it then.. Me sorry.