8 week Recomp Tren/11-oxo/Furaza

[mirmod2002]

This log represents my attempt to track my results and to hold myself (quasi)accountable. I'm starting the log a couple weeks earlier than I'm actually starting the run because I am currently working over a rotational injury in my shoulder that compromises my Bi and Tri that has kept me from performing any significant push movements for nearly a month. But injury gives me an opportunity to focus on a whole body philosophy of fitness going forward and this log gives me a couple weeks to explore the minds of people that know much more about the topic than I do.

That said, if you've come here to s*** on what everybody else is doing to make yourself feel better then please listen closely because this next part is for you . . .

Oh WOW! I never knew that. I can't believe I'm such a twat. Thank you for the clarity. You are hands down the smartest person in this forum. I am going to follow your advice to the letter and sing your praises from blog to blog to let everybody know that they should come to you for all their fitness concerns. #urkingfitness

. . . now please move along.

If you're somebody that likes open and honest, free flowing informative conversations, even if the reality contradicts personal dogma, then you are more than welcome to participate in this with me. I want to learn as much as I can about the products, the process, supplementation support, the aftermath and everything else. So please feel free to offer advice, insight or any other constructive criticisms.

This will be an 8 week cycle dosed as below. Doses will remain the same for weeks 1-8 (probably):

- 11-X (LGI)/11-sterone (Brawn) @ 900mgs/day
- TB Carnage – Tren (Extreme Labs) @ 120mgs/day
- Furaza (Olympus Labs) @ 300mgs/day

Things I hope to learn (including but not limited to):

1. What types of carbohydrates and fats work best with these compounds? I don't know if certain carbohydrates or fats help or hamper the conversion of these PH's but my information gap here is one reason I'm waiting to fully develop a diet plan.
2. What support supplements (Tudca, hawthorn berry, B12, etc.) work best with these particular compounds? I’m seeing if I can introduce foods that give me the proper support vitamins and minerals instead of taking more supplements.
3. I'm wondering about lethargy. It wasn't bad with Helladrol. DMZ was brutal. I don't expect the current group to be overly troublesome but I ask you. And what do you do to counter balance lethargy?

Well, this is one hell of a long opening to not really say anything I realize. But, if you made it through all that then – Wow – you’re the type of person I hope helps me through all this. Because you're a warrior. So it begins . . .

 

[mixedup]

It looks good 120mg of the tren could be hard on bp and sleeping. I hope the furaz treats you good I ran 2 bottles didn't get much off it stano treated me better but I can't remember if my diet was on point during the run

 

[mirmod2002]

Mixup yeah I know the tren is high and I've heard insomnia can be an issue. But unfortunately I'm always on the higher end of things dose wise. Insomnia is already an issue but I'm staying conscious in that regard and will adjust if needed.
steve I actually perfer a topical. I read 11-x works well that way. I have 11-x and Furaza bottles I bought end of last year so I'll run those but I'll definitely try a topical if I run it again.

 

[mixedup]

Mixup yeah I know the tren is high and I've heard insomnia can be an issue. But unfortunately I'm always on the higher end of things dose wise. Insomnia is already an issue but I'm staying conscious in that regard and will adjust if needed.
steve I actually perfer a topical. I read 11-x works well that way. I have 11-x and Furaza bottles I bought end of last year so I'll run those but I'll definitely try a topical if I run it again.

I see nothing wrong with 120mg if you can keep bp in check

 

[mirmod2002]

Training Split:

*Monday - Chest and Back

*Tuesday- Legs and Abs

*Wednesday - Arms and 45 minutes to an hour Cardio

*Thursday - Back, Traps and Shoulder

*Friday - Chest and Legs

*Saturday- Hour Cardio and Abs

*Sunday - Yoga

 

[Nitro41]

Cool split! Definetly shakes up the normal splits Ive seen.

Subbed to see how your cycle goes.

 

[Chrisko]

Training Split: *Monday - Chest and Back *Tuesday- Legs and Abs *Wednesday - Arms and 45 minutes to an hour Cardio *Thursday - Back, Traps and Shoulder *Friday - Chest and Legs *Saturday- Hour Cardio and Abs *Sunday - Yoga

What's the breakdown of your split? Is it one day heavy and one day rep out(light)? Any particular reason for working certain body parts twice?

 

[Dma378]

Subbed

 

[mirmod2002]

Chrisko I've designed the split that way for a couple of reasons. 1st, yes I do go one day heavier and the next round I work more on refined or compound movements. The second reason is some of the injuries I'm gone through deal with over tension of one body part over another and doing things like chest and back together helps me balance out the stress on the rear delt, my rotar, my front pecs and shoulders. I've done the push-pull philosophy for a while & I just feel I need a bit more motion in my routines. Also I've thrown yoga in at the end because honestly stretching is about the best thing I've ever done for my muscles.

 

[Nitro41]

How has your stretching helped?
Im really losing flexibiltiy with more muscle mass i keep adding and feel like its affecting my posture and i can definetly tell its hurting my overhead pressing ability

 

[mirmod2002]

@Nitro first it helped eliminated nagging pains associated with stronger muscle groups pulling weaker muscle groups out of position. second is actually helped with overall muscle development and strength. I noticed as I got stronger and my flexibility diminished I got bigger knots in my muscles. I was activating fewer and fewer muscle fibers because the range of motion in the muscle was severely compacted. Stretching allowed me to activate more of the muscle instead of just pockets with knots.

 

[yates84]

Subbed.

 

[Chrisko]

What does your pct look like? What is the setup?

 

[mirmod2002]

I'm open to suggestions here. I've reseached the hell out of this and the best I can come up with is there are a couple staples and everything else is speculative as to how the body will react and what doses are adequate. But my PCT is set up as follows:

- Clomid 100mg/50mg/50mg/25mg

- Nolva 40mg/20mg/20mg/10mg

- Ostarine 20mg for 4 weeks

- Caradrine 20mg for 4 weeks

- Aromasin 12.5mg either ED or EOD

- HCGenerate

- DAA

 

[vujade]

drop the osta from pct... its too suppressive @ 20mg.... maybe you can get away with 5mg.
in the studies it was suppressive @ 3mg.

 

[mirmod2002]

Thanks Vu. I've read articles that echo your post that suppression can occur as low as 3mg or as high as 25mg. I'd assume I'll be ok without it. Given it's the one that is known to be suppressive at a dose no one can agree, it may be best, like you said, to drop it.

 

[Nitro41]

If you are running tren, then clomid will be SERM of choice in pct.

And Id reccomend running your AI for 6wks for pct, so 2wks past your SERM, then taper off the AI

 

[yates84]

I'm open to suggestions here. I've reseached the hell out of this and the best I can come up with is there are a couple staples and everything else is speculative as to how the body will react and what doses are adequate. But my PCT is set up as follows:

- Clomid 100mg/50mg/50mg/25mg

- Nolva 40mg/20mg/20mg/10mg

- Ostarine 20mg for 4 weeks

- Caradrine 20mg for 4 weeks

- Aromasin 12.5mg either ED or EOD

- HCGenerate

- DAA

You can run the clomid at 50/50/25/25. 100mg of clomid had me feeling real crazy, 50 is plenty imo. Have you already purchased the hcgenerate? It is way overpriced. You can get t force, that has higher fadgodia content, for a fraction of the cost. I don't think you need both serms, I say drop the nolva

 

[mirmod2002]

@Nitro What's the benefit of extending the AI for 2 additional weeks?

 

[Nitro41]

@Nitro What's the benefit of extending the AI for 2 additional weeks?

Prevent estrogen rebound

 

[mirmod2002]

Yates no I haven't purchased HCGenerate yet. I'll look into T-Force. And I appreciate the advice on Clomid. I'll take it.

 

[mirmod2002]

Prevent estrogen rebound

Thanks. Do you know if Clomid or Nolva have a hard rebound. I saw Arimidex does which is why I went with Aromasin. I thought about Formastane but I believe it converts to 4-hydroxytest (basically) which will suppress natural test production.

 

[vujade]

Thanks. Do you know if Clomid or Nolva have a hard rebound.
I saw Arimidex does which is why I went with Aromasin. I thought about Formastane but I believe
it converts to 4-hydroxytest (basically) which will suppress natural test production.

Any SERM will cause estrogen to rebound once you stop taking it if no AI is used. Thats one of
the reasons why you taper the SERM down, so that your normal estrogen production doesn't just
rebound back up all at once.

 

[mirmod2002]

Workout Log:

Hit legs & abs. Went old school; bare feet. Jump rope tore me up a bit, haha. Numbers aren’t impressive:

- Barbell Squat: 135 x 15 (4 sets)
- Barbell Calf Raises: 185 X 10 (3 sets)
- Jump Box Straight Leg Deadlift: 185 x 10 (3 sets)
- Variation on traditional sit ups: 25 (3 sets)
- Plank: anywhere from 60 sec to 2 min switching every 10 sec between a plank position perched on my forearms to a (almost) locked out push up position
- Last I take a spare truck tire lift it over and behind my head, touch my back and I throw on the floor as hard as possible focusing on contracting my abs through the movement.

It was more about making it out there tonight. I can blame the numbers on a midnight workout but truth is leg training has only been an honest part of my routine for a couple months. I know; I know. I know it’s a sin. I guess now is as good a time as any to give everyone a bit more background so you have a better idea of where I’m coming from.

First, I realize this reads like something out of Ripley’s Believe it or Not but I have all the scars as proof, haha.
I’m 5’8, 205. Currently 15% - 17% bf. All in my midsection. My grandpa is Pakistani. I swear our genes are coded that way, haha. Small town country kid. Farm country. Played every sport imaginable as a kid. Traveling Baseball and Club Soccer mainly. But I was on swim teams. Traveling volleyball teams. Like I said, the whole nine yards. Picked up Football in high school. Ran track. Ended up playing Rugby and running track for a D1 college. Failed out after three years. There was this thing called class; I guess . . . . Stopped working out. Went home. Got a job. Hated it. Went back to school. Failed out; that whole class thing again. Gained 50 pounds. Possibly went to county a couple times. May have been homeless for a spell. Went back to a community college so I could lie to myself about my position. Got an apartment that gave out free gym memberships. Started lifting again. Began running. Ran a ½. Lost 85 pounds. Began speed training. Trained in BJJ and Muay Thai. Planned to try out for USA’s national Rugby team. Popped a hamstring. Tore a calf. Started lifting for size. Worked at a GNC. This is in the days of the original M1T. At peak I maxed 345 bench and 495 squat. Deadlift I never maxed but worked with 405. Shrugs; I could rack 605 for 10. Around this time I went out to a bar. Met a girl. Fell in love. Changed my ways. Left community college and tried big boy college again. For real. Did ok. Had a baby. Got married. Graduated. Went to law school. Now I have a desk job with JPmorgan. I go “couples wedding showers.” I plan all my purchases around Giant Eagle’s gas points. I went to a craft store. I coach my son’s U5 soccer team. And I carry Oh the Places You Will Go by Dr. Seuss in my brief case.

Verbose? Yes. If you skipped it the recap is; I had periods where I was formidable opponent athletically and periods of extended inactivity. I began lifting again in earnest a little over a year ago. However, foolishly. Now I did work hard. Ate good. Gained and trimmed. But I workout in my garage because I’m fairly busy. So I started with a bench only. So basically all I did push movements. I figured at least I was working out. I starting with 155 x 10 and before my shoulder injury I was back to 245 x 10. I was push pressing the spare tire 100 to 250 times per set. But it came at a cost. Since I had neglected my back and never stretched, my chest and front delts started overpowering my rear delts and lats. This pulled my whole right side forward and in. This caused injuries to my rotator cuff, bicep and tricep that took me from 245 x 10 to not being able to do a push up on my knees. So I bought a Powertech Power Rack and for the past couple months I’ve rehabbed my shoulder. Focused on stretching, legs and back. I did my first push movement workout a couple days ago and it was ugly. But at least I made it through the other side and I feel ready to put a little weight back on the bar.

I promise never to write anything this long again. (But remember I went to law school. We’re long winded)

 

[mirmod2002]

Been a sec. Wanted to update the progress. Lifting is good. Strength is coming back and I'm getting close to feeling like I can push it again. I've done a couple push exercises here and I've gone up in weight everytime. Everything is still light however. I'm going to bench tonight and I'm going to see how I'm feeling.

I go to the doctor on the on the 9th (this Thursady). I'm getting tests, a general check up and a once over on my "arm" issues. If everything comes back good and I get thorugh tonight's workout, I'm starting this cycle Monday the 13th. Getting fairly anxious at this point. But I'm trying to stay level headed and not push my self too fast. Be a bitch to immediately reinjure myself.

On Cycle support for now is:

Hawthorne Berry for BP
Tudaca for Liver
N2Guard for general cycle support
CoQ10 for heart support
Fish Oils for Heart, Brain and Lipid support

Any additions or subtractions I should consider?

 

[Nitro41]

Prolactin control if your running tren, especially at 120mg

 

[mirmod2002]

Prolactin control if your running tren, especially at 120mg

Thanks! You think adding HghPro by AI and NOW's P5P will be effective for prolactin regulation or is there something stronger you'd suggest?

 

[Nitro41]

I have only ever used pharma grade caber, or a quality RC prami.

Both did excellent and can be had for very good money. So its cheaper and works better, you cant go wrong with either option. I like running my prami @ .3-.4ml everyday. No stomach issues and absolutley zaps any prolactin issues right away.

 

[jason267]

check out Inhibit P
but pharma might be best @ 120mg Tren

 

[mirmod2002]

Lifts yesterday were good. Tried a few press movements to gauge the rotator even though it was an arm day. While the weight went up the pain did as well. However, I tried close grip and I had little to no pain in the muscle during this movement. Arm workout however went:

ISO Curls - (45lbs) 4 x 12
Brbl Curls - (90lbs) 3 x 10
Seated Dmbl Curls - (35lbs) 3 x 10
Brbl Ovr Hd Ext (90lbs) 4 x 12
Tri Kickback (25lbs) 3 x 10

Went to the doctor today. BP and all vitals are textbook. I go to a sports med doc so he checks my shoulder injury as well. It's a weird injury because strength is there. I can feel it. Which is great because I couldn't do any press movement for the past couple months. But the pain won't go away. Doctor confirmed that the strength is there through tests; however, he feels that there is still a lot on inflammation in the rotator and possible some cartilage tears. He prescribed an anti-inflammatory med. Going to try this for a few weeks and continue rehabbing which will push my start day back a couple weeks at least. If I'm not 75% better by my next visit in 3 weeks we're going to image the muscle and I'll get a cortizone shot. This is the last step before we discuss scoping it. I hope the meds work and I can get running here but, again, the worst thing I can do is be foolish and hurt the area more. We'll see.

On a different topic - researched a lot of on-cycle supports and so far I've gone with:

Ar1macare Pro - OL
AD-3 PCT - Lecheek Nutrition
Taurine - NOW (1g - looking to take 5g or 6g to battle back pumps which I can get without ph's)
Fish Oils (GNC Brand)

My only concern is both Ar1macare and AD-3 have Arimastane (75mg in AD-3 and 70mg in Ar1macare) - is this overkill?

 

[medinacirilo]

Great log, and awesome story! Way to pick yourself up by the bootstraps and get it together

 

[MTPMJM]

All that Arimistane might dry out your joints, I'd probably just go with Arim1care

 

[mirmod2002]

All that Arimistane might dry out your joints, I'd probably just go with Arim1care

I'm not sure how it compares but Hdrol really dried my joints so I thank you because that is a concern.

 

[MTPMJM]

Ive run hdrol and ive run arimistane at 100mg a day, hdrol didnt do anything noticiable to joint comfort, however ostarine+arimistane def messed with my knees and elbows to some extent

 

[mirmod2002]

Ive run hdrol and ive run arimistane at 100mg a day, hdrol didnt do anything noticiable to joint comfort, however ostarine+arimistane def messed with my knees and elbows to some extent

Have you tried Formastane? Did that play with your joints at all? Is drying of joints common to AI's in general?

 

[MTPMJM]

Ive used forma, didnt bother me all that much. I think its because arimistane functions as a cortisol inhibitor

 

[mirmod2002]

That suggests 11oxo may be rough because of its ability to regulate cortisol.

 

[MTPMJM]

Keep your omega 3 intake up and maybe run some ciccus and/or glucosamine/condroitin/msm/hyalaraunic acid and you should be okay

 

[yates84]

Have you tried Formastane? Did that play with your joints at all? Is drying of joints common to AI's in general?

Lower estrogen =sore joints. All ai's will do this if your estrogen is too low

 

[mirmod2002]

Keep your omega 3 intake up and maybe run some ciccus and/or glucosamine/condroitin/msm/hyalaraunic acid and you should be okay

I do have a joint formula with all that. I'll make sure I have enough and incorp into my cycle support.

 

[mirmod2002]

Lower estrogen =sore joints. All ai's will do this if your estrogen is too low

Watching your OL log closely. Want to see how it treats you. I imported SD and M1T from across the pond for seperate bulking cycles this fall and winter. Need to get through thid one first though, haha

 

[yates84]

Watching your OL log closely. Want to see how it treats you. I imported SD and M1T from across the pond for seperate bulking cycles this fall and winter. Need to get through thid one first though, haha

Cool, glad to have you! Looking forward to the tr3n next week!

 

[mirmod2002]

2nd day of this anti-inflammatory. Honestly I can feel less tension on my shoulder, bi and tri. Feels looser. Gave the area a good stretch.
Still doing rehab band work.

Lift was legs and chest but ended up just legs and stretching. Been doing legs barefoot and I'm liking it.

Squat: 135/15 (4)
Straight Leg Jump Box Deads: 205/8 (4)
Standing Calf Raises: 205/10 (3)
Kneeling Jump Squat (best I can describe it. Its an explosive move starting on the ground, on knees hands at side or on head and you burst to a squat position, stand and repeat.)

 

[mirmod2002]

I've been researching Furaza a bit. I believe it was Vida's profile that said a lot of the compound is destroyed by stomach acid and that addng it to an oil before consumption may help more of the furazadrol survive. Has any heard this or done something like this before?

 

[mirmod2002]

Rehab. Rehab. Rehab. That’s my routine. Saturday I didn’t lift. Life events. No issues just a busy day. Sunday I worked Back (basically). My current routine is not routine. I’m basically flying by the seat of my pants currently doing what feels good that day. But I’m still lifting all body parts, sans Chest and Shoulders, once a week. Once on-cycle I will stick to the routine I outlined here earlier and not deviate. I want a base for comparison so I’m going to track the change in weight for specific exercises over the 8 weeks. Sunday’s workout went:
-DB Reverse Flys: 50lbs x 10 (4)
Super-set
-BB Overhand Bent Over Rows: 135lbs x 10 (4) – (Keeping elbows strictly at my side to minimize impact on rotator)
-Shrugs: 225lbs x 20 (4)
-Good Mornings: 95lbs x 10 (4)

 

[yates84]

I've been researching Furaza a bit. I believe it was Vida's profile that said a lot of the compound is destroyed by stomach acid and that addng it to an oil before consumption may help more of the furazadrol survive. Has any heard this or done something like this before?

Oils and fats will help any compound absorb better, I like to take my dose with mct oil. Olive oil works good too

 

[mirmod2002]

Oils and fats will help any compound absorb better, I like to take my dose with mct oil. Olive oil works good too

I wasn't expecting to hear MCT oils. But its a pleasant surprise. Embarssingly enough I didn't think about MCT supplementation. That's almost as bad as saying I forgot protien and aminos. I should run and hide. But since I won't, haha, do you desolve all your ph's in MCT oil? What brand do you use?

 

[yates84]

I wasn't expecting to hear MCT oils. But its a pleasant surprise. Embarssingly enough I didn't think about MCT supplementation. That's almost as bad as saying I forgot protien and aminos. I should run and hide. But since I won't, haha, do you desolve all your ph's in MCT oil? What brand do you use?

Just throw a little oil in your shake or drink a little behind your dose, no need for any mad science bro

 

[mirmod2002]

Early morning lift today before work. Hit Chest and Back which means I did rehab band work like a mofo. I did however bench according to my doctor's instructions. He said I should be able to go as heavy as I'd like as long as I stick to close grip keeping my elbows strict to my sides. Close Grip went: 135lbs (where big boys got to warm up) x 10 (4). Probably focus on close grip for a few weeks until I feel the rotator can handle the stress associated with flat bench. Time to swell the Tri's I guess.

135lbs benched for reps and sets with little or no pain has been my target since the injury. This means I'm getting really close to starting. I may start as early as next Monday if I feel I have things sufficiently under control that I can create a repeatable routine for 8 weeks.

My cycle support arrived last Friday. The only thing I added not a part of the initial list is N2Guard

 

[mirmod2002]

Quick update. lifts over the past few days have been good. Feeling stronger getting a little more endurance in the muscle and feeling power from the bottom of the rep to the top of the rep. It's a good feeling and I don't want to push myself too hard. But I feel like I'm getting back.

still not doing any overhead press or bench press movement other than flat and decline close grip. Been sticking strictly to legs back arms abs and cardio for the past few days and I'll probably stick to it pretty much throughout the cycle.

all my support supps are in. i sat down last night and researched the half life of the PH's. based on my research it seems taking pills four times a day every 6 hours is going to work best. But when I started running the numbers on how many pills I'll have to take each time and then aggregate for each day it actually is UNBELIEVABLE. it actually has me a bit concerned that all the plastic casing from the pills will adversely affect my system to some degree. So I've been researching heavily on how to make solutions or just how to mix these things up in an oil base so that I don't have to ingest all this casing from the pills.

if I can get everything in order over the next couple days then I'm going to begin on Monday. However more realistically next Monday would be best because I would like to get myself in a schedule where I'm waking up at about 5 to 5:30 a.m. everyday to work out.