Very Confused

[Wolfe08]

Okay so I want to do a cycle in May, it will be my first AAS cycle (i've done 2 ph cycles) so I've been researching a lot and once I finally find a cycle that seems to be good I read this book "chemical muscle enhancement" and it's TOTALLY different from what I have heard from this board and various other places...I was planning on doing a 12 week cycle of test E, with the frist 4 weeks including dbol, and was thinking about deca or EQ as well...BUT this book says, weeks 1-4 deca, weeks 9-12 test prop and oxanadrolne (anavar I think) and then much more giving me like some damn 36 week cycle (not all ON of course, but broken up) this is really confusing the hell out of me, cause now I have no idea what to do...and on top of that others tell me oh just do a dbol/deca cycle for your frist cycle, but then I heard, oh now a days people do test only for there first cycle...wtf...please help guy...


If anyone wonders...I'm 5'9" 170lbs 8-10%bf
I want a cycle that will put on 20-30 lbs...that's why I was thinking bulk with dbol+test then somewhat cut with either test alone or EQ or Deca...so then I'll have weight to spare at the end of the cycle so when I lose a little during PCT I'll still be up 15-20 lbs (goal 180'ish lbs at 4-6% BF)

 

[Strateg0s]

If you are set on doing a cycle one way or another, then test should be sufficient by itself for your first time, as long as you eat and train properly. Adding EQ would help you EAT enough, if you think it would be a problem to chow down ~350g of protein/day. D-bol will work and speed things up, but it will also give you moon face, etc. plus you will have strength gains which are disproportionate to your connective tissue development, so you invite injury if you don't maintain the discipline to use exacting form. Why not just run something like this:
1: 800mg test-e + an anti-estrogen
2: 600mg test-e + an anti-estrogen + 2x250iu HCG if you've got it
3-12: 400mg test-e + an anti-estrogen + 2x250iu HCG if you've got it
14-17: PCT

That should do the job. No need to get fancy and expensive. Other things might be better, somewhat, but you aren't going to know or notice much difference now. Go once by itself, then you always have that as a reference point.

 

[gobig1]

Strategos laid out a good first cycle......K.I.S.S. principle works well with steroid cycles. With rare exceptions, every cycle should include some type of testosterone and without exception every cycle has PCT at the end. Spend a week or two just reading posts and you will get a feel for the right/wrong way to do things.

 

[Skye]

Okay so I want to do a cycle in May, it will be my first AAS cycle (i've done 2 ph cycles) so I've been researching a lot and once I finally find a cycle that seems to be good I read this book "chemical muscle enhancement" and it's TOTALLY different from what I have heard from this board and various other places...I was planning on doing a 12 week cycle of test E, with the frist 4 weeks including dbol, and was thinking about deca or EQ as well...BUT this book says, weeks 1-4 deca, weeks 9-12 test prop and oxanadrolne (anavar I think) and then much more giving me like some damn 36 week cycle (not all ON of course, but broken up) this is really confusing the hell out of me, cause now I have no idea what to do...and on top of that others tell me oh just do a dbol/deca cycle for your frist cycle, but then I heard, oh now a days people do test only for there first cycle...wtf...please help guy...


If anyone wonders...I'm 5'9" 170lbs 8-10%bf
I want a cycle that will put on 20-30 lbs...that's why I was thinking bulk with dbol+test then somewhat cut with either test alone or EQ or Deca...so then I'll have weight to spare at the end of the cycle so when I lose a little during PCT I'll still be up 15-20 lbs (goal 180'ish lbs at 4-6% BF)

Nothing wrong with your first plan. Test + dbol + deca = very nice bread and butter cycle. the is tried and true, ran thousands of times. it works. Use the dbol to get started while you wait for the longer ester to kick in. I wrote a long post on first cycle options, test only vs bread and butter. both have there pros and cons.
http://www.chemicalfitness.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3574

There are always someone coming up with complex cycle and theory about how to get bigger. Or some fancy designer steroid. funny thing is that most people that are big use about the same 5 common items all the time. Test, deca, EQ, tren, and orals to modify things. Most of the pros just use a lot of test when it comes down to it. (JMO)

here is what I would do:
25 to 40mg dbol ed for weeks 1 to 4
400 to 600mg of test e, cyp a week weeks 1 to 12
optional 250iu of hcg twice a week weeks 5 to 14
10mg of nolvadex ed weeks 1 to 14
start pct week 15 with 40mg of nolvadex ed for 2 weeks then 20mg ed for another 2 weeks.

With deca
25 to 40mg dbol ed for weeks 1 to 6 (I get blood work done after week 4 but I am paranoid)
400 to 600mg of test e, cyp, or test deca a week weeks 1 to 14
300 to 400mg of deca weeks 1 to 13
250iu of hcg twice a week weeks 1 to 16
10mg of nolvadex ed weeks 1 to 16
start pct with 40mg of nolvadex ed for 2 weeks then 20mg ed for another 2 weeks.

 

[raybravo]

yeah the beginner cycles of CME are really bad actually, dont follow them, follow a normal cycle suggested by the memebrs on this board:

test enanthate -500 mg for 8 weeks.
dbol- 30 mg for first 5 weeks .

followed by post cycle therapy, and also using proper supplementation during this period is an excellent and most efficient way to start off ur steroid use. btw, no need to try to bulk and cut within the same cycle, keep cardio 5 times a week in there, plus keep carbs off 3-4 hrs before bed and u will stay lean while adding significant muscle mass assuming ure eating a lot of protein and making up for surplus calories during the other times.
btw, i suggest u stop the cycle after 8 weeks becos beyond that point, gains slow down and most people start overeating to force more gains and end up getting fat, and i dont think thats what u want.

 

[Wolfe08]

after hearing all the imput I think I'd like to do a 12 week cycle
1-4 dbol 25-30mgs
1-12 Test E 400-500

14-17
Pct: Nolva, CEE, ZMA

I plan on looking into PCT a lot more so no need to comment...my question is will I need HCG for this cycle and if so how should I administer it...ALso might use Finasteride or Nizal (whatever it is) for hairloss, not sure which one, leaning towards Nizal cause it wont hurt gains...also should I run Nolva during cycle, when I did my ph cycles I had pretty much no sigh of gyno...thanks

 

[raybravo]

yeah u need hcg, and its nizral, its a shampoo, and yeah its good to use that too. and yes, again use some 10-20 mg nolva per day during the cycle, may help..
and research more on pct, read some of the other threads and u'll know more about it .

 

[CarryOnTheChaos]

I would administer the HCG twice weekly @ 250iu's sub-q....slin pins are obviously fine too

COTC

 

[Wolfe08]

okay thanks guys for all the help...just a couple more quesitons...Should I start the Nolva during week 1 or wait till say week 4, because I heard nolva might hinder gains slightly, and I dont thin i'm prone to gyno, but I'd like to be on the safe side...Also what about Armidex or Letro for water retention...? And will the test make me more hungry (like I noticed on my 1ad/4ad cycle) because it's hard for me to eat over 3,000 cal's/250protein a day regularly

 

[raybravo]

i think more than the test making u hungry, your desire for gains has to do that for u, if u dont eat u dont gain, if u have this thought in mind, why wont u force urself to eat?
anyway, u can start nolva from week 3 onwards, let the estro mediated gains get ur body's weight up a little the first 14 days, this is good tactic.. and also pretty safe.

and u dont really need an anti aromatase to keep water off,just use a dandellion root capsule with ur meals and u will be allright..and its much cheaper.

 

[Cuffs]

after hearing all the imput I think I'd like to do a 12 week cycle
1-4 dbol 25-30mgs
1-12 Test E 400-500

14-17
Pct: Nolva, CEE, ZMA

my question is will I need HCG for this cycle and if so how should I administer it...

You do not NEED HCG for this type of cycle. Although, it would help with recovery.

The cycle you laid out is a great first cycle.