Transdermal furuza?

[reps4jesus]

I have been very interested in finding a stronger legal alternative to stanozolol (winny) than furuza. It has to be ran at such high doses due to poor bioavailability (300mg min).
This got me thinking about a transdermal form, possibly leading to the compound being more effective.
It's molecular weight is around 400 I believe, and I was reading some literature by Patrick Arnold (ill post the link) leading me to believe non methyls under 500 can be effective in transdermal form. Of course many other factors could play into this.

Just want to hear some feedback from you guys. Especially you chem guys out there.

I know a lot of guys including myself would be very interested in this if it turned out to be possible/effective. Non or at least Not many legal PH/ds can boost endurance and athletic performance like winny and something along these lines would definitely be a win.
http://www3.netrition.com/cgi/article_display.cgi?magazine_id=RIP&issue_number=8&article_id=6

Hit me with opinions. Especially you reps that could possibly get something like this started.

 

[jbryand101b]

You would have to have it without the thp ether.
Enzymes in the blood aren't enough to remove it, this is normally removed in the stomach acids or liver.

The compound is inactive until the thp ether is removed.

Would def be nice though.

 

[reps4jesus]

How would this be done?

 

[jbryand101b]

The buyer would have to ask the supplier/lab

 

[reps4jesus]

The buyer would have to ask the supplier/lab

So this is possible?

 

[jbryand101b]

Yes

 

[musclemaker]

Get a bottle of SALVO from Iron Legion and make your own transdermal! Heres some info about it:


Directions for use:
1. Weigh out the required amount of your active ingredient. 2. Optional: Remove label. 3. Use a funnel to add your powdered active ingredient directly into your Salvo bottle. (Note: To prevent overflow, it is recommended to perform this step very slowly. If overflow seems inevitable, perform steps 4, 5, and 6 before adding any more of your powdered active ingredient.) 4. Shake well. 5. Place your Salvo bottle in a basin of hot (near boiling) water, and let sit for 15-20 minutes. The bottle should be submerged to the shoulder. The bottle-cap, if on, should not be in-contact with the water. 6. Remove from basin and allow to cool before use.




Product Description
Iron Legion Salvo is the most advanced topical solution available. It allows for very highly concentrated solutions, and contains the most potent topical skin-permeation enhancers commercially-available.
By purchasing bulk powders and using Salvo’s advanced delivery matrix, athletes and bodybuilders can obtain excellent results at a wallet-friendly price.


Sustained Release
Passive diffusion through the layers of the dermis creates a time-release effect that allows for sustained blood-levels of the active ingredients, and convenient once-daily dosing.



Increased bioavailability
Increased bioavailability through avoidance of the first-pass effect of hepatic metabolism can be a clear benefit of topical administration – particularly in the cases of active, non-17a-methylated hormones.



Activity Enhancers
The intercellular lipids of the stratum corneum are regarded as the major barrier to the permeation of lipophilic compounds. Salvo contains potent ingredients which modulate this lipid matrix & affect the non-polar permeation-enhancement route. These ingredients include thiazone, which is 3-12x more potent than azone as a permeation-enhancer for lipophilic molecules, and nerolidol, a lipophilic terpene which has been shown to be highly effective at facilitating the delivery of lipophilic molecules. It also includes oleic acid and stearyl methacrylate, fatty-acid derivatives which insert themselves between the hydrocarbon tails of intercellular stratum corneum lipids, and which thus disrupt lipid packing, increase fluidity, and promote diffusion through the external layer of the stratum corneum.


Super-Saturation
Salvo utilizes a volatile:nonvolatile co-solvent vehicle to create a state of supersaturation, which helps compounds cross the exterior layers of the stratum corneum. As the volatile component evaporates on your skin, the solution becomes more concentrated, and eventually becomes super-saturated, resulting in increased thermodynamic ‘push’, and enhanced penetration.




Technical Notes:




-Salvo is generally compatible with active ingredients that have LogP values of 1.5-4.0. Salvo’s system is designed for use with lipophilic ingredients, does not affect the polar route of stratum corneum permeation, and thus compounds with lower lipophilicity will not partition adequately into the SC lipids. Compounds with LogP values higher than 4.0 might have such high affinity for those same SC lipids that they accumulate there & don’t reach the lower levels of the epidermis at reasonable concentrations. -Molecular weight is a good indicator of chemical surface area, which is directly related to diffusion coefficient. As such, compounds with a MW >500 are not expected to work well in this topical system. -’Melting point’ is an indicator of solubility in skin lipids. In general, compounds with low melting points are more compatible with topical solutions than compounds with high melting points. -Ionized species will permeate less readily than free acid forms.

 

[reps4jesus]

Get a bottle of SALVO from Iron Legion and make your own transdermal! Heres some info about it:

Directions for use:
1. Weigh out the required amount of your active ingredient. 2. Optional: Remove label. 3. Use a funnel to add your powdered active ingredient directly into your Salvo bottle. (Note: To prevent overflow, it is recommended to perform this step very slowly. If overflow seems inevitable, perform steps 4, 5, and 6 before adding any more of your powdered active ingredient.) 4. Shake well. 5. Place your Salvo bottle in a basin of hot (near boiling) water, and let sit for 15-20 minutes. The bottle should be submerged to the shoulder. The bottle-cap, if on, should not be in-contact with the water. 6. Remove from basin and allow to cool before use.

Product Description
Iron Legion Salvo is the most advanced topical solution available. It allows for very highly concentrated solutions, and contains the most potent topical skin-permeation enhancers commercially-available.
By purchasing bulk powders and using Salvo's advanced delivery matrix, athletes and bodybuilders can obtain excellent results at a wallet-friendly price.

Sustained Release
Passive diffusion through the layers of the dermis creates a time-release effect that allows for sustained blood-levels of the active ingredients, and convenient once-daily dosing.

Increased bioavailability
Increased bioavailability through avoidance of the first-pass effect of hepatic metabolism can be a clear benefit of topical administration - particularly in the cases of active, non-17a-methylated hormones.

Activity Enhancers
The intercellular lipids of the stratum corneum are regarded as the major barrier to the permeation of lipophilic compounds. Salvo contains potent ingredients which modulate this lipid matrix & affect the non-polar permeation-enhancement route. These ingredients include thiazone, which is 3-12x more potent than azone as a permeation-enhancer for lipophilic molecules, and nerolidol, a lipophilic terpene which has been shown to be highly effective at facilitating the delivery of lipophilic molecules. It also includes oleic acid and stearyl methacrylate, fatty-acid derivatives which insert themselves between the hydrocarbon tails of intercellular stratum corneum lipids, and which thus disrupt lipid packing, increase fluidity, and promote diffusion through the external layer of the stratum corneum.

Super-Saturation
Salvo utilizes a volatile:nonvolatile co-solvent vehicle to create a state of supersaturation, which helps compounds cross the exterior layers of the stratum corneum. As the volatile component evaporates on your skin, the solution becomes more concentrated, and eventually becomes super-saturated, resulting in increased thermodynamic 'push', and enhanced penetration.

Technical Notes:

-Salvo is generally compatible with active ingredients that have LogP values of 1.5-4.0. Salvo's system is designed for use with lipophilic ingredients, does not affect the polar route of stratum corneum permeation, and thus compounds with lower lipophilicity will not partition adequately into the SC lipids. Compounds with LogP values higher than 4.0 might have such high affinity for those same SC lipids that they accumulate there & don't reach the lower levels of the epidermis at reasonable concentrations. -Molecular weight is a good indicator of chemical surface area, which is directly related to diffusion coefficient. As such, compounds with a MW >500 are not expected to work well in this topical system. -'Melting point' is an indicator of solubility in skin lipids. In general, compounds with low melting points are more compatible with topical solutions than compounds with high melting points. -Ionized species will permeate less readily than free acid forms.

Yeah! I have thought about this however how would I take care of this thp problem?

 

[jbryand101b]

He didn't read my post, you would have to ask a chemist
Def would require something as acidic as stomach acid.

 

[g0hardorgohom]

I'll see what we can do.

 

[Olympus Labs]

jbry how worthwhile would this be in td granted we need to make the supplier custom make it without the thp. Getting it made from the supplier is no problem but whats the potential worth in terms of results?

 

[rosemont83]

This is pretty cool.
Subbed.

 

[jbryand101b]

jbry how worthwhile would this be in td granted we need to make the supplier custom make it without the thp. Getting it made from the supplier is no problem but whats the potential worth in terms of results?

I'd have to look up the molecular weight to know for sure how good it'd be.

But if it's below 300, it'd def be worth while.
Fura and trest stacked would pretty much be the best otc combo on the market in terms of gains vs sides.

The thp ether version requires such a high dose d/t much of the compound not surviving first pass metabolism

The thp group gets cleaved off in the acidic environment of the stomach/small intestines, an still has to make it past the liver before it hits circulation.

 

[jbryand101b]

The molecular weight of furazabol (mitolan) the 17a methyl counterpart, is 330.5

Fura thp ether mw is 401.

That's a significant difference the thp ether group makes.

I'd guess removal of the thp ether group would put this compound under 300.

Could be wrong, but it'd def be low enough for effective td application

 

[mw1]

The molecular weight of furazabol (mitolan) the 17a methyl counterpart, is 330.5

Fura thp ether mw is 401.

That's a significant difference the thp ether group makes.

I'd guess removal of the thp ether group would put this compound under 300.

Could be wrong, but it'd def be low enough for effective td application

Yes you would definitely want it around 300. Anything higher in mw will probably give you issues with mass product

 

[reps4jesus]

The molecular weight of furazabol (mitolan) the 17a methyl counterpart, is 330.5

Fura thp ether mw is 401.

That's a significant difference the thp ether group makes.

I'd guess removal of the thp ether group would put this compound under 300.

Could be wrong, but it'd def be low enough for effective td application

Yeah I had thought it was around 400. Take out the thp and we got ourselves a more effective delivery of furuza. Hopefully.

 

[Olympus Labs]

I will get the supplier to make this at the end of summer / early fall, way to many releases stacked on one another for now. Have a few more interesting products in mind as well for end of summer/fall release.