HCG

Sir Foxx

Sir Foxx

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I'm going to use HCG this time around during my 20-weeker. My plan is to use between 250-500iu's per week. I've come across 2 different dosing patterns, one saying do 2 injects per week on say a Monday and Thursday spacing or do 2 injects per week on a Saturday/Sunday spacing. I'm new to HCG, so which one is preferable or does it matter? Also, my plan is to run this the entire 20 weeks of the cycle. Is this too much?

On a side note, I'm also going to use Proviron during the cycle as an anti-e. My plan is to start it up around week 8 and run it through week 20. Any thoughts?

The cycle consists of this:

Week 1-20: Test Enanthate 750mgs weekly
Weeks 1-4: Dianabol 50mgs daily
Weeks 4-13: Deca-Durabolin 600 mgs weekly
Weeks 14-20: Tren Enanthate 400mgs weekly
Weeks 17-20: M4OHN 40mgs daily
 

glenihan

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personally i would (and i'm going to go with) a mon/thurs injection scheme as its what swale recommends although plenty of people have success with sat/sun ... it just seems to make more sense logically to go with mon/thurs

you'll be fine going 20 weeks with it, i wouldn't go over 500iu a week though

and the proviron should work great i'm sure you'll be very pleased with it

my only question is why not start the deca week 1? it takes so long to kick in, the way you have it when its really getting going well, you'll be stopping it
 

judge-mental

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Very good points
BTW have you ever combined tren and mohn?
 
Sir Foxx

Sir Foxx

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This will be my first experience with Tren. I really liked how things turned out on my last cycle using M4OHN during the last 4 weeks(other than the acne) so I thought I would use it again. Do you see a problem with the Tren\M4OHN at the same time?

Regarding the Deca, I've always seen results around week 5 of using it and figured that running it 10 weeks this time would be enough. I suppose I could go ahead and add it to the beginning of the cycle, I have to think about it as this is the most stuff I've ever used and for the longest time. I feel I'm on the edge of doing too much as it is.
 

judge-mental

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There is some good info on that WRT prog gyno in the "Anti-prog" thread. basically its been suspected that stacking any nandro derivatives is not too safe, although the response is personal WRT prog gyno, and one must tread lightly in this matter. taking proviron is a good step in the safe direction.
 

Chemist63

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Here is a quote from another post:

I advise my AAS patients to use small amounts of HCG (250IU to 500IU) two days each week, right from the beginning of the cycle. This serves to maintain testicular form and function. It makes more sense to me to keep the horse in the barn, so to speak, then to have to chase it across three counties later on. I am also a big fan of maintaining estrogen within physiological ranges. Both therapies have been shown to hasten recovery.

Any more than 500IU of HCG per day causes too much aromatase activity. Some feel aromatase is actually toxic to the Leydig cells of the testes. You are then inducing primary hypogonadism (which is permanent) while treating steroid-induced secondary (hypogonadotrophic) hypogonadism (which is temporary--hopefully).

If 250IU or 500IU on two days each week isn?t enough to stave off testicular atrophy, then I recommend using it more days each week (as opposed to taking larger doses). In fact, I wouldn?t mind having a guy use 250IU per day ALL THROUGH the cycle. Those that have tell me they thus avoid that edgy, burned-out feeling they usually get. They also say they simply feel better each day. Subjective reports, to be sure, but they are hard not to appreciate. Especially when HCG is so inexpensive.

The testes are then ready, willing and able to again produce testosterone at the end of the cycle. LH levels rise fairly rapidly, but endogenous testosterone production is limited by lack of use. I also want to make sure a SERM, such as Clomid or Nolvadex, is at effective serum dosage (around 100mg QD for Clomid, 20-40mg QD for Nolvadex) when serum androgen levels drop to a concentration roughly equal to 200mg of testosterone per week. That is when androgenic inhibition at the HP no longer dominates over estrogenic antagonism with respect to inducing LH production. Of course, if the fellow has been doing Clomid or Nolvadex all along the way (and I now prefer Nolvadex over Clomid, due to the possibility of negative sides from the Clomid), he is all set to simply continue it at the end (no need to switch from one to the other). BTW, I see no evidence of any benefit in using BOTH SERM?s at the same time. I used to think a couple of weeks of the SERM was enough; now I like to see an entire month after the last shot of AAS (and migration of long to short esters as the cycle matures). Tapering the SERM is probably a good idea during the last week, as well.

I want my patients to stop taking HCG within a week after the end of the cycle. The testosterone production it induces will further inhibit recovery, as will using Androgel, or any other testosterone preparation, while in recovery. There is no escaping this, as there is no such thing as a ?bridge?. Just because you are not inhibiting the HPTA for the entire 24 hours does not mean you are not suppressing it at all. IOW, you can?t ?fool? the body?it is smarter than you are.

I like Arimidex during the cycle (in fact, consider use of an AI while taking aromatisables a necessity) but it ABSOLUTELY should not be used post cycle (even though it has been shown to increase LH production) because the risk of driving estrogen too low, and therefore further damaging an already compromised Lipid Profile, is too great (this also drives libido back into the ground?and we don?t want that, do we?).

All this is meant to get my guys through recovery as fast as possible (the real goal, yes?). So far, all of them who have tried it have reported they are recovering faster than when they have tried other
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Sir Foxx

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Ok, I have access to either 1500iu amps or 5000iu amps. I figure doing 500ius a week, comes to 10000ius for the entire cycle. Which amp would one recommend? I've read that HCG can go bad so I'm thinking that 10weeks might be too long to draw out of 1 amp(5000iu amp).
 

glenihan

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10 weeks is ok (although the upper limit) if they equal out to about the same price when all things are considered i'd go with the 1500ius
 
Sir Foxx

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Price is very different. $15 per 1500iu amp and $20 per 5000iu amp.
 
jmh80

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I saw Bioman report that the HCG he had frozen in the pins were working fine. So, I'd get the 5000 iu, draw up 250 or 500 into each pin (I guess a slin pin would work?) then freeze all but the first few that you'd need, and refrig them.

This stuff can be sub-q injected right?
 

glenihan

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yeah sub-q is fine or you can mix it with your gear IM
 

pumpinfina

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i use 25-50 mg clomid every other day, this seems to keep my boys down. HCG on the other hand only drops my boys for 3 hours then they atrophy again. From personal experience HCG doesn't do **** for me except burn a hole through my wallet
 
Frank Reynolds

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how long should one run HCG after their last shot? I will come off of a 100mg prop ed/ 50mg winy ed and wanna run the hcg/novla.. I am going to start hcg in my 5th week of my 8 weeks cycle..

I will probally run 250Iu twice a week..

D-
 

glenihan

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run it up until pct if pct starts monday and you're shooting hcg mon/thurs shoot the last thurs before PCT ... why are you using it for an 8 week cycle though? you don't need it
 
exnihilo

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personally, I'd go with 250iu EOD, and see how that treats you. If you are still noticing some atrophy you can bump it up.
 
Sir Foxx

Sir Foxx

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I've ordered the HCG but it is only the amps of powder. Do I need this(30 ML of multidose, non-pyrogenic, sterile water. 0.9% Benzyl Alcohol) or this(30 ML's of Benzyl Alcohol)? Forgive my ignorance, all I've seen is people say BA. I'm leaning towards thinking that I need the BA water(first choice). Am I right?
 

Wolfe08

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How long of a cycle length should you use HCG...anything over 10 weeks or 12 or 14 or...?
 

Strateg0s

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Does anyone know whether HCG *could* be safely shipped in a loose form, i.e. outside of an ampule? Could this HCG powder be mixed with bacteriostatic water and then sterile filtered (0.20um) into a sterile vial? Or would the powder itself be quickly degraded if not kept in an ampule? Inquiring minds want to know.

And Sir Foxx, bacteriostatic water is what you are looking for. That has a little bit of BA in it. There is no reason to use straight BA.
 

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