liver toxicity discussion

[Snicket63]

sup guys, sitting around on a Saturday morning and just finished a long pull workout just relaxing and i assume some of you guys are doing the same. Lets have a little discussion on liver toxicity of some orals.

so do you guys thing the liver thing is overblown and its possible to do long cycles of orals if you use the right stuff? (under 25mg of methyls)
does 1mg of a methyl = 1 mg of another methyl? for example. 12mg of m sten would be safer than 48 mg of dmz?
if your urine is crystal clear does it mean that your liver is probably doing fine and if it gets darker can you lay off the orals for about a week then continue untill dark urine again?
some stuff is given to aids patients and stuff like that for i believe years strait. you guys think that proves that methyls aren't as bad as people make em out to be?

looking forward to your guys input

 

[kaikara]

I've been slowly lengthening my cycles. I started with your standard 6 weeks. Then I moved to 7 weeks while stacking two compounds (SD and epi) and this last cycle I just finished I did 8 weeks bridged (SD into H-drol). For the last two cycles I've taken Tudca for the liver as well as Cycle Support.

I'm pretty shut down though. Depending on how this PCT goes, I may try a 9 week next time.

I think longer cycles can be done. I just think you need to know your body. Dosing may have to change for longer cycles as well.

 

[Snicket63]

I've been slowly lengthening my cycles. I started with your standard 6 weeks. Then I moved to 7 weeks while stacking two compounds (SD and epi) and this last cycle I just finished I did 8 weeks bridged (SD into H-drol). For the last two cycles I've taken Tudca for the liver as well as Cycle Support.

I'm pretty shut down though. Depending on how this PCT goes, I may try a 9 week next time.

I think longer cycles can be done. I just think you need to know your body. Dosing may have to change for longer cycles as well.

Yeah im trying to figure this out because i finished my 16mg dmz 6 week cycle which i dont believe did much to my liver because my urine lightened up to almost crystal clear while on. I was gonna do a full pct but instead took 5 days off for some rest and now im gonna get my mass back up with 12mg of my m sten. Is that to long to be on?

 

[SuperPro]

so do you guys thing the liver thing is overblown and its possible to do long cycles of orals if you use the right stuff? (under 25mg of methyls)
does 1mg of a methyl = 1 mg of another methyl? for example. 12mg of m sten would be safer than 48 mg of dmz?
if your urine is crystal clear does it mean that your liver is probably doing fine and if it gets darker can you lay off the orals for about a week then continue untill dark urine again?
some stuff is given to aids patients and stuff like that for i believe years strait. you guys think that proves that methyls aren't as bad as people make em out to be?

looking forward to your guys input

You can do long cycles of orals, though it's dangerous and I wouldn't advise it. Knew a guy IRL who took epistane for 4 months straight with no supports or PCT and nothing happened to him, I believe he took it at 20mg a day, whatever IBE epistane says to take on the label. I would never recommend anyone do that though.

Methyl are not equal mg to mg. If that was the case I could take 100mg of SD for 6 weeks since I can do that with halodrol. However in reality SD is much more liver toxic. Another good example is M1T, definitely more liver toxic than halodrol or epistane mg to mg.

Urine being clear is a good indicator that you're probably fine, but not a be all end all. The only way to know for sure if your liver is fine is bloodwork.

What methylated compound is given to aids patients exactly? I know they are prescribed steroids sometimes for muscle wasting, but I never heard they were given methyls. This argument is not good anyhow though, doctors also prescribe nolvadex to breast cancer patients for years at a time, but this is different since the scenario is "stop cancer or lose patient" same as with aids "stop aids or lose patient" so more drastic measures are taken than usual.

All that being said I think that methyls aren't quite as bad as made out to be, but they still aren't anything to play around with, you only have one body and one liver.

 

[Snicket63]

You can do long cycles of orals, though it's dangerous and I wouldn't advise it. Knew a guy IRL who took epistane for 4 months straight with no supports or PCT and nothing happened to him, I believe he took it at 20mg a day, whatever IBE epistane says to take on the label. I would never recommend anyone do that though.

Methyl are not equal mg to mg. If that was the case I could take 100mg of SD for 6 weeks since I can do that with halodrol. However in reality SD is much more liver toxic. Another good example is M1T, definitely more liver toxic than halodrol or epistane mg to mg.

Urine being clear is a good indicator that you're probably fine, but not a be all end all. The only way to know for sure if your liver is fine is bloodwork.

What methylated compound is given to aids patients exactly? I know they are prescribed steroids sometimes for muscle wasting, but I never heard they were given methyls. This argument is not good anyhow though, doctors also prescribe nolvadex to breast cancer patients for years at a time, but this is different since the scenario is "stop cancer or lose patient" same as with aids "stop aids or lose patient" so more drastic measures are taken than usual.

All that being said I think that methyls aren't quite as bad as made out to be, but they still aren't anything to play around with, you only have one body and one liver.

4 month epi cycle. wow.

but... i saw a little video a day ago about some dude who got massive liver damage from like 4 weeks of epistane. I also have read tons of stuff about where guys do their cycles and get jaundice and they get massive liver damage or some stuff like that. These guys must be doing something horribly wrong like drinking, taking tylenol and stuff, massive dosages, something. I dont get how these people are ruining themselves on 4 weeks of stuff.