Chronic Opiate use & Test Levels

[Harry Seaward]

Does anyone have any experience or knowledge about this?

I just got my test levels tested for the first time ever, and I got:


Free Test: 1.5 pg / ml (normal = 8.5 - 25)
Test Serum: 45 ng / dl (normal = 350 - 1200)

Jesus!!! Now I know why even during my first cycle I had a very tough time making any significant gains (or basically I had to work an insane amount to even maintain my strength from natural bodybuilding for over a decade and a half...).

Anyway, I'll just say I'm a functioning addict and the culprit has to be chronic opiate use, and I'm going to try to switch to suboxone in the near future which supposedly has much less (or hopefully NO) effect on T levels.

Few questions about this:

1 - How can I or anybody even be relatively muscular with levels this low?

2 - What advice does anyone who has also used regularly have for getting T levels back up (or what was your experience?)

3 - Is this reversible? I think it is but I got scared sh*tless when I saw these results and started reading about opiate use and its effects on test levels.

4 - Do you know if this has effects on being able to have kids?

Also just fyi, I'm not trying to go back on cycle or go on TRT because I still want to have kids maybe in a few years.

Thanks for any help

 

[warbird01]

You look like you do in your avatar and thsoe are you results? Something doesn't compute, I seriously doubt you could built that physique with pretty much no natural test. Did you eat before your blood was drawn?

 

[warbird01]

Idk about the opiates, but I would run this:

Nolva
20/20/20/10/10/10
DAA
3g/3g/3g/3g/3g/3g

See if that gets to in normal range.

 

[pyrobatt]

Does anyone have any experience or knowledge about this?

I just got my test levels tested for the first time ever, and I got:

Free Test: 1.5 pg / ml (normal = 8.5 - 25)
Test Serum: 45 ng / dl (normal = 350 - 1200)

Jesus!!! Now I know why even during my first cycle I had a very tough time making any significant gains (or basically I had to work an insane amount to even maintain my strength from natural bodybuilding for over a decade and a half...).

Anyway, I'll just say I'm a functioning addict and the culprit has to be chronic opiate use, and I'm going to try to switch to suboxone in the near future which supposedly has much less (or hopefully NO) effect on T levels.

Few questions about this:

1 - How can I or anybody even be relatively muscular with levels this low?

2 - What advice does anyone who has also used regularly have for getting T levels back up (or what was your experience?)

3 - Is this reversible? I think it is but I got scared sh*tless when I saw these results and started reading about opiate use and its effects on test levels.

4 - Do you know if this has effects on being able to have kids?

Also just fyi, I'm not trying to go back on cycle or go on TRT because I still want to have kids maybe in a few years.

Thanks for any help

1. Growth hormone,genetics,supplements,progesterone,other anabolic hormomes. Test is not the only one...

2 and 3. Look into serms but by opiate abuse do you mean vast quantities? I ask because they can and do lower test. I doubt you could get back to normal if you continue.

4. Yes. It can seriouslly kill sperm count,mobility and if your testosterone/hormone health is ****ed for too long it could potentially make you sterile on a permanent basis.


My suggestion is get clean or stay on serms year round. They are fertility drugs too. Still a chance though it wont do ****.

I did alot of research on oxy,morphine,heroin in my college days. Almost got hooked. The long term is what kept me away.

 

[johnnybeegood]

Regardless of what your test levels are, i suggest you seriously consider getting clean for your own health and well-being. you say you are a functioning addict, and while that may be true right now, addiction is usually progressive and thus gets worse. so do yourself a favor and quit before your bottom gets any lower.

 

[JoshR]

If you got the body that's in your avatar with 45test. I must be doing something horribly wrong. As for opiate abuse I know where your coming from. I had a 100mg a day oxy habit in my teens. I ended up quitting cold turkey with the help of my girl friend, dxm and a lot of weed. Sure your a functional user now. But it can only get worse bro. Start considering a way out before you **** up your life

 

[Matthersby]

X-opiate addict here.... There's no way bro. No way you will ever reach you goals and have healthy T levels on any opiates, ever. And suboxone is literally a way of postponing withdrawals into a month of agony when you finally decide to get off that garbage. They will destroy any chance you have of a decent life.

 

[Harry Seaward]

You look like you do in your avatar and thsoe are you results? Something doesn't compute, I seriously doubt you could built that physique with pretty much no natural test. Did you eat before your blood was drawn?

I'd have to be an insane loser to put up a photo that isn't me. I haven't worked out in over a month, on a really bad slacking off phase but I look almost like that now and yes I think I ate a little bit (but not much) before my blood was drawn.

I still have to speak with my doc, I really can't believe that my results are that low, but yes believe it or not that is my body and those are my results...

 

[Harry Seaward]

Idk about the opiates, but I would run this:

Nolva
20/20/20/10/10/10
DAA
3g/3g/3g/3g/3g/3g

See if that gets to in normal range.

Thx brother, I started DAA after I got that test result but will try adding Nolva. I also have Clomid is there a preference there?

 

[Harry Seaward]

Thanks a lot man, yes I really gotta stop for many reasons.

Not being able to have kids possibly, killed sex drive, impossible to make gains at gym, $$$$$$$, lower feeling of well-being.

It's just SOOO F*CKING HARD to get past the withdrawal phase...if anyone has any tips on that I'd really appreciate it too, it's like having the worst flu you have ever had x 100...

Yes by the way I use up to 2 bags per day or even more or less depending on the situation. Thx again for the suggestions I'll definitely try the seems

1. Growth hormone,genetics,supplements,progesterone,other anabolic hormomes. Test is not the only one...

2 and 3. Look into serms but by opiate abuse do you mean vast quantities? I ask because they can and do lower test. I doubt you could get back to normal if you continue.

4. Yes. It can seriouslly kill sperm count,mobility and if your testosterone/hormone health is ****ed for too long it could potentially make you sterile on a permanent basis.


My suggestion is get clean or stay on serms year round. They are fertility drugs too. Still a chance though it wont do ****.

I did alot of research on oxy,morphine,heroin in my college days. Almost got hooked. The long term is what kept me away.

 

[Harry Seaward]

If you got the body that's in your avatar with 45test. I must be doing something horribly wrong. As for opiate abuse I know where your coming from. I had a 100mg a day oxy habit in my teens. I ended up quitting cold turkey with the help of my girl friend, dxm and a lot of weed. Sure your a functional user now. But it can only get worse bro. Start considering a way out before you **** up your life

Thx man, you'd be extremely surprised how long it's been, let's just say approx. 2007 or 2008 till 2010 was mostly vicodin, then 2009/2010 - 2011 a lot of oxy, then 2011 till now oxy then dope, although I only blow it (I know I know like that's much better than shooting but it really is a lot worse to shoot it I believe). I'm still rockin' but you are right can't keep this up forever.

And yes...I have to give myself some credit somehow, I honestly thought I must have had good genetics or something but I guess quite the contrary or maybe I had good genes in other areas.

Can you please tell me more about the DXM route?? What is that and how can I use it to get past withdrawals??

Thx guys I really appreciate it, you are helping me with something that can really save my life. Maybe literally, or maybe just making sure i don't spend myself broke and mess up my wife & family's life (no kids yet although kind of would be nice to know that I can have some...).

 

[Harry Seaward]

X-opiate addict here.... There's no way bro. No way you will ever reach you goals and have healthy T levels on any opiates, ever. And suboxone is literally a way of postponing withdrawals into a month of agony when you finally decide to get off that garbage. They will destroy any chance you have of a decent life.

Thx man, although I read some serious study (I'll see if I can find it) that said suboxone had very little to no effect on T levels, while methadone and the obvious other opiates had staggering effects on test levels. So...if I can manage to get into a regimen of suboxone (believe me even THAT is not possible right now taking subs rips the other opiates out of your body and it's agonizing) I think that will help my test levels a lot, esp if I take DAA & serms.

PS - So subs withdrawal is a month and opiate (i.e. oxy or dope) wd is about a week or so? I know mental and psychological addiction lasts much longer and I need to get into a 12-step but just wondering.

Thanks again

 

[Harry Seaward]

X-opiate addict here.... There's no way bro. No way you will ever reach you goals and have healthy T levels on any opiates, ever. And suboxone is literally a way of postponing withdrawals into a month of agony when you finally decide to get off that garbage. They will destroy any chance you have of a decent life.

Thx man, although I read some serious study (I'll see if I can find it) that said suboxone had very little to no effect on T levels, while methadone and the obvious other opiates had staggering effects on test levels. So...if I can manage to get into a regimen of suboxone (believe me even THAT is not possible right now taking subs rips the other opiates out of your body and it's agonizing) I think that will help my test levels a lot, esp if I take DAA & serms.

PS - So subs withdrawal is a month and opiate (i.e. oxy or dope) wd is about a week or so? I know mental and psychological addiction lasts much longer and I need to get into a 12-step but just wondering.

Thanks again

 

[pyrobatt]

Thanks a lot man, yes I really gotta stop for many reasons.

Not being able to have kids possibly, killed sex drive, impossible to make gains at gym, $$$$$$$, lower feeling of well-being.

It's just SOOO F*CKING HARD to get past the withdrawal phase...if anyone has any tips on that I'd really appreciate it too, it's like having the worst flu you have ever had x 100...

Yes by the way I use up to 2 bags per day or even more or less depending on the situation. Thx again for the suggestions I'll definitely try the seems

Okay. Cut down to one bag. Spread it out through the day first of all. What are we talking? 8ball of h or oxy. If I know the drug I can help more.

Second step is find someone to talk to. One of your brothers in iron here on am or even at na meetings. Find someone who will call you on bs. Not a girlfriend.

Third step is finding a way to keep busy while reducing the ammount you take.
If need be find a rehab center ,get a sponsor,and work with the program. You're wanting to change and thats the best part.

Do NOT quit cold turkey. Especally with opiates or alcohol.

 

[JoshR]

So dxm is strictly for WDs. Won't do **** for your cravings but it will help your WDs. I found that 300dxm every morning would help cover up being dope sick. If you have taken dxm before you know it tends to make you pretty numb all over. Although for a good 6-8 hours you will feel fine physically. But you'll still be tripping your balls off. It may make you a little nauseas too, but the aches are 90% better. I would pick up 6 bottles of dxm (syrup or gels). Take 300mg when you wake up. The good affects will last for around 8 hours. After that I'd smoke some bud and just wait it out until you can sleep again. Rinse and repeat the next day.

 

[13bret]

Go to rehab, preferably one that doesnt use suboxone. They will medicate you to get you through the withdrawls and will teach you how to live clean. I have touch an opiate in three years and i was eating oxy, roxy, diluadid, fetanyl patch. You can do it! But its way easier when you have help. Good luck. I buried friends who were functioning addicts, get clean and live life.

 

[Godstrength]

There is a lot of suggestions here.... The truth is that there is no right way to get clean.... Some have success cold turkey, others weind themselves down through lower dosages, others go to detox and get some non narcotic meds to help w withdrawals.... Suboxone is worse to come off than heroin or oxys.... It's a narcotic and a nasty one that is long acting.... It simply sits in the receptors and is so strong it will not allow anything else (opiates) in while it occupies those receptors. It is a really bad alternative to what your doing.

I am a recovering addict who also now works on the treatment field... I am currently going to school to complete my bachelors in human services specializing in addiction. You will not die from opiate withdrawals. You may feel like it lol but you won't. Benzodiazepine and alcohol are actually the two worst and most dangerous drugs to withdrawal from, and can result in death. Opiate withdrawal is hard, but not impossible. Detox is a good option, bc there is medical supervision. The bottom line is your going to have to want to be sober more than you want to use.... Often times that's what it comes down to.... You have to ask yourself, if your there and hit your bottom? Has this addiction taken enough or do you still have a few more things your willing to give away? It's a battle that can be own when you make the decision that you've had enough.

One more thing, I'm not gonna preach, but praying doesn't hurt.... It's actually the biggest single factor in me getting my life right.... Take this for what it's worth, op there is a better life for you and there is a light at the end

 

[Matthersby]

^outstanding words of wisdom^

 

[Harry Seaward]

Thanks a million PB...again I can't thank you enough.

I have actually cut down a little bit to 1 1/2 bags, a 'bag' or a 'bun' being 10 of those little stamp-like things that are usually $10 / each and have powdered light brown H in them.

I agree on not going cold turkey to start; I should definitely cut down first because I've tried cold turkey and I could barely even MAKE it to the bathroom. Scary stuff man...anyone listening please take this as a cautionary tale. As I write this I'm at work and I actually feel like I'm in a good mood, everything is great, except...if I waited over 5 hrs or so of taking a lil bump I'd start getting the sweats / muscle soreness and all that great stuff that accompanies withdrawals.

Anyway, here's what I have:

*About 25 of those stamp-things; i.e. 2.5 bags that I'm going to try to stretch out as long as possible, which I've been getting much better at
*MANY methadone 10 mg pills, but I know (1) they have the same effect on Test levels and (2) they are just another addiction
*18 suboxone strips (that melt under the tongue; NOT the orange octagon-shaped pills that I would prefer)
*A bunch of dried & grinded poppy pods to make tea
*Some clonidine, which supposedly helps a lot with cramps, sweating, hot / cold flashed, and general restlessness
*some immodiums which is actually a type of opiate; although obviously it doesn't get you high at all but will help with the insane diarrhea that you get in WD

Anyway, I might have to drive out of town this weekend so I'm gonna have to wait to really make this jump to Subs.

Again, my short term goal is to be able to comfortably be on Subs. In the past, when I took it, it gave me "precipitated withdrawals"; in that it takes up all the space on the opioid receptors and kick-starts withdrawals. This happened even if I waited 24-36 hrs after taking anything to start the Subs. So I have to take a liiiiittle bit and slowly increase the Subs and decrease either the H or the Mdones (NOT both...that would not be good).

That's my plan, but I still haven't read the other responses so I'm sure there's more useful stuff and I am DEFINITELY open to constructive criticism.

Once again thank you my AM brothers!!!

Okay. Cut down to one bag. Spread it out through the day first of all. What are we talking? 8ball of h or oxy. If I know the drug I can help more.

Second step is find someone to talk to. One of your brothers in iron here on am or even at na meetings. Find someone who will call you on bs. Not a girlfriend.

Third step is finding a way to keep busy while reducing the ammount you take.
If need be find a rehab center ,get a sponsor,and work with the program. You're wanting to change and thats the best part.

Do NOT quit cold turkey. Especally with opiates or alcohol.

 

[Harry Seaward]

So dxm is strictly for WDs. Won't do **** for your cravings but it will help your WDs. I found that 300dxm every morning would help cover up being dope sick. If you have taken dxm before you know it tends to make you pretty numb all over. Although for a good 6-8 hours you will feel fine physically. But you'll still be tripping your balls off. It may make you a little nauseas too, but the aches are 90% better. I would pick up 6 bottles of dxm (syrup or gels). Take 300mg when you wake up. The good affects will last for around 8 hours. After that I'd smoke some bud and just wait it out until you can sleep again. Rinse and repeat the next day.

Thanks a lot man! This is something I know nothing about and can help a lot I'm sure. DXM is what's in cough syrup right? I'll do my homework and see what's up and how much I'd need to take...

Thanks again

 

[Tbol]

My son was in the ICU, multiple times, due to DXM. Be careful with that Shi*t!!!!

 

[JoshR]

I know it's helped a lot of people with WDs, myself included. Do some research and read some erowid to make sure you're prepared.

Sorry to hear about your son tbol. Like all drugs, It needs to be treated with respect. I hope your son is doing okay now. He wasn't taking CCCs by any chance was he? You most certainly don't want to use those for WDs

 

[Tbol]

Thanks for asking, he is ok NOW. But the long term health implications are what we worry about. Best of luck to u in fighting this battle. God bless!

 

[RecompMan]

Nalaxone I believe my buddy used to help raise jis test after years of use

 

[Harry Seaward]

Thanks for asking, he is ok NOW. But the long term health implications are what we worry about. Best of luck to u in fighting this battle. God bless!

Yes! Thank God man your son made it!!!

What are CCC's by the way?

I'm hoping to get my plan in order asap but with sufficient planning and keeping any family meetings / holidays in mind. Will start (or continue) to post (1) my plan and (2) my progress notes, basically this will be my log, just a different, MUCH less fun kind of one!

 

[Dr.Stri8ed]

We're all here for support bro. We got your back, you're never alone in this. You're in my prayers.

 

[JoshR]

CCCs are a dxm containing product a lot of kids take for a buzz. But it has another ingredient called chloramine maleate. CM in high enough doses will lower blood pressure enough to stroke out. Just have to make sure anything you get only has dxm as an active ingredient.

Yeah I get what your saying about not spoiling the holidays for your family. Make up your detox plan now though so you're ready for next month.
Stay strong bro

 

[souljah]

I know this is an old thread, but suboxone contains naloxone which does boost T levels, however it is supposedly not bioavailable in sublingual form and only has that effect if injected. Many H addicts are offered this monthly shot to stay clean, Im sure all that extra T helps with Post-Acute Withdrawal Symptoms.

 

[WarDamn]

Everyone's different. I barely know my body - much less yours. But what I can say is, I am a recovering addict and I just got back into the weight room. I am making massive gains, mostly because I have two weeks into a 1-Andro cycle. Three weeks ago (because of super long half life), I thought of tweaking my suboxone dosage down to only from 12mgs to 2mg per day and I have only just started my cycle. I'm sure that everyone thinks I am crazy for doing this, but at this point in my life, I am so damn happy to be off the ski's (roxys/oxy) - thank GOD! I am sure that actual opiates have a more negative effect on Test Levels than suboxone/subutex, but the truth is, I don't know bro, all I know is that I am making gains while in my first cycle in 4 years, all the while still taking my suboxone - albeit a very small dosage. To me, it is all working out great. I'm sure I am doing some damage to my liver/kidneys, but its only a few more weeks and then its on to intense PCT.

I am a new subscriber/member here. Does anyone know, under normal circumstances (not recovering or current opiate addict/not in detox) after most cycles, do test levels start to return to measurably "normal" levels?

Thanks

 

[souljah]

suboxone tanks T levels just as bad as other opiates like oxys, H, Methadone, etc. It just doesnt seem like it gets you high, but you are. Definitely wouldnt stay on the subs for long, know people who did and it really killed their T levels and other evil side effects. In other words as long as your on subs your natural t levels will not respond to PCT.

 

[backatit]

Thanks a lot man, yes I really gotta stop for many reasons. Not being able to have kids possibly, killed sex drive, impossible to make gains at gym, $$$$$$$, lower feeling of well-being. It's just SOOO F*CKING HARD to get past the withdrawal phase...if anyone has any tips on that I'd really appreciate it too, it's like having the worst flu you have ever had x 100... Yes by the way I use up to 2 bags per day or even more or less depending on the situation. Thx again for the suggestions I'll definitely try the seems

I kicked heroin cold turkey. You just have to ****ing do it

 

[barrymcokiner]

Everyone's different. I barely know my body - much less yours. But what I can say is, I am a recovering addict and I just got back into the weight room. I am making massive gains, mostly because I have two weeks into a 1-Andro cycle. Three weeks ago (because of super long half life), I thought of tweaking my suboxone dosage down to only from 12mgs to 2mg per day and I have only just started my cycle. I'm sure that everyone thinks I am crazy for doing this, but at this point in my life, I am so damn happy to be off the ski's (roxys/oxy) - thank GOD! I am sure that actual opiates have a more negative effect on Test Levels than suboxone/subutex, but the truth is, I don't know bro, all I know is that I am making gains while in my first cycle in 4 years, all the while still taking my suboxone - albeit a very small dosage. To me, it is all working out great. I'm sure I am doing some damage to my liver/kidneys, but its only a few more weeks and then its on to intense PCT.

I am a new subscriber/member here. Does anyone know, under normal circumstances (not recovering or current opiate addict/not in detox) after most cycles, do test levels start to return to measurably "normal" levels?

Thanks

12mg to 2mg must have been hell. I've been on subs for over a year now and bounce from 12 one day to six the next. Trying to get off them but it's extremely hard. On a side note..opiates definitely lower your T levels. I worked out for 8 years and had the body of a god (while being a functioning opiate addict). As soon as I stopped working out due to my use, I lost all my gains, some 40lbs, and had no urge to have sex. (This was years of opiate use mind u, so yes they do most def lower T levels.) Needless to say, subs do help, and I use them on cycle with no problem. I'm currently running stano and triumphalis and feel great. Good luck to OP And others who are on thrle same train.

 

[WarDamn]

12mg to 2mg must have been hell. I've been on subs for over a year now and bounce from 12 one day to six the next. Trying to get off them but it's extremely hard. On a side note..opiates definitely lower your T levels. I worked out for 8 years and had the body of a god (while being a functioning opiate addict). As soon as I stopped working out due to my use, I lost all my gains, some 40lbs, and had no urge to have sex. (This was years of opiate use mind u, so yes they do most def lower T levels.) Needless to say, subs do help, and I use them on cycle with no problem. I'm currently running stano and triumphalis and feel great. Good luck to OP And others who are on thrle same train.

Quote Originally Posted by Harry Seaward View Post

Thanks a lot man, yes I really gotta stop for many reasons. Not being able to have kids possibly, killed sex drive, impossible to make gains at gym, $$$$$$$, lower feeling of well-being. It's just SOOO F*CKING HARD to get past the withdrawal phase...if anyone has any tips on that I'd really appreciate it too, it's like having the worst flu you have ever had x 100... Yes by the way I use up to 2 bags per day or even more or less depending on the situation. Thx again for the suggestions I'll definitely try the seems
I kicked heroin cold turkey. You just have to ****ing do it

A--MEN & A--MEN!

 

[reps4jesus]

Studies show steroid users/bodybuilders/badasses (like all of us) have extremely addictive personalities which of course can lead to issues like this. I sure as hell have had my drugs I had to kick. But one thing that you have to remember is the other side of all that, yes we may have addictive personalities but we also show discipline, consistency, and a vision of an end goal that will better ourselves and our lives. This is what is needed to quit. So yes, you may have screwed up, but its merely your choice when it ends. Yes you're gonna have one hell of a withdrawal phase, but is that really something you can't handle? Don't let a drug control your life, it makes you look weak. And I highly doubt you're a weak person. Best of luck.

 

[TheGnome]

With all the deaths and loss of young lives due to heroin use; I think you should find a way to get clean. I'm not here to judge anyone, but I have seen so many bad things from heroin; an obviously higher rate than other drugs. On several occasions I have dealt with people that should have died without medical attention and narcan; soon after they were not as lucky. All associated with opiates.

Just like anything else, cigarettes, alcohol, etc, every person may have a different way to achieve an effective solution.

An effective solution obviously requires a lot of desire and dedication; sounds like the gym, doesn't it.

 

[souljah]

Ive been there more than once, you just have to prioritize whats important to you, long term opiate abuse will take everything thats dear to you. WD's isnt any worse than the flu, it just seems worse from the anticipation. Immodium AD active ingredient (loperamide hydrochloride) is a synthetic opioid that only binds with the opiate receptors in your intestines but cant pass the blood brain barrier, so it doesnt get you high. You have to take more than the normal dose. You can find a study online that morphine addicted monkeys were given it and showed no signs of physical withdrawals. Of course it doesnt do anything for cravings or anxiety. The most difficult thing is to remove yourself from friends and connections that use, otherwise you WILL relapse. I have kicked on the streets and in the pen, the former is much preferable. Everybody's addiction eventually makes them run afoul of the law even if just in the act of copping or using. I used to the best "functioning addict" key word is functioning, not winning, not excelling, not pushing ourselves to the limit, etc. just functioning.

 

[barrymcokiner]

Studies show steroid users/bodybuilders/badasses (like all of us) have extremely addictive personalities which of course can lead to issues like this. I sure as hell have had my drugs I had to kick. But one thing that you have to remember is the other side of all that, yes we may have addictive personalities but we also show discipline, consistency, and a vision of an end goal that will better ourselves and our lives. This is what is needed to quit. So yes, you may have screwed up, but its merely your choice when it ends. Yes you're gonna have one hell of a withdrawal phase, but is that really something you can't handle? Don't let a drug control your life, it makes you look weak. And I highly doubt you're a weak person. Best of luck.

Great post brother....amen

 

[backatit]

only way I have stayed clean bro is 12 step groups. I tried everything else. Im not saying its the only way- but its the only way that works for me. I don't even really think about getting high any more. The urge is gone. And trust me I know that urge. Driving to the dope dealers house screaming I don't want to do this I hate this, but doing it any ways. Give it a shot for a month- it might save your life, and I myself am much happier this way.Good luck man opiates are a bitch. Heroin brought me to me knees

 

[johnnybeegood]

Never Alone. Never Again.

 

[WarDamn]

only way I have stayed clean bro is 12 step groups. I tried everything else. Im not saying its the only way- but its the only way that works for me. I don't even really think about getting high any more. The urge is gone. And trust me I know that urge. Driving to the dope dealers house screaming I don't want to do this I hate this, but doing it any ways. Give it a shot for a month- it might save your life, and I myself am much happier this way.Good luck man opiates are a bitch. Heroin brought me to me knees

Look atcha!! good for you bro. right behind ya!!