biggiesmallz
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Gynecomastia: Causes & Cures
Gyno treatment protocols;
For estrogen-related gyno;
Raloxifene at 60mg daily for up to 90 days
or
Nolva at 20mg daily for up to 90 days
or
Torem at 60mg daily for up to 90 days
SERMs have a half-life of 5-7 days, with Raloxifene being the best one at binding to and blocking breast receptors for the purposes of gyno reversal/reduction according to all the available medical literature, then nolva, then torem
Keep in mind dosages are specific to the individual, but those are the standardly recommended ones. Anything past 90 days we risk breakdown of bone mineral density. Some whole milk and joint support supps for a few months afterwards may be able to take care of that, however.
Also some people may require a mild AI like Aromasin with their SERM treatment, doses range from 6.25mg daily, to 12.5mg daily, to 25mg daily on the high end. GET BLOODWORK, WITHOUT BLOODWORK YOU HAVE NO IDEA WHICH HORMONE IS WHACKY AND WHY Then proceed to treat from there.
Common Cures and treatments for Gyno
Mega Dosing on SERMS
For Prolactin Gyno;
Can use P5P or NOW Vitex (vitamin b6) or L-dopa for prevention. Don't use both together, since one can counter-indicate the effects of the other;
http://www.prohormoneforum.com/q-patrick-arnold/55984-progestin-gyno-p5p-l-dopa-l-dopa-alone.html
Can use Cabergoline for prevention/treatment of prolactin gyno;
copy paste;
The How To Use Caber Thread
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I have had a few PM’s and came across too many threads inquiring about Cabergoline. Its uses, doses, sides and the like. So in this post I am going to give a bit of the information that I have come across and learned in my time.
What is Cabergoline?
>CABERGOLINE (Dostinex) – Caber is a very potent Dopamine Agonist. It acts on dopamine receptors in the hypothalamus to suppress prolactin production in the pituitary gland. It is used for Hyperprolactinemia. (elevated levels of prolactin in blood) It is also used in treatment of Parkinsons Disease. Now Ill get deeper into what the hell all that means a little further on.
>Half Life = 63-69 Hours. So I recommend to take Caber every third day. That’s at the far end of the range of its half life. Though this is what the dosing is for patients and studies that have been done and it works just fine. If you’re a stickler for dosing everything correctly I would obviously dose it every 2 and ½ days.
>Taking your dose of Caber before bed. (with or without food) will minimize your experience of sides.
- Documented Sides– (bad sides) Fatigue, nausea, dizziness, vertigo, headache, slightly abnormal vision, hot flashes. Now before you get all scared and think oh I cant take this. These sides were mostly reported when taking higher doses (1g+ a week) then we will be taking for our cycles. Also Caber has been found in some instances to increase the affects of Depression Medication. Word to the wise for those members using said meds.
-Other Sides- (good sides) I have not come across any scientific studies documenting them but many users have reported are…Increased Sex Drive, Stronger Erections, More Powerful Orgasms, Taking Less Time to Achieve A Full Erection after Ejactulation. And I will attest to the fact that those sides do happen. I have experienced all the “good sides” first hand. Also I have not experienced any of the “bad sides” ever.
There are even ppl who have been taking Caber only for the specific reason of the sexual sides. Now I of course do not condone this and would only recommend using Caber in conjuction with an AAS cycle.
-Another big thing I have heard members cry about as a reason not to take Caber, is that it has been found to cause Heart Valve Damage. This is true but as I stated earlier, only at a lot higher doses (3mg/per day!!) then we will be using. So stop whining.
-If for some reason you are prone to sides for any and everything, reducing your dose, while continuing the Caber will improve the severity of the sides. So basically if you experience a slight amount of sides at any given dose. Lower your dose until the sides fade but don’t stop using the caber! I would prefer some of the lesser sides of Caber to those of Tren and Deca any day.
How much Caber to use and when?
I prefer to use Caber while running any 19-Nor. (tren, deca) They affect the thyroid by lowering it (hypothyroidism) which causes the body to release more prolactin in the blood stream. (note- an overactive thyroid can cause elevated prolactin levels also) Prolactin at high levels has the affect of lowering sex drive and causing erectile dysfunction. We call it deca and fina ****. And from first hand experience, deca **** is not fun!! Tren is also a Progestin, it bonds to the receptor of the female sex hormone Progesterone. Which is responsible for preparing the body for milk production. I.E. By raising prolactin. So in order to avoid all that. Its best to run Caber from the very beginning of the cycle. I even prefer to run it into PCT for an extra boost.
STARTING DOSE – Beginning dose of Caber for use on cycle would be .25mg taken twice a week. For a total of .50 mg a week. Notice the point in front of the 25. Its not 25mg!! Its .25mg
This dose is usually enough for an 8 week Tren cycle. If your prone to sides, running deca/tren E, or just running the Tren A longer. Then take the .50 mg/per week for 4 weeks and then bump it up another .25mg a week. For a total of .75mg per week. If sides from the gear are very bad, you can even bump it up to a total of 1mg a week. You can continue to up your dose (only if your experiencing sides from Tren/Deca) of the Caber every 4 weeks until you have reached a maximum dose of 1mg twice a week or 2mg per week. But there is no reason to go no where near that high. If your still experiencing sides at 1mg/per week then your Caber is bunk or there is more serious underlying causes at work.
I was taking .5mg/p/w of Caber during a cycle with high doses of Tren. I actually didn’t have any fina **** problems but I did start Lactating! Yes my nipples were leaking. (its called Galactorrhea = lactation in the absence of nursing) lol So then I bumped up my dose to .50mg at 2 times a week (1mg/week) and the milk juice went away within a week. Other then that, I have had no problems and nothing but good experiences while taking Caber.
Now to give you an idea of the doses that are being taken by Parkinsons Disease and other Patients,
• Parkinson's disease: Monotherapy: Initial dose should be 0.5 mg daily. The usual maintenance dose is 2 to 4 mg daily. Combination therapy: Usually 2 to 6 mg daily.
• Tumors of the pituitary gland and other hyperprolactinemic conditions: Initially 0.5 mg per week, slowly titrated to 4.5 mg per week, if necessary.
• Note – Caber is not approved in the U.S. for the treatment of Parkinsons.
You can see why they would experience the sides that I stated above. Since we are no where near those doses, we should not experience any sides other then the “good ones.”
Caber for PCT – Basically the same dosing as during cycle. I would go with a good dose of .50per/week to 1mg per/week. You are not taking the Caber during PCT for its affects on Prolactin because the use of it during cycle will negate any of the prolactin affects. I use caber during PCT to help with the lowered sex drive and slight decrease in the strength of your erections. It will give a little bump to your sex drive and give you slightly more powerful erections. During PCT while many experience depression and such, knowing that you can still get it nice and hard when you want is always a plus in my book. Since Caber is also known for helping prevent gyno. Theres another reason to use it during PCT. I run Caber during every PCT and have found that it does help a great deal.
A lot of ppl put off adding Caber to their cycles because of the price and availability of it. But if you have access to and can afford it. I highly recommend Caber as an addition to your cycle and PCT.
-Dukkit
Knew I forgot something. If you do find liquid Caber... most liquid caber is known for losing its strength over a period of time. A month or so and the strength will slowly decrease. (dont know why, but i know from first hand experience) So if thats all you can obtain then you can use slightly higher dosing levels towards the end of the cycle/PCT. To make up for the loss of the compounds strength. But dont go crazy.
*Caber is associated with the above noted side affects. Though those sides are less common and less severe then sides experienced while using Bromocriptine. For the record.
Use own judgement, dosing of everything is absolutely individual. Find own personal dose that works best for required effect, would be different and specific to every individual based on physiology and personal sensitivity response
HOW TO USE HCG
hCG-Unraveled: A valuable resource reference
Restoring Lydig Cell Desensitivity after a steroid cycle with the use of HCG
Anabolic steroid induced hypogonadism treated with human chorionic gonadotropin.
Also, a few words on the mechanisms behind the reversal of Atherosclerosis
An integrated approach for the mechanisms responsible for atherosclerotic plaque regression
How to Raise Testosterone levels and treat hypogonadism with Aromasin
and
Pharmacokinetics and Dose Finding of a Potent Aromatase Inhibitor, Aromasin (Exemestane), in Young Males
Gyno treatment protocols;
For estrogen-related gyno;
Raloxifene at 60mg daily for up to 90 days
or
Nolva at 20mg daily for up to 90 days
or
Torem at 60mg daily for up to 90 days
SERMs have a half-life of 5-7 days, with Raloxifene being the best one at binding to and blocking breast receptors for the purposes of gyno reversal/reduction according to all the available medical literature, then nolva, then torem
Keep in mind dosages are specific to the individual, but those are the standardly recommended ones. Anything past 90 days we risk breakdown of bone mineral density. Some whole milk and joint support supps for a few months afterwards may be able to take care of that, however.
Also some people may require a mild AI like Aromasin with their SERM treatment, doses range from 6.25mg daily, to 12.5mg daily, to 25mg daily on the high end. GET BLOODWORK, WITHOUT BLOODWORK YOU HAVE NO IDEA WHICH HORMONE IS WHACKY AND WHY Then proceed to treat from there.
Common Cures and treatments for Gyno
Mega Dosing on SERMS
Regarding the proper use of Aromatase Inhibitors (AI's)There is no doubt that SERMs (Selective Estrogen Receptor Modulators) such as Clomid and Nolvadex can stimulate testosterone production.
Unfortunately, these drugs can have a host of side effects including -
Liver Toxicity
Reduced Libido
Ocular Toxicity/Blurred Vision
Emotional Side-effects
Clomid in particular can lead to emotional side-effects and cause a man to feel like a weeping and emotionally distressed pregnant woman. This is because Clomid acts like an estrogen in certain parts of the brain and causes serious emotional episodes. To read more about the side-effects of SERM's, read this article.
hCG-Unraveled: A valuable resource referenceOver Use of Anti-Estrogens
Aromatase inhibitors (AI's) such as Arimidex, Aromasin, and Formestane are powerful tools for reducing estrogen conversion from heavily aromatizing drugs such as Testosterone or Dianabol. While these drugs are sometimes useful during cycle, these drugs are often counter-productive to use during PCT.
More specifically, it is a common misconception that estrogen will be elevated post cycle. Generally, estrogen is below a normal level after a cycle, especially if the cycle consisted primarily of non-aromatizing (non-estrogenic) AAS's or pro-hormones. Additionally, if one uses proper anti-estrogen's during a cycle with aromatizing AAS's then estrogen will not be elevated in this scenario either. Therefore, assuming proper AI's are used during cycle, I can only recommend an AI be used for PCT if hCG is also used.
Using AI's when they are not needed can lead to extremely low estrogen, which can cause the following side-effects -
Lower Sex Drive / Erectile dysfunction
Joint Pain
Lower HDL levels
Increased Risk of Heart Disease
Ultimately, this hurts your long and short term recovery and does not benefit you. Don't forget, normal levels of estrogen are necessary to support libido, muscle recovery, and testicular function.
For Prolactin Gyno;
Can use P5P or NOW Vitex (vitamin b6) or L-dopa for prevention. Don't use both together, since one can counter-indicate the effects of the other;
http://www.prohormoneforum.com/q-patrick-arnold/55984-progestin-gyno-p5p-l-dopa-l-dopa-alone.html
Can use Cabergoline for prevention/treatment of prolactin gyno;
copy paste;
The How To Use Caber Thread
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I have had a few PM’s and came across too many threads inquiring about Cabergoline. Its uses, doses, sides and the like. So in this post I am going to give a bit of the information that I have come across and learned in my time.
What is Cabergoline?
>CABERGOLINE (Dostinex) – Caber is a very potent Dopamine Agonist. It acts on dopamine receptors in the hypothalamus to suppress prolactin production in the pituitary gland. It is used for Hyperprolactinemia. (elevated levels of prolactin in blood) It is also used in treatment of Parkinsons Disease. Now Ill get deeper into what the hell all that means a little further on.
>Half Life = 63-69 Hours. So I recommend to take Caber every third day. That’s at the far end of the range of its half life. Though this is what the dosing is for patients and studies that have been done and it works just fine. If you’re a stickler for dosing everything correctly I would obviously dose it every 2 and ½ days.
>Taking your dose of Caber before bed. (with or without food) will minimize your experience of sides.
- Documented Sides– (bad sides) Fatigue, nausea, dizziness, vertigo, headache, slightly abnormal vision, hot flashes. Now before you get all scared and think oh I cant take this. These sides were mostly reported when taking higher doses (1g+ a week) then we will be taking for our cycles. Also Caber has been found in some instances to increase the affects of Depression Medication. Word to the wise for those members using said meds.
-Other Sides- (good sides) I have not come across any scientific studies documenting them but many users have reported are…Increased Sex Drive, Stronger Erections, More Powerful Orgasms, Taking Less Time to Achieve A Full Erection after Ejactulation. And I will attest to the fact that those sides do happen. I have experienced all the “good sides” first hand. Also I have not experienced any of the “bad sides” ever.
There are even ppl who have been taking Caber only for the specific reason of the sexual sides. Now I of course do not condone this and would only recommend using Caber in conjuction with an AAS cycle.
-Another big thing I have heard members cry about as a reason not to take Caber, is that it has been found to cause Heart Valve Damage. This is true but as I stated earlier, only at a lot higher doses (3mg/per day!!) then we will be using. So stop whining.
-If for some reason you are prone to sides for any and everything, reducing your dose, while continuing the Caber will improve the severity of the sides. So basically if you experience a slight amount of sides at any given dose. Lower your dose until the sides fade but don’t stop using the caber! I would prefer some of the lesser sides of Caber to those of Tren and Deca any day.
How much Caber to use and when?
I prefer to use Caber while running any 19-Nor. (tren, deca) They affect the thyroid by lowering it (hypothyroidism) which causes the body to release more prolactin in the blood stream. (note- an overactive thyroid can cause elevated prolactin levels also) Prolactin at high levels has the affect of lowering sex drive and causing erectile dysfunction. We call it deca and fina ****. And from first hand experience, deca **** is not fun!! Tren is also a Progestin, it bonds to the receptor of the female sex hormone Progesterone. Which is responsible for preparing the body for milk production. I.E. By raising prolactin. So in order to avoid all that. Its best to run Caber from the very beginning of the cycle. I even prefer to run it into PCT for an extra boost.
STARTING DOSE – Beginning dose of Caber for use on cycle would be .25mg taken twice a week. For a total of .50 mg a week. Notice the point in front of the 25. Its not 25mg!! Its .25mg
This dose is usually enough for an 8 week Tren cycle. If your prone to sides, running deca/tren E, or just running the Tren A longer. Then take the .50 mg/per week for 4 weeks and then bump it up another .25mg a week. For a total of .75mg per week. If sides from the gear are very bad, you can even bump it up to a total of 1mg a week. You can continue to up your dose (only if your experiencing sides from Tren/Deca) of the Caber every 4 weeks until you have reached a maximum dose of 1mg twice a week or 2mg per week. But there is no reason to go no where near that high. If your still experiencing sides at 1mg/per week then your Caber is bunk or there is more serious underlying causes at work.
I was taking .5mg/p/w of Caber during a cycle with high doses of Tren. I actually didn’t have any fina **** problems but I did start Lactating! Yes my nipples were leaking. (its called Galactorrhea = lactation in the absence of nursing) lol So then I bumped up my dose to .50mg at 2 times a week (1mg/week) and the milk juice went away within a week. Other then that, I have had no problems and nothing but good experiences while taking Caber.
Now to give you an idea of the doses that are being taken by Parkinsons Disease and other Patients,
• Parkinson's disease: Monotherapy: Initial dose should be 0.5 mg daily. The usual maintenance dose is 2 to 4 mg daily. Combination therapy: Usually 2 to 6 mg daily.
• Tumors of the pituitary gland and other hyperprolactinemic conditions: Initially 0.5 mg per week, slowly titrated to 4.5 mg per week, if necessary.
• Note – Caber is not approved in the U.S. for the treatment of Parkinsons.
You can see why they would experience the sides that I stated above. Since we are no where near those doses, we should not experience any sides other then the “good ones.”
Caber for PCT – Basically the same dosing as during cycle. I would go with a good dose of .50per/week to 1mg per/week. You are not taking the Caber during PCT for its affects on Prolactin because the use of it during cycle will negate any of the prolactin affects. I use caber during PCT to help with the lowered sex drive and slight decrease in the strength of your erections. It will give a little bump to your sex drive and give you slightly more powerful erections. During PCT while many experience depression and such, knowing that you can still get it nice and hard when you want is always a plus in my book. Since Caber is also known for helping prevent gyno. Theres another reason to use it during PCT. I run Caber during every PCT and have found that it does help a great deal.
A lot of ppl put off adding Caber to their cycles because of the price and availability of it. But if you have access to and can afford it. I highly recommend Caber as an addition to your cycle and PCT.
-Dukkit
Knew I forgot something. If you do find liquid Caber... most liquid caber is known for losing its strength over a period of time. A month or so and the strength will slowly decrease. (dont know why, but i know from first hand experience) So if thats all you can obtain then you can use slightly higher dosing levels towards the end of the cycle/PCT. To make up for the loss of the compounds strength. But dont go crazy.
*Caber is associated with the above noted side affects. Though those sides are less common and less severe then sides experienced while using Bromocriptine. For the record.
Use own judgement, dosing of everything is absolutely individual. Find own personal dose that works best for required effect, would be different and specific to every individual based on physiology and personal sensitivity response
HOW TO USE HCG
Also, HCG desensitivity is a myth, as long as dosage is respected can use however long is needed. However;For preservation of testicular sensitivity, use 250iu every 4 day starting 14 days after your first AAS dose. At the end of the cycle, drop the hCG two weeks before the AAS clear the system. For example, you would drop hCG about the same time as your last Testosterone Enanthate shot. Or, if you are ending the cycle with orals, you would drop the hCG about 10 days before your last oral dose. This will allow for a sudden and even clearance in hormone levels. This will initiate a strong LH and FSH surge from the pituitary, to begin stimulating your testes to produce testosterone. Remember, recovery doesn't begin until you are off hCG since your body will not release its own LH until the hCG has cleared the system.
Blasting hCG is unhealthy, and the increase in intratesticular E2, which cannot be managed with the commonly readily available aromatase inhibitors, is damaging.
hCG-Unraveled: A valuable resource reference
Restoring Lydig Cell Desensitivity after a steroid cycle with the use of HCG
Anabolic steroid induced hypogonadism treated with human chorionic gonadotropin.
Also, a few words on the mechanisms behind the reversal of Atherosclerosis
An integrated approach for the mechanisms responsible for atherosclerotic plaque regression
How to Raise Testosterone levels and treat hypogonadism with Aromasin
Im saying if I could only use one for PCT I would use an AI. Not a serm.
If you want to stay shutdown. AIs do nothing to restart the HPTA. There's no point in blocking aromatization if there's no test being produced to aromatize.
Sorry but this is false.
Low estrogen levels will almost always force the brain to send the LH signal.
In men estrogen is made primarily via enzymatic conversion.
Test.>aromatase.>estrogen
So when estro is very low the body makes more testosterone in order to make more estro.
But....your blocking the route of creation for the estrogen so...test keeps going up.
Eventually, after PCT the body will seek homeostasis.
Test will drop a bit and estro will rise a bit and ultimately youll wind up with relatively high normal test and relatively low estro.
I have helped dozens of guys with low test levels recover HPTA function.
Not once have I used a SERM.
This is under the assumption that there is already some HPTA function. The issue is that there are very few estrogen receptors at the hypothalamus. SERMs attach to these receptors and block estrogen from signaling them. The issue with AIs is while they can reduce estrogen to near zero levels they can't reduce them to absolute zero levels, there will be estrogen that will make it to these receptors and continue to suppress HPTA function. A SERM is paramount to changing this condition as it can simulate a zero estrogen state. An AI will boost serum test levels by preventing aromatization but the resulting higher test level will also suppress HPTA activity. This is why AIs can be run later in PCT but they should not be used early and definitely not by themselves. Trading estrogen for test is not nearly as effective because the hypothalamus detects both hormones and will adjust production by the total of the two. If we had SARMs that acted at the hypothalamus then blocking aromatization would be handy but unfortunately no real effective meds have been developed for this besides maybe ATD but the verdict is still out on that.
Aromasin#5) hypogonadism - so you're getting older, you've been cycling since you were 21 and your natty test levels just never get back in the good range, but you don't wanna go HRT??? Aromasin will get you back in the game without having to take the plunge for HRT.
and
Pharmacokinetics and Dose Finding of a Potent Aromatase Inhibitor, Aromasin (Exemestane), in Young Males