12 Week Dianabol, Test, Tren lean bulking cycle log

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    Quote Originally Posted by RussianAK47 View Post
    Won't be another 2-3 weeks until i can get ahold of a supply of ketotifin ... FP what do u think about Benadryl to upregulate Beta Receptors in the meantime or is that bull**** bro science?

    And im using Caber, been on caber for over a week now.. no issues with sleep at all throughout this whole cycle just last night.
    could just be a nasty coincidence
    I doubt it if you put Clen in the picture...

    Benadryl will work. 50mg/night should do. Over the course of 2-3 days however it tends to affect erectile function. That's one reason I like Keto. The other is that Keto is far more powerful and thus large doses are not needed. I'm on the same bottle from last year, lol.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RussianAK47 View Post
    Won't be another 2-3 weeks until i can get ahold of a supply of ketotifin ... FP what do u think about Benadryl to upregulate Beta Receptors in the meantime or is that bull**** bro science?

    And im using Caber, been on caber for over a week now.. no issues with sleep at all throughout this whole cycle just last night.
    could just be a nasty coincidence
    I love caber. I hate prami. True story
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    Quote Originally Posted by fueledpassion View Post

    That stuff makes me throw up, lol. I have a full bottle collecting dust
    Lol I learned te hard way when it came to prami, I spewed every day for 5 days before I found my sweet spot.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lukef2000 View Post

    Lol I learned te hard way when it came to prami, I spewed every day for 5 days before I found my sweet spot.
    If I take .2mg before bed and get to sleep right away the sides are pretty much gone by morning
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    Quote Originally Posted by tinytony View Post

    If I take .2mg before bed and get to sleep right away the sides are pretty much gone by morning
    I took .5mg before bed and then proceeded to spew all over the bed 3 hours later. The wife was not impressed.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lukef2000 View Post

    I took .5mg before bed and then proceeded to spew all over the bed 3 hours later. The wife was not impressed.
    The first time I took it I took like .5 and I was at work. My wife dropped it off and I wanted to get it going right away. About an hour later I got sooo tired and sick to my stomach. So tired it was like I took 4 benadryl. I had to leave 2.5 hours early sick. Went home and crashed right away for a few hours . Felt like a zombie. The next day I could still feel it. The whole first couple hours and during my waking moments I head random rockhard wood.. totally out of control.. well I learned my lesson. One guy said he was taking .7 so I thought Id be good
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    Quote Originally Posted by tinytony View Post

    The first time I took it I took like .5 and I was at work. My wife dropped it off and I wanted to get it going right away. About an hour later I got sooo tired and sick to my stomach. So tired it was like I took 4 benadryl. I had to leave 2.5 hours early sick. Went home and crashed right away for a few hours . Felt like a zombie. The next day I could still feel it. The whole first couple hours and during my waking moments I head random rockhard wood.. totally out of control.. well I learned my lesson. One guy said he was taking .7 so I thought Id be good
    Haha, yeah it does make you tired as ****. It's definitely something you have to start low on and work your way up.
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    cabers the way to go boys no sides =D
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    LOL@ throwing up in bed with your wife laying next to you, made me laugh bro
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    Quote Originally Posted by RussianAK47 View Post
    LOL@ throwing up in bed with your wife laying next to you, made me laugh bro
    Haha well it's funny NOW but when it happened not so much lol!
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    hahah i could image
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    Yeah I took my first dose @ .3mg and got sick about an hour later. Had to call in to work and tell them I was gonna be late because I was hangin my head out the car throwin' up while drivin' down the street in rush hour traffic, lol. Even better, that was 2 days before my wedding and people thought I was getting cold feet about it callin' in sick.
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    just ordered my next cycle for spring,

    got 9 vials of Andromix coming.
    One of those bad boys has 50 mgs of Tren Ace, Test Prop, and Masteron per CC.
    Gunna be shooting up 1 cc every ****ing day of the week 350 mg of tren, test, masteron per week.
    Contemplating on adding 500 mg of test cyp per week to bring total test to 850 as goal of that 12 week cycle would be to LEAN bulk.

    im cutting now getting shredded as i type this, want to cut down to 175. then pack on 15 lbs of lean muscle with andromix be 190, ripped, at 5'10
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    By the way however said to run test lower than tren i think thats Bull****

    Im running 500-600 mgs test now with 350 mg of tren and still cutting uup just fine. feel amazing, even tho im constantly hungry i still have energy,

    Test should def be kept at or higher than Tren levels unless ur hardcore contest prepping last month or so and every ****ing ounce of water counts
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    Quote Originally Posted by RussianAK47 View Post
    By the way however said to run test lower than tren i think thats Bull****

    Im running 500-600 mgs test now with 350 mg of tren and still cutting uup just fine. feel amazing, even tho im constantly hungry i still have energy,

    Test should def be kept at or higher than Tren levels unless ur hardcore contest prepping last month or so and every ****ing ounce of water counts
    The idea behind running test lower than tren is due to trens affinity to bind to the AR receptor. Tren will hog the receptor leaving little room for the test to bind to it, this leaving a lot of test floating around with nothing to do but aromatise. In saying that I ran 750mg test with 350mg tren and had no estrogen related issues.
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    you what im thinking bro

    Andromix 1 cc a day ---> 350 mg test, 350 mg tren, 350 mg masteron

    then on mon/friday 1 cc of tren enanthate---> 400 mg of tren

    so weekly 750 mg of tren enanthate, 350 mg of test, 350 mg of masteron


    what do u think about sucha high dosage of tren? are the gains gunna be worth the side effects?
    is more tren better or it wont be that much different than 350 of tren?

    i dont want to take any orals for next cycle giving liver a break
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    the **** happaned to everyone?

    im geting lean as ****

    192 lbs dropped 13 lbs since start of cut

    got 6 more weeks of cutting left
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    More gear doesn't make better gains. More food makes better gains
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    both gear and food are necessary. its easy to inject a gram of test a week but hard to dial in ur diet.
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    Quote Originally Posted by RussianAK47 View Post
    both gear and food are necessary. its easy to inject a gram of test a week but hard to dial in ur diet.
    I dont think upping the Tren is necessary. Sure, it might give you faster gains but definitely more sides with it. All you need is persistence at this point. The current gear will do its job w/ that alone.
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    Quote Originally Posted by fueledpassion View Post

    I dont think upping the Tren is necessary. Sure, it might give you faster gains but definitely more sides with it. All you need is persistence at this point. The current gear will do its job w/ that alone.
    There's something to be said here.
    Sometimes combating sides due to an increased dose yields diminished returns. When I enjoy incredible gains and start thinking: more will be better! I quickly remind myself of the skipped deadlifts from pack pumps, the nausea from some orals at higher doses, the poor sleep, etc.
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    Progress Progress Progress

    Cycle is slowly coming to end guys

    Ive been cutting for last 5 weeks went from 205 lbs to 188. 17 lbs in 5 weeks, not too ****ing bad

    On Tren. Test. Clen and T3

    What are your thought on T3?
    My arms got a lil smaller since i started taking t3 at 25 mcg,
    you think that **** is eating away my Joocy muscles?

    Today is chest day, if I crank out 315 on flat bench for 2-3 reps i know strengh is holding up well
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    Quote Originally Posted by RussianAK47 View Post
    <img src="http://anabolicminds.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=91 826"/>
    <img src="http://anabolicminds.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=91 827"/>

    Progress Progress Progress

    Cycle is slowly coming to end guys

    Ive been cutting for last 5 weeks went from 205 lbs to 188. 17 lbs in 5 weeks, not too ****ing bad

    On Tren. Test. Clen and T3

    What are your thought on T3?
    My arms got a lil smaller since i started taking t3 at 25 mcg,
    you think that **** is eating away my Joocy muscles?

    Today is chest day, if I crank out 315 on flat bench for 2-3 reps i know strengh is holding up well
    Muscle wasting occurs regardless when ur on a deficit. This is why I think timing of nutrients & training r very important when cutting as well as doing it slowly (250-500 total daily deficit).

    Strength will not be reflective of muscle mass retention especially while on gear like Tren.
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    Quote Originally Posted by fueledpassion View Post
    Muscle wasting occurs regardless when ur on a deficit. This is why I think timing of nutrients & training r very important when cutting as well as doing it slowly (250-500 total daily deficit).

    Strength will not be reflective of muscle mass retention especially while on gear like Tren.
    Good progress man. Pics look good. I think you need to keep cutting for another 10lbs, imo. Will be fairly ripped at 178lbs...
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    thanks man, will continue cutting for another 5 weeks then pct
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    I doubt whether you've lost much muscle while your on Tren. Looking good tho man, getting pretty lean.
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    My pct will be HCG 500 ius for 10 days staight followed by clomid for 4 weeks and nolva for 6 weeks. Will continue to run Adex into pct to control rebound estrogen as i dont think nolva will be enough.

    Now for my question. What is the best way to retain maximum muscle tissue post cycle and limit fat gains? I will continue to periodically run 2 week cycles of clen, Will eat at maintenance maybe slightly above, will continue training hard and doing cardio a few times a week. Diet will be clean, high protein, mod carb mod fat. I just want to maintain my gains (Both leanness and muscle mass) until next cycle sometime in spring.
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    MCT's and BCAA's will help alot. Get several hundred calories daily from MCT's because they r glucose sparing. Between the spared glucose and drinking BCAA's during training u should keep everything so long as ur eating maintenance. If anything u might keep burning fat.
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    Quote Originally Posted by RussianAK47 View Post
    My pct will be HCG 500 ius for 10 days staight followed by clomid for 4 weeks and nolva for 6 weeks. Will continue to run Adex into pct to control rebound estrogen as i dont think nolva will be enough.
    This is wrong here.

    Nolva combined with a 19nor compounds active metabolites can cause a prolactin rebound and bind to ypur progedterone receptors.
    -Plus-
    Running adex and nolva at the same time is pointless because they compete at the receptor and one will be pushed to the side wasting it. You need to rethink that pct.

    HCG should have been run DURING cycle. You see guys run it between cycles (like me) but I cruise. Its different I am nit trying to restart my LH and FSH just mimic its function while my HPTA is shutdown. 5000Iu in 10days will give you a "bleed" because if the 5 day halflife of hcg so in the end it will be a delayed restart if you LH and FSH resulting in a slowed recovery.

    You need a bit of research into pct if you want to keep those gains.
    The advice I give is just that... Advice, purely my opinion. Not medical advice
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    Quote Originally Posted by fueledpassion View Post
    MCT's and BCAA's will help alot. Get several hundred calories daily from MCT's because they r glucose sparing. Between the spared glucose and drinking BCAA's during training u should keep everything so long as ur eating maintenance. If anything u might keep burning fat.
    VERY good advice. Solid as usual FueledPassion.
    The advice I give is just that... Advice, purely my opinion. Not medical advice
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    Quote Originally Posted by DangerDave View Post
    This is wrong here.

    Nolva combined with a 19nor compounds active metabolites can cause a prolactin rebound and bind to ypur progedterone receptors.
    -Plus-
    Running adex and nolva at the same time is pointless because they compete at the receptor and one will be pushed to the side wasting it. You need to rethink that pct.

    HCG should have been run DURING cycle. You see guys run it between cycles (like me) but I cruise. Its different I am nit trying to restart my LH and FSH just mimic its function while my HPTA is shutdown. 5000Iu in 10days will give you a "bleed" because if the 5 day halflife of hcg so in the end it will be a delayed restart if you LH and FSH resulting in a slowed recovery.

    You need a bit of research into pct if you want to keep those gains.
    Thanks for your input Dave

    1. For the prolactin rebound, I have caber on hand so should i run that for a few weeks into my pct while the tren ace completely clears??
    I dont want to drop the nolva

    2. Okay I will drop adex, save it for future cycle. So just Nolva nd clomid?

    3. I have been running HCG, 250 ius twice a week with my test cyp injections. Nuts are in good shape
    The HCG blast at end would be an added layer of security to really kickstat my natural recovery. Maybe I wont do 500 ius for 10 days, maybe just 500 Ius every other day for 10 days so 2500 total.
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    Quote Originally Posted by fueledpassion View Post
    MCT's and BCAA's will help alot. Get several hundred calories daily from MCT's because they r glucose sparing. Between the spared glucose and drinking BCAA's during training u should keep everything so long as ur eating maintenance. If anything u might keep burning fat.
    I always drink 15 grams of BCAAs and Silk Amino Acids during my workouts. MCTs i will try to get more of.
    I like the sound of keeping everything and burning fat, thats what i like to ****ing hear FP
    thanks man
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    Also as you guys can see from the pict, i am not above my genetic potential, i'm not freakishly big, just in the 180's at a body fat level slightly higher than 10%. I believe that with a good pct my body can sustain this naturally.
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    Quote Originally Posted by RussianAK47 View Post
    Also as you guys can see from the pict, i am not above my genetic potential, i'm not freakishly big, just in the 180's at a body fat level slightly higher than 10%. I believe that with a good pct my body can sustain this naturally.
    That my friend depends on ur diet and cardio routine
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    Quote Originally Posted by RussianAK47 View Post

    Thanks for your input Dave

    1. For the prolactin rebound, I have caber on hand so should i run that for a few weeks into my pct while the tren ace completely clears??
    I dont want to drop the nolva

    2. Okay I will drop adex, save it for future cycle. So just Nolva nd clomid?

    3. I have been running HCG, 250 ius twice a week with my test cyp injections. Nuts are in good shape
    The HCG blast at end would be an added layer of security to really kickstat my natural recovery. Maybe I wont do 500 ius for 10 days, maybe just 500 Ius every other day for 10 days so 2500 total.
    Your welcome man.

    I think you missed the point tho. Reducing the hcg doesn't fix the issue of it not being there. It has no business in that spot of your pct. If thats what you wanna run go ahead tho.

    For the nolva using caber doesn't fix the problem. The problem is you DON'T run nolva after a 19nor (tren, deca, npp). Your scared of estrogen rebound? From what? Tren doesn't aromatize only test does. And you aren't running enough to worry about rebound if you pct with clomid right.

    If you were truly worried about rebound you wouldn't prevent it with a SERM anyways... because you can rebound off those. You would use a suicidal aromatase inhibitor like exemestane (aromasin).

    You need to rethink your pct and do some research. You obviously just cookie cutted it or decided to take EVERYTHING without any research.

    My work here is done haha
    The advice I give is just that... Advice, purely my opinion. Not medical advice
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    Quote Originally Posted by DangerDave View Post
    Your welcome man.

    I think you missed the point tho. Reducing the hcg doesn't fix the issue of it not being there. It has no business in that spot of your pct. If thats what you wanna run go ahead tho.

    For the nolva using caber doesn't fix the problem. The problem is you DON'T run nolva after a 19nor (tren, deca, npp). Your scared of estrogen rebound? From what? Tren doesn't aromatize only test does. And you aren't running enough to worry about rebound if you pct with clomid right.

    If you were truly worried about rebound you wouldn't prevent it with a SERM anyways... because you can rebound off those. You would use a suicidal aromatase inhibitor like exemestane (aromasin).

    You need to rethink your pct and do some research. You obviously just cookie cutted it or decided to take EVERYTHING without any research.

    My work here is done haha

    MY PCT is well- thought out and I straight from the Anabolics textbook. Its been tried and tested.

    Who the **** are you to tell me what i have or havent done?

    Yeah ur work here is done now piss off
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    Quote Originally Posted by RussianAK47 View Post
    MY PCT is well- thought out and I straight from the Anabolics textbook. Its been tried and tested.

    Who the **** are you to tell me what i have or havent done?

    Yeah ur work here is done now piss off
    Hey hey, its ok man.

    I always thought one of the benefits of running hcg on cycle is that is allows the PCT to be much less complicated afterwards. I mean, your LH is probably still low, like .5-1.0 at best. But it isn't completely dead so the bounce back should happen immediately upon taking a SERM. Blasting then moving right into a SERM could desensitize your body to all of it, which means that after PCT is over, your T levels could plummit anyways.

    I'd just run the 250iu/twice a week in the first of the two weeks that you are clearing the test. Then after the 2 weeks of clearing is over, jump on Clomid.

    You need to let that hcg clear your system as well before starting Clomid, imo. If I had all the resources to do whatever, I'd actually just run 100iu/day of the hcg in the weeks while I was clearing the test and stop everything a few days before starting up Clomid therapy.

    Running 100iu/day simulates a similar pulsing that your body would naturally do. Take in the am. Frequency can matter just as much as dosing when you are trying to retrain your body to do its own thing.

    BTW, you did a really good job cutting up. I'm impressed with the progress and I think you should keep it going well into PCT to make even more dramatic gains. If you get super low in BF, you'll actually adjust your fat set point which means you'll permanently stay in that realm of bf%.
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    Quote Originally Posted by RussianAK47 View Post

    MY PCT is well- thought out and I straight from the Anabolics textbook. Its been tried and tested.

    Who the **** are you to tell me what i have or havent done?

    Yeah ur work here is done now piss off
    Lol DD has been around a long while young buck, just because you read something in a book doesn't mean it entirely accurate, that book is over 10 years old and many of the methods in the book have been debunked. Dangerdave is perfectly on point and you would do well to listen to the voice of experience.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lukef2000 View Post
    Lol DD has been around a long while young buck, just because you read something in a book doesn't mean it entirely accurate, that book is over 10 years old and many of the methods in the book have been debunked. Dangerdave is perfectly on point and you would do well to listen to the voice of experience.
    They update the book every year or so but you're right you can never trust one source.

    I what I like to do is to get advice from numerous sources ( They're so many different sources telling you conflicting information) and compare them to each other.
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    Quote Originally Posted by fueledpassion View Post
    Hey hey, its ok man.

    I always thought one of the benefits of running hcg on cycle is that is allows the PCT to be much less complicated afterwards. I mean, your LH is probably still low, like .5-1.0 at best. But it isn't completely dead so the bounce back should happen immediately upon taking a SERM. Blasting then moving right into a SERM could desensitize your body to all of it, which means that after PCT is over, your T levels could plummit anyways.

    I'd just run the 250iu/twice a week in the first of the two weeks that you are clearing the test. Then after the 2 weeks of clearing is over, jump on Clomid.

    You need to let that hcg clear your system as well before starting Clomid, imo. If I had all the resources to do whatever, I'd actually just run 100iu/day of the hcg in the weeks while I was clearing the test and stop everything a few days before starting up Clomid therapy.

    Running 100iu/day simulates a similar pulsing that your body would naturally do. Take in the am. Frequency can matter just as much as dosing when you are trying to retrain your body to do its own thing.

    BTW, you did a really good job cutting up. I'm impressed with the progress and I think you should keep it going well into PCT to make even more dramatic gains. If you get super low in BF, you'll actually adjust your fat set point which means you'll permanently stay in that realm of bf%.
    Thank you FP.

    I have no tolerance to people who speak down to others in a condescending way. That is rude, disrespectful, shows lack of manner and class.

    This is why I have respect for you FP, you are older than me and have more experience in bodybuilding as a whole, yet you do not speak down to me in a condescending way. It's just a basic life skill.

    I am not arguing with his advice, it could very well be right. But the way he worded himself "You obviously didnt do your research" it came off as disrespectful. I am not confrontational and he probably just meant well. Just a misunderstanding.
    I apologize for what i said.

    I am looking for constructive helpful feedback, not criticism.

    I agree with you FP and will follow your advice, I will continue the HCG for two weeks after last injection at 200 ius every other day (running low on insuling needles). Then wait 2-3 days then start the clomid and nolva, I will continue to run caber and adex for two weeks after last injection as well.

    I will however, tone down my cutting intensity in pct, I will definitely drop the t3, up the carbs and lower the cardio.
    I will no longer be in anabolic environment and I will have to focus on preserving muscle mass instead of losing body fat.

    Thanks for saying I did a good job cutting up, I still have 4 weeks left of cutting then doing a photoshoot ( I want to fitness model/compete in mens physique in future) So well see how my cut went.



    Something tells me I will be just fine.

    Thank you everyone for your advice and help.

    It's much appreciated.
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