4-ad Converstion To Test

[Wilko]

This is purely speculation and I'm curious if perhaps someone has more insight they could share. 4-ad, specifically 4-ad RMS Chrome tablets, list a 'proprietary blend' of 200mg. The two compounds in said blend being 4-Androstene-3B-ol-17-one and Hydroxypropyl-beta-cyclodextrin. I can't find the ratio of the two. The 4-ad becomes test via a two-step conversion. Now, as far as I understand, if we assume a 1:1 ratio and assign a 10% endstate conversion - just for this example - then one 200mg tab provides roughly 10mg of testosterone.

So, hypotheticals aside, does anyone know how much testosterone this provides in the end?

 

[rphash49]

This is purely speculation and I'm curious if perhaps someone has more insight they could share. 4-ad, specifically 4-ad RMS Chrome tablets, list a 'proprietary blend' of 200mg. The two compounds in said blend being 4-Androstene-3B-ol-17-one and Hydroxypropyl-beta-cyclodextrin. I can't find the ratio of the two. The 4-ad becomes test via a two-step conversion. Now, as far as I understand, if we assume a 1:1 ratio and assign a 10% endstate conversion - just for this example - then one 200mg tab provides roughly 10mg of testosterone.

So, hypotheticals aside, does anyone know how much testosterone this provides in the end?

From what I have read the oral A:A ratio is unknown.

Did find an oral bioavailability 'estimate' at 4%

 

[Wilko]

I wasn't referencing the anabolic:androgenic ratio. I meant the ratio between the active 4-ad compound and whatever the Hydro-blahblahblah is. 190mg of active compound is very different than 90mg, you know?

Where did you find that number, if you don't mind me asking?

 

[rphash49]

I wasn't referencing the anabolic:androgenic ratio. I meant the ratio between the active 4-ad compound and whatever the Hydro-blahblahblah is. 190mg of active compound is very different than 90mg, you know?

Where did you find that number, if you don't mind me asking?

Oh ok gotcha....miss read. I got that number from a DS/PH profile sticky at primordial performance which is now shut down and the board is closed so I can't link it to you if I wanted to. I printed it off before the board closed. The stickys on that board were top notch and I learned a lot. Not sure where PP got that number but Eric P seemed like a very intelligent individual that cared about his product and customer base so I trust what he posted.

 

[Wilko]

I recall PP... unfortunate scenario, that whole thing. Thanks much for the information, friend.

Now if we can just find the amount of actual 4-ad in the 200mg we'd be golden.

 

[jbryand101b]

This is purely speculation and I'm curious if perhaps someone has more insight they could share. 4-ad, specifically 4-ad RMS Chrome tablets, list a 'proprietary blend' of 200mg. The two compounds in said blend being 4-Androstene-3B-ol-17-one and Hydroxypropyl-beta-cyclodextrin. I can't find the ratio of the two. The 4-ad becomes test via a two-step conversion. Now, as far as I understand, if we assume a 1:1 ratio and assign a 10% endstate conversion - just for this example - then one 200mg tab provides roughly 10mg of testosterone.

So, hypotheticals aside, does anyone know how much testosterone this provides in the end?

no, the possibilities are endless,

 

[jbryand101b]

I recall PP... unfortunate scenario, that whole thing. Thanks much for the information, friend.

Now if we can just find the amount of actual 4-ad in the 200mg we'd be golden.

Pp just made the numbers up.

It is impossible to estimate conversion rate in vivo.

 

[Wilko]

Unfortunate. Thanks Jbry.

 

[JD261985]

If 4 ad did nothing no one would take it

 

[Wilko]

I'm not arguing 4-ad's efficacy. Within the context of a test base, it gets the job done, though I find I prefer around 6 tabs as opposed to recommended 2. Of course, manufacturer dosage recommendations have become virtually worthless.

 

[JD261985]

I'm not arguing 4-ad's efficacy. Within the context of a test base, it gets the job done, though I find I prefer around 6 tabs as opposed to recommended 2. Of course, manufacturer dosage recommendations have become virtually worthless.

Lol which really pisses me off

 

[jbryand101b]

if it makes y'all feel any better, I like ams, I've used their diendrone, then dienedrone utt, 4-ad utt, mass drops, and yesterday I ordered two bottles of 4-ad rde.

I also like forrunner labs. it's good stuff.

 

[Wilko]

Oh, they're good in my book. There is world of difference between tren solo and tren with 4-ad.

What does utt designate?

 

[jbryand101b]

under the tounge. it was their liquid suspension.

 

[jbryand101b]

tmi.

 

[bjordan]

I read a patrick arnold article one time on the conversion rate of 4ad and i believe he stated that its impossible to get a accurate number for conversion because the hormone can keep converting back and forth between 4ad and test. But if it converts to a estrogen metabolite it cannot convert back to 4ad or test.

 

[Wilko]

a typical cyclodextrin complex can be formed with a 9:1 ratio of cyclo to steroid, so the 200mg contains around 22 mg of 4dhea. at least according to the cyclo recipes i've seen. like these
btw bioavailability will be extremely high and the half-life very short.

Method1
For the first method we will formulate it for a total of 2g of steroid.
Dissolve 18g of HPBCD in 80ml saline in a beaker on a stir plate. Once this is dissolved, slowly add the 2g of steroid over about 5 minutes. Let this stir overnight. Filter out any insoluble particles. This provides a 25mg/ml solution.

Method 2
For the second method, we will formulate it for 1g of steroid.
Triturate (mix in a mortar with a pestle) 9g HPBCD with 1g steroid. Place this in a high humidity environment for 2-4 days. I have used a covered fish tank with water in the bottom, but anything that can create a humid environment will work. A syrup will form, and this is dissolved in 40ml saline and you have a 25mg/ml solution.

Method 3
For the third method, we will formulate for 4g of steroid.
Triturate 36g of HPBCD with 4g steroid. Let this sit at normal room temperature and humidity for a week. Complexation will occur, but takes time with this process Dissolve the powder in 160ml saline. This again makes a 25mg/ml solution.

Ready, set, science boner.

 

[bjordan]

Yea bro i am fascinated by it as well. Sucks about the half-life just gotta pop more tabs.

 

[jbryand101b]

not sure how half life is affected.

testosterone itself has a half life of 4hrs.

 

[jbryand101b]

once the ester is removed from the ment, it's half live has been noted as being around 40min-2hrs or so, cant remember exactly, but I know the low end was in the minutes.

but yea, when I would run 4-androstenediol, I dosed it every 4 hours.