A few questions on this after reading Anabolics by William L...

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    A few questions on this after reading Anabolics by William L...


    So I've been doing all the research I can in order to approach everything with the safest and most knowledgeable route I can take. I picked up Anabolics, the latest edition that was released in 2011 and was hoping for some input on this cycle.

    AAS Chosen: Testosterone Enanthate- 500mg per week
    8 Weeks at a time (10-12 weeks max)
    Week
    1 200mg
    2 400mg
    3 400mg
    4 400mg
    5 400mg
    6 500mg
    7 500mg
    8 500mg
    9 500mg
    10 200mg

    Products: 20mL 200mg/mL Testosterone enanthate

    All weeks: Cholesterol support: Lipid Stabil (3 caps/day) and Fish oil (4g a day)
    Estrogen Support: Tamoxifen(Nolva) (20-40mg/day)

    PCT Initiated 2 weeks after last injection:
    HCG @ 2000IU every other day for 20 days.
    Clomiphene Citrate 50mg twice per day for 30 days.
    Tamoxifen Citrate 20mg twice per day for 45 days.

    OCT (Off Cycle Support)
    Vitamin D 3,000 IU/Day
    Calcium 500 mg/day
    Zinc Sulphate 250mg/day
    D-Aspartic Acid 3.2g/day
    Arachidonic Acid 250mg/day
    Fish Oil 2g/day
    Creatine 5g/day
    Beta Alanine 3-6g/day
    BCAA 10g/day

    I also heard that running taurine may help counteract back pumps as a possible side but I couldn't much information to confirm this. Aside from that I was going to look into something to reduce testicular atrophy while on cycle. How does this look though?

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    If you're going to use 500mg a week, then use 500mg a week. Tapering up... what a waste of time. hcg is on cycle, not post cycle. Hcg only if needed on cycle, don't just use it to use it. Taurine can help with hydration, yes. Clomid/Nolva, that's fine.
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    Just go test e 500 a week for 12 weeks. Get an ai in case you need it. Wait two weeks after last injection and take clomid 100/100/50/50. For your first cycle keep it as simple as possible.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rhadam View Post
    If you're going to use 500mg a week, then use 500mg a week. Tapering up... what a waste of time. hcg is on cycle, not post cycle. Hcg only if needed on cycle, don't just use it to use it. Taurine can help with hydration, yes. Clomid/Nolva, that's fine.
    Thanks for the response. So essentially you're saying 500 a week, all weeks (doing twice a week pins, Monday/Thursday night). HCG is really the only thing I'll need to keep on hand with just a basic Test E cycle as a just in case and then Clomid/Nolva as my PCT. This should cover it?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rhadam View Post
    If you're going to use 500mg a week, then use 500mg a week. Tapering up... what a waste of time. hcg is on cycle, not post cycle. Hcg only if needed on cycle, don't just use it to use it. Taurine can help with hydration, yes. Clomid/Nolva, that's fine.
    Ok so these are the revisions I'll make and finalize with:

    Weeks 1-10
    -500mg Test E, twice a week, 3.5 days a part.
    -HCG Kept on hand if needed. When we say "if needed", this is assuming atrophy gets bad I assume?

    PCT Weeks 12-14
    -Clomid split twice per day @ 100/100/50/50
    -Nolva split twice per day @ 40/40/20/20

    I hear mixed reviews on running aromasin while on cycle, any opinions on that? I also see people running Nolva on cycle also.
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    Pct is to strong:


    Pick one or the other:

    Clomid - 50/50/25/25
    Or
    Nolva - 20/20/10/10

    I'd run the test e for 12 weeks. I know it means u'll need another vial. But most vials only contain around 9ml anyway so u'll probably need the extra anyway.
    Hcg start week 3. 250-500iu the night before test shot. Not needed but it will help. For just a test e cycle I'd say 250iu will be fine
    Christopher
    http://anabolicminds.com/forum/old-school-hormone/239904-csa2179s-hulk-mirror.html#post4289751
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    Aromasin is good but Adex will probably be fine for this cycle. U might not need it but have it anyway
    Christopher
    http://anabolicminds.com/forum/old-school-hormone/239904-csa2179s-hulk-mirror.html#post4289751
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    Quote Originally Posted by csa2179 View Post
    Aromasin is good but Adex will probably be fine for this cycle. U might not need it but have it anyway
    Thanks for the response csa. So then it will look like this..

    Weeks 1-12
    -500mg Test E, twice a week, 3.5 days a part.
    -HCG starting at Week 3-12 at 500iu the nights before test shots.
    -Aromasin 12.5mg eod up to PCT if needed. (or Adex)

    PCT Weeks 14-16
    -Nolva split twice per day @ 40/40/20/20
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    Is this your first cycle? What do you expect to get out of it? Is there a reason you're not including any kind of oral? Just curious.
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    Quote Originally Posted by JRam View Post
    Is this your first cycle? What do you expect to get out of it? Is there a reason you're not including any kind of oral? Just curious.
    It's my first cycle, one of the main reasons I'm trying to keep it as simple as possible. I'm hoping to gain anywhere between 5-15lbs (as lean as possible). I track my diet pretty accurately and know my macros and calories to gain/lose on for the most part, though I'm not sure if being on cycle effects anything in that department but I'd assume not. I decided not to go with an oral because from what I've read it seems to put a lot more stress on the liver and cardiovascular system as opposed to injections.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cronos1247 View Post
    So I've been doing all the research I can in order to approach everything with the safest and most knowledgeable route I can take. I picked up Anabolics, the latest edition that was released in 2011 and was hoping for some input on this cycle.

    AAS Chosen: Testosterone Enanthate- 500mg per week
    8 Weeks at a time (10-12 weeks max)
    Week
    1 200mg
    2 400mg
    3 400mg
    4 400mg
    5 400mg
    6 500mg
    7 500mg
    8 500mg
    9 500mg
    10 200mg

    Products: 20mL 200mg/mL Testosterone enanthate

    All weeks: Cholesterol support: Lipid Stabil (3 caps/day) and Fish oil (4g a day)
    Estrogen Support: Tamoxifen(Nolva) (20-40mg/day)

    PCT Initiated 2 weeks after last injection:
    HCG @ 2000IU every other day for 20 days.
    Clomiphene Citrate 50mg twice per day for 30 days.
    Tamoxifen Citrate 20mg twice per day for 45 days.

    OCT (Off Cycle Support)
    Vitamin D 3,000 IU/Day
    Calcium 500 mg/day
    Zinc Sulphate 250mg/day
    D-Aspartic Acid 3.2g/day
    Arachidonic Acid 250mg/day
    Fish Oil 2g/day
    Creatine 5g/day
    Beta Alanine 3-6g/day
    BCAA 10g/day

    I also heard that running taurine may help counteract back pumps as a possible side but I couldn't much information to confirm this. Aside from that I was going to look into something to reduce testicular atrophy while on cycle. How does this look though?
    There is a reason why that cycle tapers like that.
    Do you know much 500mg of test a week increases your test levels? ...if it's real test properly dosed. More is not better. Most ppl I know their first cycle was 200 or 250mg a week of test and they gained up to 20lbs with proper diet and lifting regiment.
    100mg of test a week will put most ppl at about 1200-1400ng/dl next day after injection or even higher in some cases...500mg is a lot for a first timer. THen next cycle is 750? That's ridiculous. lol
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    Quote Originally Posted by vassille View Post
    There is a reason why that cycle tapers like that.
    Do you know much 500mg of test a week increases your test levels? ...if it's real test properly dosed. More is not better. Most ppl I know their first cycle was 200 or 250mg a week of test and they gained up to 20lbs with proper diet and lifting regiment.
    100mg of test a week will put most ppl at about 1200-1400ng/dl next day after injection or even higher in some cases...500mg is a lot for a first timer. THen next cycle is 750? That's ridiculous. lol
    Whenever I started looking into running a cycle, I had done the majority of my research online and with advice from people on various forums about what they suggest starting with, etc. After getting contradicting opinions from nearly every forum, that's when I decided to pick up the book that seems to be reviewed as the "bible for AAS" from a lot of users. The original cycle with the tapering is what was suggested by the author as a first time run, though it suggests starting between 200-600mg weekly, I just chose 500 as sort of a median.

    The only thing I'm still a bit confused on is the HCG dosing. The book states every other day and on here a lot of people say before test shots. Assuming before test shots, are we talking twice weekly, on the night before test shots? So essentially I'd be pinning 4x a week (2 HCG & 2 Test E) at this protocol?
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    Whatever you finally decide, you should log it if you have the time and inclination. As someone else noted, 500mg a week is a legit dosage. You're probably going to see some serious progress. This sounds like it's going to be an interesting adventure.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cronos1247 View Post
    Whenever I started looking into running a cycle, I had done the majority of my research online and with advice from people on various forums about what they suggest starting with, etc. After getting contradicting opinions from nearly every forum, that's when I decided to pick up the book that seems to be reviewed as the "bible for AAS" from a lot of users. The original cycle with the tapering is what was suggested by the author as a first time run, though it suggests starting between 200-600mg weekly, I just chose 500 as sort of a median.

    The only thing I'm still a bit confused on is the HCG dosing. The book states every other day and on here a lot of people say before test shots. Assuming before test shots, are we talking twice weekly, on the night before test shots? So essentially I'd be pinning 4x a week (2 HCG & 2 Test E) at this protocol?
    Tapering is an older model of doing a cycle. THe main benefit is that will let the body adjust to the anabolics slowly. Then the question would be why? It has to do with functions of the hormone production and also the brain. Dopamine is def affected by anabolics, that;s why some feel euphoric on the stuff. Another is the production of estrogen under increased testosterone. Flooding the body with too much test at once will def create this sort of problems. THe same goes for tapering down. The body needs time to readjust otherwise you could possibly feel like crap for a long time. Tren is notorious for extreme sides even when tapered down, but if you just abruptly go on or off is just even more brutal.
    So that's the deal on the tapering down.
    Dosages. Most of the higher dosages are a direst result of underdosed gear. Many ppl who do 500 with underground stuff is more realistically 250ish to be honest. I have pharm stuff and even to this day 250mg a week starts to put on weight and I've been doing anabolics for more than 15 years. I usually keep the doage under that and the blood work doesnt lie. At 100mg of test my levels are 1200ng/dl. So if you doing 500 real gear you better have an AI on hand for sure and take it. Make sure that AI is real as well so you dont F-up your body and bloat like a baloon.
    HCG. If you dose every other day, do like 500IU. You dont need too much. Every other day is just that every other day. Doesnt matter when you take the other test shots. You not doing HRT trying to keep levels all that constant. I wouldnt do 2000iu at once. I personally dont think is necessary to dose up like that.

    Have you considered blood pressure issues? At 500mg a week your BP will go up.
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    Quote Originally Posted by vassille View Post
    Tapering is an older model of doing a cycle. THe main benefit is that will let the body adjust to the anabolics slowly. Then the question would be why? It has to do with functions of the hormone production and also the brain. Dopamine is def affected by anabolics, that;s why some feel euphoric on the stuff. Another is the production of estrogen under increased testosterone. Flooding the body with too much test at once will def create this sort of problems. THe same goes for tapering down. The body needs time to readjust otherwise you could possibly feel like crap for a long time. Tren is notorious for extreme sides even when tapered down, but if you just abruptly go on or off is just even more brutal.
    So that's the deal on the tapering down.
    Dosages. Most of the higher dosages are a direst result of underdosed gear. Many ppl who do 500 with underground stuff is more realistically 250ish to be honest. I have pharm stuff and even to this day 250mg a week starts to put on weight and I've been doing anabolics for more than 15 years. I usually keep the doage under that and the blood work doesnt lie. At 100mg of test my levels are 1200ng/dl. So if you doing 500 real gear you better have an AI on hand for sure and take it. Make sure that AI is real as well so you dont F-up your body and bloat like a baloon.
    HCG. If you dose every other day, do like 500IU. You dont need too much. Every other day is just that every other day. Doesnt matter when you take the other test shots. You not doing HRT trying to keep levels all that constant. I wouldnt do 2000iu at once. I personally dont think is necessary to dose up like that.

    Have you considered blood pressure issues? At 500mg a week your BP will go up.
    Thanks Vassille, extremely useful information there. I still unfortunately haven't found a source, so maybe it's a better choice to base my dosage off whether or not it ends up being from a pharm or underground. I'd much rather go through a pharm source just so I know everythings legit. So assuming I drop the dosing down to 250mg weekly, would you still suggest the tapering approach?

    Running the cycle at 250mg for 12 weeks, HCG every other day at 500iu with an AI on hand just in case and a basic PCT with just clomid or Nolva would be a better approach in your opinion? On the subject of PCT, would you still suggest incorporating both clomid AND nolva, or just one or the other?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cronos1247 View Post
    Thanks Vassille, extremely useful information there. I still unfortunately haven't found a source, so maybe it's a better choice to base my dosage off whether or not it ends up being from a pharm or underground. I'd much rather go through a pharm source just so I know everythings legit. So assuming I drop the dosing down to 250mg weekly, would you still suggest the tapering approach?

    Running the cycle at 250mg for 12 weeks, HCG every other day at 500iu with an AI on hand just in case and a basic PCT with just clomid or Nolva would be a better approach in your opinion? On the subject of PCT, would you still suggest incorporating both clomid AND nolva, or just one or the other?
    Sure np
    If you can, get pharm grade even if it's more expensive. You get what you pay for in reality.
    At 250mg a week I dont see the need to taper. I personally would taper at the end last one or two week to 125mg. Then start your PCT right after that since the test levels by then would return within normal range. Also, at this stage HCG should have been stopped for about 2 weeks.
    Just run either nolva or clomid and dont go crazy with the dosages either.
  

  
 

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