Cycle length vs cycle dose for gains and recovery?

[ezza]

Hey guys as the tittle says, I'm interested on oppinions from experienced gear heads,as I am not experienced. Which will be better for gains and which will be better for recover? I'll give an example so there's not too much assumption factored into the answer. Ok so for arguments sake and because this is my current predicament. I have asked this in another thread of mine but was hoping for more detail. I'll give 2 cycle examples:

Week 1-13 600mg test
Week 1-4 oral kicker
Week 12-15 oral finisher
Week 16- pct

Or

Week 1-10 800 mg test
Week 1-4 oral kicker
Week 9-12 oral finisher
Week 13 pct

 

[j05441]

What test?

What kicker?
What pct?

Lots of variables here

 

[usealittle]

Pct on cyp is 2 wks not 3..

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[bad rad]

I don't think the difference of 3 weeks will be much impact. In my experience after 8 weeks on it was a bitch to recover from and if I didn't use hCG I was screwed.

 

[ezza]

I know everyone wants to pick everything to pieces but if all things are constant those variables are not variables at all they are constants in each cycle. The only variable is the Length and dose.That's why I didn't include details. Pct is starting 2 weeks after last injection therefore pcts starts beginning of 3rd week after last injection. Will be tamoxifen + aromasin. No hcg at all. Test is a mix 150 test e 150 test c 50 prop 50 acetate per ml. Injections will be done 3-4 times a week to make use of short esters. Kicker will be 25mg anadrol first 10 days + superdrol 20mg for first 10 then 30 till week 4, last portion of orals is undecided but will be run right up until pct in both cycles. A variable is only variable if it is different guys come on, you could have answered my question.

 

[ezza]

Basically i need advice from someone with experience, who can count to 3 and tell the difference between a constant and a variable, if not, your not qualified to give me advice thanks!

 

[bad rad]

I answered your question on recovery, it's a wash. 800mgs>600mgs if you can handle possible sides. From a clinical stand point myostatin increase about week 8 or 9 and will offset gains acheived from cycling longer than that.

 

[ezza]

Thanks bad rad, yeah you did answer my question so that wasnt aimed at you in any way. I think a higher dosed shorter cycle will be the ticket for both gains and recovery.

 

[DetroitHammer]

Math isn't that easy when you're using AAS. You want to know about recovery, but without knowing what you plan on using, it's not a variable, you're missing part of the equation. Maybe this will help then you can do the math anyway you want:

With any amount of test, for any length of time, you are going to shut down. The difference of 3 weeks is no difference at all. If you were going for 13 weeks or considering two years, then maybe it will be harder after two years, but we don't know. Since you're going to shut down no matter what, just focus on gains because if you will recover after 13 weeks, you'll recover after 16 weeks even with more gear, because you're already over what you would normally produce. If you take 500mgs or 2grams, it's going to be just as hard to recover, if "recovery" is for you to produce your own test. If recovery includes liver values, RBC, etc., then maybe more gear will make recovery harder.

My only comments, which you didn't ask for, are that your PCT sucks. You don't need Tamoxifen if you're using Aromasin. You need HCG, period. If it were me I would not wait two weeks, although I understand the perceived logic of waiting two weeks. I'd start a week after the last injection, and go for maybe three weeks, even four if you taper down.

Your test blend is quite bizarre, but it's probably all you could get your hands on. Why anyone would mix cyp and enanthate is beyond me. They are too close to split hairs on. The orals at the end will make recovery of your liver harder. I'd back off the orals at the end.

So, go for the big gains and don't worry about making recovery any easier, it doesn't matter.

I know everyone wants to pick everything to pieces but if all things are constant those variables are not variables at all they are constants in each cycle. The only variable is the Length and dose.That's why I didn't include details. Pct is starting 2 weeks after last injection therefore pcts starts beginning of 3rd week after last injection. Will be tamoxifen + aromasin. No hcg at all. Test is a mix 150 test e 150 test c 50 prop 50 acetate per ml. Injections will be done 3-4 times a week to make use of short esters. Kicker will be 25mg anadrol first 10 days + superdrol 20mg for first 10 then 30 till week 4, last portion of orals is undecided but will be run right up until pct in both cycles. A variable is only variable if it is different guys come on, you could have answered my question.

 

[howwedo107]

That's really odd to have a blend of e and c bc I believe they are super close but the reason test c was made was bc some ppl can have an allergy to test E...also I can tell you from experience from week 8-16 of my cycle was when I had the most gains in size...personally I blast and cruise at this point in my life but DH is correct (as always) 3 weeks won't matter when it comes to recovery just focus on gains and if your still gaining well then go for it...800mg of test a week will give you a lot of ability to grow I'm 5'9 203lbs and I'm only blasting at 500mg but I'm slowly working my way up my sdrol dosage is still only 15mg and in gaining very nicely and steadily but anyway back to your question go with 800mg test with hcg and aromasin and drop the Novla on cycle...if I was you I'd kick it with sdrol and do a nice clean bulk then your last 6 weeks cut with tbol or var if you can get your hands on them

 

[ezza]

Thanks detroit hammer your a big unit and you make some points i already understand, for example i could even be shut down completely on 250mg test or even the superdrol alone. But i dont think you read or understood my question properly.Your still making assumptions that you didnt need to, to answer my question. My pct doesnt suck! Haha i appreciate the sentiment though. Its tamox 40/20/20/10/10 with continuation of on cycle estrogen control at around 12.5 mg aromasin e3d or eod ending one week after tamoxifen use. So its basically a 6 week pct and aromasin could not be used alone at this dosage for pct. Tamoxifen will increase estrogen levels and once i come off tamoxifen they will be able to attatch to receptors and put a hault to further test production. Starting pct the next week after injection would not be very good since ill be taking orals for a further 2 weeks by the time i finish pct i will still be shut right down still, 2 weeks is still a bit early without a long pct considering dose and half life.The test i chose which human grade, was nearly the same price as test e 250mg/ml so test 400mg/mlfor the same price, was a no brainer even with the weird mix. hcg is not happening because it would have cost nearly the same as 20ml of the test which was a small fortune in itself. Basic maths is basic maths weather it is aas or money, we are not building a rocket!

 

[ezza]

That's really odd to blend of e and c bc I believe they are super close but the reason test c was made was bc some ppl can have an allergy to test E...also I can tell you from experience from week 8-16 of my cycle was when I had the most gains in size...personally I blast and cruise at this point in my life but DH is correct (as always) 3 weeks won't matter when it comes to recovery just focus on gains and if your still gaining well then go for it...800mg of test a week will give you a lot of ability to grow I'm 5'9 203lbs and I'm only blasting at 500mg but I'm slowly working my way up my sdrol dosage is still only 15mg and in gaining very nicely and steadily but anyway back to your question go with 800mg test with hcg and aromasin and drop the Novla on cycle...if I was you I'd kick it with sdrol and do a nice clean bulk then your last 6 weeks cut with tbol or var if you can get your hands on them

Thanks mate your reply has been the best so far i will go the 600mg for 13 weeks, whats the minimum hcg i could get away with, this cycle is going to top the grand mark shortly not including the stuff i already had, luckily i found lots of goodies laying around like peptides and orals.

 

[usealittle]

I would go with shorter cycle with higher doses....

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[handcannon7]

Longer is always better, not only will you have an easier time holding onto your gains since you are not cruising but a consistent dose of hormones over time is what will get you the best results.
Time and consistency are the 2 things that mean the most in all aspects of bodybuilding, same holds true for drug use.

 

[usealittle]

^^^^ sense he is not on a cruise you are correct but in any other instance shorter is better for the body. Get on and get off... That's why I love "shic's"

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[schwellington]

I answered your question on recovery, it's a wash. 800mgs>600mgs if you can handle possible sides. From a clinical stand point myostatin increase about week 8 or 9 and will offset gains acheived from cycling longer than that.

Do you have proof of myostatin interacting a such?

 

[bad rad]

Here's the study showing levels increase about week 8 and drop around week 20. Whether this explains the stall many get it is interesting that broscience has been saying to increase doses around week 8.

http://www.afboard.com/library/Measurement of myostatin concentrations in human serum Circulating concentrations in young and older men and effects of testosterone administration.pdf

 

[Mack555]

Starting pct the next week after injection would not be very good since ill be taking orals for a further 2 weeks by the time i finish pct i will still be shut right down still, 2 weeks is still a bit early without a long pct considering dose and half life.The test i chose which human grade, was nearly the same price as test e 250mg/ml so test 400mg/mlfor the same price,