Starting first cycle for the first time and have questions

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    Starting first cycle for the first time and have questions


    Hi everyone, have been a big fan of AM and have been learning a lot from u guys and thx to u all finally I made the decision to go to the dark side also. I m planning on doing a test e cycle as advised for first timers (500mcg a week mon thusday devided into two) for 12 weeks and planning on adding winny or tren a to the end of the cycle to cut and start my pct.
    My stats are: 37 years old, 215lbs, 17% bf, 6.2, have been lifting for 6 years and did osta and andromass cycles before with nice results. (On osta put like 8lbs in 6 weeks, andro about 17lbs in 2 months both shut me down and killed libido, did torem pct for both)

    For the cycle im getting adex for cycle, aromasin for pct, have torem in hand but planning to get nolva also for pct, ordering also taurine for backbumps, have cycle support in hand, planing to get hcg also just in case (if I find a source my guy doesnt have it), have some liquid clen in hand to use at the end in my pct.
    Since im typing this at work and dont have the written cycle info infront of me I cant give u guys the detailed info about my cycle in terms of how many mcgs of every indidual component but I know 500mcgs teste 12.5 eod adex thru cycle, 12.5 aromasin eod in pct, 60, 60, 50, 40 torem 2 weeks after last injection open to suggestions if anyone thinks how to stack nolva with it with which protocole, 3 to 5g taurine daily. Besides all 2g these, preworkout sups for lathergy, fishoils and glucosamine for joints, s$*t ton of vitamines, bcaa, daa and zma some other test booster that I dont remember the name (dont have the paper with me remember) will be included in pct.

    Now some questions
    1) what do u guys think about winny or tren which one to go with to cut in week 13 after im done with test e in week 12 or shall I do tren a or winny while im on test any opinions?

    2) Im thinking about adding ostarine below 12.5 (read its not suppresive at that level) to pct any opinions suggestions on that?

    3)Couldnt get and orals to stack with test e for the begining of the cycle before test kicks in, shall I do ostarine I have which im already on right now before test kicks in or some say bad idea they compete for the same receptors, any suggestions?

    4)Anything else I havent written here that u experienced bros would suggest.

    I ll start my cycle in 3 weeks after I drop to 12% bf by doing a keto diet and deplete my gloco deposits so once on cycle ll gain way faster hopefully. Thanks for reading and considering to help and hopefull not flaming me.
    Can wait to be in beast mode and finally in the dark side dudes
    Peace

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    Quote Originally Posted by armanm75 View Post
    Now some questions
    1) what do u guys think about winny or tren which one to go with to cut in week 13 after im done with test e in week 12 or shall I do tren a or winny while im on test any opinions?

    Just thought I'd say, we have a dude at my gym, 54 freaking years old, weighs like 200, THREE PERCENT BODY FAT, probably the most buff and most cut dude I've seen IRL, and he said he used winstrol to get down to the 3%. He said it's damn expensive if its legitimate though, tried throwing out a 700 dollar number at me (idk if that is accurate) but what I can say is that I recommend winstrol for cutting based on him alone lol

    But if you ask me, I have seen more great results by people doing HIIT with a good diet, than any substance I can think of
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    Thx for the suggestion brother, I want winny also becuse of its less sides compared to tren but the fact that tren is said to be the father of all and good for bulk and cut that d give perfrct results, only concern of mine is, is it too hardcore for the first cycle, my guys says dont be a wuss, experienced bros here on AM say do simpler in ur first cycle, dunno which way to go
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    Quote Originally Posted by armanm75 View Post
    my guys says dont be a wuss
    Yeah stop talking to your guys. I can think of nothing more detrimental than going hardcore on your first cycle. I am on my first cycle, and ALL I'm using is test cyp. Don't listen to anyone who tells you to more or less risk your health / life while saying to stop being a puss. That's ... insane.
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    I have to agree with u with the health part and winny being a great first cycle option my question is how bad would be the sides for one month use of tren just as a cutter in the end but not thru the whole cycle. I already ordered my winny tho since I decided to go with it, im asking just out of curiousity. Thx for your input and good luck with your first cycle also
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    My first cycle was Sus and Winny and I loved it... Took about 6-8 weeks before I really felt or noticed much... but after that I felt like I was a God.
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    Does wherever you ordered it from accept returns?

    And I just see too many people warning against using it at all on your first cycle. Hell, the more research I do on winstrol, I see a lot of negative on that too... lot of people say the damage to your body is more severe than the results you get... but who do/can we really trust?

    But there was a guy who got great results using a tren only cycle as his FIRST cycle... people were praising him up and down... but he used something called diphenhydramine to counter the side effects, said it was effective.

    and for reference, this was his diet.


    Meal 1: Pre-workout - 1 cup 2% milk, 1/2 cup quick oats heated in microwave, added 1 scoop syntha 6 chocolate malt protein and splenda.. I call it bodybuilder soup, ****s delicious with a little splenda
    Meal 2: Immediate Post-workout - 50g whey, 75g dextrose shake
    Meal 3: 1 hr post workout - 5 oz tuna with salsa
    Meal 4: 1 cup FF cottage cheese with salsa
    Meal 5: 1/2 scoop whey, 1/2 scoop casein shake with ice, water and splenda in blender
    Meal 6: 4 oz non-red meat (chicken breast or pork tenderloin usually) with carrots and broccoli
    Meal 7: Bed - 1 scoop casein, 1 cup skim milk, 1 tsp peanut butter shake with ice and splenda in blender




    Dude cut like 10% of his bodyfat. Ridiculous
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    Quote Originally Posted by BLABD
    My first cycle was Sus and Winny and I loved it... Took about 6-8 weeks before I really felt or noticed much... but after that I felt like I was a God.
    Yep, I hear u, that s my goal also and a nice 25 to 30 lbs gain wouldnt be that bad at all. Any opinions about the ostarine usage in the beginning or at pct phase of the cycle? Or anything else you can add on about my questions above would be greatly appreciated. Thx for ur comment.
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    Quote Originally Posted by armanm75 View Post
    Yep, I hear u, that s my goal also and a nice 25 to 30 lbs gain wouldnt be that bad at all. Any opinions about the ostarine usage in the beginning or at pct phase of the cycle? Or anything else you can add on about my questions above would be greatly appreciated. Thx for ur comment.
    All the research I've done EXPLICITLY states that you will NOT gain anywhere near 30 lbs while on a test cycle if you use winstrol on it.

    Also beware, I see a lot of people saying it massacres your joints and can mess up your heart too. The joints thing doesn't look temporary either..
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thomasxavier
    Does wherever you ordered it from accept returns?

    And I just see too many people warning against using it at all on your first cycle. Hell, the more research I do on winstrol, I see a lot of negative on that too... lot of people say the damage to your body is more severe than the results you get... but who do/can we really trust?

    But there was a guy who got great results using a tren only cycle as his FIRST cycle... people were praising him up and down... but he used something called diphenhydramine to counter the side effects, said it was effective.

    and for reference, this was his diet.

    Meal 1: Pre-workout - 1 cup 2% milk, 1/2 cup quick oats heated in microwave, added 1 scoop syntha 6 chocolate malt protein and splenda.. I call it bodybuilder soup, ****s delicious with a little splenda
    Meal 2: Immediate Post-workout - 50g whey, 75g dextrose shake
    Meal 3: 1 hr post workout - 5 oz tuna with salsa
    Meal 4: 1 cup FF cottage cheese with salsa
    Meal 5: 1/2 scoop whey, 1/2 scoop casein shake with ice, water and splenda in blender
    Meal 6: 4 oz non-red meat (chicken breast or pork tenderloin usually) with carrots and broccoli
    Meal 7: Bed - 1 scoop casein, 1 cup skim milk, 1 tsp peanut butter shake with ice and splenda in blender

    Dude cut like 10% of his bodyfat. Ridiculous
    Looks like a nice cutting diet, I was thinking of something similar around 1500 to 1800 calories while cutting but in the begining it ll be time to eat 3500 to 4000 all clean 40 carb 40 protein 20 fat. I ll be careful to put 30 g of protein every 1.5 hours either shake bar or meat form. Gotta finish this keto diet first tho before I start the cycle and it sucs since I get too depressed on this diet.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thomasxavier

    All the research I've done EXPLICITLY states that you will NOT gain anywhere near 30 lbs while on a test cycle if you use winstrol on it.

    Also beware, I see a lot of people saying it massacres your joints and can mess up your heart too. The joints thing doesn't look temporary either..
    I probably will gain at least in the cycle but again not nececarily ll keep it all at the end of my pct
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    Dang man make sure you take those before and after pics... I will be here to see them once your cycle is over
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thomasxavier

    All the research I've done EXPLICITLY states that you will NOT gain anywhere near 30 lbs while on a test cycle if you use winstrol on it.

    Also beware, I see a lot of people saying it massacres your joints and can mess up your heart too. The joints thing doesn't look temporary either..
    Diet will dictate if he gains 30 lbs or not. In a cut ...probably not but he could bulk and gain 40 lbs(ballpark) if he used test plus gh plus igf1 plus other peptides.
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    Quote Originally Posted by pyrobatt View Post
    Diet will dictate if he gains 30 lbs or not. In a cut ...probably not but he could bulk and gain 40 lbs(ballpark) if he used test plus gh plus igf1 plus other peptides.
    Using that much starts to sound dangerous
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thomasxavier

    Using that much starts to sound dangerous
    The effects of just one cycle are pretty bad. Generally peptides have less side effects than most steroids.
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    Quote Originally Posted by pyrobatt View Post
    The effects of just one cycle are pretty bad. Generally peptides have less side effects than most steroids.
    Whats your BF%? What do you cycle exactly
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    Quote Originally Posted by pyrobatt

    Diet will dictate if he gains 30 lbs or not. In a cut ...probably not but he could bulk and gain 40 lbs(ballpark) if he used test plus gh plus igf1 plus other peptides.
    Welcome pyro and thx for your input, I am planning on doing bulk fot the first 12 weeks than cut with winny. I do have cjc(no dac, ghrp 2, 2 month supply of hgh, osta and gw501516 in hand that ll go to cutting cycle, as u said I believe peptides have really few side effects like messing ur prolactin I believe if I dont remember wrong from what I read. Im not putting hgh and very new and unknown gw to few sides category tho. I believe I can pull 30+ in the first 12 week bulk then dont mind loosing 10 if im gonna be looking like the dude in ur profile pic and if thats u im going to be doin what u did
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thomasxavier

    Whats your BF%? What do you cycle exactly
    I'm currently running igf1 cjc mod and dac. As for the phs I'm running androhard stano and trenazone. I'm jumping on test after this. It should be noted I'm going to compete. My picture in my AV is me at 8 %. I'm closer to 11 now
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    Quote Originally Posted by armanm75

    Welcome pyro and thx for your input, I am planning on doing bulk fot the first 12 weeks than cut with winny. I do have cjc(no dac, ghrp 2, 2 month supply of hgh, osta and gw501516 in hand that ll go to cutting cycle, as u said I believe peptides have really few side effects like messing ur prolactin I believe if I dont remember wrong from what I read. Im not putting hgh and very new and unknown gw to few sides category tho. I believe I can pull 30+ in the first 12 week bulk then dont mind loosing 10 if im gonna be looking like the dude in ur profile pic and if thats u im going to be doin what u did
    I only did 2 cycles when that photo was taken. In the middle of my pstanz and hdrol cycle. I had been lifting 5 years prior to my first cycle.
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    Quote Originally Posted by pyrobatt

    I only did 2 cycles when that photo was taken. In the middle of my pstanz and hdrol cycle. I had been lifting 5 years prior to my first cycle.
    Sounds like u did mostly ph and peptide cycles, any AAS experiance? It sucks that there is no more andro series by the way.
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    Quote Originally Posted by armanm75

    Sounds like u did mostly ph and peptide cycles, any AAS experiance? It sucks that there is no more andro series by the way.
    Prohormones convert into Anabolic androgenic steroids so technically I have. I'm going to pin test here pretty soon
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    Quote Originally Posted by pyrobatt

    Prohormones convert into Anabolic androgenic steroids so technically I have. I'm going to pin test here pretty soon
    Yes they sure do, so far I ve been reading nobody puts ph and the real gear in the same category in terms of results tho. I personally had great results from andromass and ostarine stack, ther reason I decided to go with aas is I have greater expectations.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thomasxavier
    Dang man make sure you take those before and after pics... I will be here to see them once your cycle is over
    I ll definetely do that right before my first pin which ll be in about 2 weeks after the keto diet
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    Quote Originally Posted by armanm75 View Post
    Yes they sure do, so far I ve been reading nobody puts ph and the real gear in the same category in terms of results tho. I personally had great results from andromass and ostarine stack, ther reason I decided to go with aas is I have greater expectations.
    aas and ph's are the same thing.If you take stano your on dht.if you take trenazone your on tren.If you take meythl 1 t your on 1t.
    AAS can and usually are far more effective due to them usually needing no conversion.People call epistane a ph when in actuality it is an active steroid.So is superdrol.So...there are very potent ph's/ds when used correctly you can gain more than a 12 week test cycle.
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    Quote Originally Posted by pyrobatt

    aas and ph's are the same thing.If you take stano your on dht.if you take trenazone your on tren.If you take meythl 1 t your on 1t.
    AAS can and usually are far more effective due to them usually needing no conversion.People call epistane a ph when in actuality it is an active steroid.So is superdrol.So...there are very potent ph's/ds when used correctly you can gain more than a 12 week test cycle.
    I do agree and I may gain more also if I were to do trenazone instead of test e + winny cycle since the conversion ll be to tren, but the side effects kinda scare me, as I mentioned before only did andro mass that converts to test e. I know oral steroids messed with or liver, dunno how it d turn out with ph usage tho so I dont wanna make an ignorant comment. I d like to know ur opinion about me starting my cycle with stacking osta and test e together. I dont have and scared off orals so was planning to dose up the osta that im on before test e kicks in but read about some comments like they compete for tge same receptors. U know anything about that or any alternative solution u might recommend?
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    Quote Originally Posted by armanm75

    I do agree and I may gain more also if I were to do trenazone instead of test e + winny cycle since the conversion ll be to tren, but the side effects kinda scare me, as I mentioned before only did andro mass that converts to test e. I know oral steroids messed with or liver, dunno how it d turn out with ph usage tho so I dont wanna make an ignorant comment. I d like to know ur opinion about me starting my cycle with stacking osta and test e together. I dont have and scared off orals so was planning to dose up the osta that im on before test e kicks in but read about some comments like they compete for tge same receptors. U know anything about that or any alternative solution u might recommend?
    Save ostraine for another cycle. The reason people choose the 4 weekers to throw in with the test e is to start making gains while the test is kicking in. Here's what I would do

    Test e or cyp 500mg/week 2 injections a week.
    Winstrol will be your kick start at 5 to 6 weeks. You may experience joint pain but shouldn't be unbearable.
    Anavar and primo tabs can also be added.
    You can also add igf1 and gh for some more "keepable" muscle fibers.steroids don't grow muscle fibers they just enlarge the muscle. You can grow fibers on cycle but igf1 and gh will help in a major way for keepable gains.
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    Quote Originally Posted by pyrobatt

    Save ostraine for another cycle. The reason people choose the 4 weekers to throw in with the test e is to start making gains while the test is kicking in. Here's what I would do

    Test e or cyp 500mg/week 2 injections a week.
    Winstrol will be your kick start at 5 to 6 weeks. You may experience joint pain but shouldn't be unbearable.
    Anavar and primo tabs can also be added.
    You can also add igf1 and gh for some more "keepable" muscle fibers.steroids don't grow muscle fibers they just enlarge the muscle. You can grow fibers on cycle but igf1 and gh will help in a major way for keepable gains.
    I am thinking about adding hgh to the cycle at weeks 5 to 12, but was considering winny at the end of the cycle after im done with test e at week 13. The reason I dont have a 4 weeker is why I was considering keeping on doing osta thay I'm currently on right now so at least I ll have the anabolic effect of that untill test e kicks in. well you certainly know way better than I ve researched so I shall drop the osta for pct. Since I wanna bilk for the first 12 weeks tho, dont u think I should leave winny for the end of my cycle, I was thinking of doing it just for 1 month at the very end. I can get another vial tho so it d last until week 12 if u really think I should start it on week 6
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    Quote Originally Posted by armanm75 View Post
    I am thinking about adding hgh to the cycle at weeks 5 to 12, but was considering winny at the end of the cycle after im done with test e at week 13. The reason I dont have a 4 weeker is why I was considering keeping on doing osta thay I'm currently on right now so at least I ll have the anabolic effect of that untill test e kicks in. well you certainly know way better than I ve researched so I shall drop the osta for pct. Since I wanna bilk for the first 12 weeks tho, dont u think I should leave winny for the end of my cycle, I was thinking of doing it just for 1 month at the very end. I can get another vial tho so it d last until week 12 if u really think I should start it on week 6
    Use the winny at the end.You should have gotten the liver friendly version(injectable) and you could have ran it for 7 weeks.HGH needs to be used for atleast 3 months to see amazing results.Helps with fatloss aswell.
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    Quote Originally Posted by pyrobatt

    Use the winny at the end.You should have gotten the liver friendly version(injectable) and you could have ran it for 7 weeks.HGH needs to be used for atleast 3 months to see amazing results.Helps with fatloss aswell.
    Yes, I do have the injectable version of winny and ill get another one and start on week 7. Again ill listen your advice and get some more hgh and bump it to 4 months planning to start it at week 2 now. I d like to thank you for all your valuable information and educating a noob like me to reach my bodybuilding goals. Now that you mentioned about winny's being harsh on joints, I am reconsidering my choice of AI also. I was planning on doin adex thru the cycle and aromasin at my pct. I guess adex and winny combo ll f#$ck my joints even worse to a point that I cant maintain with fish oils and glucosamine ha?
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    By the way by any chance anyone is fallowing the tread, ill post some pics, whole protocole of every individual gear and suplement that ill be using soon. Its just working alot these days and dont have much time. In a week I hope.
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    pyro, what are the sides you've experienced using igf1
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thomasxavier
    pyro, what are the sides you've experienced using igf1
    Idk if its igf1 or the cjc but my muscles contort in a weird way. My lats locked up and such yesterday and i think if I take them post workout or too soon pwo I get cramps.
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    Quote Originally Posted by pyrobatt View Post
    Idk if its igf1 or the cjc but my muscles contort in a weird way. My lats locked up and such yesterday and i think if I take them post workout or too soon pwo I get cramps.
    Why isn't something like test c enough for your goals? It is infinitely safer than the majority of these things, and produces great results... why deviate?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thomasxavier

    Why isn't something like test c enough for your goals? It is infinitely safer than the majority of these things, and produces great results... why deviate?
    Steroids don't produce many new muscle fibers.even the best steroids don't produce the effects of gh and igf1. Steroids are much more risky than peptides if you line them up side by side. Pick your poison. They will both **** you with long term use
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    Quote Originally Posted by pyrobatt View Post
    Steroids don't produce many new muscle fibers.even the best steroids don't produce the effects of gh and igf1. Steroids are much more risky than peptides if you line them up side by side. Pick your poison. They will both **** you with long term use
    By long term use do you mean doing many cycles over years, or staying on cycles longer than you're supposed to?
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    Quote Originally Posted by pyrobatt

    Idk if its igf1 or the cjc but my muscles contort in a weird way. My lats locked up and such yesterday and i think if I take them post workout or too soon pwo I get cramps.
    Cjc gives me itchy legs sometimes and crazy dreams. I stack it with ghrp 2. Still on it 2 to 3 times a day 100 cjc 200mcgs ghrp. Weekends off. Shall I keep it thru my cycle u think or just do hgh?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thomasxavier

    Why isn't something like test c enough for your goals? It is infinitely safer than the majority of these things, and produces great results... why deviate?
    I am not as knowledgable as pyro but cjc and ghrp combo is almost no sides accept the high prolactin levels I believe. Dont quote tho, its been years since I read datbtru's posts about cjc+ghrp combo. Igf and hgh so far that I know duplicates cells, this might be muscle which we want but can be cancerius tumors also. Thats why hgh and igf are different than aas. While aas grows muscle, hgh adds muscle fiber
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    Any recomendations about acne problem thru cycle?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thomasxavier

    By long term use do you mean doing many cycles over years, or staying on cycles longer than you're supposed to?
    Staying on cycle for years
    . Or even doing them once if you have high BP, cholesterol problems, or heart problems.
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