Some advice needed...

[musclemanmike]

Hello, I'm new to this forum but not neccissarly new to lifting. Been lifting off and on since '87 when I got my first taste of the 'ol iron in my old man's garage. Needless to say, I was hooked. I'm 38 now and I haven't always lifted. I've had my moments of junk food binges and just out and out laziness but I'm back in the gym and training pretty serious now. My hope is achieve a certain goal and then maintain from there (I'll post up some examples below). I have a medium sized frame.

Current stats:
6' tall
220 lbs.

Anyway, I figured I would pick some brains here since some of you guys have more experience with suppliments and how to correctly use them. I have been studying for my ACE certification for personal trainer but haven't taken the test yet. Aside from that, I am an avid reader of many different types of BBing mags and books (including The Encyclopedia of BBing and a little gem called "Anabolic Primer").

I will kind of lay out my routine and you can pick away and tell me if I'm in the ballpark or way off in left field.


Me currently:

At my lowest point back in '07. First pic is me at 230+ lbs and pretty damn miserable. The second is after 7 months of cardio and strength training weighing in at 190 lbs. A bit light for my taste but I definitely felt 100% better. You can see by my current pics I have considerably more muscle mass. (obviously natural with really clean eating and a lot of cardio)

Here's a few pics of my suppliments:

First up is a product that I was using for awhile without any real good results. I was taking 2 pills spaced evenly daily. (this is in addition to my normal daily vitamins, protien powder etc etc).

Well I got rid of those and switched to this product. I currently just started these this week and have been doing 2 pills spaced evenly daily. Should I change this? This is my only "anabolic" enhancer. I am not stacking anything with this. (you'll understand my reasoning which may be off base when you see my goal below) So what's with this stuff? Any good? Waste of money?

That brings me to a couple pics of my regular daily stuff. Any info on these products would be appreciated. (example: that protien powder is great but that particular brand of creatine is crap etc...)

Here's pretty much my method:

Food is clean and eaten all day long. I try to get at least 5 meals in even if one is only a protien bar. I eat a LOT of meat consisting primarily of lean bison meat, chicken, fish and lots of greens like broccoli and/or spinach. Carbs are taken in the form of whole grain pasta or double fiber bread for the occassional sandwich (usually tuna). I keep sugar intake to a bare minimum and I only eat white rice once per day right after my gym workout for a natural insulin spike. Since I'm not diabetic and have no business injecting actual insulin, you will never catch me doing that. I believe it to be foolish and dangerous. That being said, does the rice thing work or should I just skip it? I cook a lot with olive oil.

My pill and potion intake is as follows... I space the 2 dbol pills evenly. Both taken at 8am and 8pm respectively. I take upwards of 3 protien powder shakes daily. I take 3-4 thousand mg's of vitamin C daily. I take a glucosamine 2x daily morning and night. I take the fish oils 3x daily at 1200mg each. I take one serving of the creatine powder daily mixed with a small amount of Gatorade. My understanding is that a high carb based drink is best when taking the creatine? I split one serving of the amino acid liquid before my workout and right before bed. I take 3 nitric oxide pills just prior to my daily workout.


Well with all that said here is my goal. I would absolutely love achieve something like this:

I absolutely DO NOT want to look anything like this....

I'm so tired of the ridiculous "GH Belly" that is soooooo previlent today. I think Zane had it dead on back at the '79 Olympia. If I could get my body looking like that I would be pretty happy. I want to be on the beach attracting the right kind of attention because of a tight ripped look NOT because people think I swallowed a pumpkin and look all disproportionate because the muscle mass is so ridiculously big.

Any helpful pointers would really be appreciated!

 

[WerdUp]

Attachment links are bunk. So really the only thing I can currently give you pointers on is your cycle. Dbol only cycle? No injectable to solidify gains? And if you are going for shredded look, you've simply picked the wrong compound imo. Sounds a bit haphazard and thrown together to me. Not only have you not given us dosage information, I did not see a single thing about PCT--the most important part of any cycle.

 

[musclemanmike]

Sorry about the messed up post and missing info... I fixed the above links.

Okie dokie so the dosage of the dbol pills I am taking is as follows:

I have been taking one in the morning and one in the evening.

As far as my PCT goes, I was going to take a pill called XABOL from Generation Labs X. It says it contains a test booster.

Do you think I will have to add an injectable as part of a stack then?

 

[swollen87]

that stuff isnt dbol. its a bunch of herbal crap and some daa...... i dont think you need pct


i think you have made great progress so far, but you need to do more research about steroids before your start buying up crap like that...

 

[musclemanmike]

that stuff isnt dbol. its a bunch of herbal crap and some daa...... i dont think you need pct


i think you have made great progress so far, but you need to do more research about steroids before your start buying up crap like that...

Excellent! See, this is exactaly why I am seeking advice and joined this forum. So that I can do my due diligence and figure this stuff out.
Let's say I wanted to start some anabolic help... do you recommend actual (real) dbol alone or with something else to achieve the type of lean mass that I am looking for? I think both the above pictures posted of my goal of Zane and that other guy most likely had some pharmacudical help. But what?

 

[antihero]

Sorry about the messed up post and missing info... I fixed the above links.

Okie dokie so the dosage of the dbol pills I am taking is as follows:

I have been taking one in the morning and one in the evening.

As far as my PCT goes, I was going to take a pill called XABOL from Generation Labs X. It says it contains a test booster.

Do you think I will have to add an injectable as part of a stack then?

The stuff from SDI-Labs is worthless. There's no actual hormone (not even a prohormone) in that bottle, and it's definitely not d-bol. It's actually owned by the same guy who owns Fizogen.

 

[no reason]

do you wanna inject or not go that route..if not then do a prohormone..i would suggest doing some halo (h-drol) for a first time cycle.

if you wanna inject then a test -e only cycle is a good one you would cycle the test -e for 10-12 weeks.. its possible to put on 20-25lbs with a test =e cycle... a prohormone wont give you those results .. with a prohormone you will only put on about 7-10lbs.

theres alot more you gotta do with an injectable cycle and its more expensive but the gains can make it worth the money

 

[musclemanmike]

The stuff from SDI-Labs is worthless. There's no actual hormone (not even a prohormone) in that bottle, and it's definitely not d-bol. It's actually owned by the same guy who owns Fizogen.

Copy that.

do you wanna inject or not go that route..if not then do a prohormone..i would suggest doing some halo (h-drol) for a first time cycle.

if you wanna inject then a test -e only cycle is a good one you would cycle the test -e for 10-12 weeks.. its possible to put on 20-25lbs with a test =e cycle... a prohormone wont give you those results .. with a prohormone you will only put on about 7-10lbs.

theres alot more you gotta do with an injectable cycle and its more expensive but the gains can make it worth the money

I don't have any problems with needles so I would be ok injecting. If I were to do a test-e only cycle would I need to stack that with anything to counter sides etc? Or just a good PCT?

edit: That being said, I am definitely not opposed to starting off with the prohormone (h-drol) to see how it goes since I'm trying to stay a bit on the lean side and not look so "juiced".

 

[no reason]

with injecting or doing a prohormone you want to take cycle support supps while on cycle... injectable test-e cycles also consist of using an AI (aromasin) with your cycle to suppress estrogen while on cycle because test converts to estrogen.. also some will suggest using hcg while on cycle also to keep your balls at their fullest.. so theres more you gotta do...with a prohormone its just cycle support supplements and a good pct with a serm...much easier. The gains from injecting are easier to keep because the cycle is longer and it puts on pounds gradually. methylated promormones like superdrol put on pounds rapidly in like 3-4 weeks but makes then hard to keep because 3-4 weeks isnt enough time for your body to acclimate..fast gains equals fast loss of gains.

 

[WerdUp]

Some people do, some people don't. I always recommend an AI with any aromatizing compound and even run low dose HCG with 12wk test cycles. I think you need several months of research on AAS before you jump into the deep end. Compare and contrast compounds, see what you desire and what is even possible with a proposed cycle. Otherwise great progress (i can see now that the links were fixed).

 

[no reason]

I think you need several months of research on AAS before you jump into the deep end. Compare and contrast compounds, see what you desire and what is even possible with a proposed cycle. Otherwise great progress (i can see now that the links were fixed).

i agree... i think you should start off with a mild prohormone like halo (h-drol ) . it will give you some lean gains an wont bulk you up to much.

 

[antihero]

i agree... i think you should start off with a mild prohormone like halo (h-drol ) . it will give you some lean gains an wont bulk you up to much.

I agree with starting off with something like H-drol. It's a great way to get your feet wet.

 

[swollen87]

Excellent! See, this is exactaly why I am seeking advice and joined this forum. So that I can do my due diligence and figure this stuff out.
Let's say I wanted to start some anabolic help... do you recommend actual (real) dbol alone or with something else to achieve the type of lean mass that I am looking for? I think both the above pictures posted of my goal of Zane and that other guy most likely had some pharmacudical help. But what?

Well, since you dont look like you have gyno right now, i suggest you keep it that way, and STAY AWAY FROM PROHORMONES.... its been my experience that most people i see running them, end up with some form of gyno..... even seasoned veterans. IMO stay with whats tried and true, if you do decide to run something. These otc steroids are all crap, and have worse side effects than the real deal... with less gains and less keepable gains

imo a good first cycle would be something simmilar to this

test e or c
400-500mg week for 12 weeks
250iu hcg 1x or 2x a week starting second week of cycle

If you want something to kickstart the cycle, you could run prop along side of the test e for the first 4 weeks OR run some tbol (real turinabol) not hdrol garbage crap

pct

clomid 100/100/50
aromasin 25/25/25/12.5/12.5 Ive done this and loved it

things to have on hand-
dostinex (especially if ur running any orals)
letrozole lots of it, if your nipples blow up the first week of your cycle your gunna need this
nolvadex see above comment

but in all honesty, you dont NEED to run a cycle. You dont have a bad physique right now, and with proper diet/rest/training you can get much closer to your goal without steroids. in general, try to reach your genetic limit before starting a cycle. hope this helps

 

[musclemanmike]

Thank you. That was actually very helpful. I will give it maybe another year of hard dieting and training and see where I am at that point. In the meantime I will do some more research. You guys have been more than helpful.

 

[DYEGYE]

That finaflex 550-xd was a prohormone/ designer steroid. 10mg of superdrol and 25mg of tren per cap. How you managed to not gain anything taking two of those a day is astounding to me, unless your diet was completely hypocaloric. Very interesting... Let's just say that of the two products you listed, you tossed the good one.

 

[musclemanmike]

That finaflex 550-xd was a prohormone/ designer steroid. 10mg of superdrol and 25mg of tren per cap. How you managed to not gain anything taking two of those a day is astounding to me, unless your diet was completely hypocaloric. Very interesting... Let's just say that of the two products you listed, you tossed the good one.

Well maybe I didn't give it enough time? I was only using it for a month.

 

[DYEGYE]

To be honest, taking 20 mg of superdrol should have been putting about a pound a day on you by the end of the first week at the latest. There are a number of things, however that could have had significant effects on you weight gain:

not enough calories
too much cardio
improper lifting regimen
etc etc

 

[no reason]

imo a good first cycle would be something simmilar to this

test e or c
400-500mg week for 12 weeks
250iu hcg 1x or 2x a week starting second week of cycle

If you want something to kickstart the cycle, you could run prop along side of the test e for the first 4 weeks OR run some tbol (real turinabol) not hdrol garbage crap

pct

clomid 100/100/50
aromasin 25/25/25/12.5/12.5 Ive done this and loved it

i agree..nice cycle...but i run aromasin with the cycle 12.5mgs eod.

 

[Bry17]

i lol'd at the dbol bottle :lol:

 

[musclemanmike]

To be honest, taking 20 mg of superdrol should have been putting about a pound a day on you by the end of the first week at the latest. There are a number of things, however that could have had significant effects on you weight gain:

not enough calories
too much cardio
improper lifting regimen
etc etc

Honestly I think it might have been a combo of a couple of the things mentioned. 1. I have been doing a LOT of cardio to try to burn off fat. 2. My diet was a bit calorie light with trying to achieve #1's goal of fat burning.

 

[DYEGYE]

That's what I figured based on your description of what you've been doing. You probably got good recomping effects, but thought you weren't getting anything because the scale wasn't going up or down... It'd be really hard to lose weight on SD. Did you take a PCT for it?

 

[musclemanmike]

That's probably exactaly what it was then. Forgive me but what is "recomping"?
And no pct for that round.

 

[DYEGYE]

That's probably exactaly what it was then. Forgive me but what is "recomping"?
And no pct for that round.

Recomping is when you gain muscle and lose fat at an equal rate, so that your body weight remains about the same. Based on Unrealmachine's recomping guide, a strong compound like SD will allow you to do unholy amounts of cardio and still not lose muscle. Unfortunately, deliberate recomp cycles need to be longer (6-16 weeks depending on compounds), and SD does not lend itself well to that in any role other than a kickstart.

 

[RickRock13]

Recomping is when you gain muscle and lose fat at an equal rate, so that your body weight remains about the same. Based on Unrealmachine's recomping guide, a strong compound like SD will allow you to do unholy amounts of cardio and still not lose muscle. Unfortunately, deliberate recomp cycles need to be longer (6-16 weeks depending on compounds), and SD does not lend itself well to that in any role other than a kickstart.

:goodpost: This^^