Need help with cutting

[bmichael123]

I have been on a very strict diet for about 45 days. It worked extremely well until day 30. That is when I decided to try some clen. The first few days were great. I was losing weight (about 5 pounds), body fat (dropped 2% points), and had no appetite. I worked up to 200 mcg's and now am on day 7. I know I have another 7 days, but it is nothing like days 1-3. Now I am hungry all the time and the shakes and sweats only last about an hour (first 3 days lasted for hours). I am currently taking it 3 times a day. Maybe the solution wasn't fresh and lost potency before I used it. So I started thinking of options. This is why I am here. Also, I increased my cardio and my hunger increased (of course). I ate a little more of good foods. I have not lost a pound or any body fat since day 3 on clen. Am I expecting too much? Should I increase to 250mg's (especially since the last time I took it I had severe side effects-not this time)? Should I reduce to 40mg and add 1 dose of ECA stack (usually dose three times a day)? Maybe change to ECA and quit clen for now to see what happens? I am stuck.

 

[GLHF]

okay...


why r u dosing clen so high so fast?
drop the clen for 2 full weeks. than start taking clen again but do first 4 days from 40-80mcg/day, than bump to 120mcg stay at that for another 3-4 days, than bump to 160 for a reminder.

for diet: while on clen eat carbs. when off clen for 2 weeks, do keto diet at like 2500cal.

r u using any steroids?

 

[bmichael123]

I'm just using clen and phentermine. The big issue is that my appetite really increased with the clen. Any suggestions on app suppressants? I've been doing a keto diet for about 45 days. It worked great for the first 30 days, but then stopped working. That's when I added clen. Do you think ECA would be a better fit for now?

 

[GLHF]

I'm just using clen and phentermine. The big issue is that my appetite really increased with the clen. Any suggestions on app suppressants? I've been doing a keto diet for about 45 days. It worked great for the first 30 days, but then stopped working. That's when I added clen. Do you think ECA would be a better fit for now?

i see now. the problem is not with the supplements, its in ur diet. introduce carbs in ur diet for a few weeks only pre and post workout.

 

[Rosie Chee]

i see now. the problem is not with the supplements, its in ur diet. introduce carbs in ur diet for a few weeks only pre and post workout.

The problem is most DEFINITELY in his NUTRITION! bmichael123, I replied in your other thread, http://anabolicminds.com/forum/weight-loss/173961-would-like-advice.html#post2845698 - you should seriously just work on getting your NUTRITION right and forgetting about the supplements (and honestly, stop using the Clen AND ECA, IMO)!

~Rosie~

 

[bmichael123]

I agree about diet. In other thread I posted that I got bad advice. Worse is that I paid for it. So easy to scam the hopeful. Maybe I should start a business telling people not to eat. I'm sure they'll lose weight just like me.......

 

[GLHF]

damn dawgs...u paid for that advice??? shiiit i gave u golden advice for free. damn i shuld really start charging for my drug/diet advice.

 

[bmichael123]

What an idiot I was. Actually, I was really just looking for Phen to get me started and decided to try what they were preaching. At least it got me where I am. I'll definitely take your advice when I go back on clen. Oh, and the reason I took so much was because I read that sometimes the liquid is pretty old. I took clen pills a few years ago and had HORRIBLE side effects at 60mcg. At 200 liquid, barely anything--thought maybe it wasn't as good.

 

[EasyEJL]

I'll also add that at your bodyfat keto is pretty pointless. Theres no evidence at all that at "normal" bodyfat levels that keto has any advantage in fat loss or muscle retention. If you are at 8% and going for contest grade lean there are some advantages, but even then its largely water retention related.

If the keto was working for you, and you felt good while on it, theres no real negatives. If you felt the need to boost stimulants because of how you felt on it, may as well eat the carbs.

 

[bmichael123]

I am aware that metabolism slows in starvation. I must have read somewhere that stimulants help offset this process (along with muscle building exercises).

One thing that I found to be interesting is that the amount of muscle lost in starvation isn't as much as people think. No need to get into the science here, but it's funny how many people talk about losing muscle from not eating; yet not one of them can reference any studies or tests that show how much is lost and at what calorie deficit it occurs. It does happen, but it's not like someone will lose all their muscle by not eating for a week. The body still converts fats and uses water.

Anyway, I do agree that if I find something that works I should stick with it. Keto worked at first, but I probably need to do it 3 weeks on 2 weeks off--maybe 20 carbs per day when on and 50-75 when off.

 

[GLHF]

ive recently started doing 2weeks carbs, 1 week keto.
im probably gonna bulk in a similar way, mayb 2-4week carbs, 1-2 keto.

 

[bmichael123]

Definitely let me know how it goes. BTW, I've done a lot more research on Clen (but did a ton before taking it too). I haven't found anything about the amount of carbs needed. I did, however, find that at too high a dose the receptors become useless much sooner than the two weeks that research showed. I was taking Benedryl, but it may not have been enough (I know it's also not the preferred way to clear receptors). Anyway, got conflicting information on acceptable BF before using. Some say 15% or less, others say the higher the fat the more beneficial. I'm on week 14 of eating perfect and week 5 of a structured cardio/weight program (cardio before that was less structures). Rosie's advice seemed to get me on the right track again (or maybe it's just the ECY I'm doing). Anyway, any more advice would be greatly appreciated. I've been a student of bodybuilding for 17 years and always appreciate any tips (I must have read Arnold's book 10 times over the years). It's just that I got away from it for awhile. I'm shocked by how much has changed in the last few years. Also, any great reads would be appreciated.

 

[MakaveliThaDon]

I am aware that metabolism slows in starvation. I must have read somewhere that stimulants help offset this process (along with muscle building exercises).

One thing that I found to be interesting is that the amount of muscle lost in starvation isn't as much as people think. No need to get into the science here, but it's funny how many people talk about losing muscle from not eating; yet not one of them can reference any studies or tests that show how much is lost and at what calorie deficit it occurs. It does happen, but it's not like someone will lose all their muscle by not eating for a week. The body still converts fats and uses water.

Anyway, I do agree that if I find something that works I should stick with it. Keto worked at first, but I probably need to do it 3 weeks on 2 weeks off--maybe 20 carbs per day when on and 50-75 when off.

not COMPLETELY the case. If the stims start leading to adrenal fatigue, it is actually quite the opposite.

 

[bmichael123]

Anything in excess is typically bad. A good balanced diet (higher proteins, lower fats, lower carbs, lots of vitamins and minerals) and a balanced exercise routine should really help reduce the potential of adrenal fatigue or failure--even with stims (but not if taken in excess). Great point though Mak. There are some people looking for the easy way and go overboard. They are the one's who helped with the ban on ephedrine.