New Primordial Performance Products

[Kulper1]

All opinions aside ...

The cheapest we can get these right now are 20% during the pre-sale ... plus 30% off if you buy 6 of each.

So that means the cheapest you can get them is for:

6 Andromass for $840 (average of $140)
6 Androhard for $336 ($56)
6 Androlean for $546 ($91)

For a total of $1,722.

Thoughts?

 

[schwellington]

totally NOT worth it

AT ALL

 

[schwellington]

for 900 dollars i could buy a lot of gear

A LOT

and they want 900 for 6 bottles of DHEA related products?!

no thanks

 

[abformulations]

Super expensive. But i budged and got one Androlean, and Andromass...Lets see what happens with the logs

 

[jbryand101b]

:lmao: no comment. im just going to watch.

 

[TulsaTalons]

:wtf: HELL NO.....

 

[ambulldog]

:lmao: no comment. im just going to watch.

i like your comments. please comment on this. originally they said ah would have a bio-eq = ~500mg mast. now the officail says = ~200mg dht. im very disappointed in that because i was int in ah only but now that its just dht i have no real interest at that price. besides and im no pp hater all those "possible" conversions scare me. some may get no where near the target hormone mg that the charts say.

 

[T50]

i like your comments. please comment on this. originally they said ah would have a bio-eq = ~500mg mast. now the officail says = ~200mg dht. im very disappointed in that because i was int in ah only but now that its just dht i have no real interest at that price. besides and im no pp hater all those "possible" conversions scare me. some may get no where near the target hormone mg that the charts say.

Masteron is a derivative of DHT so you shouldn't be turned off that they are saying DHT instead of Mast since they should act pretty similar results wise.

Only question is how much Mast = 200mg DHT?

 

[schwellington]

Masteron is a derivative of DHT so you shouldn't be turned off that they are saying DHT instead of Mast since they should act pretty similar results wise.

Only question is how much Mast = 200mg DHT?

materon being a derivative doesnt mean its anything like dht

wow

all steroids are derived from testosterone

nandrolone is an alteration of testosterone- but its nothing like testosterone


your post= ignorance

 

[delsolrob]

I'll be looking forward to CM's review...I think he got hooked up with a bottle of Andro Mass

 

[T50]

materon being a derivative doesnt mean its anything like dht

wow

all steroids are derived from testosterone

nandrolone is an alteration of testosterone- but its nothing like testosterone


your post= ignorance

But it is similar to DHT...both act as anti-e, give a tight hard vascular look, good for libido, harsh on the hairline. So care to explain how my post was wrong?

Go run your 40 week cycle with 18 different orals :sigh1:

 

[tuRkx]

way too expensive


still willing to tryout androhard however

 

[schwellington]

But it is similar to DHT...both act as anti-e, give a tight hard vascular look, good for libido, harsh on the hairline. So care to explain how my post was wrong?

Go run your 40 week cycle with 18 different orals :sigh1:

maybe i misunderstood your post

i was under the impression that you thouhgt since they said it was DHT like- it would behave like masteron would

clearly i misunderstood your post!

i dont think either of is is wrong, i think it was merely me misunderstanding


ps. my cycle does not consist of orals

its more like alot of test/tren/deca

with some orals sprinkled on top

that being said

i will not use these pp products- if they gave me some for free-- i would just sell them

but this is me i dont use otc hormones

 

[liftin4fun]

I didn't believe the prices in the first post. I just went there. Very high. It will be interesting to see what they do for the people who try them.

 

[soontobbeast]

But it is similar to DHT...both act as anti-e, give a tight hard vascular look, good for libido, harsh on the hairline. So care to explain how my post was wrong?

Go run your 40 week cycle with 18 different orals :sigh1:

Actually, what you said was :

Masteron is a derivative of DHT so you shouldn't be turned off that they are saying DHT instead of Mast since they should act pretty similar results wise.

Only question is how much Mast = 200mg DHT?

you said that since masteron is a dht derivative, it will have similar results to DHT.

dbol and anavar are both dht derivatives. they dont give similar results.

so ,yes, your post was wrong.

 

[Kulper1]

Right and this is the best possible price of getting 20 percent off and then 30 percent off.

I like the innovation I really do, but 200 for a four week cycle of DHEA isomers seems very high. BUT, I look forward to reviews because if this gives SD or M1T type gains with little to no sides, then they may have a customer.

But, if it seems too good to be true ... You know what they say

 

[gymrat827]

The prices will come down and will also be way cheaper on other sites. Not sure why anyone buys from PP direct?? fukin horrible pricing, every place i look sells their stuff for less than they do. Well enough bashing PP....

The new Andro series should be pretty good for peeps who dont want to pin real gear. All they are is PH's tho, nothing more, people are hyping them way tooo much.

Ill try their stuff once it comes down to 30-50bux a bottle.

 

[SilentBob187]

I hope that some of the customers that are taking part in this 'first run' sale intend to log it for us.

 

[jbryand101b]

i'll say this much:

dht is quickly de-activated in the muscle tissue via 3hsb enzyme to an inactive metabolite, and exreted from the body.

thats where the 2a methyl in di-methyl dht (superdrol) comes in handy, to help slow down/prevent this de-activation.

enzymes aren't just used in the body for converting pro hormones. your body uses them for other things. that = more competition for the enzymes to convert it.

I do think these products will most def be more effective than previous isomers of dhea though. but i'll be suprised if it is to the effect thats claimed.

dermacrine was the closest legal thing to injectable testosterone, turinabol (a testosterone derivative) was the closest legal thing to anavar (a dht derivative like epistane)

andro mass is as good if not better than superdrol.

and I do think formastanozol is a good topical ai, but it's too strong for my taste. I prefer 6-bromo. havnt tried erase yet.

 

[ZamaMan]

maybe i misunderstood your post

i was under the impression that you thouhgt since they said it was DHT like- it would behave like masteron would

clearly i misunderstood your post!

i dont think either of is is wrong, i think it was merely me misunderstanding


ps. my cycle does not consist of orals

its more like alot of test/tren/deca

with some orals sprinkled on top

that being said

i will not use these pp products- if they gave me some for free-- i would just sell them

but this is me i dont use otc hormones

Lol a few orals sprinkled on top. A few weeks ago you had like 32 weeks of orals maped out. Hahahaha wow I'd hate to see what a harsh oral cycle looks like for you.


I can't wait to see the logs but there's no oral worth that kind of mind when you canrun an sd cycle for 17 bucks. But i will let people act crazy and buy a bunch and see how thr logs go.

 

[BigBlackGuy]

i'll say this much:

dht is quickly de-activated in the muscle tissue via 3hsb enzyme to an inactive metabolite, and exreted from the body.

thats where the 2a methyl in di-methyl dht (superdrol) comes in handy, to help slow down/prevent this de-activation.

That's why the androhard isn't a mass builder. Androgens are active in fat cells, not muscle cells (as you mentioned). They increase beta adrenergic receptors while decreasing alpha adrenergic receptors. This results in increased levels of epinephrine and norepinephrine due to alpha-2 receptor negative feedback and decreased fat accumulation due to epinephrine and norepinephrine acting on lipolysis-inducing beta receptors.

Strong copy and paste for the most part.

 

[Lightweight1]

I'll wait for some logs and price drops before I jump on this band wagon

 

[schwellington]

That's why the androhard isn't a mass builder. Androgens are active in fat cells, not muscle cells (as you mentioned). They increase beta adrenergic receptors while decreasing alpha adrenergic receptors. This results in increased levels of epinephrine and norepinephrine due to alpha-2 receptor negative feedback and decreased fat accumulation due to epinephrine and norepinephrine acting on lipolysis-inducing beta receptors.

Strong copy and paste for the most part.

Provide me a link to this information- im curious

because as far as I know steroids (androgens) do not play any direct role in fat loss. Please provide me a link to this info it interests me

 

[jbryand101b]

Strong copy and paste for the most part.

no copy and paste, that was all from my beautiful memory.

if I copy and pasted something, I would cite where it is from, like I always do sucka.

but do you have a link to that data you just posted? im curious to the studies showing this, or did you just make that up?

:bling:

 

[BigBlackGuy]

no copy and paste, that was all from my beautiful memory.

if I copy and pasted something, I would cite where it is from, like I always do sucka.

but do you have a link to that data you just posted? im curious to the studies showing this, or did you just make that up?

:bling:

Yours wasn't a copy and paste, mine was. Thanks for the negs though, smart guy.

 

[schwellington]

Yours wasn't a copy and paste, mine was. Thanks for the negs though, smart guy.

dont dodge the question- show us some data to back up your claim


androgens(steroids) do not directly aid in fat burning....and jbry- is very knowledgeable i trust him


and your a rep for pp so your opinion= worthless in this thread imho


data pleaseeeeeeeeee

 

[dewing246]

I hope that some of the customers that are taking part in this 'first run' sale intend to log it for us.

They will be too busy working their second jobs they had to get to pay for the stuff.

 

[jbryand101b]

oh, I got that, well here, let me re run it with more rep comments.

if you do copy and paste, you should always cite your source, how else is someone gonna know your not talking about them when you quote them, and in the same post, state strong copy and paste?.

but, did you get that info from wiki? I googled it and found this:

Inhibition of fat depositionMales typically have less adipose tissue than females. Recent results indicate that androgens inhibit the ability of some fat cells to store lipids by blocking a signal transduction pathway that normally supports adipocyte function.[3] Also, androgens, but not estrogens, increase beta adrenergic receptors while decreasing alpha adrenergic receptors- which results in increased levels of epinephrine/ norepinephrine due to lack of alpha-2 receptor negative feedback and decreased fat accumulation due to epinephrine/ norepinephrine then acting on lipolysis-inducing beta receptors.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Androgen

I know (or hope) you know anyone can write stuff in there. i find this interesting, as I always thought the fat loss from androgens was d/t lack of estrogen, which estrogen causes storage of fat. have to find the source of this info, there is no reference number in the wiki post.

 

[jin]

I can't wait to see the logs but there's no oral worth that kind of mind when you canrun an sd cycle for 17 bucks.

you can run 2, 3, even 4 sd cycles for 17 bux.
10mg/day works, and well, for a lot of people.
myself included.

and it doesn't kill you.

androseries schmandroseries.

 

[jin]

They will be too busy working their second jobs they had to get to pay for the stuff.

:goodpost:

 

[BigBlackGuy]

dont dodge the question- show us some data to back up your claim


androgens(steroids) do not directly aid in fat burning....and jbry- is very knowledgeable i trust him


and your a rep for pp so your opinion= worthless in this thread imho


data pleaseeeeeeeeee

I don't know where to begin so I'll post up some studies...

Study 1



Study 2

As I said before, I copy and pasted. So here, I know how to use google, do YOU? Your broscience that androgens don't help burn fat is not real science. I'm not trying to be a ****, but you aren't posting studies about your "facts" either.

 

[schwellington]

oh, I got that, well here, let me re run it with more rep comments.

if you do copy and paste, you should always cite your source, how else is someone gonna know your not talking about them when you quote them, and in the same post, state strong copy and paste?.

but, did you get that info from wiki? I googled it and found this:

Inhibition of fat depositionMales typically have less adipose tissue than females. Recent results indicate that androgens inhibit the ability of some fat cells to store lipids by blocking a signal transduction pathway that normally supports adipocyte function.[3] Also, androgens, but not estrogens, increase beta adrenergic receptors while decreasing alpha adrenergic receptors- which results in increased levels of epinephrine/ norepinephrine due to lack of alpha-2 receptor negative feedback and decreased fat accumulation due to epinephrine/ norepinephrine then acting on lipolysis-inducing beta receptors.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Androgen

I know (or hope) you know anyone can write stuff in there. i find this interesting, as I always thought the fat loss from androgens was d/t lack of estrogen, which estrogen causes storage of fat. have to find the source of this info, there is no reference number in the wiki post.

Exactly- no actual scientific data- which is why wikipedia is WORTHLESS in this scenario

bigblackguy-0 jbry-1

 

[BigBlackGuy]

I know (or hope) you know anyone can write stuff in there. i find this interesting, as I always thought the fat loss from androgens was d/t lack of estrogen, which estrogen causes storage of fat. have to find the source of this info, there is no reference number in the wiki post.

Study I meant to post...

I don't believe that is the case, though I'm sure lower estrogen levels helps.

Exactly- no actual scientific data- which is why wikipedia is WORTHLESS in this scenario

bigblackguy-0 jbry-1

Schwellington -3000 :afro:

 

[schwellington]

Exactly- no actual scientific data- which is why wikipedia is WORTHLESS in this scenario

bigblackguy-0 jbry-1

HAHAHA, dude, the links in your post- dont exist- google couldnt find them- wowwwww

cmon man i got no beef with pp- but for someone who just spouts info with no real data

i will laugh at

 

[jin]

i find this interesting, as I always thought the fat loss from androgens was d/t lack of estrogen, which estrogen causes storage of fat. have to find the source of this info, there is no reference number in the wiki post.

if i remember correctly, fat cells excrete aromatase, which raises estrogen, which encourages fat deposits, which create more aromatase, and...

dht stops this cycle.

that is, if i remember correctly.

 

[BigBlackGuy]

HAHAHA, dude, the links in your post- dont exist- google couldnt find them- wowwwww

cmon man i got no beef with pp- but for someone who just spouts info with no real data

i will laugh at

My bad, I did the link thing wrong, lol.

Study 1

Study 2

Study I meant to post...

Three isn't working for some reason

 

[jbryand101b]

I did find this study, but good luck understanding what their talking about.

this is the study in your first link.

also, as is stated in the last part of the study, it is in vitro, effects in humans may differ. in many ways.

http://endo.endojournals.org/cgi/content/full/147/1/141



edit: previous comment doesn't matter because the study has nothing to do with the discussion.

study is done to see effects of test on the body and basically compare positive effects (decreased body fat) with negative effects (negative impact on lipids & cardiovascular system)

it concludes using test does reduce body fat, but it is a double edge sword. men with higher bf tend to have lowered test levels, as well as lowered hdl cholesterol, but then, with the use of outside test, bf is lowered, test levels are raised, and hdl cholesterol goes up.

doesn't do anything for why this happens. they dont study on the cellular level. just with bio electrical impedance, & blood work.

(explains why they used the bia device instead of d.e.x.a.)

but a good study to read non the less.

 

[BigBlackGuy]

I did find this study, but good luck understanding what their talking about.

also, as is stated in the last part of the study, it is in vitro, effects in humans may differ. in many ways.

http://endo.endojournals.org/cgi/content/full/147/1/141

I posted three studies, I don't have time to search the internet for this. Schwell seems pretty interested, he should look up some rivateeye:

I did find this study, but good luck understanding what their talking about.

this is the study in your first link.

also, as is stated in the last part of the study, it is in vitro, effects in humans may differ. in many ways.

http://endo.endojournals.org/cgi/content/full/147/1/141

Testosterone supplementation in men decreases fat mass; however, the mechanisms by which it inhibits fat mass are unknown. We hypothesized that testosterone inhibits adipogenic differentiation of preadipocytes by activation of androgen receptor (AR)/ß-catenin interaction and subsequent translocation of this complex to the nucleus thereby bypassing canonical Wnt signaling.

Activated the androgen receptor, I can assume they are talking about inside the fat cells?

 

[schwellington]

nah i got class

 

[dewing246]

you can run 2, 3, even 4 sd cycles for 17 bux.
10mg/day works, and well, for a lot of people.
myself included.

and it doesn't kill you.

androseries schmandroseries.

Even with the cost of support supps for a sd cycle it isn't as expensive as the adro series.

Like alot of people i am curious on how the products are going to work. I would be pissed if i spent that kind of money and it didn't really do anything for me.

 

[BigBlackGuy]

nah i got class

Fair enough. But you should probably look at the studies I posted. You were the one to request them and be so adamant about it, right? :drillsergeant:

 

[BigBlackGuy]

Even with the cost of support supps for a sd cycle it isn't as expensive as the adro series.

Like alot of people i am curious on how the products are going to work. I would be pissed if i spent that kind of money and it didn't really do anything for me.

Agreed.

All purchases of Primordial Performance product that are ordered directly from Primordial Performance are backed by a 100% money-back guarantee for the original purchase price. If for any reason you are dissatisfied, simply call us at 1-800-568-2924 within 60 days from your date of purchase, and we will provide you with a return authorization number (RA#). You will be instructed to return any unused portions and/or empty containers along with the RA# for a full refund. Shipping charges are non-refundable.

 

[jbryand101b]

I posted three studies, I don't have time to search the internet for this. Schwell seems pretty interested, he should look up some rivateeye:



Testosterone supplementation in men decreases fat mass; however, the mechanisms by which it inhibits fat mass are unknown. We hypothesized that testosterone inhibits adipogenic differentiation of preadipocytes by activation of androgen receptor (AR)/ß-catenin interaction and subsequent translocation of this complex to the nucleus thereby bypassing canonical Wnt signaling.

Activated the androgen receptor, I can assume they are talking about inside the fat cells?

this is quoted in the abstract. when you have time, you should read the entire study (as I just did.)

also, the third study has the same purpose as the second study, both are on a totally different subject than the first. the first study is as close to the subject at hand that I can find.

I have not been able to find any studies that support the quote posted from wiki. this explains why there is no reference to a data based source.

also, the last study is done using anavar (oxandrolone) this a different steroid than plain dht, still an androgen, but it will have different effects on a cellular level than plain dht d/t the changes in the chemical structure.

at least though, the 3rd study (for studying fat loss in men) uses much better testing methods than the second one from germany (everythings better in usa)

but like the second one, good read if your curious on the fat loss effects of anavar in 50 y/o men, but nothing for the subject of effects on the cellular level of dht & lipid metabolism.

last thing, in bold, please dont excuse my words typed on a screen for me thinking I am an expert, I am far from it. but I am more knowledgable than most, but not an expert, and quite far from it. I will continue this conversation with those much more knowledgable than I and will def follow up with that I learn.

but I do thank you for trying to take the time to post studies for us. everyone should (postive) rep bigblack for the effort. even if he didn't take the time to actually read the studies. he tried.

 

[HereToStudy]

nah i got class

Holy ****ing ****! This comment made me LOL at the office so ****ing hard, Im getting looks from coworkers.

 

[morry]

I'm looking forwards to the logs. Until then I'll keep my mouth shut.

 

[HereToStudy]

you can run 2, 3, even 4 sd cycles for 17 bux.
10mg/day works, and well, for a lot of people.
myself included.

and it doesn't kill you.

androseries schmandroseries.

Ask Mr. Classy above what SD is like. He seemed to enjoy it.

 

[jbryand101b]

wish I could qualify for that 150% money back gurantee. but I know I wouldn't, otherwise i'd def buy some. he he he.

 

[jbryand101b]

I love superdrol. I think it is a wonderful steroid, with many benifits & risks. but, i've never experienced anything negative from superdrol that wasn't temporary.

hepatotoxicity is very over rated in my and others opinions, but it's a key selling point in the andro series, as it's the only side their compounds wont give you, all the other typical sides (positive & negative) from androgens, one can and should expect.

 

[schwellington]

Fair enough. But you should probably look at the studies I posted. You were the one to request them and be so adamant about it, right? :drillsergeant:

i will look at em for sure

 

[schwellington]

Ask Mr. Classy above what SD is like. He seemed to enjoy it.

lol i meant like school class


but i do got th at kind of class too