- 06-10-2004, 07:14 PM
I was wondering if anyone has used this supp or has an info on it. I'm new to ph's (I've done one cycle of BSN's 1-testabolin-aq and was fairly disappointed). Anyway, Iron-Tek has discontinued Nor-Tek, but a friend of mine gave me two unopened bottles, and I'm not sure if I should use them or not. They would be good for two 30 day cycles, with 3-4 weeks pct in between. Any reply would be greatly appreciated.
Here are the ingredients:
Each serving of 1 tablet contains: Calcium (as calcium carbonate) 138 mg Zinc (as zinc citrate) 30 mg Tribulus Terrestris Extract 10:1 (leaf) (standardized for 40% saponins) 250 mg 19-Nor-4-Androstenediol 100 mg 19-Nor-4-Androstenedione 100 mg 4-Androstenediol 100 mg 4-Androstenedione 100 mg Chrysin 100 mg Saw Palmetto (berry) 100 mg
Thanks for any replies
- 06-10-2004, 07:16 PM
06-10-2004, 07:21 PM
That bad huh? Based on the listed ingredients or personal experience? I'll trust you on this one. As I said, the bottles were given to me, so no skin off my back.Originally Posted by Kristopher
06-10-2004, 07:50 PM
Ingredients are complete **** IMO. anyone who is throwing trib and zinc in a hormone and some other fluff ingredients is just ridiculous. Also, the tiny doses of multiple hormones is sad. Tell us your experience with PH, and we can give recommendations.
06-11-2004, 12:37 AM
If you are new to the game, then I strongly believe this is fine to start with. It will work. Take 1 pill twice a day then go up to 3 or 4. That should be high enough. You might concider getting some stronger stuff (for your next cycle) because they are about to ban it. Don't worry, keep reading and we'll get you up to speed!Originally Posted by 323mattb
06-11-2004, 01:00 PM
Thanks Doc D. The bottle suggests 1 tablet daily, but you think 2 is better? Is this because the dosages of the andros are low? Also, I've read that 4-androstenedione is best avoided because of its high estrogen conversion and low test conversion. It is one of the 4 ingredients included, but I'm not sure why. Should this worry me (I'd hate to have tits)? Chrysin is also included to counter the aromatization, but many seem to think that chrysin is useless. Should I use 6-oxo during the cycle or just hold off and use the 6-oxo during PCT? Thanks so much for the guidance.Originally Posted by DR.D
06-11-2004, 01:03 PM
4-ad shouldn't be avoided, although the nordiol and 4-ad will compete for the same receptor. 4-ad also has a high test conversion rate (95% to test). Use 6-oxo during PCT, not on cycle.Originally Posted by 323mattb
06-11-2004, 01:05 PM
**** man, 4AD is my favorite PH to date, good for bulking, not all estrogen is bad. 6oxo is ok, but I wouldn't risk it. Even though this particular choice of PH seems weak, it might behoove you to get some Nolva for PCT.Originally Posted by 323mattb
06-11-2004, 01:09 PM
You're better off with a transdermal 1-Test & 4-AD than Nor-Tek. This product 4-DIONE, which I wouldnt' take, even if the bottles were given to me for free.
06-11-2004, 01:23 PM
Wow! A few conflicting opinions, but that's ok. I appreciate all of your feedback. Am I correct in thinking that the 4-dione is the only ingredient with estro conversion? If this is the case and the product seems weak, then estro related sides would be minimal if at all, right? Also, I read an article recently on Will Brinks' site that referenced a study showing that lignans from flax seeds are more effective at countering gyno/estro side effects than nolva. Anyone else heard this? I already include 2 tbsp. of ground flax seed in my daily diet for other health benefits, so maybe the nolva would be unneccessary? Thanks again for all of the feedback.
06-11-2004, 05:25 PM
Maybe this will shed a little light on the confusion: The 4-AD referenced is the 4-Androstenediol...the 4-Androstenedione (Androstenedione) is not even available anymore, but has a lower conversion to testosterone and a higher affinity to estrogen than the 4-Androstenediol. So go with the diol...
06-11-2004, 07:54 PM
Just toss it and go pick up a 1-test/4-AD transdermal. You will be much happier. Why put yourself through 4-6 weeks of a let down. Followed up by 4 weeks of PCT. Start reading all you can about transdermals, 1-test, & 4-AD (diol). There is enough to read on this site to keep you busy for a year.
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