I am reading much more BAD than good about Methyl style PH's.....
- 06-10-2004, 01:32 PM
I am reading much more BAD than good about Methyl style PH's.....
Hey guys, new poster here but i've been lurking for quite some time. I was doing a little research on the Methyl style products before trying a cycle, and I can definately say the results are discouraging. The amount of complaints totally overweigh the small amount of good i've read. Bitch tits, LACTATING?!?!, high blood pressure, lots of lower back pain, gyno, etc...And this is coming from some people who even used proper PCT....
- 06-10-2004, 01:41 PM
Actually, I remember most of these cases. The lower back pain comes with M1T exclusively which can be assisted with taurine. Gyno, lactacting, etc. comes with the lack of proper PCT.
06-10-2004, 01:44 PM
I would add that these are note sides that are exclusive to methyls either.
All my life I've never stopped to worry 'bout a thing,
Open up and shout it out, an' never try to sing,
Wondering if I've done it wrong,
Will this depression last for long, wont you tell me,
Where have all the good times gone.
06-10-2004, 01:53 PM
taurine?Really...wish I would of known that one...everyone said potasium...potasium....I had to cut a cycle short from the back spasssss....no other sides though..Originally Posted by Beelzebub
06-10-2004, 01:54 PM
Yes, those are legitimate side effects noted by certain individuals, but not everyone experiences those. Also the dosage taken and the cycle duration also plays a role in the severity and notablilty of side effects.
Another factor is which methyl you are taking. The higher androgenic properties of a ph equates to a higher chance of side effects. M4OHN by Designer is supposedly more anabolic, but less androgenic. Also this ph is supposedly less likely to aromatize. I plan on doing a cycle of Sledge's M4OHN and will see for myself.
I admire you did all your research before jumping on the methyl bandwagon. If you are concerned about the potential side effects, a 1-Test/4-AD stack is always a good choice.
06-10-2004, 02:30 PM
Stryder, I appreciate that. Lemme ask you, what do you know about IDS's "Methyl X"? I've talked to a couple of guys who loved it, but I wanna be sure i know what I am taking first...Originally Posted by stryder
FWIW, I recently ran a cycle of 1-AD by itself with GREAT results. Gained weight, gained strength, kept all of it and had little to no sides. I'm looking for similar results but slightly harder hitting stuff. If thats not possible, I might wanna just stick with the weaker 1-Test/1-AD style PH's...
Any input is appreciated..
06-10-2004, 02:32 PM
06-10-2004, 02:49 PM
Not really looking for that type of response. I am more or less just trying to get some feedback to confirm what i've read. I'm well aware of potential sides when using any type of AS or potent PH, just trying to weigh my options at this point and get some feedback.Originally Posted by Jarconis
06-10-2004, 02:55 PM
I've gotten worse sides from AAS (even weaker ones) than with any of the PHs. The only sides I got at all are water retention and some low back pain with M1T and mdien, but taurine and magnesium did the trick. I really think the sides are less extreme and the PHs are cheaper, easier and legal.
06-10-2004, 03:16 PM
Best I've seen so far is trans 4AD with M1T. 4 week long cycle with the first of 4AD trans solo followed by adding M1T for the remaining 2 weeks. Of course, you'll need proper PCT.Originally Posted by Prime Rib
06-10-2004, 05:10 PM
Never tried Methyl X--actually never tried anything by IDS. But looking at the ingredients, it's a combo of Methyl-Dien and 1-AD. The dosages look comparable to other products. If I ran it I would probably go with 3 caps/day. Not sure about the sides...best bet is to ask someone who's tried it and see what dosage, how long, and any sides. Make sure you have some Nolva on hand if need be--in case of puffy nips or gyno flare ups.Originally Posted by Prime Rib
Personally I loved 1-AD, but I usually took a higher dose 3-6 per day...but if you really want a good kick in your cycle, definelty add 4-AD to the mix at about 2-3 grams per day. That would be a great stack...just remember to have your PCT on hand before starting a cycle.
06-10-2004, 05:17 PM
06-10-2004, 09:00 PM
I took 4 a day, for 8 weeks. Kicked ass. So you're saying try a 1-AD/4-AD stack?Personally I loved 1-AD, but I usually took a higher dose 3-6 per day...but if you really want a good kick in your cycle, definelty add 4-AD to the mix at about 2-3 grams per day. That would be a great stack...just remember to have your PCT on hand before starting a cycle.
06-10-2004, 09:27 PM
I would suggest doing the 4-ad either trans or injectable. I would not do it any other way. Ever....
06-10-2004, 10:21 PM
06-10-2004, 11:03 PM
Potasium is fine, it's just Taurine metabolizes into Potasium, which is better. Increase in water, and decrease in sodium also helps.Originally Posted by willieman
06-11-2004, 08:53 AM
the reason I ask is because the potasium did nothing for me even at high levels.....thanksOriginally Posted by Cuffs
06-11-2004, 10:18 AM
I don't understand why Prime Rib made this statement about *ALL* methyls. It reminds me of people who think all steroids are bad (and equally bad).
It's pretty clear that most of the feedback so far has been about m1t and to a much lesser extent m-dien. Has anyone complained about side effects of m4ohn yet?
06-12-2004, 05:30 AM
Bro, I just read back through all my replies and not one of them say "ALL" so I dunno what you're talking about. My statements are very general and wide open, noticed i used the term "Methyl style" products, and asked a general question. I am not an idiot that looks down upon AS or PH's and think they are "bad", I wouldn't be on this board if I did and i'd appreciate it not to be classified as such. ThanksOriginally Posted by rrgg
06-12-2004, 10:15 AM
You wrote, "the methyl style products."Originally Posted by Prime Rib
So you made a mistake and didn't mean to write that. I don't know why you're trying to claim it doesn't mean any and all methyl PH out there. It does.
06-12-2004, 12:17 PM
i just got my new methyl style products in the mail today!
i got the new methylated hair gel and facial cleanser! how cool.
06-13-2004, 04:33 AM
Honestly who gives a **** if i'm trying to classifiy them or not. It's a SIMPLE QUESTION bro. Either discuss it or don't post. I didn't come on here to critique my speech....
06-13-2004, 04:50 AM
Gentlemen, attempt to keep it on topic and Prime.. he was joking around to attempt to lighten things up.. relax, so far no one is cutting you a new *******..
06-13-2004, 06:58 PM
I think a lot of people like to hate on methyls just coz. There are a lot of theoratical problems that could happen with them. So people get all crazy and start hating on them at boards like bb.coms. And then it just goes crazy. Its funny but most posts about the flaws of metyhls seem to come from people that have never used them. They are merely repeating what someone more educated like pat arnold or big cat says.But then they add a level of drama. Prime Rib if you have not went to bodybuilding.com's boards I recommend you do. They are good for a few laughs. I can predict about 75% of what is going to be said just by reading the topic of the posts there. Its some of the most uneducated petty stuff I have ever read. IE worrying about drinking too much water because it might hurt your liver.
But on topic I will say this... people are ridiculous and expect meythls to be mircale pills without sides. If something works its going to have sides. Thats just the trade offs. Read some of the cycles posted on this board. You will see with enough research and some guidance a methyl PH stack doesnt have to turn into lactating titties.
06-14-2004, 10:30 AM
look, it comes down to this.
whether you are talking ph's, steroids, or "prosteroids" etc.
generally speaking... the more profound the effect of ANY substance, the greater the sides/risks.
that is pretty much true across the board. when a compound comes out that has very high sides AND pretty mediocre effects, it generally leaves the market, or becomes rare/unpopular. the perfect example is methyltest (note i said methyltest, NOT methy-1-test).
while methyltest is useful for competitive pl'ers/wl'ers during comp's other than that, it's just not effective enough to justify the sides.
frankly, this cost/benefit equation holds true with most NON-steroidal products as well. cars, food, whatever. generally speaking, the market works such that there has to be added value to justify added price (or people won't buy it), and/or added benefits to justify added risks.
the market in this sense is "efficient". and steroidals are no different.
now, in a very small market, where there are constantly new products and a small user base (think methyl-ph's) there is going to be more market inefficiency than in a hyooooge market, which can be an advantage to a KNOWLEDGEABLE consumer, but the concept generally holds true OVER TIME.
if a substance comes out with HIGH risk, and little benefit it falls by the wayside. if a substance comes out with HIGH benefit and low risk, it will supplant that high risk, high benefit substance - generally speaking.
that's how markets work. PH's are no different.
at this point, with ESTABLISHED compounds, everyone knows what works. in the methyls, m1-t is simply king. exceptionally cheap, extremely effective, and moderate risk/sides (lethargy, cramping, etc). it has stood the test of time, imo. ditto, in injectable/transdermals with 4-ad. it simply WORKS. methyl-di was all the rage due to PROSPECTIVE benefits, but since it hasn't worked out like suspected, it has simply fallen from favor.
in the end, the consumer wins.
if you don't like the risk of methyls, then don't use them. simply put, the SAFEST AND BEST way to take PH's is injectable ASSUMING you know how to make a sterile compound - low hepatotoxicity issues (compared to methyls esp) , lots of bang per mg, lots of bang per $$$, no messy gels, and more convenience (5 minutes to inject and you're done. you don't have to time your showers like with transdermals, etc.)
you are going to pay more to use transdermals, since you get less %age of the compound available.
methyls are so ridiculously cheap (especially m-1-t in bulk powder form), but if you don't like the risks, then choose other option.
and don't even think about ANY PH without proper PCT ***on hand***. much of the risk of these substances comes from improper planning and/or response to sides when they occur.
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