frontloading hdrol??

  1. New Member
    bigdave's Avatar
    Stats
    5'9"  200 lbs.
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Age
    30
    Posts
    77
    Answers
    0

    frontloading hdrol??


    was wondering if it makes sense, it kicks in the 4th week usually for me at 50-75mg so was thinking something like
    week1- 100mg
    week 2- 100mg
    week3- 75mg
    week 4-6 50mg


  2. Professional Member
    celc5's Avatar
    Stats
    5'10"  195 lbs.
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Age
    34
    Posts
    3,211
    Answers
    0

    Quote Originally Posted by bigdave View Post
    was wondering if it makes sense, it kicks in the 4th week usually for me at 50-75mg so was thinking something like
    week1- 100mg
    week 2- 100mg
    week3- 75mg
    week 4-6 50mg
    What is your goal with frontloading? Are you trying to make it kick in faster? I just don't think that will work

  3. Primordial Performance Rep
    HereToStudy's Avatar
    Stats
    6'0"  208 lbs.
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Posts
    9,390
    Answers
    0

    I don't get it either.
    Just inject.
    Facebook:
    www.facebook.com/heretostudy

    •   
       

  4. Professional Member
    lennoxchi's Avatar
    Stats
    6'1"  235 lbs.
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    3,643
    Answers
    0

    Quote Originally Posted by celc5 View Post
    What is your goal with frontloading? Are you trying to make it kick in faster? I just don't think that will work
    i don't know, it might work. like front loading test-e. start at a high does then after 2 weeks resume to what doseage you really want to be at.....hmm, might work

  5. New Member
    bigdave's Avatar
    Stats
    5'9"  200 lbs.
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Age
    30
    Posts
    77
    Answers
    0

    exactly to kick in faster,many people frontload some injectables and have some success is elevating serum levels of the drug and I was wondering anyones opinion or perhaps experience on frontloading a substance like halodrol in order to see results faster. kicking in on week 3 of a 6 week cycle leaves me wanting more on a potentially hepatoxic hormone. i did 8 weeks hdrol (50-75mg)in the summer with great results however my liver values and bp elevated slighly and my sleep quality declined while on

  6. Bananas
    TripDog's Avatar
    Stats
    5'10"  201 lbs.
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Posts
    10,084
    Answers
    0

    That will just shut you down faster bro, isn't the same as front loading injectables. Start with a slow taper, so you utilize your natty test as long as possible before shutdown, or inhibition.
    The LORD is my rock, my fortress, and my savior; my God is my rock, in whom I find protection. He is my shield, the power that saves me, and my place of safety.-Psalm 18:2

  7. New Member
    bigdave's Avatar
    Stats
    5'9"  200 lbs.
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Age
    30
    Posts
    77
    Answers
    0

    sounds good trip, i totally 4got bout shut down juss cause i usually get it later on in the cycle and the big jump in dose will def shut me down

  8. Professional Member
    celc5's Avatar
    Stats
    5'10"  195 lbs.
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Age
    34
    Posts
    3,211
    Answers
    0

    Let's say we start at 75 or 100mg, it doesn't REALLY kick until about day 14 or 21 (ish) anyhow. So starting at that dose (100) and then tapering down still doesn't change the "kick in" time for this compound IMO.

    I have a theory with these fast acting orals that we can get something out of a low dose, but only to a point. When that initial dose is maxed out, we bump to the next level, max out our potential at that dose, then repeat to keep the cycle productive and prevent mid-cycle plateau.

    If we frontload, where do we go when we reach that dosage specific plateau? Higher dosage, right?

    If we're tapering, we still have an exogenous hormone source prolonging suppression... but it doesn't even push the plateau threshold higher to do more work. So theoretically, we are accomplishing less while still be "on." We could do that by starting pct and bringing endogenous hormones back in the process.

    That's me thinking out loud, so my theory could certainly be chalked full of holes.

  9. Advanced Member
    Libertarian's Avatar
    Stats
    5'9"   lbs.
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Posts
    583
    Answers
    0

    Quote Originally Posted by TripDog View Post
    That will just shut you down faster bro, isn't the same as front loading injectables. Start with a slow taper, so you utilize your natty test as long as possible before shutdown, or inhibition.
    In this case I doubt it would make much of a difference how fast HPTA suppression occurs. Also, what's the point of trying to "utilize your natty test as long as possible before shutdown"?

  10. dpfisher
    Guest
    dpfisher's Avatar

    Can anyone give a legit reason for the "kick in" time? I mean it should be binding to receptors from day one right? As a methyl it's going to have high availability. The only explanation I can think of is that it is accumulating over time- in which case frontloading would be effective.

    Possible cons: May not work, sides will probably hit harder as you won't have any time to adjust to it.

  11. Diamond Member
    Trauma1's Avatar
    Stats
    5'11"  220 lbs.
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Age
    35
    Posts
    15,444
    Answers
    0

    Quote Originally Posted by dpfisher View Post
    Can anyone give a legit reason for the "kick in" time? I mean it should be binding to receptors from day one right? As a methyl it's going to have high availability. The only explanation I can think of is that it is accumulating over time- in which case frontloading would be effective.

    It's a discussion worth having, and I wish I had something useful to add.
    Target hormone conversion has a lot to do with it; with this being a prohormone. Some guys will get better conversion than others due to genetic factors of steroidogenic enzymes (3b-HSD in particular here).

    Check this out:

    http://www.primordialperformance.com...iles.html?id=6

    Evolutionary Muse - Inspire to Evolve
    Legendary


  12. Professional Member
    celc5's Avatar
    Stats
    5'10"  195 lbs.
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Age
    34
    Posts
    3,211
    Answers
    0

    Quote Originally Posted by Trauma1 View Post
    Target hormone conversion has a lot to do with it; with this being a prohormone. Some guys will get better conversion than others due to genetic factors of steroidogenic enzymes (3b-HSD in particular here).
    Another interesting thing with "kick in" with halo is that, in my opinion, we FEEL it kick in sometime around day 20.

    I used calipers and recomp was occuring for me by day 5 and 10. So I think people just aren't seeing the scale move and assume it's doing nothing in those first 10 or 20 days.

  13. Bananas
    TripDog's Avatar
    Stats
    5'10"  201 lbs.
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Posts
    10,084
    Answers
    0

    Quote Originally Posted by Libertarian View Post
    In this case I doubt it would make much of a difference how fast HPTA suppression occurs. Also, what's the point of trying to "utilize your natty test as long as possible before shutdown"?
    ?? Are you saying that shutdown isn't dose dependant? Natural test is just going to deal with the lethargy associated with oral only cycles without running test. It will add to the overall level of anabolic hormones present, but nothing drastic. It's not a huge concern if using some type of test precursor, but sometimes little things add up.
    The LORD is my rock, my fortress, and my savior; my God is my rock, in whom I find protection. He is my shield, the power that saves me, and my place of safety.-Psalm 18:2

  14. Diamond Member
    Trauma1's Avatar
    Stats
    5'11"  220 lbs.
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Age
    35
    Posts
    15,444
    Answers
    0

    Quote Originally Posted by celc5 View Post
    Another interesting thing with "kick in" with halo is that, in my opinion, we FEEL it kick in sometime around day 20.

    I used calipers and recomp was occuring for me by day 5 and 10. So I think people just aren't seeing the scale move and assume it's doing nothing in those first 10 or 20 days.
    I didn't "feel" anything significant with it until about day 21 or so. From there on out though, it was fairly impressive. I suspect I didn't dose it high enough initially (50mg x 3 weeks) to see better effects at my weight at the time. I bumped it to 100mg/day on day 22, and it was markedly more noticeable all around. I think the strength gains and recomposition effects impressed me more than anything.

    A pretty good compound that was very mild in comparison of side effects with say Superdrol or Phera Plex.

    I don't think front loading this is going to have any significant effect. I agree that people are looking at the scale and not the mirror.

    Evolutionary Muse - Inspire to Evolve
    Legendary


  15. dpfisher
    Guest
    dpfisher's Avatar

    Quote Originally Posted by Trauma1 View Post
    Target hormone conversion has a lot to do with it; with this being a prohormone. Some guys will get better conversion than others due to genetic factors of steroidogenic enzymes (3b-HSD in particular here).

    Check this out:

    http://www.primordialperformance.com...iles.html?id=6
    It's active on its own though and the half-life is similar for both compounds right? Unless somehow the body becomes more efficient at converting it with time...

    I mean "kick in" time with esterified injectables makes sense- takes time to break them apart into bases. As far as the methyls, I really don't get it.

  16. Diamond Member
    Trauma1's Avatar
    Stats
    5'11"  220 lbs.
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Age
    35
    Posts
    15,444
    Answers
    0

    Quote Originally Posted by dpfisher View Post
    It's active on its own though and the half-life is similar for both compounds right? Unless somehow the body becomes more efficient at converting it with time...

    I mean "kick in" time with esterified injectables makes sense- takes time to break them apart into bases. As far as the methyls, I really don't get it.
    I don't have much faith in any significant intrinsic value it offers before conversion. There are going to be people that get better conversion rates due to the factors I stated above. The body isn't going to become more efficient in converting the target hormone Those steroidogenic enzmyes are genetic factors that aren't modifiable, so it's all in the luck of the draw there.

    Most people should still get very decent results overall.

    -John

    Evolutionary Muse - Inspire to Evolve
    Legendary


  17. dpfisher
    Guest
    dpfisher's Avatar

    So basically what you're thinking is it's binding to the set amount of enzymes you have. The tbol builds up over time then does the actual muscle building, and if you take more hdrol-frontloaded or endloaded- the extra just floats around doing nothing?

    Yeah that makes a lot of sense actually, also explains why with high doses you get increased sides but not increased gains.

  18. Advanced Member
    Libertarian's Avatar
    Stats
    5'9"   lbs.
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Posts
    583
    Answers
    0

    Quote Originally Posted by TripDog View Post
    ?? Are you saying that shutdown isn't dose dependant? Natural test is just going to deal with the lethargy associated with oral only cycles without running test. It will add to the overall level of anabolic hormones present, but nothing drastic. It's not a huge concern if using some type of test precursor, but sometimes little things add up.
    I see what you're saying. But still, I don't think HPTA suppression is going to be noticeably different starting off with 100mg vs 75mg. When I run a cycle, I'm not worried about trying to delay suppression a few days - it's going to happen anyway, so I go in with the mindset of making the most out of the cycle and maximizing gains. Eh, splitting hairs I suppose.

  19. New Member
    SeanEH's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Posts
    17
    Answers
    0

    Quote Originally Posted by Trauma1 View Post
    I don't have much faith in any significant intrinsic value it offers before conversion.
    Isn't a typical t-bol dose 50 mg a day? And it's not a particularly strong steroid. If halo converts at 5% - even 10%, I would expect nothing from the conversion. It does work, so something else must be happening, right?

  20. dav
    dav is offline
    New Member
    dav's Avatar
    Stats
    5'11"  240 lbs.
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Posts
    22
    Answers
    0

    Conversion rates for Hdrol are around 40% apparently so this would equate fairly well with an almost double dose to that of Tbol (what it converts to).

  21. Advanced Member
    OnTheRoadTo's Avatar
    Stats
    6'3"  272 lbs.
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    678
    Answers
    0

    Where are the conversion rates coming from - 5% seems low (I know it is on PP's website).
    Paging Dr. Banner. . .

  22. Diamond Member
    Trauma1's Avatar
    Stats
    5'11"  220 lbs.
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Age
    35
    Posts
    15,444
    Answers
    0

    Quote Originally Posted by dav View Post
    Conversion rates for Hdrol are around 40% apparently so this would equate fairly well with an almost double dose to that of Tbol (what it converts to).
    According to who exactly?

    -John

    Evolutionary Muse - Inspire to Evolve
    Legendary


  •   

      
     

Similar Forum Threads

  1. frontloading clomid
    By Jasen in forum Anabolics
    Replies: 28
    Last Post: 08-26-2010, 06:39 PM
  2. Frontloading with 1-AD?
    By babygetoboy in forum Anabolics
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 08-27-2003, 11:31 AM
  3. Frontloading ?
    By babygetoboy in forum Anabolics
    Replies: 14
    Last Post: 04-25-2003, 12:08 PM
  4. Who's Down With Frontloading?
    By YellowJacket in forum Anabolics
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 02-24-2003, 04:25 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Log in

Log in