P-Plex, M-drol or Havoc for strength only?

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  1. P-Plex, M-drol or Havoc for strength only?


    Which compound run SOLO, would be the best for strength gain with the least amount of weight gain. Diet will be high protein, moderate carbs and fat. Do not want to stack any of these together and strength gain is the only goal.


  2. Diet will determine weight gain... but I know what you mean. None of those are the best options for gaining strength without gaining weight... SD and PP are reliant on a good amount of water/glycogen "temporary weight" from my experience, you could maintain weight if you work to burn the fat off.

    With havoc you could accomplish what you want if you use a high dose and do proper diet/cardio to keep weight down but really i don't think it promotes weight gain as much.

    I think the best PH for what you want would be Tren, a lot of people report heavy weight gain on it but I think it's well suited for gaining strength without mass.

    The other thing I would consider for your requirements is a high dose of Hdrol, possibly stacked with low/moderate doses of Epi or Tren.

    If you had access to AAS you'd have some better options like winstrol, anavar, well Halotestin but maybe I shouldn't mention that one :P
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  3. Thanks for your advice. H-drol at 100 mgs for 6 weeks worked well for me, but I am wanting to try something a bit stronger. I stacked the H-drol with 800mgs of Bold and it was succesful even after PCT. I didn't think of Tren, since it is not a methyl, would stacking it with any of these three work well? Again, the more strength the better. I can deal with 8 or 9 pounds of weight gain.

  4. Hdrol/Tren would probably be a pretty sick stack for what you want

    also 8-9 pounds is a ton of weight for someone not looking to gain weight
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  5. In my experience m-drol would be the route to go. Most ppl retain little to no water on this compound, and the strength gains are sic. weight gain due to increase in lbm will still exist, but they should all be very dry.
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  6. i ran two solo mdrol cycles, i didn't notice anything compared to my epistane/hdrol 6 week cycle.
    my bench went up about 30 lbs over the 6 wks, maybe i just ran the mdrol wrong nutrition wise..idk. im definately keeping epistane in my stacks from now on though

  7. If you're concerned about strength only, you must consider and strength training routine and another diet.

  8. Quote Originally Posted by russy_russ View Post
    If you're concerned about strength only, you must consider and strength training routine and another diet.
    Dude, I actually compete in powerlifting and I am trying to get my Elite total in the 275 pound weight class in the USPF. My routine is fine and my diet is fine as well. I am just looking for an advantage without ordering illegal steroids through the internet. I have these three drugs and want to know what peoples experience is with any f them run solo as it pertains to strngth without too much weight gain and bloat.

  9. I'd stay away from the Pheraplex based upon what you seem to be looking for. I just stopped an Epistane/Pheraplex cycle early because the Pheraplex was wreaking havoc with me. I gained about 16 lbs in 4 weeks and it seems like it is mostly h20 weight. I'm puffy and bloated and that was not really what I was looking for when I decided to stack the Phera w/ Epi. With me, the Pheraplex appears to be a sopping wet designer. My back pumps were so bad from the Phera, all of my compound lifts went down and it got hard to even complete a workout.

  10. phera is pretty close to d-bo mg/mg for me.

  11. Quote Originally Posted by texastweeter View Post
    In my experience m-drol would be the route to go. Most ppl retain little to no water on this compound, and the strength gains are sic. weight gain due to increase in lbm will still exist, but they should all be very dry.
    I gain weight like mad on Superdrol though, not so much the water as the glycogen and filling of the muscles, a huge percentage of that intramuscular weight is water even if there's less water retention elsewhere. Anyway, i was eating x calories and not gaining weight, started SD, started gaining a pound a day at least. So i didn't even increase my calories and I started gaining... So I would say it's very prone to weight gain.

    I do agree tho that SD is the best thing for strength out there, everytime I take Superdrol my pressing (which is my weakest area) explodes.

    I think you could run SD to achieve these goals but proper diet and cardio should be done to control the weight gain. I'd still feel safer recommending an Hdrol/Tren stack as those can be ramped up to pretty high doses with excellent strength and very managable weight gain
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  12. that is odd if i run super alone, i gain very modest weight. can anyone else chime in on this with personal experience?

  13. Quote Originally Posted by russy_russ View Post
    If you're concerned about strength only, you must consider and strength training routine and another diet.

    this is right. you ask for advice then get upset when you get it. any of these will increase strength. and your diet will determine how much weight you gain/loose. again, diet is what can allow you to cut on test, or bulk up.

    I feel epistane would be the easiest if you dont know how to diet well. sd stacked with pp if you do know how to diet well would be your best bet for strength.

  14. When I ran SD on a bulk each time the first week i did 10mg and gained around 10 pounds

    When I ran SD stacked with PP on a recomp, in order to maintain weight I ate 3k calories, did cardio 1x to 2x a day, and was on T3. I imagine without the ridiculous amount of cardio and the T3, and on normal maintenance calories (more like 3500) I would have gained weight stupidly fast

    when weight comes on that fast, its not muscle. Its rapid uptake of water and glycogen puffing out the muscles. Its not keepable by itself, but it allows your muscles to work way harder and get way stronger, and its in the ensuing days that actual muscle is built. thought i should clarify that.
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  15. but remember he is looking for minimal weight gain, noit a good idea IMO to run a phera compound when you want little weight gain. if weight was not a factor, anadrol ftw

  16. well texas if you bring real illegal AAS into the mix then he would want halotestin! lol

    That's the powerlifter drug of choice
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  17. are you sure? so you are saying I cant take superdrol for a week and gain 10lbs of solid muscle?

  18. i have heard so many ppl calim so many diffrent results on sd that Im not saying anything lol except what MY numerous experiences are.

  19. Quote Originally Posted by hangclean View Post
    Dude, I actually compete in powerlifting and I am trying to get my Elite total in the 275 pound weight class in the USPF. My routine is fine and my diet is fine as well. I am just looking for an advantage without ordering illegal steroids through the internet. I have these three drugs and want to know what peoples experience is with any f them run solo as it pertains to strngth without too much weight gain and bloat.
    That doesn't mean you know sh*t. Don't give me that 'look at me i'm my badest person in the world' bs. I'm telling you that your 'high protein' diet isn't optimal for powerlifting.

  20. Quote Originally Posted by russy_russ View Post
    That doesn't mean you know sh*t. Don't give me that 'look at me i'm my badest person in the world' bs. I'm telling you that your 'high protein' diet isn't optimal for powerlifting.
    It is when someone is trying to stay in a weight class.

  21. Quote Originally Posted by hangclean View Post
    It is when someone is trying to stay in a weight class.
    How so? Let me guess you think carbohydrates are stored as fat?

  22. Excess carbs do get stored as fat... are you going to try to argue that?
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  23. Quote Originally Posted by UnrealMachine View Post
    Excess carbs do get stored as fat... are you going to try to argue that?
    Yep. That's not true

  24. I'll explain why with research studies to back it.

  25. When I get home.. Err AM mobile blows
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