M1T vs Oral AAS's - Safety
- 01-27-2004, 12:18 PM
M1T vs Oral AAS's - Safety
Hey guys, it has been a while to say the least.....
I have been reading up on the M1t and am looking at doing a cylce
4 weeks M1t - 10mg ED or 20 mg ED
6 weeks 4ad - spray - not sure on how much to put in, range from 5-10g
nolva at end
ala, swole2, fatburners.....and the rest of the norms
I was on bb and Big Cat was saying that M1T is harsher on the liver than many orals...is this true??? (Something about Gamma GT levels)
Please give me some feedback on the proposed cycle and saftey issue
23 - 5'9" - 5 years training - did some aas before (test/deca) - 200lbs, 12% bf
I am looking to add some size while not adding much fat (hopefully lose some)
I did some 1test/4ad before with great success
- 01-27-2004, 12:50 PM
Originally Posted by Super Tri's
most users are reporting gains plateauing after 2 weeks. running it for 4 weeks is a waste imo.
5-10g of 4ad? i hope you mean .5 - 1g
m1t raises your blood pressure, so it is not recommended to take fatburners during your cycle. hawthorne berry is also recommended for your reducing blood pressure while on cycle.
m1t is hard on your liver, so it is recommended to take supplements (milk thistle, nac) for protection.
- 01-27-2004, 12:55 PM
keoki, maybe you need to do more research before posting.
He definately meant 5-10g of 4AD, not per dose, but TOTAL. Secondly, the short cycle theory works for some, but trying longer (4 week) cycles have been producing good gains for members here as well. As for fatburners, thats up to him, but yes hawthorne berry is highly recommended anyway.
01-27-2004, 01:00 PM
ke0ki covered the blood pressure stuff well. Hawthorn Berry and CoQ10 are great choices.
I've always been a fan of short cycles, but there are actually a good handful of users who haven't seen the great benefits in the first two weeks (or in my case, nothing drastic and no strength) so 5 or 10mg ED for 4 weeks is a reasonable approach. 20mg anecdotally shows very little in increased gains but definitive increase in sides. Would *not* recommend a 4 week 20mg run.
For the 4ad, I assume you mean putting 5 - 10g into the bottle. Personally, I'd saturate it with a full 10 and go 2x ed.
Just make sure that diet is in check and you should be able to meet your goal.
Originally Posted by ke0ki
01-27-2004, 01:03 PM
The only for sure about M-1-T is no one really knows that much about about it but everyone is using it. After reading alot of post on m-1-t thats what I came up with.
It seems most people below 200#'s have good results with 10mg ed. Well people over 200#'s don't. I have to agree with running 4-ad with the M-1-T. After doing a cycle without it. My next cycle will be ran with 4-ad and with M-1-T at 10-15mg each day.
But your cycle looks good for a 4 week cycle. I would add in the Q-10 and maybe cut out the ECA I didn't care for the way the ECA made me feel on my last cycle.
01-27-2004, 01:15 PM
Hey guys, thanks for the input.
Sounds like 10mg/day of m1t is the way to go then.
As for the 4ad, I mean 5g-10g for the total solution. Most likey 10g then, or if i order from mike m then i'll have to decide between 6g (142mg per daya) or 12g (285mg per day).
i'll get rid of the fatburners, didn't know that had an impact.
I think I'd want to go the 4 weeks with m1t, give a better chance of keeping the gains in the long run.
let me know your thoughts on the 4ad?
milk thistle and ala will be in there,
01-27-2004, 02:01 PM
If you are going to take the 4ad for 6 weeks, then frontload it for 2 weeks before starting the M1t. I think you will definitely gain well with 10mg M1t. There are mixed opinions on M1t cycle lengths, I have never exceeded 17 days. I suggest adding the m1t in your 3rd week & go for 2 weeks. If the sides are reasonable & you feel you can extend it to 3 weeks, then do so. Do this again after 3 weeks, etc. I plan to do this on my next cycle. I would not exceed 4 weeks total on M1t though. Whether you run two 2-week cycles or one 4-weeker of M1t won't matter in terms of keeping gains. You will need 4 weeks of PCT with nolva or clomid after the cycle.
If you stick to 10mg, this is a pretty safe cycle & sides should be minimal. Make sure to take ALA, NAC, Milk thistle, or a combo of those for liver protection. This cycle should suit your goals.
01-27-2004, 03:21 PM
Agreed with LONGDOG.
Take your M1T in the middle of your 4AD for two weeks.
4AD definitely makes M1T more tolerable.
01-28-2004, 07:06 AM
Where did BC grab those numbers from? 9 times out of 10 I call someone to produce their references because I don't believe they have them...however, I trust BC has some info that I don't have. See if he'll post his reference for that value...
01-28-2004, 09:23 AM
Chemo, I asked BC about this and and he gave me 3 liver values (he did not have the other results handy, he said he conducted a 6wk m-1-t test). I posted the results in Supersoldiers thread about his blood tests. GammaGT was abit above normal range, ALT/ALC was elevated 2x above normal. I have little idea what dbol/drol does to liver values.
01-28-2004, 09:25 AM
10mg a day at 200 lbs is a little low.
For a 2 week cycle... Id shoot for 15 to 20mg a day.
01-28-2004, 09:45 AM
I'm no doctor but I think elevated GAMMA-GT is a more worrisome number then elevated AST or elevated ALT. I'd like to know more if anyone has any info.Originally Posted by MarcusG
Gamma-glutamyltransferase is markedly increased in lesions which cause intrahepatic or extrahepatic obstruction of bile ducts, including parenchymatous liver diseases with a major cholestatic component (e.g., cholestatic hepatitis). Lesser elevations of gamma-GT are seen in other liver diseases, and in infectious mononucleosis, hyperthyroidism, myotonic dystrophy, and after renal allograft. Drugs causing hepatocellular damage and cholestasis may also cause gamma-GT elevation (see under "Total bilirubin," below).
Gamma-GT is a very sensitive test for liver damage, and unexpected, unexplained mild elevations are common. Alcohol consumption is a common culprit.
Decreased gamma-GT is not clinically significant.
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