Mixing Prohormones and Anabolics
- 06-05-2009, 01:16 PM
Mixing Prohormones and Anabolics
A Couple weeks ago I started running Tren 19-Nor (which is 19-norandrosta-4,9-diene-3,17-dione) I've been running 120mg per day which has worked quite nicely, with no noticable sides. In conjunction with this I am taking Himalaya Livercare, but no milk thistle, because I am on a mild benzo dose (bad combo). Also I take 6-oxo and my own version of ZMA (actually zinc orotate and magnesium taurate...my favorite zinc salt and mag ester) at bedtime.
I am planning to run this cycle for 8 weeks followed by some 95% divanil and Reversitol for 4 weeks. If I were to run an anabolic such dianabol (~30 mg/day) as a mid-cycle add-on (weeks 2-6 of the 19-Nor cycle), do I need to worry about a true SERM when all is said and done?
- 06-05-2009, 02:37 PM
- 06-05-2009, 02:58 PM
06-05-2009, 03:18 PM
06-05-2009, 03:34 PM
06-05-2009, 03:34 PM
hmm, let me see if I got the right... you're running a cycle for 8 weeks and currently doing tren at 120mg, you want to add dbol and you're worry about a true SERM? You've got to be joking, right? If I was you I would be worried to!! You should always have a SERM on hand in case things go wrong when running any compound.
From seeing your stats how old are you? why do you need to take so much juice? is this your first cycle? inquiring minds want to know!
06-05-2009, 05:55 PM
06-05-2009, 06:11 PM
i knew my question wud warrant such responses. I have a true SERM on hand, however, I am planning on tapering off the dbol, upping the 6-oxo and adding in some free-t boosters until I complete the last two weeks of the Dienolone precursor. After that i'd like to run a 4 week OTC SERM cycle. I'd personally like to see if the free-t boosters, increased AI and Tren 19-Nor keep the post-cycle drop-off of Dbol @ bay.
does anyone know for sure this will be a crash and burn?
06-05-2009, 06:20 PM
06-05-2009, 06:23 PM
06-05-2009, 06:27 PM
06-05-2009, 06:30 PM
Use a SERM, don't **** around.
edit: i like clomid! x3 for that... can replace a serm IMO, but not a bad idea to stack them
And what's up with your bodyweight. Bulk son. Eat.
06-05-2009, 06:37 PM
i have a sick metabolism...i eat like a horse, but only now with the 19-Nor have I been translating that into lean, dry mass...b4 i would gain the weight, but it would go to my gut for a few daes and say so-long in a violent fashion (poor toilet did not even see it coming) On another note, I do have the clomid on hand, but i think i might gamble a day or two for the sake of research. haha, much appreciation guys...ill let u know how things progress...gained 8 lbs solid in the first week...skys the limit. =)
06-05-2009, 06:43 PM
06-05-2009, 06:55 PM
Haha. That's funny. Anyway I see a lot of people that say they have a fast metabolism and eat like a horse, and when prompted to post their diets they won't respond, and if they do it's never enough food. Can't gain weight? Eat more. As long as you're not gaining fat, eat more. That's all there is to it.
06-05-2009, 06:58 PM
06-05-2009, 07:16 PM
06-05-2009, 08:05 PM
wow...thanks for practically sucking eachother off in my presence instead of actually being open-minded nd useful human beings...pfft juice heads...once again ill post my progress neway just so u guys can suck eachother off in my honor again
06-06-2009, 12:03 AM
5'9" 147 lbs
Once you have drunk all you can,
Drink some more.
Aim for a gallon a day.
I'm about the same height as you and got up to 290lbs by drinking two gallons a day.
Also, Squat Bench and Deadlift.
06-06-2009, 12:22 AM
"why the neg!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!im just messing with these idiots at AM i dont even like this forum everbody is so dum"
Sounds like he is 14?!
06-06-2009, 12:39 AM
"i eat like a horse" - no, you don't. you eat like a 147 pounder with a fast metabolism. 95% of guys seem to claim to "eat like a horse", but unless i see it with my own eyes i never believe it. post your diet
"with the tren im gaining so well" no ****, it's a steroid buddy. you are going to lose all your gains within 1 month of coming off if you don't learn how to eat correctly. every pound you gain is more calories you need to consume just to MAINTAIN that weight. think about it. if you couldn't gani weight without steroids you have ZERO chance of keeping what you gain.
taking more steroids now = more harm to your health done, for absolutely no reason, because you are probably going to lose 90+% of your gains anyway.
06-06-2009, 12:40 AM
Also, prohormones = anabolics. And my advice is to use the SERM you claim to have, stop taking the tren and learn how to gain naturally, THEN take something
06-06-2009, 01:45 AM
yea, that was one of these genius' jokes, not something i actually said...im 21
secondly, i appreciate the tips, but ive heard it for years and get roughly 6000-7000 calories in a day...i kno i can eat more and i should up the bar, but with work, expenses, and the ****ty paycheck i get, its just not feasible
as for my health, i get more bloodwork and other tests done regularly since i was about...well...14 haha. With all the dietary supplements i take, less the anabolics, people usually accuse me of being too health-conscious.
finally, lector and screwtape...i appreciate u acting like adults, although ive heard what u suggested from others before, they are valid, useful suggestions nonetheless
ps: does it piss ne one else off that they like to call everything tren nowadays, no matter what the target hormone is? i mean i remember the phase where everyone was bat-**** crazy over the real **** (of course then i was 14), but that day has long-since gone
06-06-2009, 02:29 AM
I am 160 atm, definitely a faster metabolism cuz if I do alot of cardio gains are impossible(getting cut is easy, but bulking like I am doing is hard). But I am currently up 11 pounds in 1 month of bulking naturally from 150 to 161-162.
You either dont know how to train at all,have a serious medical issue, or accidentally are adding an extra 0 to the number of calories you are eating.
I am basically getting 2500-3000 and can put on weight. As long as I cut running and allow some midsection build up temporarily.
06-06-2009, 12:50 PM
Think about it this way: let's say your maintenance cals @ 147 is actually 6-7k per day. If you eat more than that you'll gain weight, less you'll lose it, right? Say tren/dbol/whatever helps you get to 160. Add another x cals (500 or so) to your maintenance, at least. If you don't eat MORE than you're already eating (which you aren't doing, otherwise you would have gained weight naturally) then you will just go back down to 147!
06-06-2009, 03:04 PM
06-06-2009, 04:02 PM
06-06-2009, 04:20 PM
you know in all honesty im not concerned too much about numbers...my biggest concern is getting some meat on my legs and midsection...i find myself getting stronger in my arms and chest, but my frame is still small, so it gets tough to keep good form with higher weight. i love upright rowing and my deltoids are proof of such, but i hit a wall once in a while just because i can't keep my legs from shaking under the pressure. However, i am doing a lot more dumbells to work on my stablizer muscles and im gonna kill on my leg days, as i did today. Im gonna go knock down some black bean nachos right now, but im gonna start a diet log soon. thanx again guys.
06-06-2009, 05:47 PM
06-06-2009, 05:51 PM
Truly doubt he is getting in 7k calories... Let's see a diet
PM me with any order questions and concerns
06-06-2009, 05:58 PM
06-07-2009, 02:23 PM
06-08-2009, 09:07 AM
Here it is...
ratio is protein grams:carb grams:fat grams and approximate
breakfast - 1200 cals 2:3:1
intra-workout - 100 cals
post workout/mid-day shake - 600 cals 2:1
lunch - 1000 cals 1:2:2
dinner - 800 cals 1:2:2
after-dinner shake - 600 cals 2:1:1
snacks throughout the day (bars, yogurt, vegies, fruit)- 2000 cals 2:2:1
So my total is 6300 cals/day; however, i'd say my true range is 5500 to 6500.
Average is about 6000 cals/day.
I'm glad you guys actually pushed me to do this...its quite tedious, but now imma keep a closer watch on it.
I'm likeing the results of this cycle thus far. I've gained some dry mass, some strength, and my sleep cycle is regulated almost down to the minute. Overall, I feel comfortable with this cycle, because i'm seeing steady results, but nothing flashy. I got some nasty back and shoulder pumps, but with the addition of some systematic enzymes and b vitamins, im good to go.
A couple additions that I think could help me is some waximaize for added, easy carbs and some cassein before bed.
06-08-2009, 09:39 PM
1. Eat like a horse for REAL, 250 grams of protein a day MIN. complex carbs, potatoes, oatmeal, brown rice, no white bread or fast food, it only fills you up with junk when you could be full of goodness(no homo).
2. Lift heavy. Monday Heavy bench, low reps. pull-ups, weighted if possible.
Tuesday off, rest, sleep a ton! like 8-10 hours a day!
Wednesday Squats, good form, ask around the gym, make SURE you do them right, don't f-up your back. As many squats as possible!
Thursday rest, REST!!! Don't have an arm day, don't do serpentine curls and arnold presses for definition, you're not there yet, Eat and rest!
Friday, Dead lift! ask around, use proper form, don't f-up you're back. Do it till you puke! (not really, puking really messes up your stomach's balance of acid, and all that food is soo precious, f-it PUKE!).weekends-party, you're not a gym rat yet.
3. Don't do steroids! (yet) OR I'LL COME FIND YOU AND BLISTER YOUR ASS!
06-08-2009, 10:18 PM
^ That was a funny post. True but funny. IMO, he could get away with a little more training than that. The best shape i've ever been in (highest body weight and lowest body fat%) was when I played basketball in highschool and we lifted weights 3 days a week and ran on the track everyday.
Then again what do I know, I'm 20lbs under my target weight right now too; maybe I need to take this advice.
06-08-2009, 10:24 PM
yea i do way too much arms and not enough core-building...i got used to seeing great gains wit my arms, so i neglected the rest. On a positive note I have been deadlifting and now squating more. The weight that ive gained over the past two weeks has gone mainly to my legs and a lil to my arms.
i also have an over-training issue...i am a gym rat...im there 5-6 days a week...i need to work on recovery time. Once again thanks guys for all your insight.
06-09-2009, 04:26 AM
I'd worry about my liver if I were you. 8 weeks of Tren 19-nor orals at 120 mg plus 4 weeks of Dianabol without any milk thistle? Plus Benzo is liver-toxic itself, so you are really putting a stress on your system. You're 21, it wouldn't surprise me if you are drinking on the weekends as well.
06-09-2009, 04:50 AM
06-09-2009, 11:09 AM
As far as training...
day one is arms and back
day two is chest and usually some triceps (which i need to chill with)
day three legs and some back
day four and rarely five...rest
...rinse and repeat
i also have a habit of going at like 10 after work and doing some circuit training, when I already worked out in the morning and am going to the next morning
my boss at work thinks i should do an 11-oxo bridge, which seems to make sense. I mean dbol has been shown to keep cort at bay. I've read mixed reviews on 11-oxo standalone, but everyone seems to like this whole bridging thing. Any ideas?
06-09-2009, 11:13 AM
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