Looking For a 15-20lbs gain

[FiReFiGhTeR]

Well, I'm definetely new to this forum and i'm sure this is posted by many newbies, but I have some questions.
I'm 21 years old, 6' about 170lbs. Ive been steadily working out since high school. I have reached a plateau in size gains doing everything "naturally". So I have been doing some serious research on steroids and PH. I'm looking to gain about 15 or so lbs. Ive been looking at compounds suck as Epistane, Havoc, H-Drol, M-drol, 3-AD, Methyl 1-d, and those types of compounds. I just was looking for advise from you guys about what to stack with, as far as cycle support and PCT. Since this will be my first Steroid/PH use i wasn't looking at getting into the most POTENT stuff, but looking at getting started with a medium gain. So any advise would be GREAT.

Also, After your first cycle, will you lose your size/strength gains if you do not continue using, but do continue hitting the weights..... Wasn't sure..


Thanks

 

[crazyfool405]

post diet and training lets see if we can get u up a little more naturally before you take the dive.

 

[UnrealMachine]

x2 Crazy. A 6'0 frame has a lot more room for natural progress.

Unless you're some kind of ridiculous ectomorph, a 3500-4K diet will add mass with proper lifting.

 

[Nick26]

Yeah, I think you could get more gains naturally first. Your only 21, you should have plenty of natural test pumping. Also 15-20 pounds is quite a bit to expect from a PH. Probably what you think is your plateau is lack of Calories, Carbs, Protein, etc. Post a sample of your diet.

 

[FiReFiGhTeR]

well the thing is i eat like 3000 calories a day, and I hit the weights at the least 4 times a week for an hour or 2. I went to a nutritionist and he just said i have a ridiculously fast metabolism. I mean ive come along way from what i used to be in high school. Ive played baseball all my life as a shortstop.. so never had a need to get "big". I was weighing 135lbs out of high school... and now i fluctuate from 170 to 180. Im taking in on average about 150-200g of protein a day... so I don't know what to turn to other than Steroids or PHs.

 

[nosnmiveins]

well the thing is i eat like 3000 calories a day, and I hit the weights at the least 4 times a week for an hour or 2. I went to a nutritionist and he just said i have a ridiculously fast metabolism. I mean ive come along way from what i used to be in high school. Ive played baseball all my life as a shortstop.. so never had a need to get "big". I was weighing 135lbs out of high school... and now i fluctuate from 170 to 180. Im taking in on average about 150-200g of protein a day... so I don't know what to turn to other than Steroids or PHs.

what do ur daily meals look like?

 

[Cub]

well the thing is i eat like 3000 calories a day, and I hit the weights at the least 4 times a week for an hour or 2. I went to a nutritionist and he just said i have a ridiculously fast metabolism. I mean ive come along way from what i used to be in high school. Ive played baseball all my life as a shortstop.. so never had a need to get "big". I was weighing 135lbs out of high school... and now i fluctuate from 170 to 180. Im taking in on average about 150-200g of protein a day... so I don't know what to turn to other than Steroids or PHs.

I consume more calories on a cut. DOUBLE your intake.

 

[repmks]

first cycle i reccomend 12-15 weeks of test 250-500mg/wk any blend/ester. 170 at 6 is scawny though. you should be able get to 200-210 without a problem naturally.

 

[FiReFiGhTeR]

i don't have a specific diet, But for breakfast im usaually eating about 5 or 6 egg whites with some sort of red or white meat... steak... chicken.. whatever. Lunch, I'm either eating like 3 or 4 cans of Tuna, or grilled chicken with some veges of some sort. Dinner is always a mix up. I eat Grilleed chicken and steak like its going out of style. A normal dinner consist of 2 or 3 chicken breast with some veges, pasta, whatever. I'm kind of a health freak so i am always eatin healthy. But also I drink a protein shake when i wake up, after my workout (which usually sometime right after lunch) then one later on in the afternoon.

I could use a good work out plan. I just got done with one a Friend, who is a PT, made for me. And now im just doing the basic mass gain workout, Low rep-LOTS of weight. and im pushing some pretty heavy weight for my size. I usaully working a muscle group a day. Like chest/shoudlers or chest/tris, bis/tris or bis/back.... you get what im saying.. i like to run also.. im usually runnin about 2 or 3 miles a day. And also i work my abs usually 3 times a week, can't loose my 6 pack!!!!

But thats basically it without going into crazy detail...

 

[Nick26]

Well I am running Epistane right now to see how it works but its to early to give any advice/results. I am running it like this:
Week 1: 30/aday
Week 2: 30/aday
Week 3: 40/aday
Week 4: 40/aday

Support Supplements:
Milk Thistle
Mens Vitamin

PCT:
Just A little OTC Test Booster.

I think for a first cycle running Test E, C, or P isnt a good idea just because thats alot to get into right away, with the injections and what not. Thats just my opinion. Just try out 4 weeks of Epistane or Havoc and see how it goes. Workout harder than ever and eat more than ever. GOOD LUCK.

 

[DLM5]

<You need at least 1.5 grams of protein per pound of your body weight as a rule.. so the 150- 200 grams a day your doing isn't cutting it at 170 pounds.. If you want to weigh 190 then you should eat like your a 190lbs.. 190lbs at 1.5 grams per pound, means you need 285 grams of protein to put mass on seriously.. along with that increase the carbs, fats and total calories need to go up..
< you listed breakfast lunch and dinner.. to gain mass you should be eating 7 times a day.. every 2.5 hrs or so..
< you need to cut back the cardio
< to put serious mass on as quick as you can, will put a little fat on you.. it's how it goes..
< choose to eat big to get big, or don't.. I haven't made the choice to eat big and I'm not very big.. I've choose to stay lean, quick, and I'm hella strong for my size..
< i think most guys would tell you that if you do go "on".. well then you'd better be prepared to eat big or it's sorta pointless to go "on"..

 

[monsterbox]

simple.

Eat until you start loosing your six pack.

AND/OR

CUT BACK ON YOUR RUNNING.


If you are eating enough to get some fat with your "high" metabolism you will gain weight.....you may need to be willing to loose your bottom 2 abs for some muscle for a while, then cut.



Too high of a metabolism to gain weight is a B.S. brological misunderstanding. It simply means you have to each much more than you would normally assume.



I was stuck at 140lbs in high school. I worked out 5 days/week. Drank 3 protein shakes/day. Ran 3 miles every 3 days. And ate low carb, high protein diet. I was ripped as f*ck...like 4% BF.

Then I finally woke the hell up and just starting eating like a dirty motherf*cker when I first got to college. I gained some minor love handles and bumped up to about 12-13% BF and lost those bottom two abs and definition/veins. However, I gained 20lbs with 15lbs probably being LBM just from stuffing my face with everything in sight naturally, it was like a miracle. Between then and now I've been working on stuffing myself and minimizing that fat gainage while using a few quick orals.

***dont be afraid to gain some fat, its perfectly normal and its worth the hugeness/pumps from the carb loading. And it will be relatively easy to loose because you will then have alot more muscle and even faster metabolism...so when you cut back calories you'll drop it like its hot. Being a "hardgainer" has its advantages!

 

[MSE]

i don't have a specific diet, But for breakfast im usaually eating about 5 or 6 egg whites with some sort of red or white meat... steak... chicken.. whatever. Lunch, I'm either eating like 3 or 4 cans of Tuna, or grilled chicken with some veges of some sort. Dinner is always a mix up. I eat Grilleed chicken and steak like its going out of style. A normal dinner consist of 2 or 3 chicken breast with some veges, pasta, whatever. I'm kind of a health freak so i am always eatin healthy. But also I drink a protein shake when i wake up, after my workout (which usually sometime right after lunch) then one later on in the afternoon.

I could use a good work out plan. I just got done with one a Friend, who is a PT, made for me. And now im just doing the basic mass gain workout, Low rep-LOTS of weight. and im pushing some pretty heavy weight for my size. I usaully working a muscle group a day. Like chest/shoudlers or chest/tris, bis/tris or bis/back.... you get what im saying.. i like to run also.. im usually runnin about 2 or 3 miles a day. And also i work my abs usually 3 times a week, can't loose my 6 pack!!!!

But thats basically it without going into crazy detail...

First off, if you are going to go to a cycle you need to have your diet down exact, and yours isn't. Also, the diet you listed sounds as a weird cutting diet, the only carbs I see there are some pasta with dinner. If you really are eating 3-4 cans of tuna at one sitting or 2-3 chicken breasts, why? At approx 40 grams of protein per can 4(40) = 160g of protein at one sitting! Sorry man but you really need to spread those meals out during the duration of the day. Also, you are doing too much cardio for the amount of calories you are eating to gain any real size. I think you have two choices, the first being eat more and keep up your cardio. The second being stop the cardio all together and maybe eat more. But I do not think you are ready for a cycle of anything at your age and your body frame.

 

[crazyfool405]

post your diet in a format we can under stans


meal 1 8am.....
meal 2 11am...

ect

or use the diet tracker that AM has and see how many calories you really are consuming.

 

[ffmedic32]

well the thing is i eat like 3000 calories a day, and I hit the weights at the least 4 times a week for an hour or 2. I went to a nutritionist and he just said i have a ridiculously fast metabolism. I mean ive come along way from what i used to be in high school. Ive played baseball all my life as a shortstop.. so never had a need to get "big". I was weighing 135lbs out of high school... and now i fluctuate from 170 to 180. Im taking in on average about 150-200g of protein a day... so I don't know what to turn to other than Steroids or PHs.

Dont know where to turn at 21 years old and 6 foot 170#. Dude are you serious?
Take a good look at your diet and get it in check FIRST. Get yourself over 200 and wait a few years before you take the plunge to the darkside. This is just my opinion.
I am 5'10'' at about 200 and 30 y/o and just started my first cycle of Havoc. I am loggin it if ya wanna check it out.

Where ya a firefighter at?

 

[CHAPS]

well the thing is i eat like 3000 calories a day, and I hit the weights at the least 4 times a week for an hour or 2. I went to a nutritionist and he just said i have a ridiculously fast metabolism. I mean ive come along way from what i used to be in high school. Ive played baseball all my life as a shortstop.. so never had a need to get "big". I was weighing 135lbs out of high school... and now i fluctuate from 170 to 180. Im taking in on average about 150-200g of protein a day... so I don't know what to turn to other than Steroids or PHs.

I've already heard enough to know your not ready for steroids/prohormones. You need to master your diet, see how many calories your body needs to maintain and grow. Get yourself a journal and log everything you eat, you may THINK your eating 3000 calories but you could be eating wayyyyyyyy less. If it turns out you are eating 3000 then maybe your need 4000 maybe even more. The point is steroids won't help without the proper raw materials for growth (food), if anything you have to eat MORE when you use steroids. Make it to 200lbs naturally then possibly look into steriods. I swear to you though it's 90% eating, alot of guys don't get this, whether it's getting leaner or bigger it's all in what you put in your mouth.

 

[MSE]

I've already heard enough to know your not ready for steroids/prohormones. You need to master your diet, see how many calories your body needs to maintain and grow. Get yourself a journal and log everything you eat, you may THINK your eating 3000 calories but you could be eating wayyyyyyyy less. If it turns out you are eating 3000 then maybe your need 4000 maybe even more. The point is steroids won't help without the proper raw materials for growth (food), if anything you have to eat MORE when you use steroids. Make it to 200lbs naturally then possibly look into steriods. I swear to you though it's 90% eating, alot of guys don't get this, whether it's getting leaner or bigger it's all in what you put in your mouth.

"I swear to you though it's 90% eating, alot of guys don't get this, whether it's getting leaner or bigger it's all in what you put in your mouth."
Nicely put....

 

[EasyEJL]

diet diet diet diet

steroids aren't magic pills that make you grow. All they do is help make muscles grow faster than they normally would on just your own testosterone. That doesn't mean your body can create muscle from thin air, it still needs to be fueled. If you aren't eating enough today to be gaining weight naturally, not only will you not gain a significant amount on cycle, but also whatever you gain you will loose afterwards.

Add more carbs to your diet, fruits are an ok choice, oatmeal or quinoa are better.

 

[Paid Benefit]

I consume more calories on a cut. DOUBLE your intake.

Very off topic but I found this comment to be the funniest thing. I laughed so hard. :notworthy:

But up your calories, protein, carbs, and lift hard. You can still grow naturally. I've been where you are, I thought I hit flat ground as well, but the gains were just a lot slower because I already put on decent mass. So I just ate a ton more and upped everything and the gains started coming back.

Lift hard, eat hard, get hard gains. Thats a recipe for success bro. Keep it up.

 

[freqfly]

Already been said multiple times, but here it is again. Eat eat eat eat. 6' @ 170lbs = MUCH more natural gaining potential before steroids are considered. No need to take a shortcut when you have much more room to grow just by getting your diet and training in 100% check.

 

[Cellardude]

simple.

Eat until you start loosing your six pack.

AND/OR

CUT BACK ON YOUR RUNNING.


If you are eating enough to get some fat with your "high" metabolism you will gain weight.....you may need to be willing to loose your bottom 2 abs for some muscle for a while, then cut.



Too high of a metabolism to gain weight is a B.S. brological misunderstanding. It simply means you have to each much more than you would normally assume.



I was stuck at 140lbs in high school. I worked out 5 days/week. Drank 3 protein shakes/day. Ran 3 miles every 3 days. And ate low carb, high protein diet. I was ripped as f*ck...like 4% BF.

Then I finally woke the hell up and just starting eating like a dirty motherf*cker when I first got to college. I gained some minor love handles and bumped up to about 12-13% BF and lost those bottom two abs and definition/veins. However, I gained 20lbs with 15lbs probably being LBM just from stuffing my face with everything in sight naturally, it was like a miracle. Between then and now I've been working on stuffing myself and minimizing that fat gainage while using a few quick orals.

***dont be afraid to gain some fat, its perfectly normal and its worth the hugeness/pumps from the carb loading. And it will be relatively easy to loose because you will then have alot more muscle and even faster metabolism...so when you cut back calories you'll drop it like its hot. Being a "hardgainer" has its advantages!

word. too many people are concerned about their 6 pack abs while trying to add some lean mass.

 

[monsterbox]

word. too many people are concerned about their 6 pack abs while trying to add some lean mass.

everyone like, "gotta keep my six pack"

its as if they've never heard of bulk and cutting. Theres a reason for the two phases

 

[ibanezman08]

make sure you know exactly how many calories you're consuming

i weigh 178lbs as of recently and i consume 5000 calories a day to bulk up. i gain very little fat because i eat healthy.

if i went by the book and stuck to 18x my bodyweight for calories, i would never grow.

 

[FiReFiGhTeR]

ok ok ok .... HA

Dont know where to turn at 21 years old and 6 foot 170#. Dude are you serious?
Take a good look at your diet and get it in check FIRST. Get yourself over 200 and wait a few years before you take the plunge to the darkside. This is just my opinion.
I am 5'10'' at about 200 and 30 y/o and just started my first cycle of Havoc. I am loggin it if ya wanna check it out.

Where ya a firefighter at?

I work For Clayton county, Ga. A town just south of Atlanta. run on average about 30,000,-40,000 calls a year. Just a good ol' fire/medic for now.

But thanks for all the advise. I definitely know my diet is SHIOT, and will take all of yalls advise and step it up about 100 notches in that aspect. Believe it or not, I'm actually pretty knowledgeable when it comes to health and nutrition, just not in the "bulking" area. So ill kill the protein, create and log a new, KILLER, diet, and stay away from the "darkside" for now. I'll put some pics/progress up later on and let you all know how it goes. I'd like to be 190-200 by summer.. around june or july. Thanks again.


:thumbsup:

 

[monsterbox]

actually, in my opinion you need to eat much more, but you could enter the dark side a little bit to get your feet wet while testing your new diet.

You could use a non-methyl like 3ad or 11oxo, or maybe even bump up to H-drol. This should help you keep the fat off while you work on your diet so you can concentrate on eating huge.

 

[nosnmiveins]

but you could enter the dark side a little bit to get your feet wet while testing your new diet..

no such thing, go big or get the f uck out (not being serious, just a personal saying)

 

[Moyer]

Like others said, at 6' 170lbs you are not even remotely close to your natural potential. It's not my place to say when you should or shouldn't start using prohormones, but I can say one thing for sure. If you don't learn to eat more, you will shrink back down to 170 shortly after your cycle. ANYONE can gain weight, it just takes calories.

I'm not just regurgitating message board bs here. I've walked in your shoes. I was 6'2" 155lbs when I graduated high school, and only 170lbs when I was 21. Today I'm at 215lbs and still gaining fairly easily.

It sounds like you're trying hard to get enough protein (good), but I don't see much mention of fat/carbs or total calories. Do you have lactose intolerance? Milk is by far the easiest way to help meet your calorie and protein needs. I strongly recommend adding a lot of it to your diet, up to a gallon a day of whole milk. Maybe you think this is extreme. You probably think it'll make you fat, right? I used to think the same thing before I tried it. Now I'm a believer. At a minimum you should be gaining at least 2-3lbs/month. At your weight you may be able to put on as much as 6lbs/month or more without adding much fat. And if by some miracle you're actually able to eat so much that you start gaining fat, you don't have to worry about it happening all at once. You'll see your abs slowly starting to fade over a period of several weeks. Wait until then before you worry about cutting anything out of your diet.

As far as a lifting program, look around for a workout called Starting Strength by Mark Rippetoe. I highly recommend just ordering the book, but the basics are easily available online. It's by far the best program I've ever tried and it's perfect for anyone trying to gain weight and serious muscle.

Reading back through my post I realize it almost sounds like an infomercial. All I can say is it's been a night & day difference since I switched. I had been doing a "bodybuilder" style workout with lots of different exercises, practically obsessed with counting calories and eating "clean". Looking back it's actually funny how easy building muscle can be.

 

[animaleater2]

It's unanimous! You need to eat a shitload more than you are.