Why are longer cycles said to be better?

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    Why are longer cycles said to be better?


    I'm wondering why most cycles, (for example 1-T + 4-AD) are recommended at a minimum of 4 weeks? I've read that the PH's don't "kick in" until weeks 3-5, but is that just when people start noticing it's doing its job, or is there a physiological reason that the effects would ramp up?

    One reason I ask is that I've also read that it takes about 10 days for the testes to start shutting down in the prescence of exgenous testosterone. And that one of the major post-cycle problems is that the testes aren't capable of producing pre-cycle levels of testosterone, even with Nolva, Clomid, or what-have-you, because of atrophy. (Hence the HCG use at the end of AAS stacks, then the clomid/nolva.)

    So it makes me wonder if the conservative, and some would say ineffective, 2 weeks on, 2weeks off routine isn't the best way to go. Sure, the gains would seem slower. But if you are getting the benefit of the PH's, with diminished post-cycle problems, wouldn't that be far better in the long run?

    Please comment. I don't understand the mechanisms all that well, and I know most of you are very well informed, as well as experienced.

    Thanks.

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    I have done several PH cycles of mainly 1 test & 4ad. I never really noticed much of anything for gains until the 3rd week. You will look a little harder & gain a couple pounds weeks 1-2, but the real changes take effect in weeks 3-6 for me at least. I don't notice any shutdown or libido loss until the 3rd week either. For me to stop at 2 weeks, would be usless IMO. People respond differently to PHs, maybe you will see gains sooner than me. I also notice that gains slow past 6 weeks.

    Methyl 1-test is different. gains are said to be almost immediate & great gains can be made in only 2 weeks, that's why everyone is cycling 2-on, 2-off.
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    Originally posted by Zim
    I'm wondering why most cycles, (for example 1-T + 4-AD) are recommended at a minimum of 4 weeks? I've read that the PH's don't "kick in" until weeks 3-5, but is that just when people start noticing it's doing its job, or is there a physiological reason that the effects would ramp up?
    Actually, the psychological effects often come on before the massive physical effects (partially due to the placebo effect i'm sure).


    One reason I ask is that I've also read that it takes about 10 days for the testes to start shutting down in the prescence of exgenous testosterone. And that one of the major post-cycle problems is that the testes aren't capable of producing pre-cycle levels of testosterone, even with Nolva, Clomid, or what-have-you, because of atrophy. (Hence the HCG use at the end of AAS stacks, then the clomid/nolva.)
    This is why we do post-cycle, to bring the testes back to full functionality. In most cases, cycles under 8 weeks don't require HCG to reverse testicular atrophy, because it isn't extreme at that point. Nolva alone can often do the job. ALthough I prefer to combine nolva and clomid during post cycle.

    So it makes me wonder if the conservative, and some would say ineffective, 2 weeks on, 2weeks off routine isn't the best way to go. Sure, the gains would seem slower. But if you are getting the benefit of the PH's, with diminished post-cycle problems, wouldn't that be far better in the long run?
    This paragraph confuses me. At first you seem to knock the 2 week on 2 week off method, but then you talk about how they can benefit with less harsh shutdown. I personally am a fan of 4 week cycles at a minimum, but the 2 on 2 off has been shown to give solid gains when bulking, but I feel that these really short cycles are better for cutting.


    Please comment. I don't understand the mechanisms all that well, and I know most of you are very well informed, as well as experienced.

    Thanks.
    There ya have it! My 2cc

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    Thanks for clearing that up for me. I'll try a four week for my next cycle. I did an eight week cycle of TrenX a couple of years ago. The best post-cycle that was legal was ZMA, and so I lost all the gains, if not a little more. Since then, I've done a few 4-ad & 1-test cycles, the more recent with 6-oxo post. But only for 2-3 weeks. That seemed to work well, as I gained on the cycle, and even gained during recovery.

    Now that there are liquid post-cycle meds available, I was wondering if it was time to try a longer cycle. I'm more interested in the long haul than getting huge for next summer or whatnot, so I try not to overdo things I may regret.

    Anyway, thanks again for the responses!
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    Originally posted by Zim
    Thanks for clearing that up for me. I'll try a four week for my next cycle. I did an eight week cycle of TrenX a couple of years ago. The best post-cycle that was legal was ZMA, and so I lost all the gains, if not a little more. Since then, I've done a few 4-ad & 1-test cycles, the more recent with 6-oxo post. But only for 2-3 weeks. That seemed to work well, as I gained on the cycle, and even gained during recovery.

    Now that there are liquid post-cycle meds available, I was wondering if it was time to try a longer cycle. I'm more interested in the long haul than getting huge for next summer or whatnot, so I try not to overdo things I may regret.

    Anyway, thanks again for the responses!
    why not just try a real gear cycle?
    less money better results than PHs.
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    The only reason I don't use real gear is that I don't really know how to get it safely. As far as I'm concerned PH's are just watered down steroids with more hassles and less results. But they're legal, and I know what I'm getting.
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    I feel you on that bro that it's hard to get ...I can see the benefits in PHs but it just seems like it's more expensive for weaker results.......
    you pay all that money for an oral or transdermal cycle that only lasts about 2-3 weeks with minimal absorption and efficacy of the PH.
    but if you are getting good results then GREAT.
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    Originally posted by BMZ
    I feel you on that bro that it's hard to get ...I can see the benefits in PHs but it just seems like it's more expensive for weaker results.......
    you pay all that money for an oral or transdermal cycle that only lasts about 2-3 weeks with minimal absorption and efficacy of the PH.
    but if you are getting good results then GREAT.
    Sometimes people don't want to risk their families or loved ones livelyhood by going to jail.

    Prohormones and prosteroids can be taken intramuscularly with great effects, although delivery dosn't matter much, blood levels do.

    It really dosn't cost much to throw together an injectable 1-test cyp cycle or methyl-1-test or both. Infact you can get comparable gains to cost ratios if you compare with standard black market prices.
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    interesting...
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    I have done two cycles of 1-ad, and 4-ad, (oral). The first was 6 weeks. I gained about 7 pounds, good strenght gains, but I lost almost all weight and only some strength. After reading a thread similar to this one about short cycles, I went with a 3 week cycle the second go around. Although I made big gains in my third and final week, I stopped as orginally planned. That was two weeks ago. My bench and overall strength has continued to go up, not down. Also sides much less. While the lethargy was kicking in about week 3, since I was stopping then, it didnt last long. I feel for me that shorter cycle worked best, however like I said I have only done 2 total, so I am not the most experienced when it comes to PH's.
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    quite interesting. personlly when i do my frist cycle im going to try a 4 to 6 week cycle of 4-ad and 1-test then followed by pct
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    >Sometimes people don't want to risk their families or loved ones livelyhood
    >by going to jail.

    maybe you could take the family on a 6 week vacation to brazil or mexico, somewhere near a gym and drug store.
  

  
 

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