Mark Mcgwire

[TipTopShape]

So with his recent interview, he finally admits to using steroids and HGH. Do yo think he will ever git into the hall now ?

 

[Harry Manback]

Regardless, there will always be a place for the Bash Brothers in my heart.

 

[texaswolf]

Nope.

 

[AE14]

Here belongs in the hall, as do most of the others. I cant imagine how guys like ARod and Manny(on the list) wont get into the hall. Its so silly. You take the best from the era and they are in. However, it just goes to show what a joke the ahll is these days. Andre Dawson? Really?

It should be voted on by actual players and retired players, not the writers. Guys like Albert Belle (a known jacka$$) who's numbers are hall worthy, wont get a sniff because he was not nice to the writers? Friggin ridiculous

 

[ax1]

oh, common, does he really think the public and baseball fans are stupid?

his best years were on steroids, and you are telling me that if babe ruth did not take roids later in his career he could not have him more home runs?

i thought there was going to be something good about this, but this is a selfish and cowardly act on his part to try to authenticate his records by denying performance enhancing drugs having anything to do with performance.

yeah he is great, even if clean but he became beyond great on roids, just be honest with us,

i lost more respect for him now that he came out and tried to deceive people.

 

[Fastone]

Here belongs in the hall, as do most of the others. I cant imagine how guys like ARod and Manny(on the list) wont get into the hall. Its so silly. You take the best from the era and they are in. However, it just goes to show what a joke the ahll is these days. Andre Dawson? Really?

It should be voted on by actual players and retired players, not the writers. Guys like Albert Belle (a known jacka$$) who's numbers are hall worthy, wont get a sniff because he was not nice to the writers? Friggin ridiculous

I agree,The Hall of Fame is full of "cheaters" for various reasons. I once again say that between grandstanding congressmen and the press this has turned into a complete farce. Baseball knew what was going on for a long time and did nothing. I still say the HR race between Mcgwire and Sosa saved baseballs ass, they probably knew then, why wasn't something done then.

 

[n8te]

I don't think he should be in.

The way I view sports is that athletes are professional because they have God given abilities that others don't. When they start to get older then they should retire, but don't cheat. It would be different if these were not banned substances and they used them before they were banned, but they didn't. They knew they were breaking the rules. So no, Mcgwire should not be in the hall. He has joined the ranks of Pete Rose in my opinion.

If they decide to take them after they are out of the sport then I don't care, and I wouldn't have a problem with that at all.

 

[hardknock]

I don't think he should be in.

The way I view sports is that athletes are professional because they have God given abilities that others don't. When they start to get older then they should retire, but don't cheat. It would be different if these were not banned substances and they used them before they were banned, but they didn't. They knew they were breaking the rules. So no, Mcgwire should not be in the hall. He has joined the ranks of Pete Rose in my opinion.

If they decide to take them after they are out of the sport then I don't care, and I wouldn't have a problem with that at all.

How is it any difference if it was an illegal substance or not?

That is what i do not understand about people's direction on this. If it was illegal then it was wrong but if it was a legal substance (albeit, a real steroid) then it is ok?

It's still performance enhancing regardless of legality. Just because some paper on congresses desk states "this is a controlled substance" two weeks from now, does not mean it isn't unethical to use it 2 weeks before it becomes illegal. It's still cheating no matter the what.

Thing is, I never had him going to the hof any way in my books. He was a one dimensional player, a slugger, that was it. If he was a pitcher and a one dimensional (only had a lot of strike outs or only won games because of great savers) player, i wouldn't give him a pass into the hof either.

If Randy had not won a championship, then IMO, his career would have been null. The way I see it is that you either got to have a major impact on your team and keep them relevant during your playing years, when you are supposed to be good or win championships. I.e. barry sanders, he never won a championship, but several years he kept them relevant, hoffer...

Damn, Stacy King, played with the Bulls and won 3 rings, no damn way he's a hoffer because he wasn't even relevant on the team tbh.

 

[kingdong]

I wish he would say specifically what he took. Then we could know wether he may have been taking it to heal injurys, or for something more. In fact, the main steroid, test, won't really do much for injuries, will it?

 

[hardknock]

I wish he would say specifically what he took. Then we could know wether he may have been taking it to heal injurys, or for something more. In fact, the main steroid, test, won't really do much for injuries, will it?

In all honesty, what would it solve or matter other than to extinguish a fan or watcher's thirst for trivial knowledge.

The guy went from a scrawny kid to a behemoth in about 14 months. I would highly doubt that he only took enough to "heal" his body. Yet, what do I know, he could be telling the truth though it wouldn't matter if he was or was not. He took substances that was illegal to possess without a doc prescription.

 

[gamer2be08]

Im sorry, but roids dont make the player.. If your not a good baseball player from the start I guarentee you wont be making any more home runs than before gear... He should be in the hall of fame, nuff said...

 

[AE14]

I agree,The Hall of Fame is full of "cheaters" for various reasons. I once again say that between grandstanding congressmen and the press this has turned into a complete farce. Baseball knew what was going on for a long time and did nothing. I still say the HR race between Mcgwire and Sosa saved baseballs ass, they probably knew then, why wasn't something done then.

Couldnt agree more. The summer and fall of '98 were a huge saving grace for baseball, and for anyone to think that the owners, managers and even the commish didnt know, is most likely fooling themselves.

McGwire and Sosa gained godlike status. To be honest, this was an era issue and based on this precedent, no one should be voted in, as there is no way to know.

 

[Fastone]

Couldnt agree more. The summer and fall of '98 were a huge saving grace for baseball, and for anyone to think that the owners, managers and even the commish didnt know, is most likely fooling themselves.

McGwire and Sosa gained godlike status. To be honest, this was an era issue and based on this precedent, no one should be voted in, as there is no way to know.

Forget the so called "Steroid Era" bull, I'm talking about guys from back in the day that did things to get a edge. If you think the playing field has always been level prior to this time, I have a bridge I'd be willing to sell you.

 

[H8dook]

If they don't let Pete Rose in...then NONE of the "PED" crowd should be allowed in.

 

[AE14]

the problem with the Pete Rose argument is he signed a document stating he wouldn't seek entrance into baseball and the hall. At the end of the day, the best players from the era should be in regardless. There are players in the hall who were guilty of cheating. Pitchers who scuffed balls etc...

 

[TipTopShape]

He said he took substances to get him back on the field. Then he said that his power numbers had nothing to do with taking Steroids,HGH. He said that his numbers were the best in those years because he had great hand eye coordination.

 

[CodyK7]

Who cares about the hall of fame? Doesn't change what he did on or off juice. I'd come out and say **** you!! you can shove the hall of fame up your ass......... now that would get some espn air time.

 

[H8dook]

the problem with the Pete Rose argument is he signed a document stating he wouldn't seek entrance into baseball and the hall. At the end of the day, the best players from the era should be in regardless. There are players in the hall who were guilty of cheating. Pitchers who scuffed balls etc...

Mighty convenient that shortly after he signed said document,the HoF voted to ban those on the permanently ineligible list from entry into the Hall.

I'm sure when he signed it, he felt he would never have to "seek" entry.He was in denial obviously for years.I believe his body of work on the field speaks volumes.When he played,he was EVERYTHING that was right about baseball.

 

[BabyHulk]

Tiger had his eyes surgically done up. He has better depth perception now. If steroids is cheating, why wouldn't surgery be? Because one is illegal and the other isn't? It wasn't even gear that started this bull. It was an EAS supp found in his locker. Not saying he wasn't juicing, but jumping all over those kinds of supps is what is/will ruin the industry. I agree with the 1st post. The bash bros. are the sh*t. Canseco/Mac was unstoppable. Oakland b*tches!

Rant over.

 

[hardknock]

If they don't let Pete Rose in...then NONE of the "PED" crowd should be allowed in.

..
Dude Pete bet on his own team...hell, didn't he even bet some games that they would lose? He probably tried to throw some games. And it's not hard to do in baseball.
That is the ultimate disgrace.
At the very least, mark, sosa, did it to gain an edge to win but this guy sunk his own team to win money, not fame, rings, but flat out money.
There isn't much difference but damn, betting against your own team? That's something else...like betting against your own mother.

EDIT: Now that I have had a chance to do further research, I do not know if he exactly bet on his own team to LOSE. Perhaps, but I am not totally sure.

 

[hardknock]

Tiger had his eyes surgically done up. He has better depth perception now. If steroids is cheating, why wouldn't surgery be? Because one is illegal and the other isn't? It wasn't even gear that started this bull. It was an EAS supp found in his locker. Not saying he wasn't juicing, but jumping all over those kinds of supps is what is/will ruin the industry. I agree with the 1st post. The bash bros. are the sh*t. Canseco/Mac was unstoppable. Oakland b*tches!

Rant over.

...
That crap that was in his locker was pretty convenient also...pretty odd that it happened to be turned the correct way just for the cameras to see it...that whole thing was a sham to throw people off. People who were "in the circle" knew he was juicing the whole time..

 

[hardknock]

It was last year, I think november that Dexter Jackson came to a local Golds here. He was asked what he took to stay so big and he replied NOexplode....

I nearly died.

 

[gamer2be08]

It was last year, I think november that Dexter Jackson came to a local golds here. He was asked what he took to stay so big and he replied NOexplode....

I nearly died.

lmfao

 

[DAdams91982]

He said he took substances to get him back on the field. Then he said that his power numbers had nothing to do with taking Steroids,HGH. He said that his numbers were the best in those years because he had great hand eye coordination.

I do not have a hard time believing this... considering he hit 49 HRs his rookie year, which was prior to his juicing. lets not forget the balls of the HR race were also juiced with the rubber "pill" to incite advancing HR numbers along to attract more butts to the seats.

 

[TipTopShape]

Pete Rose should still be banned from baseball, maybe just maybe if he admitted it when it was first brought up maybe things would be different.

 

[CodyK7]

It was last year, I think november that Dexter Jackson came to a local golds here. He was asked what he took to stay so big and he replied NOexplode....

I nearly died.

Classic. It's like all the threads on bb.com where 15 year olds are talking about the 2,000 pre workout supps they are taking and the pump they get from them. I just shake my head because they are all like 160lbs.

 

[H8dook]

..
Dude Pete bet on his own team...hell, didn't he even bet some games that they would lose? He probably tried to throw some games. And it's not hard to do in baseball.
That is the ultimate disgrace.
At the very least, mark, sosa, did it to gain an edge to win but this guy sunk his own team to win money, not fame, rings, but flat out money.
There isn't much difference but damn, betting against your own team? That's something else...like betting against your own mother.

EDIT: Now that I have had a chance to do further research, I do not know if he exactly bet on his own team to LOSE. Perhaps, but I am not totally sure.

It's always wise to educate one's self.
If you don't,more often than not,you end up looking like ......well you know:stupid:

Rose maintains he ONLY bet on his team to WIN.
I 'm pretty sure if he had bet against his team,some bookie,or Vegas affiliation would have come forward with evidence otherwise....dude.

 

[hardknock]

It's always wise to educate one's self.
If you don't,more often than not,you end up looking like ......well you know:stupid:

Rose maintains he ONLY bet on his team to WIN.
I 'm pretty sure if he had bet against his team,some bookie,or Vegas affiliation would have come forward with evidence otherwise....dude.

I dont edit post and change what I say, I go back and add to it so that people can see what I typed. If i look like an ass on a post, so be it...I've done MUCH worse in life, so who really cares?

That is why I came back and put the edit at the bottom but never touched the original post, admitting that I was wrong but thought that was what I read several years ago.....Duuuuuuudddde. LOL

 

[Iron Warrior]

I don't think he should be in.

The way I view sports is that athletes are professional because they have God given abilities that others don't. When they start to get older then they should retire, but don't cheat. It would be different if these were not banned substances and they used them before they were banned, but they didn't. They knew they were breaking the rules. So no, Mcgwire should not be in the hall. He has joined the ranks of Pete Rose in my opinion.

If they decide to take them after they are out of the sport then I don't care, and I wouldn't have a problem with that at all.

Mark McGwire did not cheat because MLB didn't test for steroids while he was breaking the HR record and blasting 50+ HR a year. McGwire belongs in the HOF but he probably won't be voted in by the writers, who are really quick to criticize but always ready to spin quotes and facts in order to write their columns.

HOF voting shouldn't be done by these writers, whom never played pro ball. There were plenty of players who used amphetamines before the Sosa, McGwire, Bonds, Canseco, and A-Rod used juice. BTW, watered down pitching had something to do with the offensive explosion. It wasn't uncommon for a pitcher to go 250-300 innings a year with 35-40 starts. Most pitchers don't make that many starts anymore and very few go over 250 innings. You don't have as many 20 game winners anymore. The Oakland A's had Bob Welch and Dave Stewart win more than 20 games each in one season. A #2 guy in your rotation could get you 17 wins !

 

[H8dook]

Mark McGwire did not cheat because MLB didn't test for steroids while he was breaking the HR record and blasting 50+ HR a year. McGwire belongs in the HOF but he probably won't be voted in by the writers, who are really quick to criticize but always ready to spin quotes and facts in order to write their columns.

HOF voting shouldn't be done by these writers, whom never played pro ball. There were plenty of players who used amphetamines before the Sosa, McGwire, Bonds, Canseco, and A-Rod used juice. BTW, watered down pitching had something to do with the offensive explosion. It wasn't uncommon for a pitcher to go 250-300 innings a year with 35-40 starts. Most pitchers don't make that many starts anymore and very few go over 250 innings. You don't have as many 20 game winners anymore. The Oakland A's had Bob Welch and Dave Stewart win more than 20 games each in one season. A #2 guy in your rotation could get you 17 wins !

I'm sure YOUR logic would just make the Maris family giddy!

He'll eventually get in.ALL cheaters will presumably be allowed in.
There should be 2 sides of the Hall.
One's who assumingly did it the NATURAL way.
The other KNOWN CHEATERS on the other side w/asterisks attached to their names and stats.

Not only was McGwire a cheat,he was also a FAKE.Hence his "love affair" w/the Maris family during his juiced summer run,an eventual breakage of Maris's HR record.

Your amphetamine argument doesn't hold weight in MY opinion.
Amp's basically increase focus and alertness.
So,according to you,if I take ephedrine and caffeine before I lift,I'm cheating as well...Don't think so.

The reason why pitchers don't log the innings these days is because of the chronic, multiple shoulder an elbow injuries that occur more often than not these days.Also no organization wants to pay the multi millions for a pitcher to sit on the shelf rehabbing for a year or two,and quite possibly end their careers with MILLIONS owed to them.Pitchers are signed these days just to be "setup" types.Their job is specifically to come in and pitch 2 innings more often than not, just to get to the closer. This alleviates the amount of innings imposed on starting pitchers.

Back to McGwire......
Why didn't he use YOUR logic when he stood before Congress???
I'll tell you why..He knew he was a cheater.SIMPLE.
If you remember correctly,he had asked for immunity prior to the hearings.Wonder why???

 

[FNG]

A cheater does not belong in the HOF, and writers' should not be voting for who does indeed make it in to the HOF. The HOF should be left to those whom actually played the game and/or did more than spend their days writing about the game. At the same time, who am I to call someone a cheater? Hell, I've used "cheat sheets" in Advanced Biology, as well as in Calculus.
I will never throw a stone and hide my hand, though.

 

[hardknock]

..
He and Bonds belong in the record books but hall of fame, Mark does not belong there.
I did not have him as a hoffer even when he broke the HR record. I do not see what he did significantly in terms of team achievement.
Bonds had his teams in the playoff race several times, as a pirate, he could have seen a few more world series had it not been for my braves ... as a cisco player, I don't think he had as much playoff success though they did make that one good run.
...
I'll give them both credit as being great hitters but to me Bonds did more on the field and had more overall talent than Mark. If you look at career stats and not just HRs/slugging, Bonds was easily the better player albeit the more hated player as well, I definitely hated his ass.

 

[hardknock]

Well actually Bonds had a higher slug percentage, less strike outs with more ABs, as well and won many more individual awards except for mvp 7-10 which is funny because he had 3 ML player of the yr awards as well...

Mark, in his one WS win, didn't have a great series ... in bond's one show, he had better numbers but no ring. Mark did play in more WS but that's more team than one person.

 

[bulldogz]

How about we have our own Anabolic Hall of Fame here at AM for athletes for all sports who used and will not be in or allowed into the hall of fame...

 

[TipTopShape]

lol sounds goods to me.

 

[Bigez]

Mlb had no drug policy so what does it matter?The drugs only make you better but you still have to put in the work.So all of you here that use ph's and sd's are all cheaters then-RIGHT-if you think they were cheaters.You are all trying to be better-RIGHT? I don't get the logic?