WSB for skinny bastards hybrid log.
- 03-27-2006, 02:12 AM
WSB for skinny bastards hybrid log.
So after all the research into doing a westside split, I decided I still don't have the personal experience or actual strength yet to warrant a complete westside style program, so I modified WSB for Skinny Bastards a bit and am going to run it like this for a while. I will post the template as the days this week go by so here is the first day so far:
Day 1 ME Upper Body
1 board press
Incline Dumbell bench
4 sets 10 to 12 reps
Today I did a 311 TUT, but I'm not going to do that anymore, so I should be doing 65's or 70's at a normal tempo
Static hold for 30 seconds w/ 45's, next time I'm going to do the static holds specified in Stretch Mark Mass.
Chest Supported Rows
****ing Hate these, I'm definately going back to bent over Barbell rows
4 sets 10 to 12 reps. I did 90 lbs today (I usally bent over row 155 for 10)
Reverse machine flys
3 sets 3x10 to 12, did 100lbs for all sets today
Heavy pulldown abs
Did 80 lbs today
So basically, I narrowed down the rep ranges to help aide the quest for Sarcoplasmic hypertrophy, but kept the ME work. This is nearly the same volume specified by De Franco, but I made sure not to go over 12 reps and into the realm of lactic acid training. Starting next workout, I will be doing static holds after every set, as specified in Stretch Mark mass. I warm up for everything dynamically (which actually helped today). ME lift will change every two weeks and I will keep weak point training for my bench. I feel training this way will add the overall mass I need to really get good lift numbers and help increase my strength a good deal along the way. I guess you would call it powerbuilding, since it's a combo of the two. i will progressively load each week. I haven't specified the lifts for the other two days yet, but I will post them the day I do them. Starting weight today was 198@15% bf. I'm going to weigh weekly and take measurements every Sunday starting next Sunday. My goal is to add 10lbs of mass while increasing my lifts to their goal numbers. My goals for the time being are a 400 lb squat, a 475 deadlift, and a 265 bench. When I have time I will also post sample diet days and try to keep this log as detailed as possible. Oh yah, the rep day will Use 3-1-1 TUT and I will not lock out on the movements. I will also for sure be adding an iso movement after the main chest movement (like flys, etc.) because both size and strength wise Chest is my weak point. Will post pics when I can get new camera batteries.
- 03-27-2006, 12:48 PM
Optimum whey for pwo and asap upon waking
Superpump250, but I'm gunna finish this and get Shock Therapy again since the SP basically does nothing.
Cellmass, but once it's out I'm gunna use Storm.
6 to 10g omega 3's a day
- 03-27-2006, 02:22 PM
Originally Posted by ktw
03-27-2006, 02:31 PM
Yah, I'll check them out next time I need stuff. Bulk=better.
03-29-2006, 08:08 PM
Ok so today was the upper body hypertrophy day. I was fooling around trying to figure out my program so the workout was ok, but nothing special.
Incline hammer strength
I thought these would be great and not strain my shoulder, but I absolutely hated it. I think next week I'm just going to do incline barbell or something. I've been doing flat barbell forever and I need a change, but I can never find anything that great, and dumbells tire out my tris and shoulders faster than my chest so I don't like doing them.
4 sets of 10 w/ a 45 and 2 10lb plates on each side
2x12 w/32.5lb dumbells
Static hold w/ 40's for 30 seconds
I'm going to stop doing these because they have made my vertical pulling strength go down. I'm going to try the rack chins next week with my feet on the bench and weight on my lap and I'm going to lower the rep range to around 8 to 10 instead of 10 to 12.
3x10 with 185lbs
Pullup static hold, bodyweight for 30 seconds
3x10 with 55's and then 60's on the last set for 8
3 sets of 12
Standing ez bar curl w/ 80 lb bar
3 sets of 10 to 12, last set I only got 9
Did http://www.t-nation.com/readTopic.do?id=990092 for my first exercise, the "Dead Bug" slowly and managed to get 10 per side the first set, but then only managed 8 and 6 (per leg that is) on the next set. Those are really hard actually. I then did ball crunches with very very wide foot position and made my body into a decline position almost. Did 3 sets of 20 and almost threw up.
I think my workout next week will be
Incline Barbell bench
Super Setted with:
Static hold w/40's for 30 seconds
Rack Chins with weight on lap
3x8 to 10
Flat bench dumbell flys
Seated dumbell shoulder press
3x10 to 12
I don't see the need to go any higher as my incline bench should do some good work on my shoulders
3x10 to 12
Super Setted with
Seated Hammer curl w/ slight twist at the end
3x10 to 12
Static hold for shoulders then bi's, 30 seconds each
Barbell Shrugs at the end
Same ab exercise as this week.
Anyone have any advice on chest movements? I hate dumbells because my accessory muscles get exhausted before my chest does and I am already chest deficient. I think the flys are a good iso to do after the incline, as I am trying to do really high chest volume on this day to hopefully get my chest to catch up to the rest of my body. Also, I have had no increase in bi size in a long long time. Does anyone reccomend doing more bi work, or possibly dropping all bi iso work altogether? I've hit a major plateau here and it sucks, but I really like the rest of the components of this program.
03-30-2006, 07:04 PM
Leg day today.
Did a bunch of work sets consisting of triples for my ME work.
Used box squats for my ME lift. Did triples then worked up to singles and got 285x1 and am very disappointed. Can't complain too much though as I haven't squatted in quite a while. Rack deads did nothing for my squat either.
Glute Ham Raise on calf raise machine
bodyweight for 4 sets of 10 to 12. I love these for hams, they made my legs shake and feel like absolute ****, which is what I was looking for.
140 for 3 sets of 8 to 10
By this time my posterior chain was pretty dead so I did a bunch of core work. Next week I want to add a unilateral movement or pause squats in. I felt like crap today, so my workout took a lot longer than planned. Hopefully next week goes better.
03-30-2006, 07:07 PM
you should really take a clip of yourself doing the ghrs and make sure you're doing them right, most guys cant rep out 1 when they first start out, in fact i know an 900lb squatter that couldnt do 1 the first time he tried.Originally Posted by ktw
03-30-2006, 07:07 PM
other than that, good work
03-30-2006, 07:38 PM
Good log, I'll be watching this. I'm hoping to start up a similar program in a month or two.
03-30-2006, 09:01 PM
Ya, I'm trying to find your clip of the GHR variations and compare. there is a giant mirror right next to the machine so I was watching. It's not an actual GHR, I'm sitting backwards on a seated calf raise machine like IVYDUDE suggested. It's not the best, but it smoked my hams.
I would also like to post that I do not think I'm going to do TUT any longer on the rep day. It tires out my accessory muscles too much. I see no benefits from lifting with a 3 second eccentric opposed to a 1.5 or 2 second controlled eccentric like i already do. As long as fast twich fibers are being used and the rep range is right I am still inflicting a great amount of sarcoplasmic damage and utilizing my fast twich type 2b fibers. Also I suggest people try out the Smart Core Training article on Tnation. It really helps with core stabilization.
03-30-2006, 10:12 PM
Originally Posted by ktw
here you go
the closest to a conventional one you get on there is when he goes all the way down and back up again, but with a regular one you stop when your body is parallel
03-31-2006, 01:36 AM
Ya I was doing a regular one, but couldnt go 100% down because it doesnt go high enough. EDIT: Actually I just figured out a way to make it higher so I am going to next workout. Either way, they ****ing hurt really bad.
03-31-2006, 10:35 PM
Another note: I will be performing a heavy bicept exercise on my ME day too now and will training them with more volume. They are lagging just as badly as my chest, so hopefully I can pack on some size to them when I cut. I'm not gunna go overboard on volume, just increase frequency and make sure one day is Sarcomeric and one day is Sarcoplasmic and hit them with different angles and grips. Hopefully **** works. My hams were so sore today I couldn't skate to class. Did Rock climbing for grip work and GPP today, went very well. Also, my chest is still sore from my rep day, so something had to have gone well. I'm going to do slightly less volume next week, then the following week go very high and then low the week after that.
04-01-2006, 07:06 PM
Also, for the next month at least, I am going to make it a goal to bump my caloric intake up some. Right now I'm at 350/350/100, but I usually exceed protein by 20 to 30 grams, so I figured I might as well bump up total macro levels to 400/400/100. This isn't that many more carbs, I can make up the extra 50 by making 2 or 3 meals slightly bigger. I really want to bulk up as much as possible before cutting for 8 weeks this summer. I don't think I will gain that much fat this way, as I have been walking for 35 minutes on off days and doing GPP once a week. Hoping to go into the cut at 205 to 210 and dropping 10 to 15 lbs by the end of it. I think I will still have a max effort day and rep day during the cut, but I think it will be a slightly different program adjusted to how much volume I can handle. Supplementation so far will be just cutting my caloric intake down along with taking Active, ReboundXT, LeanExtreme and two two week alb. cycles at the end of each month. I don't like taking heavy amounts of stimulants or suppressants, so I think this method should suffice for maintaing strength while sheeding fat.
04-02-2006, 09:04 PM
Today was ME upper body.
1 board press. Worked up to singles again. 225x1, but I'm still having trouble on the eccentric. I think I mentally get intimidated by the weight on the way down and try to rush it. Once I just rely on using my back on the way down I expect my max to go up. I'm not sure what we'll change the ME movement to after week 3.
Incline dumbell bench
Switched angles all 3 sets
Static hold for 30 seconds with 40 lb'ers.
Bent over rows, plams facing in
145 for 3x10-12
Did bi's heavy today as part of my goal to get some size to them.
Preacher curls 5x5
did 80 for the first 3, then did 90 (EZ curl bar)
Static hold, pull up position for 30 seconds
Face Pulls (Was going to do reverse flys but some old dude was on the machine and I always try to avoid him because he talks for like 4 hours every time I see him and I was just trying to leave)
80 for 3x12
3x 10 with 80 lbs
Sometimes I get so frustrated in the gym. Some douchebags from my complex were benching right next to me, really skinny dudes and were doing 225 for like 6 to 8 reps, yet they have no idea what the **** they're doing. Sometimes it bothers me that total morons can be stronger and bigger than me. I really need to work on slowing my bar speed. It was just one of those workouts where I tried my best, but left disappointed in myself. Doing everything right and not even being able to do as much as my douchebag neighbors really frustrates me.
04-02-2006, 09:05 PM
Sidenote: God damn some of the UFC ring girls are fine
04-02-2006, 09:06 PM
but these are the douchebags that get hurt, and since you're doing it right, watch how they stay at the same weight and you shoot by them.Originally Posted by ktw
04-02-2006, 09:21 PM
Ya, you're right, it will be frustrating for a while, but in 6 months when I'm stronger and bigger all the frustration will be worth it. By the time I have enough experience to use ph's or such (a while by the way), I will make them look like chumps. I guess if there was no frustration or work involved, there would really be no point in lifting.
04-02-2006, 09:48 PM
make them look like chumps before the ph's, you should really only use them when you've reached your max naturallyOriginally Posted by ktw
04-02-2006, 09:50 PM
Oh I know that for sure. Personally, I have come from 156 lbs in mid september with a bench max of 135 to 203 lbs today with a max of 225. I think that is impressive in such a short time period, but sometimes I still get discouraged for not being where I want to be. I'll just give it time and see how it goes.
04-04-2006, 05:24 PM
Repetition day today. Workout took 45 minutes, but I got a lot done during that time period and changed some **** up. I'm fairly content with the program this way. I did medium volume this week, next week is high.
Flat Dumbell Bench
3x12, 10 on last set w/ 70 lb'ers
Rack Pullups w/35 lb plate on lap, 3x12 also, last set squeezed out 14
Flat dumbell flys w/35 lb'ers
2x12, last set I managed 14
Static Hold for 30 seconds w/ 40's
3x10 Dumbell Shoulder press w/ 55's, did 12 on the last set so next week it's gunna be 60's
supersetted with Twisting Dumbell Curls (seated
3x12 w/35 lb'ers, last set did 13
Didn't have much time for traps today so I wasn't able to do them, but I'm not worried about missing them once.
Overall, the workout went great. I added 25g malto to my xtend during workout and it seems to be going ok, although I do not like it on ME days. More later, gotta shower.
04-07-2006, 11:08 AM
Yesterday was ME lower body. Accidentally took 4 scoops of the superpump and what a horrible experience. At first I felt really, really hot inside, like they turned up the thermostat in my gym to 85 degrees. Then when the stims kicked in it was like I was Tony Montana in Scarface. I started having to take a dump really bad and couldn't stand still.
did a ****load of work sets, worked up to a heavy triple, then did my 3 work sets over 90%
290x1, really thinking now I coulda pushed it harder.
Glute ham raises
Managed to raise where I put my knees by 4 or 5 inches. Did bodyweight again for 3x10-12
These really were not feeling right and I think the stims were wearing off at this point because I started to feel really hungry
3x6-10 w/ 140
On a sidenote, now that I'm back in the swing of things, I am recovering really, really fast. Yesterday I no longer felt anything from my rep day 2 days before and I do not feel sore from leg day right now. I don't know why that would be since I always take every set as far as I can without failure and have been doing a good amount of volume. Maybe I might need a more voluminous workout plan soon here?
04-10-2006, 01:56 AM
Ok there will be major changes to my program as of this week. I really don't like the fact that I am recovering so fast and sitting around the rest of the week. My gains are slowing even as my eating has increased so I finally made a westside/waterbury hybrid program today. It consists of principles from both camps. Every day I work out I will post the routine and my reasoning for it. Full body workouts, 4 times a week, with varying intensities, exercises and rep ranges so that I can avoid overtraining. The goal is to hit a muscle group once a workout, total sets per week should be around 15 to 16, so it should not be too crazy.
Today was max bench/low intensity high volume upper body
Did a heavy triple, then worked up to my max. Hit 225 very well, no problems this time, stumbled on 230 a bit.
Cable rows and Pushdowns
I have this set like this for a reason. I want to make the accessory work light on this day because it will be fairly intense during the week, and max benching is already intense as it is. This day will be more upper body dominant but still be kind of full body. I will still train the Lats, Tri's, and upper back after bench. My heavy accessory work will be done in the week, after I have time to recover from my bench workout.
3 by 8 to 10
Did 165 on the cable rows for a semi easy 10, Did 90 lbs on the pressdown for 10. 75 seconds rest between exercises.
Face pulls and Standing hammer curls.
3 by 10
Did 105 on the face pulls and 30's on the hammer curls
Leg extensions and abs
3 by 8 to 10
Leg extensions are super easy. On my last set I was doing 195, but I still managed to crank out 13, so next time I must go higher. Abs will be the smart core training article from T nation.
I do legs lightly this day because the main goal is to hit the accessory muscles in the rep range a typical Westside program would have, but with less intense movements so I can avoid overtraining. The next day this week will be 4 by 6. I am sticking to Waterbury's design your own high frequency program. Day 2 will have more leg work, then it's an off day and then the 3rd and 4th day, gpp, then off then start over.
04-10-2006, 07:33 AM
imo you should just use a very simple powerlifting routine till you get your strength up, i know plenty of big time guys that dont train westside style, plus it's very confusing if yuo ask me
04-10-2006, 09:49 AM
I'm not so much training westside as using some of their ideas with a high frequency routine.
04-10-2006, 09:54 AM
I will still be doing lots of basic movements that aide my lifts, such as GHR's, good mornings, pause squats, dumbell extensions, etc. My reasoning for going high frequency is the fact that I recover very very fast and spend most of the week sitting around feeling no soreness or fatigue at all. Right now I think I am capable of doing more, so that's what I am going to do, but with an intelligently designed plan so that I do not over train and still train movements that will aide my main lifts.
04-10-2006, 09:39 PM
Ok so first off today a personal trainer at my gym I talk to sometimes took some measurements for me for free and so his boss wouldn't think he was slacking off. Here are the ones I remember off of the top of my head. All are unflexed standing with normal posture.
Shoulders- 50 1/4
Chest (lats not flexed, arms straight out to the side) 42 1/4
Chest with arms straight down 46 inches (I have fairly wide lats)
Arms (both were the same) 15 1/4 inches
Bodyfat using some stupid caliper things 15.8% to 18.8% using a 3 percent variable, I'm guessing it's realistically around 16, and most of the adipose is in my belly area)
Height 6 foot 2 inches
Calves 15 1/4 (Never trained calves in my life)
Thighs 24 1/2 inches
Here was my workout today:
Rep range: 4x6
Incline barbell bench:
First I did a 45 plus a 5 plus a 2.5 then I did 155 for the rest of the workout and last set I did 160. First time doing BB incline since October
Bent over BB rows:
whatever the hell 6 plates is, but I got that for 9 on my last set so I think I could do more. I'm doing a lot of movements I haven't in a long time so I'm usually finding I can do a lot more than I expect.
Weighted pull down abs
90lbs 3 by 10
04-11-2006, 11:45 AM
Yah it's funny because Tate tries to make it sound so easy, yet it's a total ***** to come up with a routine. This is why I have mixed methods to achieve my goals.Originally Posted by guyfromkop2
04-11-2006, 11:48 AM
Also asked my mom about some measurements taken last year after I was rock climbing one day during the summer. At this point I was 156 lbs after not working out for over a year.
chest back not flexed arms out to side 37.75
It's weird to see that my calves have grown without training them whatsoever.
04-12-2006, 06:55 PM
Ok today was another workout day. Next week and all following weeks I am going to switch the routine today with the one I did on Monday due to the fact that my accessory muscles are pretty sore still and I found it hard to do certain movements because of this. Here is what I did today, and following it is what next week will look like
Flat BB bench, 8x3 with a fresh 5rm
185 for all sets
Pushpress and Chins
135 for the Pushpress
Bodyweight+10lb dumbell for the chins except for the last set
Felt no need for any direct arm work as all these movements hit my accessory muscles fairly well
Seated Calf raises and Snatch grip shrugs
2 plates+25 for the Calf raises
195 for the Snatch grip shrugs
Forgot to do abs completely so I'm going to do them at home tonight but I would've done some kind of ab circuit
Next week Monday will look like this:
5x5 (The 8 by 3 even supersetted takes too much time)
BB bench and Bent over rows (Instead of powerlifting form I will bench at the halfway line on my chest with elbows completely parallel to the bar)
Superset 2 (not an antagonistic superset, purely just done for time reasons, might change this later but I really don't think supersetting good mornings and leg press would be very optimal, but who knows)
Pushpress and Good Mornings
Upright Rows and leg press
Wednesdays workout will be:
Pullups and Chins
Powercleans and Skull Crushers
Preacher Curls and Shrugs
Standing calf raises
I don't want to go heavy on this day because I will max on squats the next day so for now at least leg training on Wed. will be minimal. I'm beginning to think it might just be easier and go all out and do 4 day full body, I don't know. I like the strength gains I get with ME days and the theory behind it, but it's hard to organize the other days around it.
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