PCT while on TRT

[imsqueak]

Since a major part of PCT is to get natural test producing again, what is the protocall for PCT if you are on Rx Test Replacement Therapy and plan on staying on it? I.e. weekly test cyp shots and routine labs performed at Dr's office.

Something to get HPTA going again? Serm for that, right? Clomid or Nolva being the most popular of the serms with Nolva seeming to have less emotional issuse than Clomid. Did I read correctly that Clomid is preferred for stuff that ends -dione and something else.


Something to get libido going again? Plenty of different supps can help with that but what's your recommendation?

Depending on the PH or H used, an AI, right? Or is that covered with the Serm also?

Anything else to consider?

Thanks

 

[thegodfather]

No need for PCT. Just taper down your dosage until TRT level. When not on TRT you must stop abruptly and begin a PCT protocol to get things going as fast as possible.

 

[zeroshens]

If you plan to continue your testosterone supplementation you wouldn't ever need to do pct. your levels are artificially high. When you wanna come off you would probably do serm, aromasin, hcg, and anything else to get your body producing again

 

[alwaysfirst]

Sorry to hijack but what about if your on TRT for a longer time 1-2 years and want to stop, are shut down forever or can you actually start things back up?

 

[wesmantooth]

Curious about this as well

 

[B5150]

Since a major part of PCT is to get natural test producing again, what is the protocall for PCT if you are on Rx Test Replacement Therapy and plan on staying on it? I.e. weekly test cyp shots and routine labs performed at Dr's office.

Something to get HPTA going again? Serm for that, right? Clomid or Nolva being the most popular of the serms with Nolva seeming to have less emotional issuse than Clomid. Did I read correctly that Clomid is preferred for stuff that ends -dione and something else.


Something to get libido going again? Plenty of different supps can help with that but what's your recommendation?

Depending on the PH or H used, an AI, right? Or is that covered with the Serm also?

Anything else to consider?

Thanks

TRT and PCT are a contradiction. Testosterone Replacement Therapy is not cycled. It is a lifetime treatment for testosterone deficiency.

If you are being treated by a physician this is information that should have been made available to you before you began treatment. While being treated you can take hCG to help with sperm production and prevent testicular atrophy but you do not use SERM for a post cycle because it is not a cycle.

How long have you been seeing a Dr.? How long have your been being treated? How old are you?

 

[wesmantooth]

No other benefits to SERM in PCT other than restoring natural testosterone production (which wouldn't happen in this case)?

 

[B5150]

What PCT? Either you are getting TRT or you are cycling testosterone? Which is it?

 

[TFlifting]

Sorry to hijack but what about if your on TRT for a longer time 1-2 years and want to stop, are shut down forever or can you actually start things back up?

it is shown you can start to bring things back up (generally not as high as regular) but you can bring levels up and get everything working, it is not permanently shut down

 

[TFlifting]

What PCT? Either you are getting TRT or you are cycling testosterone? Which is it?

information is 100% correct though, no need for PCT if your on TRT but cycling testosterone is waaay different than TRT

 

[alwaysfirst]

it is shown you can start to bring things back up (generally not as high as regular) but you can bring levels up and get everything working, it is not permanently shut down

Intresting, thanks!

 

[TFlifting]

Intresting, thanks!

still remember though it could permanently **** up your hormone levels.. and then you will for sure need TRT but other than that you could essentially come off and live a normal life, just may notice less libido and the regular symptoms of testosterone deficiency

 

[wesmantooth]

But as far as other hormone levels, no benefit to SERMs while on TRT? Gyno, cortisol, etc.

 

[TFlifting]

But as far as other hormone levels, no benefit to SERMs while on TRT? Gyno, cortisol, etc.

nolva could be used in case gyno was prominent on TRT but as for clomid I wouldn't see a point in using it...

 

[wesmantooth]

I've been on Androgel a couple years. Probably will be on TRT for life. I've used Nolva after two cycles just as a precaution I guess whether it was truly necessary or not. It's cheap, so I figure it's no big deal. But I've been reading some about toxicity recently and am wondering if it's doing more harm than good.

 

[B5150]

I've been on Androgel a couple years. Probably will be on TRT for life. I've used Nolva after two cycles just as a precaution I guess whether it was truly necessary or not. It's cheap, so I figure it's no big deal. But I've been reading some about toxicity recently and am wondering if it's doing more harm than good.

Again with the TRT and cycles...how old are you? Are you being seen by a doctor?

If you have a need for an AI use one - not a SERM.

Androgel will not cause elevated estrogen but more likely DHT.

 

[wesmantooth]

Yes. Trying to find a new one now because the other guy is old, doesn't understand these issues, and has horrible customer service. You're saying someone on TRT shouldn't ever try to get an edge and use anabolics? Just give up, huh?

 

[wesmantooth]

32, by the way. And never touched any type of supplements until after being diagnosed with hypogonadism..

 

[B5150]

You are making it very a hard time understand you. You contradict yourself when using terms like TRT,cycles and PCT.
Are you on TRT or not?
Are you looking to cycle steroids or not?
Are you looking to blast and cruise or something?
You don't use any PCT for TRT because you don't come off TRT nor do you cycle TRT.
You use a PCT coming off a cycle of steroids.

So which is it? Are you on TRT or are you looking to cycle steroids?

 

[EasyEJL]

Yes. Trying to find a new one now because the other guy is old, doesn't understand these issues, and has horrible customer service. You're saying someone on TRT shouldn't ever try to get an edge and use anabolics? Just give up, huh?

if you are staying on your androgel year round, and adding other anabolics on top, there is no need for any sort of PCT when you come off those other anabolics.

 

[wesmantooth]

Thanks, Easy. I don't see how I'm making it hard to understand. Yes, I'm on TRT year round for the rest of my life. I've also done two cycles of other compounds to get that little extra. I used a SERM both times afterwards just in case because I thought there may be some other benefits other than restarting natural production. But I it's toxic and I'm just doing more harm than good, I'll stop. That's why I was asking.

 

[B5150]

Thanks, Easy. I don't see how I'm making it hard to understand. Yes, I'm on TRT year round for the rest of my life. I've also done two cycles of other compounds to get that little extra. I used a SERM both times afterwards just in case because I thought there may be some other benefits other than restarting natural production. But I it's toxic and I'm just doing more harm than good, I'll stop. That's why I was asking.

What makes it difficult to understand is that you never said "I am on TRT and I cycle/blast-n-cruise other steroids from time to time." What Easy did was assume what you were doing, as I could have as well, but would rather have the other person communicate more clearly so I don't have to assume or guess.

Even then there is NO need for a SERM

Good luck!

 

[BigAK9]

You're not doing more harm than good. It's just PCT stands for post cycle therapy, and it's primary use is to restore natural test production for people who wish to either not be on steroids their whole life, or who want to ensure they don't wreck their sperm production. Now since you're on TRT your test levels are artificially raised year round so you don't need to worry about a PCT to restore natural test production. Now if because of the steroids you've started to notice nasty sides likes severe atrophy of the testis you can take hcgh to increase their size and artificially restart their function. If you're experiencing gyno (btch tits) then you can take nolva. Like others have said since you don't ever plan on coming off TRT you don't ever have to worry about pct

 

[wesmantooth]

Cool, thanks!

 

[bubsnt3]

So. I am not convinced of this. Can someone elaborate on the below for me?

I am on TRT but my body is still producing quite a bit of its own natural test. My trt is augmenting what my body doesn't produce but my lh, etc is normal. No hypertrophy or issues. I would like to maintain this. I only shoot 200mg of test a month to supplement my natural test.

So when running exogenous aas, my natural lh, fsh, etc. will all be suppressed. What is the best way to get these naturally restarted? Stop the trt and run a serm for a couple weeks? Run a serm with the low dose trt? Hcg would only be for hypertrophy but I would like to restart my hpta to pre-cycle levels.
Doubt it matters but I am running estra-4, 9 (old school one), superdrol, mithras, and halodrol (spare me the my liver is going to die speech please. Have been doing these for decades, which is why I am now on trt )

 

[warbird01]

Run a long and heavy pct. I would suggest something like this (8 weeks)

Nolva
20/20/10/10/10/10/10/10
Clomid
25/25/25/25
DAA
3g/3g/3g/3g/3g/3g
Reduce XT
0/0/3/3/3/3/3

I like to throw in X gels starting week 1 of PCT as well but that is only if funds allow.

 

[EasyEJL]

So. I am not convinced of this. Can someone elaborate on the below for me?

I am on TRT but my body is still producing quite a bit of its own natural test. My trt is augmenting what my body doesn't produce but my lh, etc is normal. No hypertrophy or issues. I would like to maintain this. I only shoot 200mg of test a month to supplement my natural test.

you must be the only person I've heard of that works for, unless you are injecting that 200 as 6mg of suspension in the afternoons each day. even then. virtually everyone on TRT is replacing rather than augmenting as with augmenting natural production drops over time

 

[bubsnt3]

Run a long and heavy pct. I would suggest something like this (8 weeks)

Nolva
20/20/10/10/10/10/10/10
Clomid
25/25/25/25
DAA
3g/3g/3g/3g/3g/3g
Reduce XT
0/0/3/3/3/3/3

I like to throw in X gels starting week 1 of PCT as well but that is only if funds allow.

Thanks! Would you stay on the low dose trt

 

[bubsnt3]

you must be the only person I've heard of that works for, unless you are injecting that 200 as 6mg of suspension in the afternoons each day. even then. virtually everyone on TRT is replacing rather than augmenting as with augmenting natural production drops over time

That's weird. Do you have much experience with this? There are several reasons for trt, mine is desensitized leydig cells so even though my body is producing lh, fsh, etc. My bodies isn't responding appropriately, hence the augmenting. I believe this is a semi-common reason for trt. From what my doc says anyway.

 

[EasyEJL]

that part is common, but then usually you are producing so little that they put you on replacement. When you start augmenting it starts lowering your natural production even further to where you have to keep raising your dose till its replacement. Whats the protocol for the 200mg? 50/wk ? and do you use HCG too?

for me my LH was low but in normal range, but test was around 270ish so I just went on replacement.

 

[bubsnt3]

that part is common, but then usually you are producing so little that they put you on replacement. When you start augmenting it starts lowering your natural production even further to where you have to keep raising your dose till its replacement. Whats the protocol for the 200mg? 50/wk ? and do you use HCG too?

for me my LH was low but in normal range, but test was around 270ish so I just went on replacement.

Got it. I use hcg only when I am on cycle with other roids. My TT was about 370 and lh was actually higher than normal. I am on aveed, testosterone undecanoate, and I shoot 200mg once a month. If your doctor can get the insurance approval it is much better than pinning weekly.
I suppose I could just treat it like a normal PCT then.. Serm/AI. The question I keep debating is whether to stop the test injections during this period.

 

[EasyEJL]

if you do stop the injections, you'll probably lose much or most of the gains you made.

whats your TT now on that protocol?

 

[warbird01]

Thanks! Would you stay on the low dose trt

You need to do more research or talk to your doc more because you don't understand TRT/PCT at all. The point of PCT is to COME OFF exogenous hormones. if you stay on trt there is no need for a PCT.

If you doc has you on TRT stay on TRT.

 

[bubsnt3]

if you do stop the injections, you'll probably lose much or most of the gains you made.

whats your TT now on that protocol?

Its always above 600 but it depends on the time of the month. What are your levels at?

 

[bubsnt3]

You need to do more research or talk to your doc more because you don't understand TRT/PCT at all. The point of PCT is to COME OFF exogenous hormones. if you stay on trt there is no need for a PCT.

If you doc has you on TRT stay on TRT.

I would disagree. LH and FSH aren't completely suppressed for anyone on TRT, but they are on other hormones. Which is my point. I want my LH and FSH recovered to pre-cycle levels. Where did you get the idea your HPTA just disappears from the equation when you are on TRT?

 

[EasyEJL]

Because normally it does disappear on any TRT. My total test varies over the week from 700-1100 or so. I self inject at home, luckily my doctor allows that.

 

[bubsnt3]

Ok. Don't want to argue. But see below.. Testosterone replacement led to a suppression of FSH levels from 2.8 IU/L at baseline to 1.1 IU/L and to a suppression of LH levels from 2.3 to 0.8 IU/L. And that is at full androgen replacement. TRT does not replace your HPTA, it does suppress it. Thankfully or all of our balls would be peas! In my case my FSH and LH are still within normal range (or were prior to the cycle). I'll just stay on the TRT and run a full PCT as I would have before starting the TRT. Thanks for the help!

http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.2164/jandrol.05140/pdf