Coop's Corner #4: Alpha-2 Antagonism? Yes Please.

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  1. Quote Originally Posted by bigdavid View Post
    Some antipsychotics and antidepressants have some moderate-strong alpha-2 antagonism. Mirtazapine comes to mind. Would they also be effective for fat loss? (assuming you could deal with the increased appetite and somnolence from the blocking 5HT-2C and H1)
    They would not. And there are veeeery few alpha-2-antagonists on the drug market, with the only really common one being what you mentioned: mirtazapine. However, mirtazapine has a lot of mixed activity, not just at the serotonin receptor, but at other sites as well. This prevents us from reaching a therapeutic dose for fat loss in the periphery.

    Conversely, yohimbine is exceptionally selective for the alpha 2 receptor.

    You raise an interesting point though with respect to the other side of the coin: alpha 2 agonism. Clonidine is a BP med that has recently come into the spotlight for its ability to reduce pain. Which is interesting, because agmatine, another alpha 2 agonist, has been found to reduce pain in humans as per studies and reduce BP as well as per BF cuff tests. I see a bright future for agmatine in the medical realm


  2. Quote Originally Posted by mr.cooper69 View Post
    They would not. And there are veeeery few alpha-2-antagonists on the drug market, with the only really common one being what you mentioned: mirtazapine. However, mirtazapine has a lot of mixed activity, not just at the serotonin receptor, but at other sites as well. This prevents us from reaching a therapeutic dose for fat loss in the periphery. Conversely, yohimbine is exceptionally selective for the alpha 2 receptor. You raise an interesting point though with respect to the other side of the coin: alpha 2 agonism. Clonidine is a BP med that has recently come into the spotlight for its ability to reduce pain. Which is interesting, because agmatine, another alpha 2 agonist, has been found to reduce pain in humans as per studies and reduce BP as well as per BF cuff tests. I see a bright future for agmatine in the medical realm
    Whenever I take agmatine I feel like I can't think as clearly. It is rather annoying, especially when I'm trying to learn something. I'm assuming it's from the NMDA antagonism.
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  3. Quote Originally Posted by bigdavid View Post
    Whenever I take agmatine I feel like I can't think as clearly. It is rather annoying, especially when I'm trying to learn something. I'm assuming it's from the NMDA antagonism.
    It's unlikely. NMDA antagonism would prevent excitotoxicity at low concentrations (aka relevant agmatine concentrations) and block long term potentiation at higher concentrations (likely need to be injected). The latter would disrupt memory formation, not thought clarity which is more of a prefrontal, cholinergic phenomenon

  4. Quote Originally Posted by mr.cooper69 View Post
    It's unlikely. NMDA antagonism would prevent excitotoxicity at low concentrations (aka relevant agmatine concentrations) and block long term potentiation at higher concentrations (likely need to be injected). The latter would disrupt memory formation, not thought clarity which is more of a prefrontal, cholinergic phenomenon
    Didn't make sense to me either. However, I had the same feeling from magnesium glycinate and magmind so I just assumed that's all it could be.

  5. Quote Originally Posted by bigdavid View Post

    Didn't make sense to me either. However, I had the same feeling from magnesium glycinate and magmind so I just assumed that's all it could be.
    What did magnesium glycinate do? I was taking it for 2 months and ran out, switched back to mag citrate at bed... I feel since dropping the glycinate that fatigue and mental clarity have become issues
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  6. Quote Originally Posted by chedapalooza View Post
    What did magnesium glycinate do? I was taking it for 2 months and ran out, switched back to mag citrate at bed... I feel since dropping the glycinate that fatigue and mental clarity have become issues
    With magnesium glycerinate (was taking 400 mg before bed for about a week). After about 3 days I started to feel very mentally foggy and fatigued and that supplement was all that had changed. I felt like I couldn't learn as fast as I usually could and I just felt crappy, basically. After a week on it I stopped and slowly my mind felt better after a few days. Then tried magmind (magnesium l-threonate) and the same thing occurred but this time it was after only 2 days. Similar happened with agmatine but it was not as pronounced as the magnesium.

  7. Quote Originally Posted by mr.cooper69 View Post
    That dose is pretty low to begin with for tyrosine. How you split the yohimbine dose doesn't matter a whole lot. Preworkout > fasted > feeding
    When you say preworkout > fasted > feeding, does that mean the fat burning effects will be there if you take it preworkout even if you aren't fasted (2 hours after eating for example)?

  8. That is correct

  9. What should the dose of Y HCl be if taken with caffeine and ephedrine? and how many times per day?

  10. Quote Originally Posted by dpk33 View Post
    What should the dose of Y HCl be if taken with caffeine and ephedrine? and how many times per day?
    No rep will recommend an ECY stack due to safety issues. I have done this, as have others and done 2 doses of 200mg C, 25mg E, 1.5-3mg Y twice a day. Do NOT do this before HIIT cardio.
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  11. Quote Originally Posted by chedapalooza View Post
    No rep will recommend an ECY stack due to safety issues. I have done this, as have others and done 2 doses of 200mg C, 25mg E, 1.5-3mg Y twice a day. Do NOT do this before HIIT cardio.
    Sound advice right here.
    Olympus Labs
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