Test/Tren Cycle

[freakyion]

I am getting ready to run my third AAS cycle, and I am looking for a little input on my planned cycle as I am deciding to use tren acetate for the first time. In the past I have run test e and equipoise in both of my previous two cycles. I ran test at 600mgs a week and equipoise at the same for 16 weeks both times. I was happy with my gains in strength and body composition after each.
I am a former college football player and I am currently at 245 pounds, 5'10"". My bf% is around 17 (based in my background with wrestling and having been extremely conscious of this in the past I have what I consider to be an adequate gauge in where I'm at. I'm also not concerned with the actual bf% so much as how l look and feel). It has been over a year since my last cycle and with some back issues I've taken it somewhat easy. The last 4 months I have been back in the gym hitting it as hard as I ever have and I'm ready to start a new cycle for a kick off to the summer.
My goals are to carb watch and pretty much get all of my nutrition from food with an occasional protein shake before bed.
I want to try tren because of the obvious praise that it has gotten and I am completely aware of the sides which is why in choosing tren acetate. I don't want to go overboard with this cycle and I am happy with my strength overall (I'm done being a "meathead") and I'd like to just recomp a little.
This is what I have as an idea for my cycle. Any input would be greatly appreciated, and I can certainly accept positive or negative criticism or advice.
Tren/Test Cycle
Test Enthanate -- 600-700mgs/wk x12-16wks
Tren Acetate -- 75-100mgs eod x8wks starting on week 4-8
**Potential to add Equipoise
PCT -- Clomid or Nolvadex
-Clomid- 150mgs/day x 2wks
100mgs/day x 2wks
50mgs/day x 1-2wks

 

[DetroitHammer]

I want to try tren because of the obvious praise that it has gotten and I am completely aware of the sides which is why in choosing tren acetate.

Just so I understand, what do you mean by the above?... Also, your planned test is way, way, way too high. Where do you think all that free test is going to go once you start tren? Not to the AR's, that's for sure.

 

[freakyion]

Just so I understand, what do you mean by the above?... Also, your planned test is way, way, way too high. Where do you think all that free test is going to go once you start tren? Not to the AR's, that's for sure.

What I meant was that tren has great reviews and I'm choosing acetate because it's a short ester and if the sides become too much to handle it will be out of my system more quickly than enthanate.
What would you suggest running for test then?

 

[g0hardorgohom]

I'd take just 200mg/week of test. It's enough that you'll be able to function. Low test with tren is the trend nowadays.

Your Clomid is also way too high. 50/50/50/25/25/25 is enough.

I'd probably take HCG for the last two months of the cycle. I found that 250IU E3D works well.

 

[DetroitHammer]

What I meant was that tren has great reviews and I'm choosing acetate because it's a short ester and if the sides become too much to handle it will be out of my system more quickly than enthanate.
What would you suggest running for test then?

Ok, good reasoning. Last time I was on tren (Last year, April-Sept) I dosed tren at 200mgs Enantahe once a week and Tren Hex EOD at 100mgs. My test was 100mgs max per week. Let tren take over, because it will, and don't worry about test over 100mgs. Actually, if you take HCG you won't even need additional test. If you wanted a super kick, add some Anadrol and you'll be the Hulk.

 

[freakyion]

Ok, good reasoning. Last time I was on tren (Last year, April-Sept) I dosed tren at 200mgs Enantahe once a week and Tren Hex EOD at 100mgs. My test was 100mgs max per week. Let tren take over, because it will, and don't worry about test over 100mgs. Actually, if you take HCG you won't even need additional test. If you wanted a super kick, add some Anadrol and you'll be the Hulk.

Ok, after reading that I have a couple other questions. Since I'm not planning on starting the tren until week 4-8 should I start with test high and then decrease when I start tren? Or just run low dose test for a while before? And in your opinion at what point would I add Anadrol and at what dose?

 

[g0hardorgohom]

I'd suggest to kickstart your cycle with Anadrol at 50mg/day for 6ish weeks. Start Tren when you drop Anadrol. If you want to run high test with Anadrol, use test prop so that clears before you throw in tren.

 

[DetroitHammer]

Ok, after reading that I have a couple other questions. Since I'm not planning on starting the tren until week 4-8 should I start with test high and then decrease when I start tren? Or just run low dose test for a while before? And in your opinion at what point would I add Anadrol and at what dose?

There are others that cycle and have a better feel for this, but this is what I'd do. Run the test full dose until you start tren. Then back off the test while on Tren. I'd start using Anadrol Maybe week three for 4-6 weeks.

 

[freakyion]

There are others that cycle and have a better feel for this, but this is what I'd do. Run the test full dose until you start tren. Then back off the test while on Tren. I'd start using Anadrol Maybe week three for 4-6 weeks.

Much appreciated. Seeing as this is somewhat of a cutting cycle and I'm already about as "bulky" as I'd like to be, is Anadrol counterproductive to this goal or are the gains in mass clean enough to roll smoothly through the remaining weeks of my cycle?

 

[DetroitHammer]

Much appreciated. Seeing as this is somewhat of a cutting cycle and I'm already about as "bulky" as I'd like to be, is Anadrol counterproductive to this goal or are the gains in mass clean enough to roll smoothly through the remaining weeks of my cycle?

Personally, I never bloat on Anadrol. Others do. I use it for the strength and mass, coupled with Tren, it makes for a killer cycle. You could experiment for two weeks and see how you react.

When I used tren, I got stupid strong. After month 4, my strength went out of bounds. As you know, tren makes tendons brittle. My elbows, especially the right elbow, hurt real bad. But I pushed on. Even after I got off tren and cruised on 400 test per week and some mast, plus other stuff, I continued to lift relatively heavy, with my elbow being the limiting factor. It eventually tore off my bone and rolled up my sleeve. I'm in week 6 of post surgery recovery. So be careful about tren's amazing strength giving properties. Good luck.

 

[freakyion]

Personally, I never bloat on Anadrol. Others do. I use it for the strength and mass, coupled with Tren, it makes for a killer cycle. You could experiment for two weeks and see how you react. When I used tren, I got stupid strong. After month 4, my strength went out of bounds. As you know, tren makes tendons brittle. My elbows, especially the right elbow, hurt real bad. But I pushed on. Even after I got off tren and cruised on 400 test per week and some mast, plus other stuff, I continued to lift relatively heavy, with my elbow being the limiting factor. It eventually tore off my bone and rolled up my sleeve. I'm in week 6 of post surgery recovery. So be careful about tren's amazing strength giving properties. Good luck.

Yeah that makes sense, ease into it and see how I'm feeling. Regardless, I'm sure the bloat would go away relatively quickly after starting tren.
Good looking out on the tendon thing too, I'm sorry to hear that happened to you, hope all goes well. Is there anything I can take supplementally to help with that? Like fish oil or glucosamine?

 

[kgoldstone]

Hey guys just looking for a few pointers, I'm going to be doing my first cycle, been lifting for 10Years. I'm 6'1 230 around 17% body fat, 25 years old. I've messed around with many prohormones, and clen. I'm looking to lean out over the next 8-12 weeks. I've been thinking about running a test prop, tren, and masteron stack, I understand it's not the best idea being new to cycles, but that's what I've decided on. Any recommendations on dosing?? Any help would be appreciated.

 

[asilentj3w]

To OP - fish oil should be a staple supp anyways. Dosing varies crazy. I take 9 pills/day (4.5 servings), but I also despise fish - so my omegas are slacking if I don't take the pills. Glucosamine and chondroitin are used to help joints and I'm sure they couldn't hurt. You won't notice results in your joints immediately though, may take a while. Hopefully someone else can help name other things

To kgoldstone - I'd stay away from tren first cycle. Get your diet straightened out. Can't be on point if you're 17%. If you really want to start pinning I would personally suggest sticking to a test only cycle being your first one. Don't want to throw in a bunch of new compounds at once, you want to introduce them individually so that you can see what does what and can pinpoint what is causing something. As for dosing - maybe 50-75mg ED?

 

[LionHeart56]

Way too high, lmao!

Bro almost every pro athlete on the planet measures their test levels (yes even when running 19-nors) IN THE ****ING GRAMS almost year round.

700 mgs of test lmao my left nut produced more than that before I even started AAS.

Everyone's body is different and no disrespect to "the man" but I'm gunna concur with him only based upon the fact that you are only on your third cycle. Tell us your previous cycles and your experiences with ancilliaries (AI's in regards to dosages).

That tren is probably going to wipe you off the face of the earth a lot faster than that little bitch ass test dose. Don't run Tren without prami or caber despite what conventional knowledge on the boards says. Its as essential to a proper tren run as an AI is to a high test run (I'm talking grams).



No disrespect to anyone it is my personal ****ing mission at this point to save everybody a lot of time with the bull**** that is spread like a virus on all the various forums.

 

[LionHeart56]

Personally, I never bloat on Anadrol. Others do. I use it for the strength and mass, coupled with Tren, it makes for a killer cycle. You could experiment for two weeks and see how you react.

When I used tren, I got stupid strong. After month 4, my strength went out of bounds. As you know, tren makes tendons brittle. My elbows, especially the right elbow, hurt real bad. But I pushed on. Even after I got off tren and cruised on 400 test per week and some mast, plus other stuff, I continued to lift relatively heavy, with my elbow being the limiting factor. It eventually tore off my bone and rolled up my sleeve. I'm in week 6 of post surgery recovery. So be careful about tren's amazing strength giving properties. Good luck.

Yeah I know I'm gunna get flamed for disagreeing with this guy he obviously has experience. Couldn't agree more Anadrol + Tren = strength like you wouldn't believe. I'm talking ****ing in a matter of days you are picking **** up you couldn't even budge before AND IT FEELS LIGHT. ****ing conan strength.

Just make sure you control your prolactin and you build up slowly with the tren, and with the drol cycle that **** your liver will thank you. They say it up-regulates estrogen receptors too I haven't been able to verify this with any scientific data. I do know that it somehow operates through an alternative mechanism than AR activation so no matter what full-retard dosages you are on of other AAS, the addition of anadrol WILL blow you the **** up even further.

Not a show drug but if you want to lift weights like king-mother****ing-kong and your liver isn't half-dead, it's a staple

 

[LionHeart56]

Hey guys just looking for a few pointers, I'm going to be doing my first cycle, been lifting for 10Years. I'm 6'1 230 around 17% body fat, 25 years old. I've messed around with many prohormones, and clen. I'm looking to lean out over the next 8-12 weeks. I've been thinking about running a test prop, tren, and masteron stack, I understand it's not the best idea being new to cycles, but that's what I've decided on. Any recommendations on dosing?? Any help would be appreciated.

make a new thread friend you will get more responses

 

[LionHeart56]

Last useful thing I can contribute to this thread...


Tren runs were always hell for me until I started one after already being on EQ for a month or two. EQ increases RBC = more endurance. I could be on high doses of tren without passing out in the squat rack or feeling like i was going to die walking up stairs.

More endurance = more reps = more growth.

I won't run tren without EQ and prami (or caber) at this point. Do that and I honestly believe the bull**** about low test isn't necessary. Just control your estro with an AI (only when needed) or throw some mast in that bitch.

Right now I'm running 1750 mg EW Sustanon (250 ED), 700mg EW Tren Ace (100mg ED), 900mg EW EQ (300mg EOD), 600 mg EW Mast E (200mg EOD). I cycle dbol/drol mix 5 weeks on 5 weeks off.

I take aromasin as needed, prami every night, and IGF1 5 weeks on 5 weeks off. Gunna start GH permanent and slin 5 weeks on / 5 weeks off (in rotation with the IGF1). The prami keeps me from becoming a lunatic on the tren (well it dampens it lol).

I get bloodwork and ****, and this isn't a "hobby" for me, FYI.

I built up over time to my dosages but with the EQ and prami and controlling estrogen lowering test does nothing except slow me down. START LOW on your first tren run and prepare your mother****ing anus. The emotions, etc....you adjust over time. And FYI don't know what you're solution is going to be but I can't sleep for **** on tren if I am not running IGF1 or GH in conjuction.

If you aren't going to go balls deep and blast/cruise/trt and include either some quality peptides or GH, I think you are better with Deca or NPP instead of Tren.

Just some random info that I thought was relevant. Much respect to all the brothers in this thread and Good luck OP.


What position did you play ****er? Inside LB here (God I miss it)

 

[GLHF]

Agree wih much of the above post

Run eq high like 1000mg ew range with tren ace 50-100mg Ed. And also have test. U won't get **** done if u taking about 1.5g of anabolics and say 250mg test e per week. Ur dick won't work. U won't feel good.

If ur lean than ur test needs to equal other anabolics. Say 700mg of tren a week, u should take about that much test. IF UR LEAN. Ull blow up and love it.

For the bigger bro that say 5-10 240 at 15-20% use high tren low prop like 100mg eod to cut down to under 10%. True under ten percent. Than blast test/tren/eq/mast like I said befor and Ull blow the fuk up.

Control cycle with caber/prami and aromasin. **** the Nolva clomid bs. Tamoxifen PROVEN to cause cancer- yea that's fukn right I'm not tripping FDA gives it to breast cancer
Patients cuz it's corrupt. Forget the Nolva. U wan fight bitch tits?? Prevent em from happening or letro or surgery.

HGH/igf/slin I'm not gon get into. U want HGH. Real growth.

Lean and mean.

 

[Blergs]

Id make the trena 8-10 weeks this time around, have prami and AI on go. CEM has em if you need.
Prami i rec near bed time IMO

 

[B5150]

Test = elevated hematocrit
EQ = elevated RBC
Tren = elevated BP

Elevated Hematocrit + Elevated RBC + Elevated BP = not the best idea IMHO

OP,

Test - 200mg/w max
Tren - 400mg/w max
Mast - 400mg/w
Caber/AI - optional/as needed

GTG

 

[LionHeart56]

Running EQ with Tren and Test is very common.

Monitor your blood pressure you should be doing that anyway. If you are that worried about it get bloodwork done and you can either cycle off a compound or have blood-drawn if **** is getting too high.

FYI I've been on EQ 900mg a week, Tren 700mg a week, and test 1750 a week (plus mast 600 a week) for ****ing six months. Yeah my hemocrite is a little high and so is my RBC and my strength is through the ****ing rough. It isn't so high that I'm on the verge of stroking the **** out.

 

[LionHeart56]

Obviously you should be aware of the effects David Dunn was outlining but it isn't as bad as one might think. Throw a little caution to the wind if you want to see any magic happen. Just keep up with your bloodwork and ****.

 

[B5150]

Obviously you should be aware of the effects David Dunn was outlining but it isn't as bad as one might think. Throw a little caution to the wind if you want to see any magic happen. Just keep up with your bloodwork and ****.

Running EQ with Tren and Test is very common.

Monitor your blood pressure you should be doing that anyway. If you are that worried about it get bloodwork done and you can either cycle off a compound or have blood-drawn if **** is getting too high.

FYI I've been on EQ 900mg a week, Tren 700mg a week, and test 1750 a week (plus mast 600 a week) for ****ing six months. Yeah my hemocrite is a little high and so is my RBC and my strength is through the ****ing rough. It isn't so high that I'm on the verge of stroking the **** out.

As proud as you may be of your cycle I have a feeling my wife and family would not find my though the ****ing roof strength very consoling at my funeral.

Some are not as interested in the magic as much as longevity. To each his own.

 

[LionHeart56]

As proud as you may be of your cycle I have a feeling my wife and family would not find my though the ****ing roof strength very consoling at my funeral.

Some are not as interested in the magic as much as longevity. To each his own.

Hey bro, I'm not recommending those DOSES to anyone. I'm just pointing out that you can in fact run EQ with Tren and Test. In fact EQ and prami, as it turns out, is the little secret to not being all ****ed up and sick and crazy as hell when running high doses of tren. I know several guys in real life and dozens on another forum running the same.

Just sayin'.

However, we do all have different priorities, different reasons why we do this. Everyone does a cost benefit analysis in relation to the risks they are willing to take and the resources that they have available to keep themselves healthy, and of course the experience they have. I do absolutely think the information about hemocrit / rbc and blood pressure was absolutely essential I should have mentioned that, its a given that I overlooked. Just monitor your blood pressure and get bloodwork done occasionally it isn't as bad as it might sound "on paper" (i.e. **** being repeated on forums).

 

[LionHeart56]

The blanket statement that you can't run EQ with test and tren, quite frankly and with all respect brother, is ****ing bull****. It is common in many circles.

The strength of tren + being able to breathe and still have endurance is pretty amazing.

 

[LionHeart56]

I have not come to piss off any moderators! Haha, I love anabolic minds. It's where I started in the PEDs world and you bastards taught me a lot, kept me safe. Now I'm spending a lot more time with professional athletes and have more or less just come back to sprinkle a little bit of truth into the mix.

I'm also a little pissed about all the **** I read on here about milk-thistle and how these designer 17aa's are better for you than just moving on to the real thing lol haha

 

[Lukef2000]

Way too high, lmao! Bro almost every pro athlete on the planet measures their test levels (yes even when running 19-nors) IN THE ****ING GRAMS almost year round. 700 mgs of test lmao my left nut produced more than that before I even started AAS. Everyone's body is different and no disrespect to "the man" but I'm gunna concur with him only based upon the fact that you are only on your third cycle. Tell us your previous cycles and your experiences with ancilliaries (AI's in regards to dosages). That tren is probably going to wipe you off the face of the earth a lot faster than that little bitch ass test dose. Don't run Tren without prami or caber despite what conventional knowledge on the boards says. Its as essential to a proper tren run as an AI is to a high test run (I'm talking grams). No disrespect to anyone it is my personal ****ing mission at this point to save everybody a lot of time with the bull**** that is spread like a virus on all the various forums.

It's not exactly bull**** if it's a proven fact that tren binds 5 times stronger to the AR than test. You don't have unlimited ARs so it's prudent to utilize compounds effectively. If higher dosed tren is binding to for example 80% of your body's androgen receptors then that only leaves 20% for other compounds to bind to. It gets to a point of diminishing returns, sure your probably getting crazy results on that cycle you mentioned but who's to say how much is being utilized effectively and how much is floating around unused.

The blanket statement that you can't run EQ with test and tren, quite frankly and with all respect brother, is ****ing bull****. It is common in many circles. The strength of tren + being able to breathe and still have endurance is pretty amazing.

I agree here i would however suggest to give blood while on eq as it does make blood "thicker" and can decrease endurance if this isn't controlled so if utilized effectively eq can be a great choice to run with tren. Also remember that tren being a bronchial constrictor will always make breathing rough and eq while it may increase endurance won't actually alleviate this side effect as it improves endurance via a different pathway.

 

[B5150]

My statement regarding test, tren and EQ was a general caution. Simply because many do and it could be controlled doesn't mean all should and all can control the issue. The OP who BTW has long since abandoned this thread was fairly new to anabolics and some of us don't throw caution to the wind when considering long term health and offer more conservative advice. Juiced to the gills is not so desiresble to some regardless of who believes otherwise.

 

[LionHeart56]

My statement regarding test, tren and EQ was a general caution. Simply because many do and it could be controlled doesn't mean all should and all can control the issue. The OP who BTW has long since abandoned this thread was fairly new to anabolics and some of us don't throw caution to the wind when considering long term health and offer more conservative advice. Juiced to the gills is not so desiresble to some regardless of who believes otherwise.

Word man, don't disagree with any of this. I have different values and goals than you do.

With that caveat I don't disagree with anything you've posted.

 

[LionHeart56]

It's not exactly bull**** if it's a proven fact that tren binds 5 times stronger to the AR than test. You don't have unlimited ARs so it's prudent to utilize compounds effectively. If higher dosed tren is binding to for example 80% of your body's androgen receptors then that only leaves 20% for other compounds to bind to. It gets to a point of diminishing returns, sure your probably getting crazy results on that cycle you mentioned but who's to say how much is being utilized effectively and how much is floating around unused.




I agree here i would however suggest to give blood while on eq as it does make blood "thicker" and can decrease endurance if this isn't controlled so if utilized effectively eq can be a great choice to run with tren. Also remember that tren being a bronchial constrictor will always make breathing rough and eq while it may increase endurance won't actually alleviate this side effect as it improves endurance via a different pathway.

This is mostly all great info and advice!

FYI I use ephedrine for the bronchial issue lol.

The diminishing returns is also true. In my ****ed up world every rep and every pound counts.

Very good input with one caveat. The AR issue. Not all effects of AAS are AR mediated and too be honest I'm too lazy to go into all of what I've read. Not to mention that there are other issues you are battling such as SHBG, etc. It sucks and nobody wants to admit it but the fact is that more really IS better (although like you said on a diminishing scale) up until you destroy an organ or **** some other aspect of health up so that you either can't train or you die. That's the truth.

And my "mega-dosing" doesn't even ****ing APPROACH what the guys you all look up to are doing, lmao.


Anyway, main point other than giving you props for the good info in your post is that there isn't a lot of science about androgen receptors, AR upregulation / down regulation, how hypertrophy or hyperplasia affects ARs, or non-AR mediated / post-AR mediated effects of AAS. And if you can't just discount that discussion some of the most powerful AAS have some hard-mother****ing-core results that are nearly immediate even on low doses and yet have VERY VERY poor AR-binding affinity (anadrol for example).


We are all mad-scientists operating in an environment where gathering data is very difficult and illegal. People have a tendency to believe things to be FACT when they are nothing more than theories repeated thousands upon thousands of times within a particular group. I hate to say it but if a lot of the **** that I read on the boards were true a whole ****-load of guys that I know and thousands upon thousands that we read about would be some dead mother****ers right now.

Just sayin'.

Then you get the odd guy who grows tits on 500mg of test and his heart explodes when he eats an extra caffeine pill. Survival of the fittest I guess. There is the "dark-side" and then there is the MOTHER****ING "DARK-SIDE". There is no right and wrong its just choose your own path. I see so many damn people on the internet acting like they know everything there is to know about AAS and what constitutes safe vs. unsafe vs. what is effective vs. who gives a **** that if it were ANY sort of indication of the reality there would be a mr. olympia contendor on every block.


The great philosopher Socrates once asked the oracle in the city of Delphi who she believed to be the wisest man. She said that Socrates himself was. He stood up and replied "If I am wise, it is only because I know that I know nothing." Bowed his head, and walked away.

Personally I've seen very little scientific method behind the establishment of the magic numbers everybody spouts off on the internet and I'm kinda sick of every gym rat thinking that they know everything there is to know. I don't know ****. All I know is that those are the doses I'm running and my bloods are good and my BP is good and I'm stronger than ****ing satan.

 

[LionHeart56]

Anyway guys, it is very clear to me that you all obviously have a lot of experience with AAS and all the **** involved in this game. I'm not trying to storm in here and disrespect anybody and I do see some slight differences in our general approaches, I would love to spend some time here and see if we can't learn from eachother in an honest and objective fashion without becoming adversarial on a personal level.

Hell I don't know everything there is to know that's for ****ing sure. Train hard brothers!