Consequences of year round blast and cruise
- 11-30-2013, 09:30 PM
Consequences of year round blast and cruise
Hey bros, doing my winter cycle discussed and critiqued in a previous thread, things are going amazing.. Started off at 195lbs less than 2 months ago after taking 2nd place in a NPC physique competition and up to 218lbs. Up 23lbs trying to get up to 225-230.. And just wondering what are some of the consequences or long term sides of running a year round blast and cruise? Havent picked out compounds yet, but i am absolutely addicted to this lifestyle, i love workin hard, i love destroying the iron, i love pounds of chicken and brown rice all day. However i do want kids one day and my largest concern is if i were to run cycles year round would it make me permanently infertile? Ive been trying to research it and would like to get some input from my bros on AM. Thanks for the input guys
- 11-30-2013, 09:59 PM
There is no guarantee it will make you infertile, but in the long term it could definitely affect your HPTA negatively. Look at Branch Warren, he had a kid Feb 2012. Also Evan Centopani has a child that was born a couple years ago. However I don't know about Evan but Branch Warren has said(according to a forum) at a UKBFF expo that he cycles 18 weeks on 6 weeks off. Still that's a lot of time on.
But there's no guarantee it won't make YOU infertile either, it could happen. I think the chances of becoming 100% infertile from steroid use alone are slim, but I wouldn't dismiss it completely. Keep in mind though you could also become infertile without ever cycling, happens to many men all around the world."Lifting and Game of Thrones share the same calendar, there's only two seasons: cutting and bulking. And guess what? Winter's comin' so it's time to bulk up!"
- 11-30-2013, 10:27 PM
11-30-2013, 10:33 PM
I know it may be a dumb question but when i normally run my cycles i usually do 250ius of hcg every 3 days, its not a problem to run hcg year round if my cycles going to be year round is it? And what would be an example of a messed up HPTA system? I wont have any deformed kids as a result of all my juicing will I? That my primary concern. Thanks for the input so far, its very helpful and insightful
11-30-2013, 10:40 PM
12-01-2013, 09:44 AM
After seeing so many of my friends that had difficulty having children, if that were a concern, I would steer clear. As mentioned, there is no guarantee either way, but I sure would want to put the chances on my side. The mentality is difficult though, because you don't have kids and it is still about you. I have them, so my mind is on how great it is to have them. That puts a bias in my opinion.
12-01-2013, 10:00 AM
12-01-2013, 10:15 AM
12-01-2013, 12:03 PM
12-01-2013, 02:44 PM
12-01-2013, 08:24 PM
Thanks DetroitHammer, i really appreciate the input.. I have a friend whos mom works for a doctors office that can do all my bloodwork and test levels, im not sure if shes a doctor or just works there but i was going to go thru my friend and have his mom set something up for me to check my levels and make sure my body is all good... And 4 months on and 2 months off is probably the route im going to take in the upcoming months and stick with that for a pretty long time.
12-01-2013, 11:53 PM
12-06-2013, 05:19 AM
12-07-2013, 06:52 PM
12-08-2013, 08:27 PM
Ive been blasting and crusiing for 3 years now and am very happy with it. I cant imagine not being on something. I know that i do not want kids tho and fully expect to be on TRT for the rest of my life
12-09-2013, 12:43 PM
12-11-2013, 04:51 PM
I've blasted and cruised for the last couple years now, and my wife wants to try for child numero dos, but no luck the last few months....about a month now I've been on clomid and HCG, and got off my test/tren 100/100 cruise.....still waiting but my B's ain't so small so something is working.
I'm 37 and thought one kiddo was enough (he's 7 now), but my other half has changed my mind lol...I've read guys on blasts had luck with HCG and clomid getting their other halves preggers, so anything's possible I guess....can't really say for certain but there are ways to help improve your chances!!
I give a f**K!!
12-12-2013, 01:13 AM
12-14-2013, 12:49 AM
Guy that runs 250mg year round and doubles up when he wants a boost will be far healthier than guy that runs high doses for 12 weeks intermittently
Don't run hCG through your cycle, your leydig cells will desensitise to it and you'll have trouble when you actually need it. Balls will stay big if you run sensible doses and have high IGF-1. If you want to get your mrs pregnant then use it. I know a few guys that got their partner pregnant on +3g cycles with a 5000ui hcg shot
12-14-2013, 07:11 AM
12-14-2013, 10:02 AM
12-14-2013, 12:22 PM
12-14-2013, 08:05 PM
When your older, you will have issues with sperm count and testosterone levels. But luckily we have HRT clinics and sperm banks. Hopefully people will take both arguments and come up with their own logical conclusion instead of just believing what I, or anyone else says at face value
12-14-2013, 09:36 PM
Ok, I assumed that this was opinion, but wanted to make sure. Certainly you understand that 250mg is not anywhere the amount needed to see growth and that test is not the only factor, but just a part of the equation. Also, I am not sure where you are getting your data regarding HPTA, but it is not accurate.
12-14-2013, 10:05 PM
12-14-2013, 11:22 PM
12-15-2013, 01:17 AM
If you're going to point something out for being "broscience" at least actually refute the point
Yeah he will be suppressed all year round. So what? What are the negative health effects from being suppressed year round when you're taking testosterone anyway? Do TRT patients also get these alleged "health effects"? I have no idea what negative health effects you're talking about from running a cc a week. You'll get lowered sperm count, get your sperm frozen. Study done on HRT patients showed this (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1172906), and testosterone therapy was even stopped without PCT.
Running high doses will influence blood pressure, lipid profiles, I don't really need to go into it. Instead of growing a load then going back to nutjuice (which will only get you so far lets be serious) you're far better off in the long run using the minimum needed to grow and the minimum needed to maintain. If your diet and training is spot on this won't be an issue at all, people are just lazy
12-15-2013, 12:57 PM
A young healthy male should be able to recover from a cycle and return to his natural levels rapidly, with or without PCT. Since his natural level will be close to what 250cc a week would yield, it won’t be the ideal level for maintaining any growth beyond normal. Unless you are old like me and need help. But a young guy is better off to let his body return to a natural state if that’s what 250cc a week is designed to do. Vigilant blood work would prove this out per individual. Once an individual is unable to maintain levels that TRT doses would yield, then a cruising and blasting routine may be the way to go, but if your body is capable of returning to normal levels, then that would be the healthiest way to go.
So I tend to agree that 250cc a week is a good TRT dose, I’m not sure that it’s advisable for a young male to jump on that dose when his body is more than capable of sustaining that level of ng/dL naturally.
I do agree that going on a 20 week cycle of heavy AAS, then coming off, then going back on is not real healthy either. It plays havoc psychologically and physiologically. For that reason, I am not a strong proponent of anyone in their 20s to jump into AAS unless they need to in order to compete or make a living. Then I would follow the same routine that a pro body builder does, and never come off, just go down to maybe 500 test per week, along with other gear, then blast up for the event.
As far as sperm count goes and other sides, that’s a risk we all take. Most are manageable risks. We have to address each one and determine if we are willing to take that risk with risk mitigation protocols.
I think the older you are, the more sense it makes to stay on AAS year-round. So your example is spot on for anyone who can’t produce maybe 600ng/dL a week naturally.
12-15-2013, 01:20 PM
12-15-2013, 01:30 PM
But again, test is only part of the equation. I was able to keep muscle and bulk when my test levels were <300. Just a lot more heavy work and a lot closer attention paid to diet.
12-15-2013, 06:22 PM
Interesting about the doses you're taking and the blood levels you're getting
HRT dose is 250mg every 14 days in Australia and will get you blood levels in the upper normal range. My friend is transgender and this puts him at 900-1200 13 days post injection. Are you using UGL or pharmacy products?
12-15-2013, 06:44 PM
When are your friends getting their blood drawn? If it's on day 13 and they have levels between 900 and 1200 then something isn't right. Just knowing how esters work and cleave off, the maximum levels will be 5 days post injection. On day 7 (assuming cypionate) the levels will have dropped considerably. On day 14, there will be barely a trace of test in their system. Injecting 250 every two weeks will provide a very unstable serum testosterone level. And that's the problem with long esters, and I consider enanthate and cypionate to be long esters. The cleavage is way to precarious and unpredictable. Whereas a shorter ester, like prop or hex, will be much more stable and available. Injecting 75mgs of prop every other day is way more effective than 250mgs of cyp every two weeks.
12-15-2013, 06:47 PM
I don't know why it would be any different there as opposed to here, but it's well known that if any doc tries to tell you to inject every 2 weeks, you run away. That is a protocol from another era and one you may find here with an inexperienced doctor. Let's just take your example at face value and assume that it is true heshe runs the top of the range 13 days out. That means they are running WAY above any normal limit for almost the entire time between injections. Stop for a minute and think about that and what TRT is supposed to do (hint: keep you within normal limits) and it is easy to see why that is wrong and bad. Not to mention what it must be doing for e2, BP, hematocrit levels along the way.
12-15-2013, 06:53 PM
Also kisaj, again that's a ****load of assumptions and the doctor is a close family member so I have the utmost faith in the doctors ability to keep my friend healthy and give an adequate HRT protocol
12-15-2013, 07:08 PM
I have assumed nothing and only posted what is fairly obvious. Rather than take it personal, just take a step back and try to understand what is being said. Unless you run lab ranges that are completely different and 900-1200 is near the bottom of the range for Australia, then there is no debate. They are running well above normal range almost all the time.
Also, who cares who the doctor is? 2 weeks simply is a hormonal rollercoaster and not a good protocol. Look around here and see why so many people move to an e3.5d type schedule.
12-15-2013, 07:16 PM
12-15-2013, 07:45 PM
12-15-2013, 07:48 PM
12-15-2013, 08:00 PM
No idea what other friends you're talking about
250mg a fortnight is a standard HRT protocol in Australia to get levels into the 700-900 range
http://roidcalc.powerbody.ru/ this site is good, I don't like using them but it demonstrates it nicely
Half life of enanthate is 10.5 days. So in 10.5 days no injections, you will have half the amount as you did day 1
You'll be able to see that even in the worst case part, 13 days post injection you will have 12mg in the blood, this takes into account molecular weight of the ester too. This is 84mg a week going by worst case which is plenty for health, most guys will produce less than this and this is just the last day. It averages at 18mg a day or around 125mg a week.
250mg a week will be even better, as long as you're getting good quality- I suspect most people are getting bunk which is why these myths come about but this is just conjecture.
12-15-2013, 08:11 PM
"The material you read on half lives were probably referring to exponential decay, such as is usual with radioactive materials and true, it follows that fixed rate pattern; however, in your case, you have a pharmaceutical non exponential decay and YES, it is dependent on the original quantity you began with as well as how much is left. It is very conceivable and probable that each phase of the substances' half- life shortens as it continues to be eliminated or lose effectiveness. Other factors such as accumulation in the body, metabolism etc., influences the rate, as well.To sum it up, you are correct..."
At the half life, you have half (in vitro) the amount. Your next half life is 25% of the first. The next is 5% of the first. So after 10 days, you are pretty much at the end of your dose. If 10 days represents the half, then at maybe 13 days, it's over. If you inject 250mgs do you really believe that you will get an even distribution of molecules released into the blood stream over 14 days? Impossible. You will get the most within the first five days. After that the levels start falling off. After 10 days it's usually at the bottom of the chart, near zero.
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