12wk cycle, should I kickstart it?

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    12wk cycle, should I kickstart it?


    Cycle will be andropen 275 pinned mon/thurs.

    I have plenty of mdrol/SD-transform on hand, but I really can't deal with the lethargic sides that I get at higher doses. Would it be worth it to use 10/10/10 of SD to kickstart it? or perhaps 10/10/20? My last ED SD cycle was 10/20/20/20, and by 3rd week the lethargy really kicked in.

    I also have a limited supply of 10mg tabs of var. I've been reading that var is better used for a finisher, but I have no idea if that would be needed since this is my first pinned cycle. Has anyone used this for a kicker in the beginning?

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    heard kickstart was useless.... Cant remember where i heard that from.... Maybe somone could support me.....
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    Just read same thing on another thread as well. Especially with var. Was planning on kickstarting a Test cycle with it in Jan but might save the money and see how I do with a Test-only cycle for a first injectable run.
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    If first time injecting then i would highly recommend a just test cycle
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    I am going to do a test cycle beginning of next year and it will start as just test with the possibility of adding an oral in either week 5 or week 7. I have read that if your test is really kicking, week 5-6 for most, orals are best used then as opposed to a kickstart, especially something like Dbol. Again, not from personal experience but from many who have used this method successfully. If lethargy on SD is an issue, I would add it in once the test is working in your favor, it may be a very different run as opposed at the beginning.
    If my direct and cynical approach bothers you, just ignore it. I'm just saying what you need to hear ;).
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    lol kickstart is useless?
    slow acting- test e, meaning gains start after 6th week
    fast acting- dbol, meaning gains start right now

    sooooo, combine slow + fast and u get like 1-10 test e, 1-4 dbol. meaning ur gaining from week 1 up till week 12. compared to very little gains in first few weeks and than gaining after that till week 12.
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    Quote Originally Posted by GLHF
    lol kickstart is useless?
    slow acting- test e, meaning gains start after 6th week
    fast acting- dbol, meaning gains start right now

    sooooo, combine slow + fast and u get like 1-10 test e, 1-4 dbol. meaning ur gaining from week 1 up till week 12. compared to very little gains in first few weeks and than gaining after that till week 12.
    This is the reason you would want to kick start and they are far from useless. There are many ways to do it with orals or faster acting forms of test (prop or TNE). If its your first cycle I would stick to test only just to see how you respond to that first then run a kick start next cycle.
    For me I prefer to run a faster acting form of test the whole time and not have to worry about adding orals into the picture but lots of people have had great cycles front loading with them.
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    Quote Originally Posted by GLHF View Post
    lol kickstart is useless?
    slow acting- test e, meaning gains start after 6th week
    fast acting- dbol, meaning gains start right now

    sooooo, combine slow + fast and u get like 1-10 test e, 1-4 dbol. meaning ur gaining from week 1 up till week 12. compared to very little gains in first few weeks and than gaining after that till week 12.
    i didnt think that was called kickstart.... if im wrong thought it was when you ramp up your dosage at the beginning.
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    You are talking about front loading; there verdict on front loading is still out even though some swear by it and others say it is a waste of test. Test Prop and TNE are definitely a way to kick start gains in the beginning, I have read extensively about that but many complain about PIP with test prop and tne/test suspension.
    If my direct and cynical approach bothers you, just ignore it. I'm just saying what you need to hear ;).
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    Quote Originally Posted by madds87 View Post
    i didnt think that was called kickstart.... if im wrong thought it was when you ramp up your dosage at the beginning.
    That's a frontload when done with injectables. If you planned on using 500mgs weekly you inject 1000mgs the first week. Some will do it the second too. Anecdotally it doesn't seem to affect gains in the end. Kickstarting with fast acting orals, ie. Dbol, A-50 or SD gets strength and water weight up quickly for a psychological boost.
    Lift heavy and eat lots of dead animals! Yes, that's me in my avatar.
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    Ok. My bad.... Got my terms mixed up. Thank yah for clearin.
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    Thanks for the input guys. I think I'll just stick with test-only w/o a kickstart. I'll be running a blend, so that should help the test kick in sooner than wk6 hopefully!

    As fro the var... what to do with it... hmmmm maybe I'll just save it for my cut to retain muscle mass while on a caloric deficit in the spring.
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    Quote Originally Posted by oufinny
    You are talking about front loading; there verdict on front loading is still out even though some swear by it and others say it is a waste of test. Test Prop and TNE are definitely a way to kick start gains in the beginning, I have read extensively about that but many complain about PIP with test prop and tne/test suspension.
    Prop definitely causes pain for me especially at higher concentrations. TNE was more painful than prop but kicks in very fast so it gets a few bonus points from me for that. If TNE wasn't such a pain in the ass to make I would run it more often.
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    Quote Originally Posted by gaijininjapan
    Thanks for the input guys. I think I'll just stick with test-only w/o a kickstart. I'll be running a blend, so that should help the test kick in sooner than wk6 hopefully!

    As fro the var... what to do with it... hmmmm maybe I'll just save it for my cut to retain muscle mass while on a caloric deficit in the spring.
    With the blend you should see gains sooner due to the prop. How often are you planning on pinning?
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    Quote Originally Posted by icon0561 View Post
    Prop definitely causes pain for me especially at higher concentrations. TNE was more painful than prop but kicks in very fast so it gets a few bonus points from me for that. If TNE wasn't such a pain in the ass to make I would run it more often.
    I am told the new TNE done in oil is much less painful but that is dependent on the chemist and how it is formulated I imagine. Not even close to the point where I would be ready to use something like that but in time I want to try, I hear it is just sick.
    If my direct and cynical approach bothers you, just ignore it. I'm just saying what you need to hear ;).
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    dude use a kick start... gaining from week 1 of the cycle ensures better muscle retention.

    and one of the worst things is waiting for test e to kick in lol. you're just pinning yourself for weeks and still feel natural in the gym although your libido will be very high. gains are so slow.

    i'm at the point where i'm not gaining anything from test but it can sustain my gains from any oral very well. it's pretty much become a muscle maintenance steroid for me so def use a kickstart imo
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    Quote Originally Posted by chocolatemilk View Post
    dude use a kick start... gaining from week 1 of the cycle ensures better muscle retention.

    and one of the worst things is waiting for test e to kick in lol. you're just pinning yourself for weeks and still feel natural in the gym although your libido will be very high. gains are so slow.

    i'm at the point where i'm not gaining anything from test but it can sustain my gains from any oral very well. it's pretty much become a muscle maintenance steroid for me so def use a kickstart imo

    x2x


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    with being on the tes the lethargy wont be as bad
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    Quote Originally Posted by oufinny

    I am told the new TNE done in oil is much less painful but that is dependent on the chemist and how it is formulated I imagine. Not even close to the point where I would be ready to use something like that but in time I want to try, I hear it is just sick.
    I've made the suspension in water and made it with EO/ Guaiacol and its painful either way. Nothing that would keep me from using it, but its not exactly pleasant.
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    Quote Originally Posted by icon0561 View Post
    With the blend you should see gains sooner due to the prop. How often are you planning on pinning?
    I'm planning on pinning 2x/wk. I don't want to have to pin more than that really...

    Quote Originally Posted by gymrat827 View Post
    x2x


    SD
    10/10/20/20

    with being on the tes the lethargy wont be as bad
    Won't be as bad and non-existent are different. I can't deal with "not as bad." Actually, I might just run 10/10/10 kickstart, or just not even do a kick start this time around.
  

  
 

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