HCG ?

boggs67ss

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When do you need to run HCG in a cycle? I under stand its not need for like dbol/test cycles, or even dbol/eq/test, but when you need it? I notice people add it in for Tren, and is it mainly for keeping your boys in check? If anybody has a link for a write up on HCG that would be great. thanks.
 
nosnmiveins

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taken off another board...


Everything Im writing here is based on my personal opinion from info Ive read and from personal trial and error.
Ive done many cycles that did not include HCG in my early days, hell I didn't even know what PCT was. This was WAY before the internet so all my info was from freinds and the few books that were around.
I've done cycles that ended with just using HCG the 2wks after my last testE shot and saw results from that(1,000ius 2xwk/ 2wks). IMO never go over 2,000ius per week.
But about 3yrs ago I started using small amounts of HCG throughout the cycle with much better results. The theory behind this is to give constant stimulation throughout the cycle and not let your own test production stop, or at least minimize it. Ive also noticed my sex drive stayed constant while on HCG even when using Tren or Npp/Deca and doing very long cycles. This is without a doubt the best way to run it and IMO leads to better overall gains, reason is not only are you using artificial Test/AAS but you are still producing your own, to me this makes since.
There are 3 ways to use this method. note: always use the LEAST amount that you can get results from.

1) 100ius ED starting after wk1 and continued through cycle and for 4-18days after last AAS shot depending on the ester length (prop 4.5days - testE 14days - test Cyp 18days). Always make the last HCG shot on day ester clears.

2) 250-300ius EOD and (same as above)

3) 500ius E5D starting after wk1 and (same as above)

Ive done all and really can't say one is better, with #2-3 you won't go through as many needles but all have worked well for me.

PCT ( post cycle therapy )

Key word here is POST, meaning after the cycle is over and that means after all AAS esters have cleared your system not after your final shot.
HCG IS NOT FOR PCT IT IS FOR PRE-PCT, the time during your cycle and after last shot of AAS while esters are clearing. PCT starts on DAY4 after your last HCG shot. The reason for this is when you inject HCG you will get a spike several hours after shot and then again 72 hours later, after this final spike is when you want to start your PCT. Again HCG is not used for PCT.

Other info you will need.
Always use Bac water to mix your HCG, it will last up to 60 days in the fridge when BW is used.
Always use an insulin needle for injecting, size of slinpin does not matter but I use 29g 1cc.


MIXING
Use the bacwater, draw out 1cc BW(use a 1cc slinpin #10-100) and slowly add to p0wder and gently swirl till mixed. Then draw out mixture with 1.5" needle and inject into vial or leave in syringe and refridgerate. If you add 1cc to 5000ius then every 10mark on your 1ccslinpin will be 500ius of HCG (use E5D) if you want to use 250ius EOD then mix 2cc
s BW into p0wder and then every 10mark will have 250ius..........11
__________________

Now like I said this is my personal opinion on HCG.
Can you get by without HCG, sure.
Can you get by without PCT, sure
Can you build muscle without AAS, yes.
But if your going to spent your hard earned $$ on AAS, food and training then at least spend a little extra on trying to keep as much of those gains as possible and make recovery as easy as possible................
 

boggs67ss

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Good read, thanks NOS, your using HCG for your current cycle, right?
 
nosnmiveins

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yes i am. was doing 250iu 2x a week. about 5 weeks in i bumped to ~200iu 3x a week because the boys were shrinking, everything is good now
 
dg806

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From Bill L....

HCG


So we now see, contrary to the dominating opinion of the times, that anti-estrogens alone will do little to raise testosterone levels in the early weeks of the post-cycle window. This leaves us to focus on a very different level of the HPTA in order to hasten recovery: the testes. For this we will need the injectable drug HCG. If you are not familiar with it, HCG, or Human Chorionic Gonadotropin, is a prescription fertility agent that mimics the bodies own natural LH. Although the testes are equally desensitized to this drug as LH (they both work through the same mechanism), we are administering it as a measured drug and are therefore not constrained by the limits of our own LH production. We similarly can use HCG to provide a bolus dose of LH (of our choosing), which works only to augment the recovering LH levels we already have in the body. In essence we are looking to shock them with an overwhelmingly high level of LH activity, coming from both endogenous and exogenous sources. We want it to reach a level far above what our body, even when supported by anti-estrogens, could possibly do on its own. The result can be a rapid restoration of original testicular mass and functioning, which would allow normal levels of testosterone to be output much sooner than without such an ancillary program. What we are looking at now is HCG actually being the pivotal post-cycle drug, while anti-estrogens are relegated to a supportive role at best.



Finalizing the Program


An ideal post-cycle recovery program will focus on two things really. The first is hitting the testes hard with HCG. It is important, however, not to overuse this drug. Taken for too long, or at too high a dosage, the LH receptor will actually become desensitized to LH(2) , which may further exacerbate our post-cycle problem instead of helping it (this is why I am not in favor of regular HCG use on-cycle). My experience with HCG has led me to feel comfortable using it for a course of three weeks, at a dosage of maybe 5000-7500IU weekly. Often the last week I limit the dose to 2,500IU, unless the cycle has been particularly long or potent. This is timed so at least half of the total administered drug dosage will be given when there is still exogenous steroid in the body. On our graph above this would be at about the 3-week mark after the last injection of testosterone. This will give the testes some time to get back into shape before the baseline is actually hit with T levels. Secondly, Anti-estrogens are used to play a supportive role at the same time, so 20mg of Nolvadex or 50-100mg of Clomid would typically be added ( my last article for Mind and Muscle discusses the comparative differences with these two agents). This is to combat the suppressive effects of estrogen as testosterone levels start to go back up, as well as potential side effects (HCG has been shown to increase testicular aromatase activity as well (3)). Although in the first couple of weeks the anti-estrogen does little, it may indeed be helpful when testosterone levels actually start to get back up near normal. To further stimulate the HPTA, and support continuingly high LH levels, the anti-estrogen remains to be used for 2 to 3 weeks after the HCG therapy has been stopped. A sample program, as it would be instituted in our sample post-cycle window, is provided below.



Sample Post-cycle Plan:


Week 3: 5000IU HCG total + 20mg Nolvadex daily
Week 4: 5000IU HCG total + 20mg Nolvadex daily
Week 5: 2500IU HCG total + 20mg Nolvadex daily
Week 6: 20mg Nolvadex daily
Week 7: 20mg Nolvadex daily
Week 8: 20mg Nolvadex daily









Note: I would rather see guys use during cycle to keep from being so depressed in the first place. It makes recovery alot easier and quicker.
 
Frank Reynolds

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Note: I would rather see guys use during cycle to keep from being so depressed in the first place. It makes recovery alot easier and quicker.
I agree with that.. No matter the length, or the severity, id use it regardless. It is cheap enough.
 

bubbachew

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I need to get me some HCG for my Test E cycle...I've been looking...just can't find it...
 

bubbachew

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I know, but I don't know who is reliable and who isn't...
 
XplodeWithMe

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500iu a week split into 2 pins mon/thurs
It mimics your natty LH so you shouldn't use it in PCT since it will take longer to bring back your natty test
 
dg806

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As long as it's in the vial, it's freeze dried and should last several years.
 

samadhismiles

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yes i am. was doing 250iu 2x a week. about 5 weeks in i bumped to ~200iu 3x a week because the boys were shrinking, everything is good now
this is what I'll do for my next cycle (3x a week at 200). I started HCG late in the cycle after they shrunk and did it 250IU EOD and it bounced them back (first two doses were 500IU to get them started quick). I will never run test without HCG from now on. It increases strength to be on HCG also while on test I have found.
 
MasterFlexx

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Great plan to run while on cycle. Keep your boys in check and after much research a much better way than hcg in pct. Planning on 250iu x 2 starting 3rd week of 12 weeks test e cycle.
 

gymfreak2

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Great plan to run while on cycle. Keep your boys in check and after much research a much better way than hcg in pct. Planning on 250iu x 2 starting 3rd week of 12 weeks test e cycle.
does the same go for a 12 week test prop cycle? hcg to be used from week 3 on test prop? or will the scenario change for test prop? may be from week 2 when going for test prop? since test prop kicks in a bit quicker than test e? i dont have the experience. ive just started my research. ill run my first test cycle after an yr hopefully.
sorry if my question sounds stupid.
thanks.
 
Frank Reynolds

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does the same go for a 12 week test prop cycle? hcg to be used from week 3 on test prop? or will the scenario change for test prop? may be from week 2 when going for test prop? since test prop kicks in a bit quicker than test e? i dont have the experience. ive just started my research. ill run my first test cycle after an yr hopefully.
sorry if my question sounds stupid.
thanks.
I start right from the beginning with prop.
 
Frank Reynolds

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thanks bro. till the day of the last test prop dosage? or till 4-5 days after the last test prop dosage?
I am running it e3d/e4d(two times a week), so i will likely take my last T shot, then the day after, or two days after my last HCG shot, then pct..

I am tempted to try it in the beginning of PCT, but am out of HCG unfortunately.
 

gymfreak2

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I am running it e3d/e4d(two times a week), so i will likely take my last T shot, then the day after, or two days after my last HCG shot, then pct..

I am tempted to try it in the beginning of PCT, but am out of HCG unfortunately.
thanks for the reply bro
 

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