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    anabolic diet confusion


    Bought and read the book. Today is day 12, no crash at all, feel great. No gas or mud blowing the whole time.......love it. Funny thing is, I weighed myself this morning for the first time since I began. I was up 1 lb. I'm not worried as much as I am confused. Did CKD about 4 years ago with great success, and in this same 12 day break in, I lost in the neighborhood of 10lbs. Anyone shed any light on this?

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    bump, little help please
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    Yeh that is weird mate. I also had better results when I did a keto type diet a few years back as well. I also was waiting for alot of water weight to drop in the first week but I think I mostly lost glycogen on this first week of AD.
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    bump again
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    I've experienced the same thing. Tried Ketosis type diet twice, 18 months apart. After 2 week induction I was 12 lbs lighter. 18 months later, same diet, no weight loss.

    Sorry, can't shed light.
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    Not everyone has the genetic metabolism for low carb diets to work. Some people truly are genetically geared for a higher carb diet. How poorly they do on low carb diets is a function of how long they're on it. These people are often lean to begin with, however they are in the minority (20-25%).

    However be careful of misdiagnosing yourself as a carb type. Most people are kidding themselves with how much carbs they need, and they don't do a low carb diet properly or give it enough time to really tell if it's right for them. Some people will give up after a week when it takes 2 weeks for decent adaptation in many, and up to 4 weeks for a stronger adaptation. Many people try to drop the cals low when starting the diet, and many also make the diet low fat. I would expect anyone to feel terrible trying this, so that doesn't mean you're a carb genotype.
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    As I stated prior, I did a CKD for about 6 months with great results 4 years ago. I know I'm fine with a low carb diet. I went through the 12 day induction without even a sign of a crash. Strength has remained. The confusion comes from gaining 1 lb. No water loss? No glycogen loss? I'm not going to quit, I know it works, and I feel great on it. Just wondered if anyone had any idea how this is possible and if it's a huge deal. BTW, finished my first carb-up yesterday, up 2 lbs today.
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    Quote Originally Posted by scotty2 View Post
    As I stated prior, I did a CKD for about 6 months with great results 4 years ago. I know I'm fine with a low carb diet. I went through the 12 day induction without even a sign of a crash. Strength has remained. The confusion comes from gaining 1 lb. No water loss? No glycogen loss? I'm not going to quit, I know it works, and I feel great on it. Just wondered if anyone had any idea how this is possible and if it's a huge deal. BTW, finished my first carb-up yesterday, up 2 lbs today.
    Most of the weight loss comes from glycogen and water weight loss. To lose fat, you first become fat adapted, and then you start cutting the fat from your diet, while protein and carbs stay relatively the same. That way your body burns fat for energy instead of glycogen.
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    Quote Originally Posted by CryingEmo View Post
    Most of the weight loss comes from glycogen and water weight loss. To lose fat, you first become fat adapted, and then you start cutting the fat from your diet, while protein and carbs stay relatively the same. That way your body burns fat for energy instead of glycogen.
    Right. I understand the concept of the diet. Usually the beginning of this diet one would shed the water and the glycogen, as I have in the past. I just want to know how I could have gained 1lb in the induction phase.
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    Just a wild guess here. Allergies or sensitivities? These can prevent weight loss and cause water retention.

    I'm sure perhaps even certain medications could cause an issue with this, like prednisone for example.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neil5585 View Post
    Just a wild guess here. Allergies or sensitivities? These can prevent weight loss and cause water retention.

    I'm sure perhaps even certain medications could cause an issue with this, like prednisone for example.

    no, sir
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    Curious as to how you gave such a quick and definitive answer to the allergies/sensitivities thing.

    Have you done extensive food elimination/provocation testing? Have you had blood allergy/sensitivity testing that also tests for delayed reactions?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neil5585 View Post
    Curious as to how you gave such a quick and definitive answer to the allergies/sensitivities thing.

    Have you done extensive food elimination/provocation testing? Have you had blood allergy/sensitivity testing that also tests for delayed reactions?

    basing my answer on the fact that I've done this diet before for up to 6 months.........could also be that I'm just getting older
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    Well that doesn't rule out food sensitivities...
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    Hi, I recently read an article and felt that “The amount of antioxidants in your body is directly proportional to how long you will live.” antioxidants are the nutritional equivalent of man's best friend - they are loyal protectors and nurturers of our cells, repelling disease, and promoting good health. Antioxidants can come from healthy eating or in the form of supplements, and they include a family of naturally formed components like vitamin A, beta-carotene, lycopene, vitamin E, and more. They are believed to protect cells from free radicals, harmful oxygen molecules thought to damage cells that result in cancer, atherosclerosis, Alzheimer's disease, and rheumatoid arthritis, and they may be the underlying reason why we age.
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    Quote Originally Posted by gabriellost View Post
    Hi, I recently read an article and felt that “The amount of antioxidants in your body is directly proportional to how long you will live.” antioxidants are the nutritional equivalent of man's best friend - they are loyal protectors and nurturers of our cells, repelling disease, and promoting good health. Antioxidants can come from healthy eating or in the form of supplements, and they include a family of naturally formed components like vitamin A, beta-carotene, lycopene, vitamin E, and more. They are believed to protect cells from free radicals, harmful oxygen molecules thought to damage cells that result in cancer, atherosclerosis, Alzheimer's disease, and rheumatoid arthritis, and they may be the underlying reason why we age.


    What the... does this have to do with the AD Diet?
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    Quote Originally Posted by gabriellost View Post
    Hi, I recently read an article and felt that “The amount of antioxidants in your body is directly proportional to how long you will live.” antioxidants are the nutritional equivalent of man's best friend - they are loyal protectors and nurturers of our cells, repelling disease, and promoting good health. Antioxidants can come from healthy eating or in the form of supplements, and they include a family of naturally formed components like vitamin A, beta-carotene, lycopene, vitamin E, and more. They are believed to protect cells from free radicals, harmful oxygen molecules thought to damage cells that result in cancer, atherosclerosis, Alzheimer's disease, and rheumatoid arthritis, and they may be the underlying reason why we age.
    I haven't adhered to any known diet (Anabolic, CKD, TKD, etc.), but I have been *low-carb* for about 3-4 weeks now. The first 2 weeks, I dropped about 7lbs. I assume it to be mostly water and glycogen loss.

    The weird part is that I GAINED 7lbs. during the 3rd week and have put on 2 more pounds in the 4th week. I look better (less fat, more muscular), strength and stamina have been great in the gym, I haven't had any lethargy or fogginess.

    I started creatine mono around the start of my low-carb diet, so I assume I'm pulling more water into the body... but 7 pounds??

    The body is a funny piece of machinery. I'm still trying to figure it all out. I'm thinking about picking up Lyle McDonald's Keto book to help me out.

    I guess the point of my post is to sympathize with your unusual weight fluctuations.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ShakesAllDay View Post
    The first 2 weeks, I dropped about 7lbs. I assume it to be mostly water and glycogen loss.
    The weird part is that I GAINED 7lbs. during the 3rd week and have put on 2 more pounds in the 4th week. I look better (less fat, more muscular), strength and stamina have been great in the gym, I haven't had any lethargy or fogginess.
    I did the same thing last year. I forgot my exact numbers, and I'm too lazy to go look, but I did the AD for a month and over that time I gained about 5 lbs scale weight but lost 1/2 inch off my waist and gained about 1/2 inch to an inch in the other measurements (arms,legs,chest,ect).
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    Meant to update............Got on the scale yesterday, was down 1lb. This is the end of week 6, I have officially lost a lb. Have yet to measure, try it tomorrow.
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    OK. So, I get on the scale friday morning. Reads that I am right about even from where I started. Prior to leaving the house I measured my waist the same place I measured when I began. I used a ****ty tape measure and it was a crude measurement. I did it twice to be sure, but it read that I lost 2 inches. Not sure if it's entirely correct, as I used a different tape measure. Not even sure that's possible, but I guess it means I've lost something anyway.
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    Quote Originally Posted by scotty2 View Post
    OK. So, I get on the scale friday morning. Reads that I am right about even from where I started. Prior to leaving the house I measured my waist the same place I measured when I began. I used a ****ty tape measure and it was a crude measurement. I did it twice to be sure, but it read that I lost 2 inches. Not sure if it's entirely correct, as I used a different tape measure. Not even sure that's possible, but I guess it means I've lost something anyway.
    It's possible. It means you added lean mass and either lost waist fat or at the very least tightened the ab muscles. It's recomp.
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    Update: remeasured with original tape measure, at night before bed(should have waited until morning), read only 1/2" loss. Who knows????????
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    My confusion deepens.............been getting on the scale every day(I know I'm not supposed to, just curious to see the progression during the week after carb up). Anyway, was down to 290 yesterday, so I was encouraged. Today, sale read 291. So, after 7 weeks, I have lost a grand total of 0 lbs. Changed my ratios this week to 55%f 40%p @ 3400 cals. Guess I'm gonna have to drop it to 3000. Anyone have anything to add?
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    How do you look? Are you doing other measuements other than scale weight? ie if you lost inches around the waist, then it's possible to add muscle and lose fat. Like I said earlier, I added weight and lost waist inches.
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigrobbierob View Post
    How do you look? Are you doing other measuements other than scale weight? ie if you lost inches around the waist, then it's possible to add muscle and lose fat. Like I said earlier, I added weight and lost waist inches.

    As I wrote above, may have lost 1 inch. Have to measure again. Still, inch or not, that's some real horsesh1t progress for 7 weeks.
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    So...scale weight is the same but the waist is an inch smaller?

    You lost fat and gained muscle.

    Do you look OK? Do you feel OK? Is it just that you're not progressing as fast as you'd like?
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    Quote Originally Posted by scotty2 View Post
    As I wrote above, may have lost 1 inch. Have to measure again. Still, inch or not, that's some real horsesh1t progress for 7 weeks.
    An inch could mean 5-10 lb's of fat is you're meassuring acurately.

    That means you could be doing close to 1.5 lb's of fat a week which is close to the maximum recommended amount you're supposed to lose.


    In any case you will need to start lowering your calories as you loose weigth to keep seeing results. You need to lower your fats slowly too. If you're 1000 calories below maintenance, then you will loose 2 lb's of a fat a week.
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    Quote Originally Posted by CryingEmo View Post
    An inch could mean 5-10 lb's of fat is you're meassuring acurately.

    That means you could be doing close to 1.5 lb's of fat a week which is close to the maximum recommended amount you're supposed to lose.


    In any case you will need to start lowering your calories as you loose weigth to keep seeing results. You need to lower your fats slowly too. If you're 1000 calories below maintenance, then you will loose 2 lb's of a fat a week.
    Thamks, Emo. I lowered cals already without having lost any weight. So, we'll see. 3100 cals is a little low for 290lbs. I'll give it a go.
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    Quote Originally Posted by CryingEmo View Post
    An inch could mean 5-10 lb's of fat is you're meassuring acurately.

    That means you could be doing close to 1.5 lb's of fat a week which is close to the maximum recommended amount you're supposed to lose.


    In any case you will need to start lowering your calories as you loose weigth to keep seeing results. You need to lower your fats slowly too. If you're 1000 calories below maintenance, then you will loose 2 lb's of a fat a week.
    This is sound advice. Whatever you do don't drop your dietary fat below 40% if you decide to lower fat intake while keeping protein/carbs constant because you will be sacrificing muscle tone which can give a flat look. Remember that fat begats fat, so keeping more fat in your diet is conducive to keeping muscle tone while still lowering overall caloric intake. You must also experiment with the duration of carb up, type of foods eaten during carb up, overall calories eaten during the carb up, as well as ratios of protein/carbs/fat during the carb up to see what works best for you. You must also experiment with the types of protein and fats eaten during the week as certain foods will affect you differently. Keep track when you make changes in your diet and log your measurements every 2 weeks. Don't become obessed with scale weight as this can vary greatly for many reasons, i.e., bloating. You would be better to measure bf levels with calipers, take tape measurements, and record your metablic index every two weeks to see if you are making progress in the right direction.
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    Botch!!!!!!!!!

    Sorry carry on fella's
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    Yea true what botch said. My fats been lower than normal, just 10-30gr, and I do look "flater" than usual
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    Quote Originally Posted by scotty2 View Post
    Thamks, Emo. I lowered cals already without having lost any weight. So, we'll see. 3100 cals is a little low for 290lbs. I'll give it a go.
    3100 for 290? I would think you normal maintenance would be closer to 5100. Where did you start out at calorie wise? Could it be he isnt getting enough calories?
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    Started at 4500. Strength has remained the same. Weight all the way down to 289. I feel that 3100 is too low as well, but wasn't seeing results. 3480 being X 12, I brought it down 300 cals, all from fat. So, I'm eating 345 p, 190 f.
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    What's your bodyfat?


    You can 'safely' lose 31 calories per pound of fat a day before you start burning LBM for fuel.

    So if you're 25% BF X 290 LB's = 72.5

    72.5 x 31 = 2232

    You can go 2232 below maintenance and still pretty much retain your LBM.

    For all intensive purposes I wouldn't go as low as possible and risk possible LBM, so maybe cut 1500-2000 (max). That yeilds 2000 x 7 = 14000 calories a week which is about 4 solid LB's of fat lost a week with virtuall no LBM lost... you may lose strength but most likely due to lower glycogen when you lift.

    You have to adjust this eventually, and you have to know roughly your true maintenance level based on activity bodyweight, etc.
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    Quote Originally Posted by CryingEmo View Post
    What's your bodyfat?


    You can 'safely' lose 31 calories per pound of fat a day before you start burning LBM for fuel.

    So if you're 25% BF X 290 LB's = 72.5

    72.5 x 31 = 2232

    You can go 2232 below maintenance and still pretty much retain your LBM.

    For all intensive purposes I wouldn't go as low as possible and risk possible LBM, so maybe cut 1500-2000 (max). That yeilds 2000 x 7 = 14000 calories a week which is about 4 solid LB's of fat lost a week with virtuall no LBM lost... you may lose strength but most likely due to lower glycogen when you lift.

    You have to adjust this eventually, and you have to know roughly your true maintenance level based on activity bodyweight, etc.
    I gauge my BF at closer to 20%. SO, I get the number 1800. If my maintenance is 5220(X18). The number I get is 3400. I ate 3400 for 5 weeks and made little progress, which is when I went down to the current 3150 or so. Only this week did the scale move(2lbs.) If I feel that I'm losing too much strength or weight, I'll bump it up 200 cals/week or so. If you think something different, by all means, share. THank you EMO for the calculations. I'm starting to at least feel a little better that the scale moved. I understand completely it's not about the scale, but like to get a little momentum, unresonable to think my weight's gonna stay the same while my BF continues to decline. Too much to lose to believe that.
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    The diet can also cause you to get 'backed up' so to speak. So if you increase your fiber intake and get rid of the 'back up,' you may lose another 5 lb's, lol.


    You could always keep your cals around 3400, be more sated, but then do enough cardio to burn the extra 250 cals a day, which would be like a 15-20 min jog or less.
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    Had a sh1tty refeed last weekend, was in AC and had a bunch of drinks and really not enough to eat. Anyway, seems my strength went up this week as I used the 140lb dumbells for incline, and went to the 125 dumbells for arnold presses. Was a little discouraged by the scale again as it read 290. This morning, however, I took another waist measurement and it read I was down 2". I see it, down 2", just having trouble believing strength going up, waist going down and scale not moving. Now I'm baffled for good reasons, it appears.
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    Quote Originally Posted by scotty2 View Post
    Had a sh1tty refeed last weekend, was in AC and had a bunch of drinks and really not enough to eat. Anyway, seems my strength went up this week as I used the 140lb dumbells for incline, and went to the 125 dumbells for arnold presses. Was a little discouraged by the scale again as it read 290. This morning, however, I took another waist measurement and it read I was down 2". I see it, down 2", just having trouble believing strength going up, waist going down and scale not moving. Now I'm baffled for good reasons, it appears.
    Brosif in 10 weeks I lost about 3.5" off my waist and minimal size everywhere else. Strength dropped a tad at the beginning and then started coming back up twords the end. Endurance however was terrible.
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    Quote Originally Posted by scotty2 View Post
    Had a sh1tty refeed last weekend, was in AC and had a bunch of drinks and really not enough to eat. Anyway, seems my strength went up this week as I used the 140lb dumbells for incline, and went to the 125 dumbells for arnold presses. Was a little discouraged by the scale again as it read 290. This morning, however, I took another waist measurement and it read I was down 2". I see it, down 2", just having trouble believing strength going up, waist going down and scale not moving. Now I'm baffled for good reasons, it appears.
    Your strength is rediculous. 125 lb dumbells for arnold presses? Wtf? lol
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    Quote Originally Posted by CryingEmo View Post
    Your strength is rediculous. 125 lb dumbells for arnold presses? Wtf? lol
    ^^^^Holy Jeebus...I shoulder press the 85lb DBs and the old guys at the gym look at me like im freaking nuts!!! My gym doesnt even have 125lb DBs
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