Rotator Cuff?

[Cedarwood]

I've been working out for years, but never had an injury like this:

One morning I woke up and it felt as though my trapezius muscle on my right side was knotted up.. very tense. It lasted for 8 days, and was so bad at one point I had to leave work early. It finally subsided, and I returned to the gym.

I normally bench 315 and my 1-rep max is 405. I got on the bench and started to do a warm up with just 135, but when I lifted my right shoulder (particularly in the front part of my deltoid) just wouldn't respond... total muscle fatigue was what it felt like. No pain, just completely fatigued. I could barely push out the weight.

I stayed out of the gym for a week and returned, but still it was acting fatigued. I don't have medical insurance unfortunately so am relying on Internet help. Some say I tore the muscle but I have full range of motion and no pain. Others say I have nerve damage, but that just doesn't seem right.

This happened 2 months ago, and I'm slowly getting strength back, but have only been going in the gym sporadically to let it rest.. I still can barely press 225. With the exception of the triceps on that arm (the right) all other muscles are fine. I can curl normally. Actually, I can barely work out the triceps on my right arm too. I'm at a total loss as to what this is from. I hope it's just severe fatigue. Things are getting better, but it's slow going. Anyone with some ideas as to what it is? It's strange I know, I started out with the traps, then the deltoid and ended with the tricep, but it's all on the right side. My right bicep is full strength. I'm confused by it all, hopefully someone out there isn't. hahahaaaahhhh man this suckss.

 

[sdmf45]

there would be pain if you tore your muscle or rotator cuff. does it feel numb or tingly at all?

 

[Dagron]

Doesn't sound like a cuff, I tore mine up pretty good a couple times and I can tell you when you tear it, you know for damn sure that it's torn, as it feels sorta like a stinger (severe and instant knifing/burning pain that subsides into numbness.) Also it hurt every time I would try to do a pressing movement, be it overhead or chest pressing... bottom line this does not sound like a rotator cuff *to me*, and I would be surprised if that is the root of the problem

 

[sdmf45]

Doesn't sound like a cuff, I tore mine up pretty good a couple times and I can tell you when you tear it, you know for damn sure that it's torn, as it feels sorta like a stinger (severe and instant knifing/burning pain that subsides into numbness.) Also it hurt every time I would try to do a pressing movement, be it overhead or chest pressing... bottom line this does not sound like a rotator cuff *to me*, and I would be surprised if that is the root of the problem

yup! i tore mine real good..........everytime i moved my arm it was a sharp pain. fvckin sucked!

 

[Cedarwood]

there would be pain if you tore your muscle or rotator cuff. does it feel numb or tingly at all?

No no tingly sensation or pain, and it's not numb at all. Though it was twitching quite a bit, even as recently as yesterday. Though I was working in the yard using that muscle.

Someone mentioned that I should increase my potassium, and I have by eating more bananas. I even broke down and bought some multi-vitamins a few weeks ago. Still very weak though.

 

[ClintCanada]

Cedarwood -- I see you only have a couple posts so just a friendly tip -- you'll get better feedback regarding your injury by posting your thread in a forum dealing with exercises instead of nutrition . . . later

 

[ITHURTZ]

Its not the rotator, you wouldnt be able to move your arm around without pain.

IMO you sleept wrong and "stressed" out the muscle.

 

[Cedarwood]

Cedarwood -- I see you only have a couple posts so just a friendly tip -- you'll get better feedback regarding your injury by posting your thread in a forum dealing with exercises instead of nutrition . . . later

Got it. Thanks, and thanks to everyone for your responses.

 

[IainDaniel]

Start working to balance the pulls with the pushes. Or even a 2:1 of Pulls to Push. That would help with some shoulder stability.

 

[ticktwo]

My advice would be that if the condition continues for more then a couple of weeks go to the doctor.

I have had a nagging shoulder injury that, to me, did not fit the typical rotator cuff injury symptoms.

Did not heart when I slept.
No stabbing pain.
Full use of arm.
Felt more like overuse.

This injury has gone on for quite awhile and I did home treatments like laying off shoulder exercises and then all compound exercise. When I stopped working out it began to stiffen up more.

MRI of last monday shows a partial torn rotator cuff. Still trying to get in to see the ortho so I can find out how bad.

It is more of a warning. I couldn't imagine I had hurt myself and did not want to wimp out over a bit of discomfort. I should have gone to the doc months ago.

 

[Cedarwood]

My advice would be that if the condition continues for more then a couple of weeks go to the doctor.

I have had a nagging shoulder injury that, to me, did not fit the typical rotator cuff injury symptoms.

Did not heart when I slept.
No stabbing pain.
Full use of arm.
Felt more like overuse.

This injury has gone on for quite awhile and I did home treatments like laying off shoulder exercises and then all compound exercise. When I stopped working out it began to stiffen up more.

MRI of last monday shows a partial torn rotator cuff. Still trying to get in to see the ortho so I can find out how bad.

It is more of a warning. I couldn't imagine I had hurt myself and did not want to wimp out over a bit of discomfort. I should have gone to the doc months ago.

Thanks guys for all your advice or comments.. every bit helps. I'm slowly getting stronger, but weak compared to before. I wish I had health insurance, but don't. I'm trying to find a hot sexy doctor woman on a dating site right now.. jk

Anyway, I'm going to take it easy for a while. I benched 225, and it's not heavy, but when I push it, my shoulder just says, "F you" and I can barely push out 8 reps. No pain, and it doesn't feel heavy, it's just like the muscle is too fatigued. Imagine you just did a set and your muscles are fatigued and twitching.. you try to do another rep and they don't respond.. like lack of potassium or something.. that's how it feels. I've been eating bananas, seems to help a bit, but I'm still at a loss.

I'm in the other forums researching Epistane, Phera-Plex, etc.. I've never taking anything other than steak, eggs, protien shakes, fish, some multi vitamins and NO-Xplode before.

I'm no spring chicken, I'm 32, but have been working out consistently for 16 years and naturally got my decline bench up to 405 which I'm pretty proud of.. that was until this shoulder thing damnit. From what I've read, pulsing epistane may be an option I'll try once I understand fully how to do it properly. Unfortunately the SERMS aren't OTC, so pulsing seems to be my only option. Don't plan on filling up the boards with redundant questions I have about all this.. I've been finding most of the answers to my questions already..



Here's some of my pics:

Thanks again for the input.. :squat:

 

[ClintCanada]

You're looking good . . .
Had to laugh about being 'no spring chicken' -- I'm turning 33 in a couple weeks too
. . . and I have a bottle of Havoc (I think its the same as epistane) and have been waiting to crack it . . . thinking of pulsing it as well . . .

 

[Justincredibl]

Next time you go to your gym, take a light weight, I MEAN LIGHT...like a 2.5 or 5lb plate. Lean over bending from your waist forward until you are 90 degrees or close to it. Support your upperbody weight (to avoid tipping over) with your "good" arm by leaning on it against a dumbell rack or something, making sure that you leave as much clearance as you can between your legs and any objects that could interfere. Take the LIGHT weight in your problem arm, hand and let gravity dangle it downward toward the floor. Begin going counter clock-wise making SLOW tight circles with the weight. Gradually increase the diameter of the circles that your making until you have no more room. Then slowly decrease the diameter again, still moving in a counter clock-wise motion, until you're back to stop position. Then repeat the same process in a clock-wise direction. Pay attention to the muscle and how it's reacting at certain points, or if there's any pain at all associated with a certain area of the rotation. Try this process a few times slightly increasing the weight each time SLOWLY. No need to go above 20 lbs though. If there's no pain or obvious failure that you can notice by doing this, either in your muscle, OR joint...then I'm not sure what you've got goin on bro. Call Ghostbusters I guess... Hope that helps

 

[max silver]

You may be able to benefit from the services of a good athletic therapist, preferably one who is certified in active release, graston techniques, massage therapy, etc. A good therapist should be able to pinpoint the cause of your problems, and treat the problem accordingly. Just a guess but it sounds to me like you may have some entrapped nerves in your shoulder/arm which are causing the weakness you are experiencing. If this is the case, you may benefit from active release technique to free up the entrapments.

 

[Cedarwood]

Thanks Clint, ha, ya, I'm turning 33 in a month. Let me know how that Havoc works for you, your pulse cycle (EOD?) and any details of your PCT. Before and after weigh ins and strength gains would be cool to know too.

Justin, thank man, I'm heading to the gym now, I'll do that. I appreciate the advice for determining the issue.

Max, ya, several ppl have mentioned nerves to me. I will look into active release. I remember the last excecise I did before this was military press with 125 dumbells. Maybe I pinched a nerve or something? Anyway, I'll do the light weight rotation exercise to locate the pain if any, and find a qualified PT for the active release.

Much thanks!

 

[Cedarwood]

Next time you go to your gym, take a light weight, I MEAN LIGHT...like a 2.5 or 5lb plate. Lean over bending from your waist forward until you are 90 degrees or close to it. Support your upperbody weight (to avoid tipping over) with your "good" arm by leaning on it against a dumbell rack or something, making sure that you leave as much clearance as you can between your legs and any objects that could interfere. Take the LIGHT weight in your problem arm, hand and let gravity dangle it downward toward the floor. Begin going counter clock-wise making SLOW tight circles with the weight. Gradually increase the diameter of the circles that your making until you have no more room. Then slowly decrease the diameter again, still moving in a counter clock-wise motion, until you're back to stop position. Then repeat the same process in a clock-wise direction. Pay attention to the muscle and how it's reacting at certain points, or if there's any pain at all associated with a certain area of the rotation. Try this process a few times slightly increasing the weight each time SLOWLY. No need to go above 20 lbs though. If there's no pain or obvious failure that you can notice by doing this, either in your muscle, OR joint...then I'm not sure what you've got goin on bro. Call Ghostbusters I guess... Hope that helps

I just tried that. No pain either way, wide or small circles. However, I noticed some creaking (old man joints?) when I go clockwise and when the weight is at about the 6 o'clock position. No pain, but at that point it feels like the joint needs some synovial fluid.

Any of you guys heard of or have tried Liquid Glucosamine and Chondroitin with MSM (methylsulfonylmethane)? Some of my friends say Glucosamine is good for your joints, while others say it's bogus.

 

[ITHURTZ]

If its y our rotator try to perform cuban rotations, internal and external rotations. These will hit the 4 muscles to ur RC. If one is in pain you will know. Try it with 5lbs on the cable machine say 20 reps

 

[Cedarwood]

If its y our rotator try to perform cuban rotations, internal and external rotations. These will hit the 4 muscles to ur RC. If one is in pain you will know. Try it with 5lbs on the cable machine say 20 reps

Right on, will do, thanks

 

[Cedarwood]

What luck, I ran into a doctor last night at the gym. Some old timer on the stationary bike. He heard me talking to one of my buddies about my problem and chimed in.

He says it sounds like I have Suprascapular nerve entrapment. Active release is next.. he said the other option is surgical decompression, and I don't plan on doing any surgery, so active release was great advice (thanks Max). Thank you.

He says it was likely from dumbell military press. Anyway, for anyone that has experienced unexplainable muscle fatigue, it's likely nerve entrapment.

 

[max silver]

Hey that's great news. Be sure to keep us updated how things turn out.

 

[Cedarwood]

Will do..

Hey that's great news. Be sure to keep us updated how things turn out.

 

[Cedarwood]

Just an update: Someone suggested that it may also be a compressed nerve at C7 in the Cervical vertebrae which will cause weakness in the triceps which I'm experiencing. I'm already researching Active Release Therapy, but do any of you know about or tried non-surgical spinal decompression?

 

[Jet]

Have you looked into chiropractics? I know they don't have the best reputation, but if you find a good one they can definitely help with spinal issues. I injured my shoulder early last week, and had it fixed yesterday by a local chiropractor, feels a lot better now :thumbsup:

 

[Cedarwood]

Have you looked into chiropractics? I know they don't have the best reputation, but if you find a good one they can definitely help with spinal issues. I injured my shoulder early last week, and had it fixed yesterday by a local chiropractor, feels a lot better now :thumbsup:

That's encouraging to hear, I was thinking about doing that but didn't know anyone that's gone to a chiropractor. The active release therapy I'm doing is helping a bit, but I'm getting impatient and need results. I can't bench heavy and not being able to go heavy is starting to get me bummed out. I get paid on the 25th, I'll go see a chiropractor then and let you know how it worked out. I hope it solves the issue. I hate going to the gym and not being able to go 100 per cent.

 

[Jet]

That's encouraging to hear, I was thinking about doing that but didn't know anyone that's gone to a chiropractor. The active release therapy I'm doing is helping a bit, but I'm getting impatient and need results. I can't bench heavy and not being able to go heavy is starting to get me bummed out. I get paid on the 25th, I'll go see a chiropractor then and let you know how it worked out. I hope it solves the issue. I hate going to the gym and not being able to go 100 per cent.

Let me know how it goes. I was having symptoms very similar to yours (pain in the same area, injury was caused by military press, etc.) and was waking up with a lot of tightness and pain in my shoulder that lasted through a lot of the day. For three or four days before I went to the Chiropractor, I took ibuprofen to relax the irritated muscles in my shoulder to make adjustment easier. The pain in the mornings has gone away, and I'm almost back to 100%. I didn't have the same issues with my tricep as you, but I wouldn't be surprised if a Chiropractic visit would help.

 

[Cedarwood]

Let me know how it goes. I was having symptoms very similar to yours (pain in the same area, injury was caused by military press, etc.) and was waking up with a lot of tightness and pain in my shoulder that lasted through a lot of the day. For three or four days before I went to the Chiropractor, I took ibuprofen to relax the irritated muscles in my shoulder to make adjustment easier. The pain in the mornings has gone away, and I'm almost back to 100%. I didn't have the same issues with my tricep as you, but I wouldn't be surprised if a Chiropractic visit would help.

Just got back from my first appointment with the Chiropractor. I wasn't used to it, he put me on some electrical stimulus machine for 30 minutes to fatigue my traps before he could work on me. He said I was misaligned at C7, exactly where I figured. I feel great right now, but he said to stay out of the gym a while longer.. I'm getting anxious to get back. I go back in for another appt on Monday, then again Wednesday.

In the meantime, he has me icing my back just between the traps. He also said to sleep on my back, with a small pillow just under the knot in the back of my head so as to sort of hyper extend the neck slightly. Bad posture (which I have) has caused those vertebrae to kink in the wrong direction.

Anyway, I'm feeling good right now, and am very hopeful this will all work out so I can get back to working on my goal of hitting 4 plate bench 8 reps! I'll post back here Monday night.. thanks again everyone ~

 

[Jet]

Just got back from my first appointment with the Chiropractor. I wasn't used to it, he put me on some electrical stimulus machine for 30 minutes to fatigue my traps before he could work on me. He said I was misaligned at C7, exactly where I figured. I feel great right now, but he said to stay out of the gym a while longer.. I'm getting anxious to get back. I go back in for another appt on Monday, then again Wednesday.

In the meantime, he has me icing my back just between the traps. He also said to sleep on my back, with a small pillow just under the knot in the back of my head so as to sort of hyper extend the neck slightly. Bad posture (which I have) has caused those vertebrae to kink in the wrong direction.

Anyway, I'm feeling good right now, and am very hopeful this will all work out so I can get back to working on my goal of hitting 4 plate bench 8 reps! I'll post back here Monday night.. thanks again everyone ~

Glad to hear your first appointment went well, I hope you're able to fully resolve the problem I know what you mean about staying out of the gym, it's torture! Sounds like you found a good chiropractor though, best of luck to you.