Fake meats good or bad?

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    Fake meats good or bad?


    I dont eat red meat so my main sources of protein is chicken, turkey, and fish. I recently bought some meatless steak style strips and they are very high in protein but are also very high in sodium. Im up in the air whether these are actually worth it b/c of the high sodium levels. Ne one who knows ne thing about these vegetarian products please chime in..

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    i would imagine that since its a vegetarian product most of the protien come from soy. Soy protien has its ups and downs, people have told me soy products can lead to more estrogen production, but i have never researched that statement nor do i have any more knowledge besides hearsay on that matter.
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    Quote Originally Posted by KSMA View Post
    i would imagine that since its a vegetarian product most of the protien come from soy. Soy protien has its ups and downs, people have told me soy products can lead to more estrogen production, but i have never researched that statement nor do i have any more knowledge besides hearsay on that matter.
    It is true... soy products do lead to more estrogen.

    But, eating protein is not the only way to build muscle. Use a proprietary amino acid blend and you will build better muscle. One such product is Provantage by Reliv. A certain football team used it for training one year with 2 other Reliv products and won the superbowl that year... 2000 I think. But, and I am a vegetarian, so I am biased, but, protein, too much of it just makes you age faster. Your digestion cuts it all in to amino acid chains and then combines them in to protiens that your body can use. We are human and can not use "as is" protein from animals, so that is why starting out with a amino acid blend made for body builders will use less of your energy to put on more muscle. Hope I don't start a fire. It works.
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    Lots of contradictory information regarding soy.

    http://www.t-nation.com/tmagnum/readTopic.do?id=1296121

    http://www.timinvermont.com/fitness/soyvswhy.htm

    Regardless, it sounds like its heavily processed and full of sodium.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Xodus View Post
    Lots of contradictory information regarding soy.

    http://www.t-nation.com/tmagnum/readTopic.do?id=1296121

    http://www.timinvermont.com/fitness/soyvswhy.htm

    Regardless, it sounds like its heavily processed and full of sodium.


    X
    And even though I eat some fake meat once in a while... there is really no nutrition in it. Its garbage. Fake. All veggies have protein... not much though. Eat beans... they are complete perfect protein. Just cook them well so the sugars are cooked so you don't get gas!
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    g woiler is right when im trying to stay away from eating meat, for various personal reasons, beans are the best way to go. High in protein, I think theyre high in L-methionine, which the human body cannot produce so intake from food sources are required, and they have fiber too. Just dont be around your girlfriend while eating a lot of beans.
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    I definitely need to start eating beans need another good source of solid protein besides chicken and fish..So what r the tastiest black beans?? And i really like making my protein shakes with silk milk which is a soy product but now this seems counter productive since it highers estrogen levels...DAMN
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    Quote Originally Posted by SacDIESEL View Post
    I definitely need to start eating beans need another good source of solid protein besides chicken and fish..So what r the tastiest black beans?? And i really like making my protein shakes with silk milk which is a soy product but now this seems counter productive since it highers estrogen levels...DAMN
    Not necessarily...

    Soy Protein Isolate benefits for Bodybuilders

    Animal research suggests some great advantages of using soy protein isolate as a bodybuilding supplement. Research has shown that the isoflavone daidzein found in soy-protein isolate might have a gender specific normalizing effect on sex-hormone production. Lab animals experienced testosterone and growth hormone excretion as well as muscle growth in males, while the female animals experienced a decrease in these hormones and fat loss.

    Daidzein is a key isoflavone found in soy that acts as a potent phyto-estrogen. It is structurally a very weak "pseudo-estrogen" (about 1000 times weaker than the body's primary estrogen estradiol). This is good news to the bodybuilder because weak estrogens like daidzein will compete with stronger estrogens like estradiol for available receptor sites to "bind" to. By binding to the receptor sites daidzein then "blocks" the stronger estrogens from binding to and activating receptor sites. With the daidzein isolflavone attached, estrogen receptor sites remain inactive. This inactivity further minimizes the negative effects of estrogen in the body. Many researchers believe this effect is the reason soy protein is linked to a reduction in the risk for many forms of breast, endometrial, and prostate cancer. This mechanism works similarly to the prescription drug Nolvadex (tamoxifen citrate)--an anti-estrogen staple in the bodybuilding community.

    Research also indicates that the soy-protein isolates may reduce nitrogen loss and keep you in a positive nitrogen balance to better facilitate muscle growth. The human body can only repair and build muscles when it has a positive nitrogen balance.

    Of particular interest to the bodybuilder is Soy Isolates high concentration of the amino acids glutamine and arginine. These two aminos are extremely important to a body builder for their ability to release growth hormone, aid in immune system functions, and for their ability to speed muscle cell recovery.

    Glutamine (per 100g)
    Soy 10.5g
    Milk Protein 8.8g
    Whey 4.9g

    Many bodybuilders understand the importance of the essential amino acid L- glutamine to their muscle building supplementation. What many bodybuilders don't know is that soy protein isolate has the highest concentration of glutamine among protein sources-over twice that of whey protein! (7) Glutamine has been used for years in hospitals to speed muscle cell recovery and improve maintenance of muscle mass during periods of starvation, infection, and exercise trauma. (8) Glutamine supplementation has been shown to promote muscle glycogen accumulation, which has been linked to an increase in muscle protein synthesis. (10) Glutamine has also shown the ability to increase muscle cell volume through the process of cellular hydration. (11) Glutamine supplementation in as little as 2 grams per day has been shown to increase plasma growth hormone levels. This increase in growth hormone has been shown to help shift the fuel for muscle from glucose to fatty acids. (9) Research has suggested that a bodybuilder should consume between 8 - 15 grams of glutamine each day. Supplementing 3-5 grams of glutamine 3 times per day has been shown to elicit a positive response without stimulating the excretion of glutamine in the urine.

    Arginine (per 100g)
    Soy 7.6g
    Beef 6.3g
    Egg 5.8g
    Cassein 3.7g
    Whey 2.9g

    L-Arginine is another important amino acid with respects to body building. Arginine plays several roles in the body such as fighting mental and physical fatigue, but its main job is to assist with growth. This amino acid promotes the release of two highly anabolic hormones, insulin and growth hormone. Arginine promotes gains further by assisting in recovery from post workout muscle trauma through its ability to speed tissue healing. This amino acid aids in the detoxification of the liver by removing ammonium from the body. Arginine has also shown the ability to lower LDL cholesterol and triglyceride levels in the blood. Arginine is used in the medical treatment of angina, congestive heart failure, male infertility and wound healing. Soy isolate protein contains higher amounts of this important amino acid than any other protein source.

    As a hard training bodybuilder, your body needs protein every 2 -2 1/2 hours even if you may not think you need it. The human body does not store protein long term as it does for fat and carbohydrates. Instead, your body holds amino acids in three pools that provide the body's necessary protein for fuel. These pools are constantly in a state of flux and are replenished either from dietary protein or the breakdown of muscle. It is extremely important to keep these amino acid pools topped off through the feeding of protein every 2 - 2 1/2 hours. When feeding stops, there is a fall in protein synthesis and a rise in protein breakdown. This translates into a loss of lean body mass after extended periods without protein.
    7. Soy Protein Isolate for Dieters

    For years, bodybuilding gurus have recommended the use of soy protein for pre-contest bodybuilders who need to shed body fat while keeping as much lean muscle as possible. Normally when the body is forced into a low calorie diet program, it reacts by slowing down your metabolic rate. This will make it increasingly more difficult to lose body fat. Soy-protein isolate helps lessen this effect through several different pathways. First, soy-protein isolate has been found to enhance endogenous production of thyroid stimulating hormone (TSH), thyroxin (T4), and triiodothyronine (T3). Thyroxin is the main player in the regulation of your metabolic rate. The more thyroxin you have the faster your metabolism will be. A faster metabolism insures that more of the food you eat will be used as fuel and less will be stored as fat, an important advantage to any dieter.

    Another way soy accelerates fat loss is with its unique concentration of amino acids. Soy-protein isolate has the highest concentration of amino acids in what is called the "critical cluster". This cluster of amino acids contains the three branch chain amino acids (BCAA's) and two essential aminos - glutamine and arginine. These critical amino acids help a bodybuilder spare muscle while losing body fat during a pre-contest diet. Any time you diet, your body tries to break down muscle glycogen in an effort to provide the body with more calories. In fact, your body will often try to use broken down muscle for fuel before it uses stored body fat. This is called muscle catabolism or muscle breakdown. These three branch chain amino acids are the first amino acids that are used for fuel when your body begins muscle catabolism. If you have a high amount of these branch chain amino acids in your diet, your body will first use these for fuel before it breaks down your stored muscle.
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    Nice man this information is great news for me as I love soy products. I think that all different proteins have their different benefits. I like to balance my main protein intake with meat (only white), fish, dairy (eggs - skim milk), and soy products and i would like to add more beans so i can get yet another source of protein. I think im gonna lower my use of fake meats even though i enjoy them b/c of the sodium levels and lack of nutrition.....Yo Xodus being a vegetarian do u still eat fish and eggs or no???
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    Quote Originally Posted by SacDIESEL View Post
    Nice man this information is great news for me as I love soy products. I think that all different proteins have their different benefits. I like to balance my main protein intake with meat (only white), fish, dairy (eggs - skim milk), and soy products and i would like to add more beans so i can get yet another source of protein. I think im gonna lower my use of fake meats even though i enjoy them b/c of the sodium levels and lack of nutrition.....Yo Xodus being a vegetarian do u still eat fish and eggs or no???

    I'm no vegetarian.

    Meat tastes too good.
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    O... assumption...The mother of all **** ups
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    An interesting article just popped up on T-Nation today regarding soy:


    http://www.t-nation.com/readArticle.do?id=459516
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    That **** sucks...Guess i should limit my soy intake a little while i research this further. That article seems very believable..Unfortunately 4 me.
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    Add in some Cottage Cheese and Peanut Butter to your diet, great protein & EFA sources (PB).
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    Quote Originally Posted by SacDIESEL View Post
    That **** sucks...Guess i should limit my soy intake a little while i research this further. That article seems very believable..Unfortunately 4 me.
    I have for over 20 years used soy milk for breakfast, and tofu here and there. But I am going to do an experiment and start using Rice Dream rice milk instead. If some of the articles I have read are close at all, then soy products... even though very healthy... could help to diminish libido. When it comes to L-Arginine, I think you have to take an enormous amount to get any effect. We get tons in our normal diet. But there is another nutrient I am wondering if anyone here has insight on: "Cnidium Monnier" & "Xanthoparmelia Scabrosa". They are supposed to increase Nitric Oxide in the blood. Anyone know about htis one? And "Chrysin" is possibly able to lower estrogen levels. Oh well... herbology. I am just learning.
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    Yea ive been using soy products for pretty much my whole life...Think im gonna finish off what i have and switch to more real foods and Skim milk..How much protein in Rice Dream??
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    Quote Originally Posted by SacDIESEL View Post
    Yea ive been using soy products for pretty much my whole life...Think im gonna finish off what i have and switch to more real foods and Skim milk..How much protein in Rice Dream??
    1 gram per 8oz serving. Not much.

    At 52 years old... people tell me I look in my late thirties or forties. I attribute this to a low protein diet the last 23 years. Unless you are muscle building... you don't need the protein that they say for a daily requirement. If you look at the established daily values over the last 75 years, you will see that they have lowered it many times. Fact is... if you are eating a balanced diet, with beans!, you never have to worry about protein. Its in everything. Just stay away from empty foods like pasta and white bread, white rice.
  

  
 

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