Nutrition advice please

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    Exclamation Nutrition advice please


    Ok I haven't posted in a while so here's my current. I weigh variably from 212 to 209 depending on the day I'm 6ft 2in and am at around 14% bf. I'm currently training using the CrossFit football method which is a mix of Mark Rips starting strength with a bit of endurance and conditioning for football. I enjoy this program and am getting a lot stronger. The issue that I'm having is that I want to drop bf without dropping much weight my diet is pretty clean (I'll post a sample) an I hardly use supplements anymore. When I tweak my diet as far as calories I either do a 300-400 cal surplus or go to my maintenance. However when I go on my surplus I notice that I gain some stubborn belly fat and pudge even with slight surplus if I lower it I lose weight and bulk. I want to drop to a 12% - 10% and be at a 210. Sample diet: Breakfast 5 whole eggs1 cup whole milk1/2 scoop whey5 slices turkey hamSnack2 mozzarella cheese sticksLunch or PRE12 oz. chicken breast (or equivalent protein meal)Whole wheat pasta (or equivalent carb meal)Post WO1 scoop whey1/2 serving maltodextrin1 cup whole milk6tbsp natty pbDinner 8-10oz. Flank steak (or equivalent protein meal)Serving of asparagus (or other green veggie)As many tbsp of Olive Oil as it takes to hit the rest of my rx'd calories. Please let me know what I can add or change currently my macros areProtein: 300-330gCalories: 3000-3400Carbs: 120-170Fats: 170-200+


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    Well your at a tricky point. You would need to bulk up a bit and then slowwly cut back down to see where you hit 10-12% bf. At a natural state this can be extremely hard to achieve. Genetics are a big component. The body is designed to hold onto fat and prevent starvation. Some peoples bodies begin to breakdown muscle tissue for enery use when BF get down in this range. Id be willing to help you out if you d like send me a PM

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    when you are going to a surplus, what are you changing assuming the above is maintenance?
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    Maintence is about 3000-3200 surplus is usually 3300-3400 if I hit. 3500 I start putting on fat visibly. And it goes strait to my abs. The only thing I change calorie wise is slightly bigger carb meals and more olive oil

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    Thanks but I was just hoping to get some advice. Not professional help. I'm broke and would probably not be able to afford that kinda help.

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    have you tried in raising calories going without adding more carbs and just adding more protein/fat instead?
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    Hmm I would also try prot/fat raise during a surplus.

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    Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    have you tried in raising calories going without adding more carbs and just adding more protein/fat instead?
    I have done that too ive raised cals and lowered carbs also.but like i said i eat really low carbs already anyway and cant really get away with lowering much more.

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    have you thought about trying the intermittent fasting / lean gains style eating?
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    Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    have you thought about trying the intermittent fasting / lean gains style eating?
    I'm currently on a starting strength plus conditioning aerobic/anaerobic routine. Would intermittent fasting slow my recovery and cause me to be sluggish and perhaps stall more often on my lifts?

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    Quote Originally Posted by bi0hazurd View Post
    I'm currently on a starting strength plus conditioning aerobic/anaerobic routine. Would intermittent fasting slow my recovery and cause me to be sluggish and perhaps stall more often on my lifts?
    really depends more on where your eat window is vs your workouts, and how you adapt to the intermittent fasting. It likely has an impact the first few days to week just in getting used to it, after that it shouldn't.

    this is what you are doing plus aerobic?

    Workout A
    3x5 Squat
    3x5 Bench Press
    1x5 Deadlift

    Workout B
    3x5 Squat
    3x5 Press
    5x3 Power cleans
    what time of day is your workout?
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    Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    really depends more on where your eat window is vs your workouts, and how you adapt to the intermittent fasting. It likely has an impact the first few days to week just in getting used to it, after that it shouldn't.

    this is what you are doing plus aerobic?



    what time of day is your workout?
    Similar to that but it's CrossFit football

    Monday
    squat 3x5 5lbs heavier
    press 3x5 2.5lbs heavier
    endurance metcon

    Tuesday
    deadlift 5 10lbs heavier
    3x max reps pullups
    endurance metcon

    Wednesday off

    Thursday
    squat 3x5 5lbs heavier
    bench 3x5 2.5lbs heavier
    metcon or sprints

    Friday
    power clean 5x3 2.5lbs heavier
    3x max reps chinos
    metcon or endurance

    Saturday
    optional metcon or endurance

    And really I train whenever the day allows it

    Would IF affect my strength gains? Recovery?
    How does it work?

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    ive been researching on some crossfit sites about IF and so far even though it looks like a spectacular way to lose fat and retain some muscle it doesnt look like its good for someone on a strength routine who wants to make steady linear progress... What would be your opinion on a slight deficit like 200cal while supplementing with E/C stack and taking in atleast 2 servings of XTEND BCAAS per day to really keep hold of my muscle?

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    at a slight deficit like that, you shouldn't lose any muscle, but will still lose a little scale weight. Its definitely a tough balancing act
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    Quote Originally Posted by bi0hazurd View Post
    ive been researching on some crossfit sites about IF and so far even though it looks like a spectacular way to lose fat and retain some muscle it doesnt look like its good for someone on a strength routine who wants to make steady linear progress... What would be your opinion on a slight deficit like 200cal while supplementing with E/C stack and taking in atleast 2 servings of XTEND BCAAS per day to really keep hold of my muscle?
    CF doesn't know jack **** about gaining strength. I've been doing IF for ~2 months now and have added 60lbs to my total in that time (20/10/30) while dropping close to 20lbs. Also, strength is NOT linear and anyone that says strength is linear is someone that you should disregard.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rodja View Post
    (20/10/30)
    Is that (p/c/f) ratios?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rodja View Post
    CF doesn't know jack **** about gaining strength. I've been doing IF for ~2 months now and have added 60lbs to my total in that time (20/10/30) while dropping close to 20lbs. Also, strength is NOT linear and anyone that says strength is linear is someone that you should disregard.
    Linear progression = Mark Rip. also what CF are u doing?

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    Quote Originally Posted by JudoJosh View Post
    Is that (p/c/f) ratios?
    Increase in squat, bench, and deadlift

    Quote Originally Posted by bi0hazurd View Post
    Linear progression = Mark Rip. also what CF are u doing?
    I'm not, nor will I ever, using CF.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rodja View Post
    Increase in squat, bench, and deadlift



    I'm not, nor will I ever, using CF.
    Then you are not not will you ever know what you are talking about when you speak of CF. Also out of curiosity what are your numbers? Because you've always talked to me like a big dog ever since I started on this website and you constantly talks down to me and my methods. So I wanna know where u at??? You outweigh me and are shorter than I am so that means you must be a walking mound of muscle. So let's hear it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bi0hazurd View Post
    Then you are not not will you ever know what you are talking about when you speak of CF. Also out of curiosity what are your numbers? Because you've always talked to me like a big dog ever since I started on this website and you constantly talks down to me and my methods. So I wanna know where u at??? You outweigh me and are shorter than I am so that means you must be a walking mound of muscle. So let's hear it.
    You dont have to partake in CF in order to know it is a horrible program
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    Quote Originally Posted by bi0hazurd View Post
    Then you are not not will you ever know what you are talking about when you speak of CF. Also out of curiosity what are your numbers? Because you've always talked to me like a big dog ever since I started on this website and you constantly talks down to me and my methods. So I wanna know where u at??? You outweigh me and are shorter than I am so that means you must be a walking mound of muscle. So let's hear it.
    445/295/505

    Crossfit is a junk program for athletes. It's horribly imbalanced in terms of vertical/horizontal flexion/extension, has poor technique, and does not wave properly. As I've said, strength is not linear for multiple reasons and the foremost reason is a lack of programming with an inability to point of weaknesses within the chain. In your myriad of threads, I've never seen you post anything regarding technique analyzation and/or looking to strengthen your weaknesses.
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    If CF was linear than Cross Fitters would be lifting more than world class weight lifters on a regular basis. They lift pretty darn heavy (definitely more than most gym goers who don't every clean, snatch, or dead lift) ... but for sure Cross fit is not for the athlete... unless they are cross fit athletes.

    Even MEBB programming uses waves and percentages. CFFB uses % of 1rms and proper programming to do weight lifting/power lifting while doing foot ball. Main site Xfit though... is very one sided. Any crossfitter who is participating in the games is a genetic freak and probably has some reasonable amount of programming knowledge.

    I use cross fit like met cons no longer than 8 mins if I go all out, and my programming follows 531 for power lifts, and a wave like program for the olympic lifts based on a weight lifting wave program I got off Greg Everett. Only thing I really use off cross fit is motivation on how far some people push their bodies.... so me doing 3 sets of triples and 5 sets of 5 reps followed by some planks should be easy.

    I IF, eat pretty much a 40% fat, 30% protein, 30%carb diet and still managed to lose 15lbs while gaining strength and cardio ability. Still pretty lean, not sub 10, but not over 14%. I just keep my abs... 200lbs, and around 3k cals a day.
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    Quote Originally Posted by JudoJosh View Post
    You dont have to partake in CF in order to know it is a horrible program
    I'm curious as to why u think that way? I mean ur obviously ignorant if ur gonna disregard something I've never tried. But I'm also curious to know what ur numbers are? Seing as how CrossFit is obviously a waste of time. The routine ur on is probably a lot enter at making u stronger faster, more flexible, and have way more stamina and endurance. So I'm calling u out too. What's ur squat/deadlift/press? What's ur clean and jerk? How many strict pullups can u do? How many handstand pushups can u do? What is ur fastest 5k? What is ur fastest 53 yard sprint? What's ur 1RM weighted pullup? Sure u can lie and post some ridiculous numbers but ud only be lying to urself. I'll trust whatever scores/numbers u write down.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mattrag View Post
    If CF was linear than Cross Fitters would be lifting more than world class weight lifters on a regular basis. They lift pretty darn heavy (definitely more than most gym goers who don't every clean, snatch, or dead lift) ... but for sure Cross fit is not for the athlete... unless they are cross fit athletes. Even MEBB programming uses waves and percentages. CFFB uses % of 1rms and proper programming to do weight lifting/power lifting while doing foot ball. Main site Xfit though... is very one sided. Any crossfitter who is participating in the games is a genetic freak and probably has some reasonable amount of programming knowledge. I use cross fit like met cons no longer than 8 mins if I go all out, and my programming follows 531 for power lifts, and a wave like program for the olympic lifts based on a weight lifting wave program I got off Greg Everett. Only thing I really use off cross fit is motivation on how far some people push their bodies.... so me doing 3 sets of triples and 5 sets of 5 reps followed by some planks should be easy. I IF, eat pretty much a 40% fat, 30% protein, 30%carb diet and still managed to lose 15lbs while gaining strength and cardio ability. Still pretty lean, not sub 10, but not over 14%. I just keep my abs... 200lbs, and around 3k cals a day.
    I respect the fact that u know what u are talking about before speaking. I however don't follow mainsite I'm on CFFB amateur SWODs so my strength program is exactly like SS an I am making linear progressions as fr as strength gains and the amount of weight I can move for reps. I'm not saying this will go on forever but neither does any routine and when I'm done with ASWOD I can just move up to collegiate.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rodja View Post
    445/295/505

    Crossfit is a junk program for athletes. It's horribly imbalanced in terms of vertical/horizontal flexion/extension, has poor technique, and does not wave properly. As I've said, strength is not linear for multiple reasons and the foremost reason is a lack of programming with an inability to point of weaknesses within the chain. In your myriad of threads, I've never seen you post anything regarding technique analyzation and/or looking to strengthen your weaknesses.

    My numbers are

    Squat: 380
    Press: 225
    Deadlift: 540

    My squat and press are lighter than urs. But my deadlift is heavier than urs is. Why is that? If u are heavier and have been lifting much longer than me? An u have all this knowledge of routines. Ur just a butthurt basement dweller I don't deny that u are probably strong and in shape. But ur just a meathead and u love to criticize and flame other people like an Internet tough guy so u can gtfo my thread now.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bi0hazurd View Post
    My numbers are

    Squat: 380
    Press: 225
    Deadlift: 540

    My squat and press are lighter than urs. But my deadlift is heavier than urs is. Why is that? If u are heavier and have been lifting much longer than me? An u have all this knowledge of routines. Ur just a butthurt basement dweller I don't deny that u are probably strong and in shape. But ur just a meathead and u love to criticize and flame other people like an Internet tough guy so u can gtfo my thread now.
    Meathead with a Master's degree in this particular field and I outweigh you by <10lbs (I was 215 this morning). Care to actually address the points that I made or are you just going to hypocritically flame me? I have no problem helping and teaching others, but you seem to be the person that asks for advice and then gets pissy when someone offers advice that you do not like.
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    Quote Originally Posted by bi0hazurd View Post
    I'm curious as to why u think that way?
    there are several reasons why.

    My biggest beef with it is their implementation of high rep oly lifts (till fatigued) as a conditioning tool. They literally encourage bad form with their "dont be a pu**y" mentality. There is this glorification of overtraining with CF that is just simply retarded (for lack of a better word) Also to echo rodja, they need to focus more on individuals to address muscular imbalances, mobility and flexibility as opposed to their random broad spectrum workouts (WODs)

    I mean ur obviously ignorant if ur gonna disregard something I've never tried.
    i have a pretty good grasp of exercise science and S&amp;C programming (albeit prolly not as much as some of the other members here such as zir red or rodja) and have a basic understanding of the fundamentals of CF and their programming. This allows me to have an educated opinion on it and to be able to call it a horrible program

    But I'm also curious to know what ur numbers are?
    this is ad hominem and irrelevant to the discussion

    The routine ur on is probably a lot enter at making u stronger faster, more flexible, and have way more stamina and endurance. So I'm calling u out too.
    I use a combo of 5/3/1 and WS4SB
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    Quote Originally Posted by bi0hazurd View Post
    I'm curious as to why u think that way? I mean ur obviously ignorant if ur gonna disregard something I've never tried. But I'm also curious to know what ur numbers are? Seing as how CrossFit is obviously a waste of time. The routine ur on is probably a lot enter at making u stronger faster, more flexible, and have way more stamina and endurance. So I'm calling u out too. What's ur squat/deadlift/press? What's ur clean and jerk? How many strict pullups can u do? How many handstand pushups can u do? What is ur fastest 5k? What is ur fastest 53 yard sprint? What's ur 1RM weighted pullup? Sure u can lie and post some ridiculous numbers but ud only be lying to urself. I'll trust whatever scores/numbers u write down.
    LOL how many handstand pushups? What next? You wanna have a weighted hop-scotch competition? Who in the **** other than a cross-fitter would ask about handstand pushups. lol

    How many bosu ball squats can you do while balancing a copy of mens health on your head, and wearing a clown outfit?

    And strict pull-ups? Do you ****ers even do those? Everytime I see a CF'er doing pullups it looks like they are having a seizure, kipping like a mother ****er.

    Quote Originally Posted by bi0hazurd View Post
    My numbers are

    Squat: 380
    Press: 225
    Deadlift: 540
    I pressed 225 for a triple the other day....Strict over head ...heh

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    Quote Originally Posted by JudoJosh View Post
    there are several reasons why.

    My biggest beef with it is their implementation of high rep oly lifts (till fatigued) as a conditioning tool. They literally encourage bad form with their "dont be a pu**y" mentality. There is this glorification of overtraining with CF that is just simply retarded (for lack of a better word) Also to echo rodja, they need to focus more on individuals to address muscular imbalances, mobility and flexibility as opposed to their random broad spectrum workouts (WODs)



    i have a oretty good grasp of exercise science and S&amp;C programming (albeit prolly not as much as some of the other members here such as zir red or rodja) and have a basic understanding of the fundamentals of CF and their programming. This allows me to have an educated opinion on it and to be able to call it a horrible program



    this is ad hominem and irrelevant to the discussion



    I use a combo of 5/3/1 and WS4SB
    I used 531. And it didn't produce as good results as CFFB. Side note who is gonn know more about what my body needs than me? Oly lifts are never used til fatigued on CFFB or on mainsite from what I've seen. Like I said u do not know what ur talking about.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Frank Reynolds View Post
    LOL how many handstand pushups? What next? You wanna have a weighted hop-scotch competition? Who in the **** other than a cross-fitter would ask about handstand pushups. lol

    How many bosu ball squats can you do while balancing a copy of mens health on your head, and wearing a clown outfit?

    And strict pull-ups? Do you ****ers even do those? Everytime I see a CF'er doing pullups it looks like they are having a seizure, kipping like a mother ****er.


    I pressed 225 for a triple the other day....Strict over head ...heh
    Best thing I've read on here in awhile.
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    Quote Originally Posted by bi0hazurd View Post
    I used 531. And it didn't produce as good results as CFFB. Side note who is gonn know more about what my body needs than me? Oly lifts are never used til fatigued on CFFB or on mainsite from what I've seen. Like I said u do not know what ur talking about.
    This is a joke, right? Elizabeth, Grace, Isabel, etc. all use cleans and/or snatch for time. How long did you use 5/3/1? 3 months? That is not nearly enough time as the program is designed for 6 months minimum with at least a year recommended.
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    Quote Originally Posted by bi0hazurd View Post
    Oly lifts are never used til fatigued on CFFB or on mainsite from what I've seen. Like I said u do not know what ur talking about.
    Sigh...

    See below via CF mainsite

    “Isabel”
    Snatch 135 pounds, 30 reps for time
    "Grace"

    Clean and jerk 135 pounds, 30 reps for time
    And these are just two examples, there are others

    See- http://library.crossfit.com/free/pdf/27_04_new_girls.pdf
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    Lol this thread is gold.
    I see you finally went to IF rodja? Liking it so far?
    Biohazard, you obviously have some imbalances as your deadlift is way higher then your squat, and your bench is a far cry from impressive. Also your overall total is lower then rodjas. Besides ive yet to hear any world ranked powerlifter go, I love crossfit haha. Before you ask I hold a 475/275/501 in comp at a bw of 201 at 20.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SweetLou321 View Post
    Lol this thread is gold.
    I see you finally went to IF rodja? Liking it so far?
    Biohazard, you obviously have some imbalances as your deadlift is way higher then your squat, and your bench is a far cry from impressive. Also your overall total is lower then rodjas. Besides ive yet to hear any world ranked powerlifter go, I love crossfit haha. Before you ask I hold a 475/275/501 in comp at a bw of 201 at 20.
    Thats my strict shoulder press. I did body weight bench so 210 for 40 reps last Thursday. An I did 315 for 2 a few days before

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    Quote Originally Posted by SweetLou321 View Post
    Lol this thread is gold.
    I see you finally went to IF rodja? Liking it so far?
    Biohazard, you obviously have some imbalances as your deadlift is way higher then your squat, and your bench is a far cry from impressive. Also your overall total is lower then rodjas. Besides ive yet to hear any world ranked powerlifter go, I love crossfit haha. Before you ask I hold a 475/275/501 in comp at a bw of 201 at 20.
    And hold on. That middle number you posted is ur bench? 275? Dude ur routine is sick

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rodja View Post
    This is a joke, right? Elizabeth, Grace, Isabel, etc. all use cleans and/or snatch for time. How long did you use 5/3/1? 3 months? That is not nearly enough time as the program is designed for 6 months minimum with at least a year recommended.
    Like I said I don't follow mainsite wods. I'm doing CrossFit Football. But I see no problem with doing reps of Oly lifts I mean what's better at making u good at Oly lifts than Oly lifts themselves

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rodja View Post
    This is a joke, right? Elizabeth, Grace, Isabel, etc. all use cleans and/or snatch for time. How long did you use 5/3/1? 3 months? That is not nearly enough time as the program is designed for 6 months minimum with at least a year recommended.
    Hey was ur middle number referring to bench also?

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    Quote Originally Posted by bi0hazurd View Post
    Like I said I don't follow mainsite wods. I'm doing CrossFit Football. But I see no problem with doing reps of Oly lifts I mean what's better at making u good at Oly lifts than Oly lifts themselves
    Not too familiar with energy systems, are you? The absolute most, and this is really pushing it, that a set of Oly lifts should be is 5 reps. You cannot have proper technique and maximal force production while fatigued.

    Another thing, and this is a plague within CF, that makes no sense for CFF is that there is not consideration given to position. A lineman does not have the seem demands as a receiver.

    Quote Originally Posted by bi0hazurd View Post
    Hey was ur middle number referring to bench also?
    Yes, because those are the main PLs. If I had to guess where my OHP is, I'd say it's minimum 205 and probably closer to 225, but it's an ancillary lift in my training.
    M.Ed. Ex Phys

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rodja View Post
    Not too familiar with energy systems, are you? The absolute most, and this is really pushing it, that a set of Oly lifts should be is 5 reps. You cannot have proper technique and maximal force production while fatigued.

    Another thing, and this is a plague within CF, that makes no sense for CFF is that there is not consideration given to position. A lineman does not have the seem demands as a receiver.



    Yes, because those are the main PLs. If I had to guess where my OHP is, I'd say it's minimum 205 and probably closer to 225, but it's an ancillary lift in my training.
    In that case my lifts are 380/315/540 which makes my total less than urs by 10lbs huh? And isn't that about how many lbs heavier than me u are? Too bad ur masters isn't good at increasing ur lifts

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    Quote Originally Posted by bi0hazurd View Post
    In that case my lifts are 380/315/540 which makes my total less than urs by 10lbs huh? And isn't that about how many lbs heavier than me u are? Too bad ur masters isn't good at increasing ur lifts
    It's funny how you always change the topic when you don't have a rebuttal to an issue that is presented to you (e.g. energy systems in regards to the Oly lifts, the gaping holes within CF, etc.). Instead of presenting something to counter the issues that have been presented to you, you've (fallaciously) turned this into a **** measuring contest. Am I a record holder in anything, no, but I never pretended to be one. I've been PL'ing for 2 years after training MMA for over 5 years, which was a time that I did not train to improve 1RM. However, I am not arrogant like you in that I listen to advice from people that are smarter than me. If you can't take criticism, then stop asking for advice on what to do and/or change.
    M.Ed. Ex Phys

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