postworkout insulin spike

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    postworkout insulin spike


    hey guys, have a question. i've asked this on a few other boards i belong too but trying to get everyones informative opinion and reasoning on this. If when we workout our body goes into catabolism and protein synthesis temp degrades. And many bodybuilders will do an insulin shot after working out in order to inhibit cortisol and raise amino/protein transport. would it make more sense to take a protein shake post workout with a table spoon of brown sugar to create that insulin spike in order to shuttle the aminos and protein to the muscles?. Seems like without the insulin spike post workout that protein shakes are minimally effective and without the insulin spike the only logical meal post workout is a primarily carb loaded meal to replenish glycogen stores? Any input? I'm open for all opinions.

    p.s. the reason why im not doing insulin shots is because im not 100% confident on them yet cause i know there is some risk with them.


    thanks guys

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    Following along for more info...
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    best type of post w/o insulin raiser, in my personal opinion, is ripe bananas, high glycemic around 25g of carbs and loads of potassium. what more could you ask for
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    yeah I do not completely trust insulin shots myself (not saying they do not work). Aside from my post-workout shake (1.5 scoops of Whey, 1 banana, 6 oz. 1/2% milk, and about 3 oz. of cold coffee) right before I drink it, i eat about a small bowl of watermelon which has a GI of above 70, which your body absorbs quickly... and watermelon is higher in lycopene and beta-carotene than tomatoes, just sayin

    Ben
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    thanks guys, ill have to check try out the banana, especially on the potassium. currently on a cutting phase and taking clen, so the potassium will really benefit with those muscle cramps. just trying to get the most out of my post workout ya know? i've always been good on my diet so i can bulk and cut fairly well. im just starting to try to involve more science into my fitness goals.
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    I eat sour patch kids directly post workout then 10 mins later a shake then 45 mins later my biggest meal of the day
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    I like to buy bulk gatorade powder and do a half scoop right before my protein shake
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    I mix whey with 8 oz of grape juice right after working out. Toss some creatine in and your golden.


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    I just posted about this a couple days ago but cant seem to fond the thread no... Anyway in short, the answer to the question, "do you need a insulin spike post workout?" the answer is no (IMO)
    "The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance." - Socrates
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    This is interesting. Have you spoken to a doc about this?
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    Quote Originally Posted by JudoJosh
    I just posted about this a couple days ago but cant seem to fond the thread no... Anyway in short, the answer to the question, "do you need a insulin spike post workout?" the answer is no (IMO)
    why not? isnt insulin the reason why you muscles need nutrition and become hungry?!
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    Quote Originally Posted by JudoJosh View Post

    my question was more towards promoting protein synthesis post workout when protein synthesis is at an all time low, not so much about replenishing my glycogen stores. however those studies are pretty interesting. i personally know several large bodybuilders that use insulin shots to inhibit cortisol levels, then they will have large protein meal and amino acids added to it. is this wrong then?
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    Quote Originally Posted by NFC View Post
    my question was more towards promoting protein synthesis post workout when protein synthesis is at an all time low, not so much about replenishing my glycogen stores. however those studies are pretty interesting. i personally know several large bodybuilders that use insulin shots to inhibit cortisol levels, then they will have large protein meal and amino acids added to it. is this wrong then?

    Did you read the post in that thread? Simple sugar post workout results in faster glycogen replenishment but thise does not equate to a faster rate in muscle resynthesis. Supplementing with exogenous insulin and leucine has been shown to result in a stronger protein synthesis signal than just protein alone (http://ajpendo.physiology.org/content/281/3/E466.full ) but the same has not been true for CHO and PRO post workout ( http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21131864 )

    Basically, if you are going to take CHO with your PRO post workout than there really is no difference between a high GI CHO and a low GI CHO postworkout. All it will do is refill glycogen stores and both types of CHO will accomplish this
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    I prefer to raise my insulin levels just prior to a workout so that the protein and insulin goes into the muscle during the workout rather than after. I did the post workout shake for years but when I switched to preworkout (and continue drinking during workout) I have sustained energy levels, increased strength and gains, and improved recovery. I use a rice ogliodextrin and casien hydroslates.
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    Quote Originally Posted by JudoJosh View Post
    Did you read the post in that thread? Simple sugar post workout results in faster glycogen replenishment but thise does not equate to a faster rate in muscle resynthesis. Supplementing with exogenous insulin and leucine has been shown to result in a stronger protein synthesis signal than just protein alone (http://ajpendo.physiology.org/content/281/3/E466.full ) but the same has not been true for CHO and PRO post workout ( http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21131864 )

    Basically, if you are going to take CHO with your PRO post workout than there really is no difference between a high GI CHO and a low GI CHO postworkout. All it will do is refill glycogen stores and both types of CHO will accomplish this

    ah i gotcha, so what your essentially saying is that a post workout insulin spike from simple or complex carbs will only result in faster glycogen replenishment and not in protein synthesis. the protein synthesis would only occur if the insulin spike was a result of a shot, or would chocolate (example) be considered as an exogenous source of insulin?
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    i hear pixie sticks are good to eat post workout. very fast absorbing sugar to spike insulin
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    You don't need carbs immediately post workout assuming you don't workout twice or more per day you can replenish the glycogen with the meals you eat between workouts
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    You might not 'need' them. But it definitely helps a lot more than it could hurt
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    Whether it "helps" or not is very goal dependent
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    Two things....
    ONE --Idk wtf you're thinking, but dont **** with insulin. If you're not a pro BB trying to get 300+ lbs, dont do it. No offense, but educate yourself before you shove **** in your body.... You **** with insulin, you're asking for diabetes...
    TWO-- just buy some dextrose dude, you can drink it safely and it will spike your inusulin w/out having to fck with unnecessary hormones..
    its cheap, and idc what ppl say about karbolyn and waxymaize and all that bull****, dextrose has been clinically proven effective- the other two, well i doubt that.

    thirdly.. i dont give a **** what that kid just said. complex carbs are exactly that- complex. they take longer for the body to digest, and they are not going to provide the same / as intense of an insulin spike as dextrose.
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    Quote Originally Posted by NFC View Post
    ah i gotcha, so what your essentially saying is that a post workout insulin spike from simple or complex carbs will only result in faster glycogen replenishment and not in protein synthesis.
    yes.. While simple carbs will lead to faster glycogen replenishment, this does not equal faster muscle synthesis

    Quote Originally Posted by NFC View Post
    the protein synthesis would only occur if the insulin spike was a result of a shot, or would chocolate (example) be considered as an exogenous source of insulin?
    No... As you can see from the study I linked above, CHO + PRO did not enhance muscle synthesis. Slin pin induced insulin spike is not the same as a dietary induced insulin spike for some reason.
    "The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance." - Socrates
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    Quote Originally Posted by JudoJosh View Post
    No... As you can see from the study I linked above, CHO + PRO did not enhance muscle synthesis. Slin pin induced insulin spike is not the same as a dietary induced insulin spike for some reason.
    interesting, thanks man.. interesting to know that now. the guy i train with uses a 5 hour insulin ester, but he's also at 265lbs and conservatively 9%bf. i dont think i would ever mess around with insulin unless i was in my 50's (like the guy i train with). thanks for the feedback man.


    @aceroni, chill out man.. no one said anything about taking insulin shots the original post was used as a comparison. and trust me, i research the hell out of things before i take anything into my body. judojosh didnt say anything to the means that they would replenish at the say speed, most of us understand the difference between simple and complex carbs.
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    @op: I minimize carb intake after 5pm, so I just have a banana with some whey isolate, cissus, and creatine after every workout.

    @aceroni: thanks for the comedic relief
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    Insulin is dangerous as hell. In addition, while I don't know if insulin-sensitive cells down-regulate receptor expression in the presence of high levels of exogenous (or endogenous) insulin, I'd suspect that is the case. And, diabetes is a horrible disease.

    I don't recall the details, but I do remember a while back that there was some evidence to suggest insulin-independent means of amino-acid transport and anabolism in the post-workout state. I do know that exercise will induce insulin-independent glucose transport mechanisms.

    Having said that, yes, insulin is a pretty strong addition to anybodies drug arsenal if they're looking to get bigger.
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    How many of those sour patch kids do you use?

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    any thing high in glycemic index will spike blood sugar levels. dextrose and maltodextrin are highest on the glycemic index
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    I'll breeze through these post later see what the general consensus is.
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    Any Wonka® candies are good for insulin spike. 1st ingredient is dextrose
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    Quote Originally Posted by Benjamin1
    Any Wonka® candies are good for insulin spike. 1st ingredient is dextrose
    Pixy stix and nerds ftw!
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    Any all sugar candy works....

    I don't know how much of a difference this makes to an average gym go'er, sure a post shake &/or meal will do just fine though.
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    Endomorphics : no insulin spike , no simple carbs.
    Ectomorphics : should do pwo simple carbs , ans even during workouts.
    Mesomorphics : depends on your goals. Bulk ou cut.
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