Nootropic Stack Feedback Please!

[BigKrabbe]

As the title states I am hoping to get some feedback on my nootropic stack that I plan on using for my upcoming quarter of school. I will be in a very time intensive and demanding program, and would like to get feedback from the many members who have greater knowledge than I do. As a caveat please do not come and try to push your companies product on me; I am 100% not interested in any one size fits all pill or mix from a company (I have looked at clear edge and think it's an amazing product, just don't find it necessary for my needs. I also have focus xt which I solely use on exam days in conjunction with my racetams), and have developed the current stack based on my own research from pubmed and years of personal nootropic use.

I am planning on doing the following:
4 AM, wake-up/pre-gym:
-300 mg bacognize
-100 mg caffeine from Amino Energy
-500 mg agmatine sulfate
-300 mg KSM-66
-Controlled Labs Orange Triad

8 AM, 1 hour prior to lecture:
-800 mg aniracetam
-1200 mg oxiracetam
-300 mg alpha-gpc
-500 mg acetyl-l-carnitine
-100mg caffeine from Amino Energy

2 PM, 1 hour prior to studying for 2-4 hours
-800 mg aniracetam
-1200 mg oxiracetam
-100mg caffeine from Amino Energy

8:30 PM, 30 minutes prior to laying down for the night
-4 caps Fish Oil
-400 mg Magnesium Oxide
-Schiff Melatonin Ultra (provides 3mg melatonin, and low levels of gaba, valerian, theanine, and chamomile)


Any changes anyone see, or suggestions that you feel would benefit the stack? I am on the quarter college system, so I plan on taking this stack continuously for the entire quarter (on weekends I only take the racetams once generally), followed by 10 days off between quarters. I have tried most of the racetams and can say I'm just not a fan of many with the exception of aniracetam and oxiracetam. One thing I was considering was sulbutiamine twice a week, but I'm not entirely sure it will be necessary as I believe the orange triad has 2000% daily value of thiamine.

As always I greatly appreciate feedback and constructive debates! Thank you in advance for your replies.

-BK

 

[cubsfan815]

Calling in muscleupcrohn he is my dude when it comes to nootropics, I'm still scratching the surface lol.

 

[muscleupcrohn]

For the KSM-66, I'd also take another 300mg with your pre-bed stack (assuming it doesn't keep you up for some reason); 600mg/day is the common dose sued in studies. The 500mg ALCAR in the 8 AM stack is a pretty low dose, but you have a lot of other stuff going on that should make for a good stack; still, I'd either bump the ALCAR up to at least 1g, or just drop it all together personally. For the 2 PM dose, if you don't feel like you need more choline with your racetams (you did already have Alpha-GPC earlier), then it's fine, but I'd think about having some choline any time I have racetam(s). You could also consider adding an AChE inhibitor (like huperzine, galantamine, or sage) with your choline/racetams if you wanted, but it's not a necessity.

Also, is there any reason in particular you're using Amino Energy as your caffeine source 3x daily? Is it just a way to get the 100mg caffeine in a powder while also having flavoring? Are the other nootropics you're using caps or powders?

 

[BigKrabbe]

For the KSM-66, I'd also take another 300mg with your pre-bed stack (assuming it doesn't keep you up for some reason); 600mg/day is the common dose sued in studies. The 500mg ALCAR in the 8 AM stack is a pretty low dose, but you have a lot of other stuff going on that should make for a good stack; still, I'd either bump the ALCAR up to at least 1g, or just drop it all together personally. For the 2 PM dose, if you don't feel like you need more choline with your racetams (you did already have Alpha-GPC earlier), then it's fine, but I'd think about having some choline any time I have racetam(s). You could also consider adding an AChE inhibitor (like huperzine, galantamine, or sage) with your choline/racetams if you wanted, but it's not a necessity.

Also, is there any reason in particular you're using Amino Energy as your caffeine source 3x daily? Is it just a way to get the 100mg caffeine in a powder while also having flavoring? Are the other nootropics you're using caps or powders?

I was hoping you would chime in! I actually do take KSM-66 pre-bed as well, I forgot to add that. Sporadically I take bulk rhodiola as well, but am unsure if I will continue.

In regards to only using the alpha-gpc in the morning I usually just play it by ear. Subjectively I believe I have semi-high natural choline levels as I have gotten very few headaches even with high racetam dosage in the past. If I notice myself getting a headache post racetam dosage I will definitely include alpha-gpc in the afternoon stack.

I mostly use bulk powders for everything, I have capped some up in the past but I don't really mind the taste of any of the powders.

Caffeine source wise yes I do just like the flavor of amino energy, and the ability to adjust my caffeine intake up or down by 50mg.

I agree with you on the AChE inhibitor thought. I have lots of huperzine on hand, but am weary of everyday use.

What are your thoughts on sulbutiamine? I have not taken it before, but it appears very promising to take once or twice a week.

Sorry to ask you a multitude of questions, but also what are your thoughts on the daily racetam use for 80ish days? I had no negative effects last quarter, but was thinking perhaps m-f the racetam stack followed by sat/sun replacing the racetams with sulbutiamine.

 

[bosskardo]

I would drop magnesium oxide and get some better form (at least citrate).
Also, I would keep melatonin at 1mg (or lower) and use more of gaba, valerian, theanine, and chamomile.

 

[BigKrabbe]

I would drop magnesium oxide and get some better form (at least citrate).
Also, I would keep melatonin at 1mg (or lower) and use more of gaba, valerian, theanine, and chamomile.

Thank you for your reply. I agree with your suggestion on the magnesium source, as soon as I run out of my current magnesium I will be switching.

I have been doing a little reading into mcg dosing of melatonin verus the mg dosing that we usually see. I am a big fan of valerian and chamomile, If I am especially restless or agitated I enjoy doing 2 tea bags of sleepy time extra.

 

[muscleupcrohn]

I was hoping you would chime in! I actually do take KSM-66 pre-bed as well, I forgot to add that. Sporadically I take bulk rhodiola as well, but am unsure if I will continue.

In regards to only using the alpha-gpc in the morning I usually just play it by ear. Subjectively I believe I have semi-high natural choline levels as I have gotten very few headaches even with high racetam dosage in the past. If I notice myself getting a headache post racetam dosage I will definitely include alpha-gpc in the afternoon stack.

I mostly use bulk powders for everything, I have capped some up in the past but I don't really mind the taste of any of the powders.

Caffeine source wise yes I do just like the flavor of amino energy, and the ability to adjust my caffeine intake up or down by 50mg.

I agree with you on the AChE inhibitor thought. I have lots of huperzine on hand, but am weary of everyday use.

What are your thoughts on sulbutiamine? I have not taken it before, but it appears very promising to take once or twice a week.

Sorry to ask you a multitude of questions, but also what are your thoughts on the daily racetam use for 80ish days? I had no negative effects last quarter, but was thinking perhaps m-f the racetam stack followed by sat/sun replacing the racetams with sulbutiamine.

Thanks for the kind words man. I personally wouldn't worry about daily huperzine use, but I'd cycle it every so often like most/all nootropics. The half-life of huperzine is often greatly exaggerated/overstated.

As for Sulbutiamine, it seems fine enough to take once or twice a week. What dose are you thinking? 400-600mg?

 

[BigKrabbe]

You're welcome man, it's hard to find non-biased opinions and feedback these days! I very well may just include huperzine in my stack then.

I'm also thinking I'm just going to drop the alcar all together, I have been very satisfied with the stack without it.

For the sulbutiamine if I do decide to include it I'll start at 400mg and adjust accordingly. I like to start as low as possible.

I generally don't buy things like clear edge, azoth, etc however I must say I am minorly infatuated with clear edges ingredient profile. I am gone 5 days a week at school, so when I'm home on the weekends it'd be nice to have some motivation, and not have to tote all my pills and powders around with me.

 

[muscleupcrohn]

You're welcome man, it's hard to find non-biased opinions and feedback these days! I very well may just include huperzine in my stack then.

I'm also thinking I'm just going to drop the alcar all together, I have been very satisfied with the stack without it.

For the sulbutiamine if I do decide to include it I'll start at 400mg and adjust accordingly. I like to start as low as possible.

I generally don't buy things like clear edge, azoth, etc however I must say I am minorly infatuated with clear edges ingredient profile. I am gone 5 days a week at school, so when I'm home on the weekends it'd be nice to have some motivation, and not have to tote all my pills and powders around with me.

Sounds good. I often use huperzine daily (usually only 100mcg, but sometimes up to 150-200mcg, but not more than 200mcg) for 8 weeks at a time (sometimes maybe a little bit longer haha), and then just take some time without using it for a few weeks. Sage extract (salvia officinalis) is another interesting AChE inhibitor, and actually has several studies showing acute cognitive/nootropic effects in healthy volunteers, which is very interesting and promising. You can pick up some standalone sage powder/extract (either as a powder or caps) at a very affordable price if you wanted to try something "new."

As for "finished products," I'm not a big fan of most of them either (a lot of them are either crazy expensive, underdosed, or both). There's only two "finished product" nootropics I buy/use.

I discuss AChE inhibitors like huperzine/galantamine/sage in this thread:
http://anabolicminds.com/forum/nootropics/296327-choline-supplementation-stacking.html

 

[BigKrabbe]

Thanks for the reply and link to your thread. I'll be sure to give it a read shortly!

 

[JulzRulz]

Sub'd for more info.