Any reason I cant stack this?
- 10-08-2006, 04:05 PM
- 10-08-2006, 05:30 PM
- 10-09-2006, 01:26 AM
Originally Posted by ECTOmorph
10-09-2006, 08:25 PM
- 5'8" 190 lbs.
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Zack I assume your the same one from bb.com, I have a question do think that the amount of AA that is present in the HD liquid caps is enough to have any kind of impact. I've read a couple peopel take on supplementing low dose AA over time but I 'm not sure if it would be worth it.
10-09-2006, 08:48 PM
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How about 6-oxo & Activate for 1 month
Then X-factor for the next month
There's no reason why you can't stack all 3 for one month, but IMO there's no worthwhile advantage. Steady gains are reliable and enjoyable than the rapid gains you're convinced you're going to make by doing this.
10-09-2006, 10:22 PM
yes it is I. I dont know how much is in there, but if you read this write up you can see it has more to do with the synergy of the ingredients. Each one compliments each other.Originally Posted by rippedforce63
Here is the write up:
Halodrol Liquid Gels
serving size: 1 cap
Arachidonic Acid( 40% in a prorietary fatty acid/oil blend), 5a-etioallocholanetrione, DHEA, 20-hydroxyecdysterone, -(-)3,4-divanillytetrahydrofuran
CHEMICAL CORNER - INTRODUCING NEW HALODROL LIQUIGELS™ - THE BEST MASS AND STRENGTH BUILDER YOU’RE GOING TO BE ABLE TO LEGALLY FIND ANYWHERE IN THE SUPPLEMENT INDUSTRY!
By – Rich Gaspari
DSHEA Compliant Non-Hormonal Mediated Myotrophy & Myogenesis
By – William Llewellyn
I think the best way to describe arachidonic acid (AA) is to call it a hypertrophic catalyst actually. What I mean is this nutrient sits at the very center of the entire anabolic process. It is core to the body’s natural response to resistance training – regulating those early changes in tissue physiology after exercise which facilitates muscle repair and growth. You couldn’t grow without AA, and likewise your sensitivity to growth is partly dictated by how much arachidonic acid you have in your muscles. At the risk of sounding boastful, I will say that enhancing AA levels in the body is one of the most exciting and effective new strategies for supporting muscle growth. I should know. I patented the idea, and have been working more closely with this nutrient than anyone else in the fitness industry for the past several years (Please, don’t get up. I am already patting myself on the back). This stuff works exceedingly well, and if you give me a few minutes to explain, I think I’ll make a believer out of you too.
Before we go any further, let’s first go over the basics. Arachidonic acid is an Omega-6 essential fatty acid. We normally consume it in animal products such as meat, eggs, and milk. Don’t let the label “essential fatty acid” fool you though. Arachidonic acid has a number of very significant roles in the body, the least of which is not the regulation of muscle growth. It is also now commonly added to baby formulas to aid in the neurological and muscular development of infants. It is without question one powerful nutrient. Normally we consume only a couple of hundred milligrams of AA per day, which is enough to get what we need to function. It is not, however, enough for an optimal anabolic response to weightlifting. Old-time bodybuilders, and many bodybuilders today, instinctively know this. When you hear someone extolling the benefits of eating extra red meat, or when some old-school bodybuilder tells you that red meat was the “steroid before steroids”, it is AA they are unknowingly talking about. And yet, by relying on food sources these people have only brushed the surface of AA’s true potential.
That “what” Arachidonic acid does probably doesn’t mean much without the “how” it does it. Here is the jist of it. AA gets stored in the outer phospholipid layer of muscle cells. As we damage our muscles lifting weights, AA gets released. Its release is followed by its conversion to a number of important bioactive molecules, the most notable of which are prostaglandins. Prostaglandins are responsible for a lot of the localized changes in tissue physiology that will facilitate growth. By increasing the local expression of receptors and anabolic hormones, AA/PG’s direct repair to those tissues that need it. The three main anabolic hormones that AA supports are androgens, IGF-1 (from growth hormone), and insulin. We can start to see why synthetic forms of these very powerful anabolic agents do little when they aren’t combined with training. If Arachidonic acid release is not remodeling local gene expression patters to sensitize damaged tissues and facilitate growth, the hormones never get to fully do their jobs.
I know all this is fine and good, but by now you are probably wondering just how much of a difference supplementing Arachidonic acid in an anabolic formula like Halodrol Liquigels™ can really make for you. The answer is, a big one – a very big one. Because AA is a central catalyst for the anabolic response cascade, intensifying its levels will have the effect of essentially amplifying the whole cascade. When testosterone drops in to visit the local muscle cells, for example, it will find more available receptors to send its message. More messages will be sent, and more tissue will be built. IGF-1 and insulin reap the benefits of enhanced local sensitivity as well, which are two very powerful hormones involved in nutrient partitioning, the shifting of protein synthesis and breakdown rates, and the activation and strengthening of the satellite cell cycle. These important anabolic events are all downstream from the release of AA, and are all amplified or dampened depending on the amount of AA available for release. Increased AA storage should only result in one thing – more muscle size, more muscle strength, and better anaerobic performance.
AA may be myotrophic, but is it safe? That is an obvious and important question, as safety can often be an issue with powerful myotrophic agents. Thankfully, in this case AA can be deemed extremely safe when used by healthy exercising individuals. Many studies have been conducted on the safety of this nutrient, and all have concluded that there is no danger with its use. For example, it has been shown that AA supplementation in doses even much higher than you will get with each serving of Halodrol Liquigels™ will have no effect on such things as lipids (Lipids, 1997 Apr; 32(4):427-33), immune function (Lipids, 1997 Apr; 32(4):449-56), or blood platelets/coagulation (Lipids, 1997 Apr;32(4):421-5). Furthermore, a recent study my company, Molecular Nutrition, has funded on Arachidonic acid with Baylor University again confirmed no changes in general markers of health (presented at the International Society of Sports Medicine conference, June 15, 2006). What is even more striking, however, was the effect AA had on a key inflammatory marker (IL-6). Arachidonic acid supplementation, when combined with resistance training, caused a strong reduction in levels of IL-6. This represents a potential protective benefit by lowering systemic inflammation. AA supplementation during resistance training is not only safe, dare I say it may even turn out to be healthy!
I was very excited when Bruce ******* and Gaspari Nutrition first contacted me about his potential reformulation of the original Halodrol-50. Bruce is a prolific colleague; a sharp guy with a good eye for tweaking the various anabolic systems in the body. As our conversation turned to potential ingredients and AA, I quickly began to see a great opportunity for Gaspari Nutrition to harness the anabolic power of Arachidonic acid. I know Bruce will be explaining the other final ingredients, so I will not bother going into redundancy here. I just request that you take a minute and look at exactly what Halodrol Liquigels™ represents – a truly multi-faceted approach to augmenting the body’s core anabolic systems. The attack comes at several levels, supporting hormone sensitivity on one hand, and proliferation and action on the other. Together, we see a more “unified” approach to myotrophic/strength augmentation. I am excited to have been part of developing what I know will be deemed a revolutionary anabolic product.
10-09-2006, 10:22 PM
DSHEA Compliant Hormonal Mediated Myotrophy & Myogenesis
By Bruce *******
If this compound looks “vaguely familiar” to something else then you’re probably smarter than the average guy in reading this. The reason it looks “vaguely similar” is that it is! This “stuff” is merely androst-4-ene-3,6,17-trione minus a very critical double bond in the A ring. This is a brand new, patent-pending (United States Patent Application #20050203074 published on 09-15-2005) DSHEA compliant anti-aromatic compound never before seen in the supplement market place! And lemme tell you, this one rocks because there is no way this baby can be “aromatized”, “metabolized” or otherwise processed into any type of estrogen (unlike some other, similar products on the market). The reason for the delay in getting it to the market is that it is a real nightmare to have made right. What’s so special about it? Let’s compare it to the two best selling anti-aromatases on the market (which are both outstanding products in their own right), those of course being the already mentioned androst-4-ene-3,6,17-trione and what is arguably the “gold standard” in this segment now, androsta-1,4,6-triene-3,17-dione (aka ‘ATD’) which is patent pending to me and was brought to market first by yours truly through the now #1 selling positive testosterone modulating product, Gaspari Novedex XT™
COMPOUND Ki Value/Activity Decrease
4.03 x 10(-3)sec-1
1.10 x 10(-3)sec-1
1.54 x 10(-3)sec-1
So what does all that mean? Well in a nutshell, of the 3 compounds listed, ATD is clearly the most potent of them in vivo (and we already knew this) and androst-4-ene-3,6,17-trione is the weakest. The new “five alpha” compound falls somewhere in between but closer to ATD than androst-4-ene-3,6,17-trione. So why use this new compound instead of just using ATD like what is found in Novedex XT™? Good question. Allow me to answer it. The half life of this new compound appears to be quite long (that and its active metabolites). This means you’ll get a much more “gradual, tapered” effect when you start using this and even when you stop using it, the stuff will stay active in your system longer. This makes this new compound the first, self tapering AI on the market (whereas the effects from Novedex XT™ are much more instantaneous and return to baseline a lot quicker if you stop using it). The next effect is that this is a “kinder, gentler AI” that is quite effective in banging down estrogen levels while also increasing testosterone levels.
Now that we have maximized endogenously produced myogenic/trophic steroidal compounds with our new, patent-pending AI,(and with the soon to be noted addition below of DHEA and 20-hydroxy-ecdysterone), we have to admit that we, and all other similar “knock-off products”, have a vexing problem. Most steroidal compounds “float around” in the bloodsteam “stuck” to something. An example is the vast majority of testosterone in the body is bound to Sex Hormone Binding Globulin (SHBG) – and if it is bound to “something” it means it absolutely can not interact with a receptor (as in the Anabolic Receptor) to stimulate the nuclei of muscle cells to go into hyperdrive to produce new muscle mass. So what to do about it? For a few years now, we’ve all known that an herb called Stinging Nettle Root (Urtica dioica) contained something called “lignans” that would competitively bind to SHBG, thereby “bumping off” the sex hormones (e.g. – testosterone, whatever) so they could interact with the Anabolic Receptor of the muscle cells. Good idea in theory but sometimes theories don’t pan out well in the real world (how many times have cancers been cured in mice only to fail when the same compound was tested in man?). So what’s the problem with this herb, why does not probably not work as claimed or as it could in most supplements? The reason is two fold. 1) There are six (6) separate lignans in Stinging Nettle Root that have anywhere from ZERO effect on SHBG to a MAXIMAL effect on SHBG. Of the six found in the herb, -(-)3,4-divanillytetrahydrofuran is CLEARLY the most effective (Plant Med, 1997, Dec(63)6:529-32) and 2) the VAST majority of Stinging Nettle Root is extracted to contain a paltry 1% total lignan content (not just the maximally effective one, 1% total for ALL six of them!) with the occasional, and more expensive 10% extract used by some of the better companies. My thoughts were, ‘well why not just have the pure, maximally effective -(-)3,4-divanillytetrahydrofuran made and use that instead since it seems to be a “no brainer”.? Duh! Well that is exactly what we did! My brother-in-law over in China had his laboratory synthesize this pure lignan. You may wonder why other companies choose not to do this (and perhaps by the time you read this, some may indeed have followed our lead)? The reason is simple?
M-O-N-E-Y. The good stuff ain’t cheap!
The 1% extract costs 1/70th the price per kg as does pure -(-)3,4-divanillytetrahydrofuran!
And that is not for a full 1% -(-)3,4-divanillytetrahydrofuran because there are five other less effective lignans in the extracted version! To put this into perspective for you – a company using typical, commercially available standardized Urtica dioica herbal extract at 1% would need to use almost 1,500mg of the extract per dose (that’s over a full gram folks!) in order to equal the lignan content of pure -(-)3,4-divanillytetrahydrofuran we put into each Halodrol Liquigel™ and again, it still would not be equal because 1,500mg of “the other stuff” has those five other, less effective, grossly inferior lignans in it. Ask yourself this question – Why would you buy a product that uses a less effective, lower dosed version of something when ‘the good stuff” is readily available and not much more money for the final product? Yeah, I was wondering the same thing.
10-09-2006, 10:23 PM
The easiest way for me to tell you what an ecdysterone does is with an analogy. Ecdysterones are to insects what Testosterone or Dianabol are to humans. There are many types of ecdysterone compounds, and among them, the 20-hydroxy variant is clearly considered the most potent. So why put this compound in a product for humans when it seems to be meant for and found insects? Good question.
The single most important factor in maximizing and maintaining muscle enhancement is you’re your physiological environment. Ecdysterones, especially the 20-hydroxy variant, appear to create a very positive, myotrophic environment in the body human and insect alike. Such conditions for creating an ideal myotrophic environment include maintaining a positive nitrogen balance and increasing protein synthesis along with a solid work out plan and a proper diet high in quality protein. Arachadonic acid supplementation, as my astute colleague Bill Llewellyn has so eloquently pointed out is also a positive factor in creating a near-perfect physiological environment for muscle augmentation to develop.
Maintaining positive nitrogen balance and increased protein synthesis without also incurring hormone-like side effects was the key which was why Eastern European and Soviet era scientists became so excited about ecdysterones when in 1963 a study found that certain ecdysterones enhanced the rate of protein synthesis in some animals other than insects. This was the start of dozens of research trials demonstrating the positive myotrophic effect that (20-hydroxy) ecdysterone could induce while simultaneously showing no clinical side effects (in humans no less!).
Studies conducted in the former Soviet Union in 1980’s showed 20-hydroxy-ecdysterone helps "increase hepatic protein synthesis and subsequently promote positive nitrogen balance!" How does this lead to more myotrophy? Well, the more nitrogen your body maintains and the greater rate of protein synthesis, the more muscle mass you can pack on, period! How, exactly, does 20-hydroxt-ecdysterone do this? A talented scientist by the name of Smetanin, who ran trials at the Smolenk State Medical Institute in Russia concluded that 20-hydroxy-ecdysterone decreases urea concentration in the body and increases hemoglobin levels by increasing a process called erythropoiesis. Erythropoiesis is the genesis of red blood cells. This leads to a stimulation of the anabolic process in protein metabolism, which in turn leads to a positive nitrogen balance in the body.
The most often cited study using 20-hydroxy-ecdysterone in humans was published in Scientific Sports Bulletin by Simakin in 1988. The objective of Simakin's famous study was to determine the effect of 20-hydroxy-ecdysterone on muscle and fat mass, while checking all study subjects thoroughly for any significant, negative hormonal changes. Simakin made sure that for this study, that three cohorts were used: a placebo group, a protein only group, and a 20-hydroxy-ecdysterone with protein group. The results were significantly in favor of the third cohort. Of the close to 80 highly trained male and female athletes in the “protein only group” they showed only a slight increase in muscle mass for the 10 study duration. Those who used a placebo lost a slight amount of lean muscle, while those subjects randomized to the protein plus 20-hydroxy-ecdysterone cohort demonstrated a 6-7% increase in lean muscle tissue with nearly a 10% reduction in fat! Let reiterate this again: A 10% reduction in fat and a 7% increase in lean muscle tissue in just 10 days! Safety testing was conducted during the same time period which showed no real significant difference in hormone levels.
Another study conducted using over 100 athletes performed by B.G. Fadeev in Russia demonstrated some amazing overall results. About 90% of those who ingested 20-hydroxy-ecdysterone versus a placebo reported less fatigue, greater performance, more motivation, greater speed, and improved strength in less than 120 hours after the first dose with no side effects reported!.
20-hydroxy-ecdysterone is a naturally occurring moiety found in the herbs Rhaponticum/Leuzeae and Cyanotis vaga, has been on the market since the late 1980’s and is therefore completely DSHEA compliant. The problem is that most products that contain or claim to contain 20-hydroxy-ecdysterone as extracted from these herbs either really don’t or contain so little of this cool moiety as to be essentially useless. This is where Rich Gaspari decided not to mess around. Gaspari Nutrition is one of a handful (and we admit there are a few others, but “few” is the key word) of American companies to have located a source for clean 20-hydroxy-ecdysterone that manufactures 97%+ pure 20-hydroxy-edysterone through a biochemical reactive synthesis. This insures that you’re getting TIP TOP – TOP NOTCH stuff in our product, the stuff you need to see the results you want and not some 1.5% concentrated plant material that really only contains 1/100th the dose needed to see a tangible result and is on the label so the company can say “well we put it in there too!”. The cheap-o, essentially useless low percentaged plant extract is a few hundred bucks per kg. The clean, pure chemical is closer to $25,000/kg. But the philosophy here is that paying money, even a little bit for something that does essentially nothing is bad business. So we opted to make less profit on this product and went with the clean, 97%+ pure 20-hydroxy-ecdysterone. And we’re pretty confident you’ll notice the difference and be happy we went this route.
DHEA is the “original” prohormone even if it is crude and several metabolic steps away from being an effective myotrophic. Without the addition of an aromatase inhibitor while using a good dose of DHEA, there is a risk of aromatizaton of the material to various estrogens and in fact, some of the metabolites of DHEA, in spite of the presence of a good anti-aromatase will cross react with and loosely bind to the estrogen receptor (very slightly). So why put something in a product that might have a potential ‘estrogen like effect’ (albeit very small)? Because building muscle with estrogen, even small amounts of estrogenic material is CLEARLY faster and easier than doing so without. The best anabolic steroids for gaining mad, crazy mass (testosterone, Dianabol, Anadrol-50) all aromatize into some sort of estrogen. The goal here was to minimize the “bad estrogen” with the AI (decrease or eliminate estradiol synthesis) and replace it with a quasi-anabolic that has some very low estrogenic (minimal, but enough to get the job done) cross over. Remember, without an estrogenic effect of some sort, your blood lipid/cholesterol levels will go sky high (dangerous) and it is possible IGF-1 and GH levels will plummet into the grave. So while our cool, new AI helps to prevent your body from producing what we’ll call “toxic estrogen” (estradiol – the potent estrogen responsible for the “bad effects of some things” – like causing gynecomastia and testicular shrinkage), we needed to replace a ‘bad estrogen’ with something that was or had the potential to become very mildly estrogenic and yet myotrophic at the same time. DHEA was the clear and obvious (and legal) choice. This is the reason that while Halodrol Liquigels™ is a fantastic product for packing on the pounds as fast as possible and faster than anything else I can think of that is DSHEA compliant and legal; it is the most scientifically well thought out hormonal and non-hormonal combination myotrophic and legal supplement EVER to be sold in the supplement industry, but it is not suggested for post-cycle therapy (Novedex XT™ on the other hand, is ideally suited to pick up where Halodrol Liquigels™ leaves off. In fact, the suggested and best/safest way to use Halodrol Liquigels™ is for 40 days on and then start Novedex XT™ for another 20 days. I want to thank Bill Llewellyn for letting me “bounce” some of the ideas for the hormonal side of this product off him, despite his primary responsibility being the non-hormonal, AA side of things. Without Bill’s brilliant insights, this product might have looked quite different or may not have happened at all.
By Rich Gaspari
Phew! Well the new Halodrol Liquigels™ are done, have been beta tested and the results are pretty darn impressive. Gains of 10-15 pounds of lean muscle mass, increased vascularity and muscle density, thickness and an unexpected benefit, a few pounds of fat loss, were parameters all clearly visible in every member of our beta test group over 40 days use. That’s less than a month and a half! As you know, I was skeptical about Bill and Bruce being able to work together and agree on how to formulate this project without killing each other but it seems my concerns ended up being a waste of time. These two guys, the current reigning, “1-2 punch, best supplement formulators in the industry and perhaps in all history,” cooperated and worked as a cohesive and very methodical team in developing Halodrol Liquigels™. And because of this, all of you who try this new and exciting supplement, destined to be the absolute best non-hormone + hormone combinational mass building supplement of the future are going to be very happy. Very, very happy. Because Halodrol Liquigels™ absolutely falls within the Gaspari Nutrition Company core value – We are the brand that works!
* - Based on data supplied by company that produces 5a-etioallochanetrione. 5a-etioallocholanetrione is a naturally occurring, selective inhibitor of aromatase (estrogen synthetase). The manufacturer of the raw material has found that 5a-etioallocholanetrione is a competitive inhibitor of human placental aromatase with respect to androstenedione, with an apparent ki of 0.36 m/moles and a DIA of 1.54 x 10(-3)sec-1. Aromatase activity was measured by tritium release into water from the 1 beta position of [1(-3)h,4(-14)c]androstenedione in reaction mixtures containing NADPH and the aromatase.
10-10-2006, 02:53 PM
i would just go with the liquid gels from gaspari!
10-11-2006, 05:11 PM
- 5'9" 160 lbs.
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Yes, there's enough AA in there to synergize with the other ingredients.Originally Posted by rippedforce63
MOTIV8 II Challenge
-=The Big Squirrel Nut Swingers=-
10-11-2006, 05:31 PM
- 5'10" 230 lbs.
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- Jan 2006
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Not to hijack the thread, but it is rare to see a fellow San Martian on AM. Do you go to TSU?Originally Posted by zachattack43
10-11-2006, 05:49 PM
oh sorry, i need to update that now, but i still wish i was there...good times...Originally Posted by Rodja
10-12-2006, 07:13 PM
Looks good, just roll with it!
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