who's excited for Lesnar/Overeem?
- 12-19-2011, 07:50 PM
who's excited for Lesnar/Overeem?
Both of these guys are monsters!
- 12-19-2011, 08:17 PM
- 12-21-2011, 07:04 PM
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12-21-2011, 07:50 PM
12-21-2011, 10:40 PM
Can't wait to see Overeem in the UFC. Lets say he wins the ufc heavyweight championship in 2012. Would that make him the greatest HW in MMA history?
12-21-2011, 10:54 PM
12-21-2011, 11:03 PM
12-21-2011, 11:53 PM
I hear yeah about fedor and big nog, but overeem's name should be mentioned alongside if he wins the UFC belt, it goes along with the Dream belt, Strikforce belt, and the K-1 belt. Thats pretty impressive the only thing that is holding him back is the so called lack of competition. Although with Fedor you can say the same thing I mean he did fight Big Nog but most his other wins were against sub par competition or guys at the end of their careers for example Arlovski and Sylvia.
12-21-2011, 11:58 PM
You have to put Fedor's career in perspective as well. When he fought Herring, Schilt, Coleman I, Randleman, and Hunt, they were all ranked in the top-10 and that doesn't take into account his wins over Nog 2x and CC (he was an underdog for Nog I and CC). You can easily say that he is the one that tanked the careers of both Arlovski and Sylvia as they were both ranked in the top-5 at the time they fought (AA was #2 and Sylvia was #5)
M.Ed. Ex Phys
12-22-2011, 12:05 AM
12-22-2011, 12:06 AM
Fedor was an overrated joke who fought only garbage competition, and was exposed as such numerous times on national (well Showtime) TV recently. And as for Lesnar, he is afraid to be punched in the face.....that is not good, he runs like a wussy when punched....its fuqin hilarious! can't wait till he runs around again flopping around the octagon after being punched, then huddles up in the fetal hoping the ref stops it BWA!
12-22-2011, 12:26 AM
12-22-2011, 12:31 AM
yeah that is another thing, in one of the few wins we actually SAW LIVE of fedor's, vs rogers......rogers could have easily took out fedor in the first round if he knew WTF he was doing. Then his showtime career would have been a REAL disaster, as opposed to just a regular disaster.
12-22-2011, 08:47 AM
It's going to take multiple defenses of the HW championship to even approach being the GOAT at HW and the current record in the UFC is two with both Couture and Sylvia sharing that record. Everyone forgets that it was the general consensus during Fedor's reign that the vast majority of the top HWs were in Pride. Obviously, the careers of most of them (Barnett really being the exception) are on the downslide, but it has been over 6 years since the apex of Pride (Final Conflict '05) and judging their current skill set is not a fair comparison.
M.Ed. Ex Phys
12-22-2011, 10:56 AM
Good points Rodja - Fedor was basically the Anderson Silva of the HW division for years.... fighting almost all of the top-ranked HW's out there, defending his title over and over... look at the past few UFC HW champs going back all the way to 2006:
JDS - has yet to defend title
Cain - lost his first defense to JDS
Lesnar - defended twice
Couture - defended twice
Sylvia - defended twice
12-22-2011, 10:59 AM
12-22-2011, 12:47 PM
Well Rodja u r right I remember the Reem and hunt fight it was the open weight GP and the Reem was I think around 220 my bad recalled that wrong. My bad but I'm still not impressed by the whole Sylvia and Arlovski bouts as Fedors "tough" competition Sylvia struggled with Brandon Vera I mean really. Arlovski was KOed by Rogers wow, but then again we saw Fedor struggle with Rogers, and we saw how the Reem handled him so as far as you trying to talk mess about me being new to mma I'm not but if I was Fedor would be a chump and Overeem would be the man. You have to admit his HW run has been as good as anyones. Regardless of what you think about dream, stikeforce, and K-1 as a fighter those are three of the biggest organizations and Overeem owns the title in all three. Fedor can't say that, but people say Fedor was the greatest. How is that? With a UFC title regardless if he defends it or not he has already done more than the so called greatest."Fedor" . I understand u are a huge Fedor fan but look at it from all sides.
12-22-2011, 01:12 PM
Win 35–11 (1) Fabricio Werdum Decision (unanimous) Strikeforce: Overeem vs. Werdum June 18, 2011 3 5:00 Dallas, Texas, United States Strikeforce Heavyweight Grand Prix Quarterfinal. Later was pulled from the tournament. Win 34–11 (1) Todd Duffee KO (knee & punches) Dynamite!! 2010 December 31, 2010 1 0:19 Saitama, Saitama, Japan Won the Dream Heavyweight Championship. Later vacated title. Win 33–11 (1) Brett Rogers TKO (punches) Strikeforce: Heavy Artillery May 15, 2010 1 3:40 St. Louis, Missouri, United States Defended the Strikeforce Heavyweight Championship. Later vacated title. Win 32–11 (1) Kazuyuki Fujita KO (knee) Dynamite!! 2009 December 31, 2009 1 1:15 Saitama, Saitama, Japan Win 31–11 (1) James Thompson Submission (standing guillotine choke) Dream 12 October 25, 2009 1 0:33 Osaka, Osaka, Japan Win 30–11 (1) Tony Sylvester Submission (standing guillotine choke) Ultimate Glory 11: A Decade of Fights October 17, 2009 1 1:23 Amsterdam, Netherlands Win 29–11 (1) Gary Goodridge Submission (kimura) Ultimate Glory 10: The Battle of Arnhem November 9, 2008 1 1:42 Arnhem, Netherlands NC 28–11 (1) Mirko Filipovic No contest (knee to the groin) Dream 6 September 23, 2008 1 6:09 Saitama, Saitama, Japan Overeem kneed Cro Cop two times in the groin Win 28–11 Mark Hunt Submission (keylock) Dream 5 July 21, 2008 1 1:11 Osaka, Osaka, Japan Win 27–11 Lee Tae-Hyun KO (punches & knee) Dream 4 June 15, 2008 1 0:36 Yokohama, Kanagawa, Japan Win 26–11 Paul Buentello Submission (knees to the body) Strikeforce: Four Men Enter, One Man Survives November 16, 2007 2 3:42 San Jose, California, United States Won inaugural Strikeforce Heavyweight Championship Loss 25–11 Sergei Kharitonov KO (punch) Hero's 10 September 17, 2007 1 4:21 Yokohama, Kanagawa, Japan Win 25–10 Michael Knaap Submission (guillotine choke) K-1 World Grand Prix 2007 in Amsterdam June 23, 2007 1 4:51 Amsterdam, Netherlands Moves up to Heavyweight full-time
Loss 23–7 Fabricio Werdum Submission (kimura) Pride Total Elimination Absolute May 5, 2006 2 3:43 Osaka, Osaka, Japan Pride 2006 Openweight Grand Prix Opening Round
Win 22–6 Sergei Kharitonov TKO (knees) Pride 31 February 26, 2006 1 5:13 Saitama, Saitama, Japan Moves up to Heavyweight
This Overeem's record at HW. How in the hell can anyone say that this is truly impressive? His Dream title was won against Todd Duffee, SF title was won against Buentello and he only defended it once (against Rogers after Rogers' loss to Fedor, which makes no sense), and his K-1 title is for freaking kickboxing. If you want to throw out titles, then I could easily point out that Fedor was the Pride, Rings, WAMMA and 4x World Combat Sambo champion, but titles in and of themselves do not prove the dominance of a fighter.
Out of all of his HW fights, the only ones that were against legitimate, top competition were Werdum, Hunt, Sergei, CC, Buentello, and Rogers. In these fights, he is 5-2 (1 NC). Fedor's fights against legitimate, top competition would be Nog, CC, Hunt, Herring, AA, Sylvia, Bigfoot and Rogers. In these fights, he is 7-2 (1NC). I'll agree that Fedor is past his prime and that he has failed to keep up with the game, but to say he is a chump is asinine.
M.Ed. Ex Phys
12-22-2011, 01:17 PM
Weren't arlovsky and Sylvia on like 3 fight losing streaks and banned from ufc going into their fights with fedor? as well his many losses in sf were embarrassing. Almost as bad as his "wins" in over these former ufc "greats"
12-22-2011, 01:20 PM
This is just further proof that so many people are new to MMA and have not been following it long enough to make informed opinions.
M.Ed. Ex Phys
12-22-2011, 01:29 PM
12-22-2011, 03:54 PM
12-22-2011, 04:05 PM
OK, arlovski lost twice in a row to sylvia in UFC then won 3 straight in UFC before "leaving"......AFTER losing to fedor he went on a 3 fight skid, the one I was referring too (4 fight loss streak including the fedor fight)....I had thought it was during/leading up to the fedor fight. either way, he was getting his ass kicked around in SF for sure and apparently felt he couldn't win the UFC belt, probably the reason he left there. Sylvia lost to coutore and nog and won a decision vs vera before leaving the UFC....pretty close to a 3 fight losing streak, but yeah....he won one inbetween....my bad.... either way I am sure they wanted him out of there, I recall him fighting pisspoor his last fights dancing and running around trying not to get KO'd in UFC then he turned up elsewhere.
12-22-2011, 04:11 PM
Sylvia's, who beat the hell out of Nog for two rounds before getting submitted, departure:
Dana talking about AA leaving:
M.Ed. Ex Phys
12-22-2011, 04:25 PM
Dana is full of shyt. I need not say more about that, how many guys "would never fight in the UFC" have we seen in the UFC? or were allowed to return? He is always talking someone up or down and then his actions are the opposite of his words. OK........but anyways, both arlovski and sylvia share one thing in common....they both seemed to fall out of favor with the UFC in some form or fashion and both made for boring fights towards the end. Too much dancing around, I'm afraid to get KO'd crap.......BOTH of them. As for arlovski, were his last few fights on the main card? the prelims? unaired? I recall his 2 title fight losses vividly, but barely recall any of those wins .....and you can ask comcast, I've been a subscriber to UFC PPV's every year they were broadcast (there were the PPV banishment years in there). Perhaps if you stop talking down to anybody who DARES talk bad about "your fighters" that you seem to favor in a condescending manner ("you guys must be 'new' UFC fans).....and instead understand that not everyone thinks fedor is such a great champion and legend....and not everybody thinks arlovski and sylvia were such great competition post UFC days....you might not be arguing with fellow MMA fans so much.....
12-22-2011, 04:35 PM
12-22-2011, 04:50 PM
Fighting Nog and CC isn't fighting top competition? There seems to be a lot that you don't recall as you have clearly shown in this thread. The only people that bash Fedor are people that do not have enough knowledge of MMA-plain and simple. Fighters, trainers, analysts....hell, practically anyone not named Dana White all agree that Fedor is a legend and the only other fighter that could be a contender for GOAT is Andy (and I freaking hate Anderson Silva).
M.Ed. Ex Phys
12-22-2011, 04:53 PM
Well I have been a fan of MMA for just as long as anybody else.....and I have stated my opinions in here and stand by them. I feel I have posted more than enough info/"proof" to back my statements and beliefs. we'll leave it at that........
12-22-2011, 05:01 PM
Actually, all you have done deny the counter evidence and focus solely on the latter part of Fedor's career instead of putting into perspective as a whole and the context of his reign. You have to remember that you're not only trashing Fedor, but also Noguiera.
M.Ed. Ex Phys
12-22-2011, 05:22 PM
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