Compunding Question for TEST

[rick055]

I saw my dr today and he was very agreeable to testosterone based on my labs & symptoms. He is even open to hCG and an AI.

At my request, he prescribed me compounded gel. He wrote the RX as follows:

Testosterone 10% compounded gel for transdermal admin. Apply daily5g to skin of chest/shoulders Q5 (or QS??) to 30 day supply.

My local compounding pharmacy said they didn't know how to fill it - it seemed high. As such, I was wondering if I could get another compounding pharmacy to fill it and how/where. Would I have to send the Rx or fax it? How long to get? Is it written correctly?

He gave me an alternate Rx for Androgel, but it's weaker and more expensive, and I told him I'd only fill one (although I'm ready to start something today!!)

 

[JanSz]

I saw my dr today and he was very agreeable to testosterone based on my labs & symptoms. He is even open to hCG and an AI.

At my request, he prescribed me compounded gel. He wrote the RX as follows:

Testosterone 10% compounded gel for transdermal admin. Apply daily5g to skin of chest/shoulders Q5 (or QS??) to 30 day supply.

My local compounding pharmacy said they didn't know how to fill it - it seemed high. As such, I was wondering if I could get another compounding pharmacy to fill it and how/where. Would I have to send the Rx or fax it? How long to get? Is it written correctly?

He gave me an alternate Rx for Androgel, but it's weaker and more expensive, and I told him I'd only fill one (although I'm ready to start something today!!)

I have been on Androgel, compounded Tcream and now I am on Depo-T injections. I like injections best, overall.

I feel that unless one have very small DHT he is better off on injections.

Transdermals raise DHT and most people do not need DHT that is significantly over the range. I do not buy all the explanations (after applying transdermals) that high DHT is not harmful.
--------------------------------------------------
With transdermals there is also uncertainty of figuring out correct dose. Depends highly on individual.
My experience.
After experimenting I ended with 10gram Androgel per day.
That give me TotalT~1000
When I switched to 10% Tcream I was in position to figure out my new dose.
I assumed that if I put the same amount of testosterone (contained in less propellant) then I should be close to the correct dose.
So 10grams of Androgel (1%) would be equal to 1gram of 10% T cream.
When I did the blood test I got TotalT=456 rather than expected 1000.

I doubled my dose, changed to 2grams but latter changed all together to Depo-T.
=============================================
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telephone 800. 279. 5708

Your script calls for gell as propellant, if you think it is better, they probably can do it.

The 5gram dose you have on your script sounds high to me, start with 2grams (going by my experience).

They also do compounded Depo-T, or testosterone cypionate.
They compound in sesame seed oil, 200mg/mL.
Original Depo-T is with cottonseed oil.
Doubt if that make any difference.
10ml vial $47.50
30mL vial $99.75 (will last you almost forever).

Doctor can call script (use as directed)
you can get it at your doors within 2 days.
-----------------------------------------
If you go that route, ask for 100mg/1gram compounded pregnenolone cream, use 2grams/day.
-----------------------------------------
Your T script should have read
Compounded Testosterone gel (or cream)
100mg/mL, use 2grams/day
-----------------------------------------

 

[rick055]

do you need a script for compounded pregnenolone cream?

I really, really want to start today.

 

[JanSz]

do you need a script for compounded pregnenolone cream?

I really, really want to start today.

Yes you need script for compounded pregnenolone cream?

Your life, your decission.

If your doc could call them today with script, you can get the stuff by Monday afternoon.

If you decide to go with original Depo-T ($150) or generic ($50), Wallgreens usually have it in store, so you could get your shot today. If you decide on shots, use 30ga 1/2" long needle, subQ shots around navel.
If you have SHBG I could calculate better starting dose for you.
If you do not have it, start with 100mg/week, use E3D schedule, check your blood 2-3 months, not sooner than 6 weeks. Boost start your dose, ask how.

 

[RPHMark]

There is some problem there.
10%=100mg/ml, so
5G of gel = 500mg/dose.
The Dr. probably meant 1% gel, which would be 50mg/dose or he meant to write 10% at 1g dose (100mg/dose).

 

[rick055]

There is some problem there.
10%=100mg/ml, so
5G of gel = 500mg/dose.
The Dr. probably meant 1% gel, which would be 50mg/dose or he meant to write 10% at 1g dose (100mg/dose).

Okay, that might be why the compounding pharmacy I called locally said they wanted to talk to my doc; they said it sounded high. Remember, this is the first time he's ever written a script for compounded test.

That said, do you think I am better off asking him to rewrite it for a 10%, 5% or 1% gel?

How many mg daily do I want to start with?

Or do I just want to start out with the Androgel today and see how it goes?

Is it only a question of expense? Or is it that at 10% there's just less to put on?

 

[RPHMark]

Higher % =less to apply, which is generally considered easier to manage. I would start at 50mg and work up if needed. Be aware of possible transfer to family members (which is why I started on inj). Cost is the main issue. If your insurance pays well for androgel then start there.

 

[AnotherOldGuy]

Is it only a question of expense? Or is it that at 10% there's just less to put on?

all.

At 1% - you need to put on 5x as much as the 5%, 10 times the amount that you do with 10% for same dose. What did the scrip for the Androgel say?

1% allows better accuracy - if you are off a drop on application, its only a 1% drop, not a 10% drop. Might be why some use it.

I think I read that the 1% Androgel starting does is considered 5g. A typical compounded 5% starting dose is 1ml. Thats why I asked about your androgel scrip. if he is asking for 5g dosing on androgel, then i think that would be 1ml of 5%.

Sorry for a lot of babble for "it depends".

 

[AnotherOldGuy]

I would start at 50mg and work up if needed. ..... Cost is the main issue. If your insurance pays well for androgel then start there.

Mark, is this 50mg considered 1ml of 5%?


Cost - yeah, check deductibles. My insurance would pay for androgel, but the compounded was about the cost of my deductible. Be aware of deductibles.

 

[rick055]

Yes, insurance is paying for (most of) the androgel and it's 5g of 1% per day.

I think I'm just going to start there.

He said I can switch to shots if I want. But I know the gels get levels up and even quickly, so I think I'll know if it's working or not.

 

[JanSz]

Yes, insurance is paying for (most of) the androgel and it's 5g of 1% per day.

I think I'm just going to start there.

He said I can switch to shots if I want. But I know the gels get levels up and even quickly, so I think I'll know if it's working or not.

How to ramp up so you get to your steady levels sooner.
Look at post #18 and #22.
http://anabolicminds.com/forum/male-anti-aging/66268-jans-bloodtest-april13-2.html

Short version:
http://anabolicminds.com/forum/404images/17620d1182261673-jans-bloodtest-april13-1000mg-week-tcypionate
Second system from the left.
Use E3D schedule.

Day1-2.5dose
Day2-1dose
Day3-no shots
Day4-1dose
Day5-no shots
Day6-noshots
Day7-1dose
continue E3D schedule

 

[RPHMark]

Mark, is this 50mg considered 1ml of 5%?


Cost - yeah, check deductibles. My insurance would pay for androgel, but the compounded was about the cost of my deductible. Be aware of deductibles.

Yes, 1ml of 5% would equal 50mg. Some studies have shown that applying a very concentrated topical is not best for absorbtion, which is why Androgel is a larger (by size not mg) dose. More surface area exposed to drug supposably = better absorbtion. I don't think it matters much as long as doses don't go below 1ml of cream (not sure about gels, they may be better at a slightly larger volume, though 5g is alot to apply).

Easy % conversion. For any % move the decimal one place to the right to get mg/ml (or mg/g if % is weight/weight).
so 0.1%=1mg/ml
1%=10mg/ml
10%=100mg/ml

 

[plymouth city]

Yes, 1ml of 5% would equal 50mg. Some studies have shown that applying a very concentrated topical is not best for absorbtion, which is why Androgel is a larger (by size not mg) dose. More surface area exposed to drug supposably = better absorbtion. I don't think it matters much as long as doses don't go below 1ml of cream (not sure about gels, they may be better at a slightly larger volume, though 5g is alot to apply).

Easy % conversion. For any % move the decimal one place to the right to get mg/ml (or mg/g if % is weight/weight).
so 0.1%=1mg/ml
1%=10mg/ml
10%=100mg/ml

:goodpost:

This is also why I am having REALLY good results with Dermacrine, even at a half dose(about 3ml)

 

[JanSz]

:goodpost:

This is also why I am having REALLY good results with Dermacrine, even at a half dose(about 3ml)

Plymouth;
After my Aug30/07 blood test I have to increase my pregnenolone cream from 1 gram to two.
and I am adding 100mg of DHEA.

Dermacrine have both of this products in it.
I am considering half dose (3mL=~3grams) of Dermacrine instead of my 2grams of preg cream and a DHEA pill.
I need a crystal ball, which combination will give me desired blood levels.
It is hard to go by content as a lot depend on propelant, but would you happen to know the mg's of DHEA and preg in the lattest versions of Dermacrine and Dermacrine Sustain.

 

[rick055]

How would you use Derrmacrine in combination with transdermal T?

Aren't these products also beneficial for adrenal fatigue?

Also, pregnenolone decreases DHT, right? I was at the high end of DHT when I started a transdermal and, although I am going to recheck in a few weeks, want to keep my DHT in check otherwise I will switch to shots.

 

[JanSz]

How would you use Derrmacrine in combination with transdermal T?

Aren't these products also beneficial for adrenal fatigue?

Also, pregnenolone decreases DHT, right? I was at the high end of DHT when I started a transdermal and, although I am going to recheck in a few weeks, want to keep my DHT in check otherwise I will switch to shots.

Normal dose of Androgel is 10grams, with that I already used all the available skin that I can reach.
Normal dose od Dermacrine is close to 8grams.
I do not think it is possible to use both.

I stoped Tcream because I would need about 4 grams between Tcream and preg cream.

 

[plymouth city]

Plymouth;
After my Aug30/07 blood test I have to increase my pregnenolone cream from 1 gram to two.
and I am adding 100mg of DHEA.

Dermacrine have both of this products in it.
I am considering half dose (3mL=~3grams) of Dermacrine instead of my 2grams of preg cream and a DHEA pill.
I need a crystal ball, which combination will give me desired blood levels.
It is hard to go by content as a lot depend on propelant, but would you happen to know the mg's of DHEA and preg in the lattest versions of Dermacrine and Dermacrine Sustain.

JansZ
Derm has
56mg DHEA
21mg Pregnenolone
68mg Resveratrol/chrysin/benzoflavone

Note though that delivery/absorbtion rate I believe is higher than traditional compounding methods.

What a kickass feeling as well. :duel:

 

[plymouth city]

How would you use Derrmacrine in combination with transdermal T?

Aren't these products also beneficial for adrenal fatigue?

Also, pregnenolone decreases DHT, right? I was at the high end of DHT when I started a transdermal and, although I am going to recheck in a few weeks, want to keep my DHT in check otherwise I will switch to shots.

To be honest, I would try Derm first.

It is very possible you won't need transdermal T.

Im having outstanding results from using half the dose. :thumbsup:

Yep, preg decreases DHT

 

[plymouth city]

Normal dose of Androgel is 10grams, with that I already used all the available skin that I can reach.
Normal dose od Dermacrine is close to 8grams.
I do not think it is possible to use both.

I stoped Tcream because I would need about 4 grams between Tcream and preg cream.

Derm is 7ml

I am having pretty good results with 3.5ml

 

[rick055]

plymouth,

I started androgel 5 days ago.

Could you use the Dermacrine on your legs? Or back? Or do I need more skin?

Plymouth - are you on test?

 

[plymouth city]

plymouth,

I started androgel 5 days ago.

Could you use the Dermacrine on your legs? Or back? Or do I need more skin?

Plymouth - are you on test?

Original Derm is for upper body use only.

Sustain can be used on legs I believe, Im actually trying to get an official answer from the Eric, PP guy in charge.

Nope, no test for me. Im glad I did not go that route. I have found some good protocols that work for me.

I will have new BW soon. I can;'t wait to see what It says, cause Im feeling pretty dam solid. :thumbsup:

Rick, give me a link to your log, or history/bloodwork.

 

[rick055]

Original Derm is for upper body use only.

Rick, give me a link to your log, or history/bloodwork.

http://anabolicminds.com/forum/male-anti-aging/74211-bloodwork-results-help.html

My log is brief; I am on day 5 of 5 grams 1% Androgel.