Anything to be concerned about?

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    Anything to be concerned about?


    I have been on HRT for about two years now, injections the past six months or so. My last appointment with Dr. John was last week during which he said it was time to donate blood, it was a little thick. He didn't say anything was way out of wack and actually said everything was just about perfect across the board. I went today to give blood and they rejected me because my blood pressure was 150/112. I have had some problems with anxiety in the past and still do on occasion when I go to the doctor or as in this case I am waiting for someone to jab a needle in my arm and draw out a pint of blood. I went home and took it; it was a little high and then after an hour or so and several times since has been around 130/80. Now I have to get doctor John to fax an order to them so they will take the blood, which sucks, for me as well as him I am sure. The technician also said my iron was 51 and was acting like it was outrageously high. I looked it up and the range is like 20-50 and if my RBC count is a little up I would assume my iron would be high as well. Any input? I guess the gears just started turning and I am a bit worried if all is okay.

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    no reason to be worried
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    Keep an eye on the BP. If your relaxed BP 130/80 (which is just about borderline high) then throughout the day it probably runs higher than that. High iron in a man is somewhat unusual, probably not anything to be concerned about at that level, but don't forget to keep an eye on it. If iron does go extremely high it can destroy the liver and kidneys.
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    Your hemoglobin is probably hitting the upper end of the range, which is probably why he is asking you to donate.

    Many men have high iron and do not know it until something happens, as Mark said - kidneys or liver, or really any/all organs. Consider yourself lucky that you found this out.

    What typically happens is that you slowly increase your iron level - it might take another 10 yrs to reach a serious point - but if you give blood regularily, you will keep your iron level in check. Drawing blood, or Phlebotomy is about the only way to get iron levels down. So give blood with regularity - it does 3 things - keeps your hemogloben level down, it takes iron out of your blood, and it is a community service.

    I would HIGHLY suggest all men, especially once you start approaching 40, to have your iron checked. I found out mine had gone over 1000 - which finally explained my high ALT/AST levels. Often high iron isn't discovered until damage starts to occur somewhere, and then finally it is discovered. If yoru range was up to 50, and you were 51 - I wouldn't worry about it - just give blood once a year and monitor it.

    Its a cheap blood test - I go outside of insurance to get extra ones done for about $25 from HealthCheckUSA without a Drs order (done at LabQuest), or I ask my Dr to add it in at time of annual physical.
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    These people are jerks.

    Why did they ask for all these numbers, iron numbers, BP, etc?

    This is why I never go to clinics to donate blood, to much hassle. Your better off going other routes, like red cross, or look into community areas that are having blood drives. In my area they do them every six months at the local high school. You walk in, give blood, leave, no BS hassle, etc.

    Giving blood is a good idea, I go twice a year at least.
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    Quote Originally Posted by bioman3131 View Post
    I have been on HRT for about two years now, injections the past six months or so. My last appointment with Dr. John was last week during which he said it was time to donate blood, it was a little thick. He didn't say anything was way out of wack and actually said everything was just about perfect across the board. I went today to give blood and they rejected me because my blood pressure was 150/112. I have had some problems with anxiety in the past and still do on occasion when I go to the doctor or as in this case I am waiting for someone to jab a needle in my arm and draw out a pint of blood. I went home and took it; it was a little high and then after an hour or so and several times since has been around 130/80. Now I have to get doctor John to fax an order to them so they will take the blood, which sucks, for me as well as him I am sure. The technician also said my iron was 51 and was acting like it was outrageously high. I looked it up and the range is like 20-50 and if my RBC count is a little up I would assume my iron would be high as well. Any input? I guess the gears just started turning and I am a bit worried if all is okay.

    The iron level could just be a blip. A couple of years ago, mine tested 54 against a similar reference range. I had it done again three months later and it was mid-30's.

    Do make sure that none of your supplements contains iron.
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    Why isn't anyone telling him that HRT thickens the blood and increases RBC and iron ?

    It's a good idea to monitor iron while on HRT and donate blood regularly.
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    Quote Originally Posted by dcguy4u View Post
    Why isn't anyone telling him that HRT thickens the blood and increases RBC and iron ?

    It's a good idea to monitor iron while on HRT and donate blood regularly.
    Ah, I assumed he knew this considering he is one of Dr Johns guys.
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    Yes, I did know it does this but it just freaked me out, the way the technician was acting. This is nuts though, I am still waiting for the order from Dr. John so I decided to go back and try again today. I checked to BP before a left work and it was 138/80, got in my car drove ten minutes to the blood place and there it was 182/94. rejected again. Actually, it's kind of pissing me off. Why can't they just take my damn blood. I am kind of concerned with these spikes though.
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    I just went to the Red Cross website. It said they will reject you if your top number is 180 or higher, or if your lower number is 100 or higher. If it is a blood drive at your school run by the red cross, you will still be rejected.

    Taking BP is an art. I have to remind the nurse sometimes to use the larger cuff, my arms are too big for the normal cuff. Was the room quiet? no music or distractions. How fast did they take it, tell them to take their time. Did they do both arms? If you are high on one arm, have them check the other. Make sure the cuff is not below your heart.

    before having your BP taken, before and during - meditate on something that relaxes you. If the nurse has large tits, don't look at them <g>, instead, imagine that you just got a blow job, or, better, that you are relaxing on a beach listening to the waves crash in.
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    First they used the machine and then she took it mannually and she did rush. Actually seemed kind of happy she didn't have to take my blood. I guess its more fun to sit on your but than do your job. I don't trust the machine much either. I have a strange pulse, normal for me, I had it completly checked out, and sometimes is messes with the machine. This happend at my doctors office once and he rechecked it and said the nurse didn't listen close enough. I will use your suggestions. Hopefully I can get the order from doctor John soon and won't have to worry about this crap.Though, I will probably monitor it for a week and talk it over with my GP just to be sure tho
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    Don't lose sight of the fact that it's beginning to look like you need to address your BP.
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    Sounds like anxiety induced High BP to me, I have anxiety issues and white coat syndrome. I can look at a BP machine and my BP will go up, I would suggest telling them you get a little nervous sometimes and try to relax for 5 or 10 minutes then have them retest. I have been at my Dr. office and tested as high as 200 over 100, them 10 minutes later 130 over 80. If you have any anti anxiety medicine like xanax or valium you could take a small dose to calm you down prior to going to give blood. Good luck
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    Question: how high does iron have to be so that you should be concerned about hemochromatosis?

    The American Hemochromatosis Society website says anything over 40% transferrin and/or more than 150 serum ferritin.

    Untitled Document

    It also mentions that in young males (like myself), you commonly see high transferrin accompanied by normal ferritin, yet hemochromatosis is still present.

    "What iron levels are considered "suspicious" for iron overload/hemochromatosis?

    A: A percent of saturation of more than 40% and/or a serum ferritin of more than 150 are considered suspicious for iron overload/hemochromatosis. It is important to note that in some patients, the percent of saturation can be quite high while the ferritin rather low (this is often the case in children or young adults in their 20's) or conversely, with normal percent of saturation and a high serum ferritin. Genetic testing can, in most cases, confirm the diagnosis so that treatment can begin. Ask your doctor about liver function tests, if these are also elevated, that is another possible sign of HH."


    I myself have a transferrin saturation of 51%, and mid/high ferritin. Is there any chance that this could indicate hemochromatosis, which might then explain my low T?
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    Quote Originally Posted by RPHMark View Post
    Don't lose sight of the fact that it's beginning to look like you need to address your BP.
    Also why nobody ask for Hematocrit levels?
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    I have a cool BP tester from Costco. It goes on your wrist, has a sensor that will not allow the reading to be taken until the unit is that the right level. It also has a USB cable with graphing software.
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    Quote Originally Posted by JanSz View Post
    Also why nobody ask for Hematocrit levels?
    I assumed from the first post that it was high, but I certainly could be wrong.
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    Quote Originally Posted by RPHMark View Post
    I assumed from the first post that it was high, but I certainly could be wrong.
    Probably close enough, but he is talking iron.
    Quote:"The technician also said my iron was 51 "

    There is number of iron tests:

    Quest Diagnostics: Test Menu

    • Iron and Iron Binding Capacity (7573X) - (356N)
    • IRON LIVER TISSUE (8350) - (8828X)
    • Iron, 24 Hour Urine (8056) - (17515X)
    • Iron, Blood (2430B) - (11104X)
    • Iron, Total (571X) - (24984P)

    I was assuming that most likely he is talking about one of the bottom two.
    ============================== ==========
    Ok, Hematocrit range on my test is (38.5-50)%
    so, may be he really think of Hematocrit.
    And his is 51, slightly over the upper range.

    Not drinking before blood draw may raise it slightly.
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    I think your right about the iron test. I assumed when he mentioned the blood being "tihick" that the hemoglobin was high. But, that may not be what he meant at all.
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    I once tried to sell blood and they rejected me, saying there was "too much grease" in my blood. They told me to come back another day when I had not eaten such a greasy meal. I never went back.
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    I have pretty much decided the high iron level is due to an increases in RBC's. I started injections six months or so ago starting with 200mg/ml for ten weeks and I am now on 150mg/ml per week. I don't take any iron supplements, so I m pretty sure thats were the high ferritin level is comming from. The blood pressure thing is what is confusing me. I have noticed long before starting HRT that it is occasionaly up but only occasionaly and my doc has always said it's okay. Here are my reading over the past week or so.

    9-12
    4:00 PM At the blood bank 160/112
    7;00 PM 147/88
    8;45 PM 147/67

    9-13
    6:00Am 123/89
    4:00 PM 125/71

    9-14
    4:00 130/82 (Checked at work before going to the blood bank
    4:15 182/92 (At the blood bank)
    6:00 124/75

    9-15
    6:30 AM 123/89
    2:00 PM 124/75

    9-16
    12:30 132/92

    I checked it a few times just out of the blue and it was 104/60 several times.

    I don't know, sometimes its a little high, sometimes really high and even kind of low sometimes. Would an increased blood volume secondary to HRT therapy cause an increase in BP?
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    Quote Originally Posted by bioman3131 View Post
    I have pretty much decided the high iron level is due to an increases in RBC's. I started injections six months or so ago starting with 200mg/ml for ten weeks and I am now on 150mg/ml per week. I don't take any iron supplements, so I m pretty sure thats were the high ferritin level is comming from. The blood pressure thing is what is confusing me. I have noticed long before starting HRT that it is occasionaly up but only occasionaly and my doc has always said it's okay. Here are my reading over the past week or so.

    9-12
    4:00 PM At the blood bank 160/112
    7;00 PM 147/88
    8;45 PM 147/67

    9-13
    6:00Am 123/89
    4:00 PM 125/71

    9-14
    4:00 130/82 (Checked at work before going to the blood bank
    4:15 182/92 (At the blood bank)
    6:00 124/75

    9-15
    6:30 AM 123/89
    2:00 PM 124/75

    9-16
    12:30 132/92

    I checked it a few times just out of the blue and it was 104/60 several times.

    I don't know, sometimes its a little high, sometimes really high and even kind of low sometimes. Would an increased blood volume secondary to HRT therapy cause an increase in BP?
    I am guessing you were trying to say:
    200mg/week for ten weeks and I am now on 150mg/week
    ========================
    What is your SHBG level.
    With lowish SHBG this may be high T dose.
    In any case change to E3D or 2/week injections.
    ========================
    You have to test
    Hematocrit

    if your hematocrit is high and you are not able to donate blood, urge you doctor to write a script (do not wait too long) to take blood from you.
    They may dump that blood latter if they wish.
    =============================
    Post all the blood tests that you did in last year or so.
    Or post link to place where we could find it.
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    Yes JanSZ that is what I meant on the dose. I can't remeber what my SBHG was. I just had a consult with Dr. John week before last he said what it was. He said everything was great across the board though just that I needed to donate blood. He is suposed to be working on a script for me to donate blood. Hopefully I can get it Monday or so. I am kind of interested to see what happens with the blood pressure after I do. What is the benefit of switching to two injections per week. As far as the hormone stuff, I am feeling great however if changing my injection schedule would help me feeleven better I am up for it as long as Dr. John approved.
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    Quote Originally Posted by bioman3131 View Post
    Yes JanSZ that is what I meant on the dose. I can't remeber what my SBHG was. I just had a consult with Dr. John week before last he said what it was. He said everything was great across the board though just that I needed to donate blood. He is suposed to be working on a script for me to donate blood. Hopefully I can get it Monday or so. I am kind of interested to see what happens with the blood pressure after I do. What is the benefit of switching to two injections per week. As far as the hormone stuff, I am feeling great however if changing my injection schedule would help me feeleven better I am up for it as long as Dr. John approved.
    Find out the place where you will go to give blood.
    I would go to my local hospital.
    Get their phone and contact person's name.
    (Double check-- Call that person and ask if you really need script for blood letting.)
    E-mail phone number and person's name to your doc and ask him to call the script in, No wait, stat. Pronto. Do not use snail mail.
    Do not poopoo or buy any explanation from your doc of why he cannot do it this way.
    Do this today.
    If you do not get satisfaction from your doc, take print of your blood test with you, go to Emergency Room, state your problem to doctor there.
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    Quote Originally Posted by bioman3131 View Post
    I have pretty much decided the high iron level is due to an increases in RBC's. I started injections six months or so ago starting with 200mg/ml for ten weeks and I am now on 150mg/ml per week. I don't take any iron supplements, so I m pretty sure thats were the high ferritin level is comming from. The blood pressure thing is what is confusing me. I have noticed long before starting HRT that it is occasionaly up but only occasionaly and my doc has always said it's okay. Here are my reading over the past week or so.

    9-12
    4:00 PM At the blood bank 160/112
    7;00 PM 147/88
    8;45 PM 147/67

    9-13
    6:00Am 123/89
    4:00 PM 125/71

    9-14
    4:00 130/82 (Checked at work before going to the blood bank
    4:15 182/92 (At the blood bank)
    6:00 124/75

    9-15
    6:30 AM 123/89
    2:00 PM 124/75

    9-16
    12:30 132/92

    I checked it a few times just out of the blue and it was 104/60 several times.

    I don't know, sometimes its a little high, sometimes really high and even kind of low sometimes. Would an increased blood volume secondary to HRT therapy cause an increase in BP?
    From the readings above I would say you are getting anxious when you go to give blood. All of your readings are fine except when you are at the blood bank and they were a little high the evening after your first blood bank visit which could have been caused by some lingering anxiety from the blood bank as you were probably worrying about ehy it was so high earlier. This sounds like classic White coat syndrome to me.
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    Dougfl I think your right. I am still waiting on my blood draw orders from Dr. John. I am sure he is very busy but I am hoping I can get it tomorrow. Today I thought what the hell and stopped by to see if the Ol blood pressure would cooperate. My highest ever 200/112 two hours later at home, 130/72. This is the craziest crap I have encountered. I had anxiety really bad for many years and while I still have it on occasion it has been way better since my hormone stuff has been straitened out. I even got off the antianxiety medicine I was taking. I just wonder if all of those years of having anxiety has fried my CNS and every time I get stressed even just a little if my BP shoots up. Funny thing is I didn't feel very anxious on my first two trips to the blood bank and only a little today. I would hate to see what it is when I really get stressed. Anyway, hopefully I can get this over by tomorrow but it looks like I will need a script every time I need to donate. Thanks for everyone’s input! I really appreciate it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by bioman3131 View Post
    Dougfl I think your right. I am still waiting on my blood draw orders from Dr. John. I am sure he is very busy but I am hoping I can get it tomorrow. Today I thought what the hell and stopped by to see if the Ol blood pressure would cooperate. My highest ever 200/112 two hours later at home, 130/72. This is the craziest crap I have encountered. I had anxiety really bad for many years and while I still have it on occasion it has been way better since my hormone stuff has been straitened out. I even got off the antianxiety medicine I was taking. I just wonder if all of those years of having anxiety has fried my CNS and every time I get stressed even just a little if my BP shoots up. Funny thing is I didn't feel very anxious on my first two trips to the blood bank and only a little today. I would hate to see what it is when I really get stressed. Anyway, hopefully I can get this over by tomorrow but it looks like I will need a script every time I need to donate. Thanks for everyone’s input! I really appreciate it.

    Maybe you ought to give it a rest. The process is starting to spiral - you're getting anxious about getting anxious.
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    Quote Originally Posted by cpeil2 View Post
    Maybe you ought to give it a rest. The process is starting to spiral - you're getting anxious about getting anxious.
    I agree, I have been battleing anxiety and panick attacks for years and most of the time your mind is your worst enemy. I would let it go for a while and try not to dwell. You do not want this episode to cause you to start getting nervous about more things more often.
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    You’re absolutely right. I do need to let it go for a while and I agree it does seem like your mind is your worst enemy at times when you battle anxiety. I guess this just really lit the fire because I am very concerned that everything stays right in regard to my HRT. I am finally where I need to be with it and don’t want anything changing. The anxiety stuff really does suck though. If you keep that door shut all is great but if you allow it to be cracked open a little too far it floods in and there isn’t a whole lot you can do but ride it out.
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    I gave blood today and my BP was 162/82, then after I finished it was something like 158 over some high number.

    Normally I am under 124/82 or so. I self-check it 20 times/week or so.
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    I was finally able to give blood today and I guess I will starting blood pressure medicine as well, Atenolol as per my family doc. I am still kind of concerned with the iron levels though. I think they are testing hematocrit at the blood bank. Two weeks ago mine was 51 and today it was 54. The technician said it should be below 38. Is anyone familiar with these values? They keep acting like they are outrageously high. I had blood work done about two months ago and Dr. John didn't say anything was that out of wack just that it was time for me to donate blood.
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    Quote Originally Posted by bioman3131 View Post
    I was finally able to give blood today and I guess I will starting blood pressure medicine as well, Atenolol as per my family doc. I am still kind of concerned with the iron levels though. I think they are testing hematocrit at the blood bank. Two weeks ago mine was 51 and today it was 54. The technician said it should be below 38. Is anyone familiar with these values? They keep acting like they are outrageously high. I had blood work done about two months ago and Dr. John didn't say anything was that out of wack just that it was time for me to donate blood.
    I go with Dr John here.

    This technician is a little out of her league I think.

    FYI - If you speak with a local clinic about your HRT situation, they should be happy to take your blod even if they cannot use it, for your good.
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    Bioman carefull about the BP meds. They are well known to clog up the liver and cause a sluggish liver, which leads to higher E2, quite possibly bad 16 hydroxy as well.

    Make sure you monitor E2 even more closely.
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