Does HRT eventually signal the Adrenals to Halt DHEA production?

  1. Registered User
    BigAk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    291
    Answers
    0

    Does HRT eventually signal the Adrenals to Halt DHEA production?


    The logic I'm trying to verify is that; since HRT provides the body with Testosterone externally, why would the adrenals keep on producing DHEA at normal levels?? It's obvious that HRT halts LH and FSH production for abvious reasons.. But, isnt' it obvious that DHEA production would follow the same destiny also?

  2. Running with the Big Boys
    hardasnails1973's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Posts
    2,039
    Answers
    0


    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. John View Post
    I regularly see low DHEA in men who are hypogonadal, pre-TRT.

    And I now want all (well, nearly all) my guys on DHEA, to help rebalance their pathways after TRT begins.
    I know that dhea alone can be used in adrenal fatigue in women, but I just don't understand the mechanism other then could it be that dhea possible converts into estrogen and estrogen can stimulate cortisol production. Now if a guy has low estrogen levels and was given DHEA could this actually work through the same pathway for estrogen to stimulate cortisol production?
  3. Registered User
    BigAk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    291
    Answers
    0


    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. John View Post
    I regularly see low DHEA in men who are hypogonadal, pre-TRT.

    And I now want all (well, nearly all) my guys on DHEA, to help rebalance their pathways after TRT begins.
    Do you have any data on hypogonadal patients who started out with very normal DHEA levels prior to TRT but "eventually" ended up with below normal DHEA levels after a year or so on TRT? I'm sure that NOT all your hypo. patients started out with below normal levels of DHEA prior to TRT administration.

    For those patients who you do not put on DHEA supp., have you observed any data as to how long term TRT impacted their natural DHEA levels?
    •   
       

  4. Registered User
    BigAk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    291
    Answers
    0


    Dr. John... I think you may have answered my very question in this post in another thread... Here's what you wrote when someone asked the following question:

    Quote Originally Posted by ItsHectic View Post
    Another question, does HCG or LH act upon the adrenals?
    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. John View Post
    Yes. Both do. They stimulate the P450scc enzyme, whihc ocnverts CHOL to pregnenolone. This increases the "building blocks" for hormone production.
    This leads me to believe that "yes", HRT that "does not" include HCG will eventually cause the adrenals to halt the production of DHEA. Since HCG is part of your HRT protocol, you're able to avoid this issue.... Interesting!!!
  5. Running with the Big Boys
    hardasnails1973's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Posts
    2,039
    Answers
    0


    Quote Originally Posted by BigAk View Post
    Dr. John... I think you may have answered my very question in this post in another thread... Here's what you wrote when someone asked the following question:





    This leads me to believe that "yes", HRT that "does not" include HCG will eventually cause the adrenals to halt the production of DHEA. Since HCG is part of your HRT protocol, you're able to avoid this issue.... Interesting!!!
    This got me thinking too as well why i felt so much better on hcg/ t creame alone then just the tcreame, but I have been off hcg for nearly 5 months and will have a clear testing of just the tcreame no DHEA, NO DIM, Nothing I have finally a clean slate to begin with.. Makes you wonder if testcreame alone with out hcg will suppress dhea well I will give you an aswer in about 3-4 days when I get my test results back .
  6. Registered User
    BigAk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    291
    Answers
    0


    Quote Originally Posted by hardasnails1973 View Post
    This got me thinking too as well why i felt so much better on hcg/ t creame alone then just the tcreame, but I have been off hcg for nearly 5 months and will have a clear testing of just the tcreame no DHEA, NO DIM, Nothing I have finally a clean slate to begin with.. Makes you wonder if testcreame alone with out hcg will suppress dhea well I will give you an aswer in about 3-4 days when I get my test results back .
    Sounds good buddy... However, my thinking that it would take more than 5 months to suppress one's dhea to noticable levels. But, I would be interesting in knowing what you got for comparison for sure. Lemme know... thank you.
  7. Running with the Big Boys
    hardasnails1973's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Posts
    2,039
    Answers
    0


    Quote Originally Posted by BigAk View Post
    Sounds good buddy... However, my thinking that it would take more than 5 months to suppress one's dhea to noticable levels. But, I would be interesting in knowing what you got for comparison for sure. Lemme know... thank you.
    My dhea has never gone above 220 in past 3 years since I got sick so far so it will be interesting to see. But 8 months ago when i was taken 25 mgs dhea, hcg with 5% T creame and .5 armidex m ,th I felt like i million bucks and was 20 lbs heavier and leaner then i am now. Since stopping every thing I lost 25 lbs of muscle feel like crap and have no desire to even do anything. My insurance ran out and I just decieded to take 5 months on just t creame and get blood work but no reason for spending 400 bucks on blood work when thats a month insurance for me when i did get it so I just suffered for past 5 months but will suffer no more!!
  8. Registered User
    Kanecore's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Age
    43
    Posts
    45
    Answers
    0


    I have been on TRT since 1996 and I've never taken DHEA before. My present DHEA Sulfate was 312 (ref 110-370).
  9. Registered User
    BigAk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    291
    Answers
    0


    Quote Originally Posted by Kanecore View Post
    I have been on TRT since 1996 and I've never taken DHEA before. My present DHEA Sulfate was 312 (ref 110-370).
    Does your TRT include HCG by any chance?
  10. Registered User
    ItsHectic's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Posts
    1,607
    Answers
    0


    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. John View Post
    I regularly see low DHEA in men who are hypogonadal, pre-TRT.

    And I now want all (well, nearly all) my guys on DHEA, to help rebalance their pathways after TRT begins.
    "Regularly" I am assuming must be in both primary and 2ndary patients, if someone is primary and LH is high wouldnt that mean increased DHEA(and pregnenelone)?
  11. Registered User
    JanSz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Posts
    4,631
    Answers
    0


    Quote Originally Posted by BigAk View Post
    This leads me to believe that "yes", HRT that "does not" include HCG will eventually cause the adrenals to halt the production of DHEA. Since HCG is part of your HRT protocol, you're able to avoid this issue.... Interesting!!!
    I see people reporting using relatively small amounts of DHEA.
    I am using massive amount of 350mg daily, divided morning/evening.
    I was able to raise my blood DHEAs from 118(apr05) (only) to 369(oct06).
    During that time I was on 10grams of Androgel, no HCG.
    Recently I made two changes, I use 1gram of Tcream instead of Androgel (same amount of testosterone) and also 250IU HCG (Novarel) every other day.
    Should I make changes to my DHEA dose?
    What is going to happen to my blood DHEA if I keep my current DHEA intake? How will this affect my Adrenals (overall)?
    In the mean time my testicles are 80% back to pre-T state, libido suffers, getting dreams more often.
  12. Registered User
    BigAk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    291
    Answers
    0


    Quote Originally Posted by JanSz View Post
    I see people reporting using relatively small amounts of DHEA.
    I am using massive amount of 350mg daily, divided morning/evening.
    I was able to raise my blood DHEAs from 118(apr05) (only) to 369(oct06).
    During that time I was on 10grams of Androgel, no HCG.
    Recently I made two changes, I use 1gram of Tcream instead of Androgel (same amount of testosterone) and also 250IU HCG (Novarel) every other day.
    Should I make changes to my DHEA dose?
    What is going to happen to my blood DHEA if I keep my current DHEA intake? How will this affect my Adrenals (overall)?
    In the mean time my testicles are 80% back to pre-T state, libido suffers, getting dreams more often.
    According to what's being said, I would think that an HRT patient who's also on HCG would NOT need DHEA supplementation at all since the HCG is acting on his adrenals to promote production. Afterall; the less drug intervention, the better. If results can be achieved with minimal drug intake, why add more?
  13. Registered User
    Scottyo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Posts
    1,002
    Answers
    0


    JanSz, any reason on the 250mg HCG EOD dosing schedule. I am currently on 100mg ED and was wondering if I should change that up. Also on tcream daily, so I never saw much of a 'schedule' for those not doing injections.
  14. Running with the Big Boys
    hardasnails1973's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Posts
    2,039
    Answers
    0


    Quote Originally Posted by Scottyo View Post
    JanSz, any reason on the 250mg HCG EOD dosing schedule. I am currently on 100mg ED and was wondering if I should change that up. Also on tcream daily, so I never saw much of a 'schedule' for those not doing injections.
    SCotty what brand of t cream you using
    Thanks
    and also are you senitive to perfumes, and gasoline fumes and lysol cans? This was a major discover and I went from mt ass dragging to ripping uip the gym in like 24 hours. i was taking taurine and msm to help with constpation but did when i looked back on lab tests and found out that excereting excessive amounts of sulfur amino acids taurine, cysteines and then it just hit me like a brick that perfumes drive me nuts and so does gasoline. I found like to molydebnum and how it is esssential for comverting your amino acids taurine and cysteine in to sulfur with out moly it converts to sulfites which resembles MSG toxicity and elevated glutamate levels in the brain all of which I had on my lab tests. Bacterial infections also produce sulfites as well as cleaming products such as clorax which I can smell miles away when some one is doing the laundry. People with PST problems have a hard time breaking down phenols and have chemical sensitivity to enviorment toxins. Look into PST detoxification and hopefully this might shed some light on things for you. If people have problems in sulfation pathways then you can not detoxify hormones meaning estrogen,enviormental toxins, thyroid, testosterone and so forth. HMMM maybe why mu DHEA-s levels where elevated 10 fold on salvia test because it could not detoxify the dhea so it just reciruclated around clogging up the cortisol receptors sites. Since reducing the MSM and lowering sulfur based foods my body has started to levels and reversing alot of the symptoms first thing that I noticed are stools are no longer light tan but darker brown which means bile production is starting to flow again and I am farting again (feel so good to releive that buily up gass). I t got so bad I did not fart for a week on end at a time..
  15. Registered User
    JanSz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Posts
    4,631
    Answers
    0


    Quote Originally Posted by BigAk View Post
    According to what's being said, I would think that an HRT patient who's also on HCG would NOT need DHEA supplementation at all since the HCG is acting on his adrenals to promote production. Afterall; the less drug intervention, the better. If results can be achieved with minimal drug intake, why add more?
    What you saying make sense.
    So much to learn. Only today I see this being discussed.
    I am readying for my next (large) blood test sometime end of March or April.
    Now this got me to wonder if with my decission on starting HCG I should not drop or lower my DHEA supplementation.
    When I did my first DHEA test I was already taking 5grams Androgel for quite some time (but not HCG) and with that my DHEA=118 was low. Also, I did not do anything to adrenals or thyroid.
    Other than HCG I am on 15mg Cortef and 2grains of Armour in my new routine.
    Quote Originally Posted by Scottyo View Post
    JanSz, any reason on the 250mg HCG EOD dosing schedule. I am currently on 100mg ED and was wondering if I should change that up. Also on tcream daily, so I never saw much of a 'schedule' for those not doing injections.
    From previous posts, 100IU of HCG would be ideal,
    I may change to that when I get used to poking myself that often.
    Per my current understanding, I do not worry much about TotalT.
    I just try to get FreeT and BAT into right place, all this because different people have different SHBG levels also Albumin levels, so comparing TT is less usefull.
  16. Running with the Big Boys
    hardasnails1973's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Posts
    2,039
    Answers
    0


    Quote Originally Posted by JanSz View Post
    What you saying make sense.
    So much to learn. Only today I see this being discussed.
    I am readying for my next (large) blood test sometime end of March or April.
    Now this got me to wonder if with my decission on starting HCG I should not drop or lower my DHEA supplementation.
    When I did my first DHEA test I was already taking 5grams Androgel for quite some time (but not HCG) and with that my DHEA=118 was low. Also, I did not do anything to adrenals or thyroid.
    Other than HCG I am on 15mg Cortef and 2grains of Armour in my new routine.

    From previous posts, 100IU of HCG would be ideal,
    I may change to that when I get used to poking myself that often.

    ..
    Per my current understanding, I do not worry much about TotalT.
    I just try to get FreeT and BAT into right place, all this because different people have different SHBG levels also Albumin levels, so comparing TT is less usefull.
    2 years ago i felt great on 10 grams androgel and HCG 250 ius m,th and levels where at 841, free was top of the range and e2 was 20 (BUT I did not put the gel on before the test no one told me too) so I was probably a lot higher, but felt like a million bucks. Last check on total t pre TRTwas 241 with one point of range from lowest on the FT, but albumin was off the charts !! Dr told me this was signs of detoxifcation when I researched it said dehydration..
    Now for the first time for 2.5 years I will have an accurate reading of Testosteorne, estrodial, free TTm BA testerone, shbg, dht, prolactin, dhea-s, pregnenolone, progesterone well having the creame on 3 hours priori the test as indicated and just minumal water intake. And all supplements where discountinued for 5 months. it was 5 months of suffering I will tell you that, but I wanted my system complemetly clean of everything so i can get a GOOD fresh reading.
  17. Registered User
    Scottyo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Posts
    1,002
    Answers
    0


    Quote Originally Posted by hardasnails1973 View Post
    SCotty what brand of t cream you using
    Thanks
    and also are you senitive to perfumes, and gasoline fumes and lysol cans? This was a major discover and I went from mt ass dragging to ripping uip the gym in like 24 hours. i was taking taurine and msm to help with constpation but did when i looked back on lab tests and found out that excereting excessive amounts of sulfur amino acids taurine, cysteines and then it just hit me like a brick that perfumes drive me nuts and so does gasoline. I found like to molydebnum and how it is esssential for comverting your amino acids taurine and cysteine in to sulfur with out moly it converts to sulfites which resembles MSG toxicity and elevated glutamate levels in the brain all of which I had on my lab tests. Bacterial infections also produce sulfites as well as cleaming products such as clorax which I can smell miles away when some one is doing the laundry. People with PST problems have a hard time breaking down phenols and have chemical sensitivity to enviorment toxins. Look into PST detoxification and hopefully this might shed some light on things for you. If people have problems in sulfation pathways then you can not detoxify hormones meaning estrogen,enviormental toxins, thyroid, testosterone and so forth. HMMM maybe why mu DHEA-s levels where elevated 10 fold on salvia test because it could not detoxify the dhea so it just reciruclated around clogging up the cortisol receptors sites. Since reducing the MSM and lowering sulfur based foods my body has started to levels and reversing alot of the symptoms first thing that I noticed are stools are no longer light tan but darker brown which means bile production is starting to flow again and I am farting again (feel so good to releive that buily up gass). I t got so bad I did not fart for a week on end at a time..
    HAN, I am using a simple compounded gel from a local pharmacy. no known brand, but I seem to have no reaction to it. I dont think I am sensitive to perfumes or colognes or anything of that sort.

    I do, however, feel I was incredibly stupid (and taxing on my adrenals) when I used to use A LOT of No-salt and go low sodium otherwise. (p/s ratio screwy). I also used to eat a lot of cassava, even the skins (another no-no). So they may have really wigged me out on top of everything else we talked about.

    But I dont seem to react to sulfa or sulfur foods any worse.
  18. Running with the Big Boys
    hardasnails1973's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Posts
    2,039
    Answers
    0


    Quote Originally Posted by Scottyo View Post
    HAN, I am using a simple compounded gel from a local pharmacy. no known brand, but I seem to have no reaction to it. I dont think I am sensitive to perfumes or colognes or anything of that sort.

    I do, however, feel I was incredibly stupid (and taxing on my adrenals) when I used to use A LOT of No-salt and go low sodium otherwise. (p/s ratio screwy). I also used to eat a lot of cassava, even the skins (another no-no). So they may have really wigged me out on top of everything else we talked about.

    But I dont seem to react to sulfa or sulfur foods any worse.
    Just thought i throw that out there
    Because after 2 years i fouind out that my PST and Sulfation are under active which is causing a build up of reverse t-3 and hypothyroidism because sulfuration is where rt3 get detoxed !!

    To tell you how low my sulfation system is I had an with some vinegar and an apple yestaerday and it set me off reall bad in severe shaking like a slight seizure, First night in almost 3 months I could not sleep and was pacing the floors all night long,

    Children with PST deficiency sometimes have red ears, or red cheeks, dark circles under the eyes, tantrums, aggressive behaviors, defiant behaviors, increased laughing, hypotonia (low muscle tone), and stimming behaviors (spinning in circles,toe walking, lining things up),
  19. Registered User
    BigAk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    291
    Answers
    0


    you guys hi-jacking my thread... LOL
  20. Banned
    plymouth city's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    1,299
    Answers
    0


    Speaking of DHEA, Im curious as to how someone like me can have a higher DHEA-S level(520) than total T level(490).

    Basically, how come Ive got such a massive amount of DHEA and so so T(especially for my age, 27)?
  21. Registered User
    ItsHectic's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Posts
    1,607
    Answers
    0


    Quote Originally Posted by plymouth city View Post
    Speaking of DHEA, Im curious as to how someone like me can have a higher DHEA-S level(520) than total T level(490).

    Basically, how come Ive got such a massive amount of DHEA and so so T(especially for my age, 27)?
    Maybe high LH and FSH?
  22. Running with the Big Boys
    hardasnails1973's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Posts
    2,039
    Answers
    0


    Quote Originally Posted by plymouth city View Post
    Speaking of DHEA, Im curious as to how someone like me can have a higher DHEA-S level(520) than total T level(490).

    Basically, how come Ive got such a massive amount of DHEA and so so T(especially for my age, 27)?
    Are your e2 levels in check?
  23. Registered User
    Kanecore's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Age
    43
    Posts
    45
    Answers
    0


    Quote Originally Posted by BigAk View Post
    Does your TRT include HCG by any chance?

    60mg of T cyp every third day; 100iu of HCG ED; .25mg of Arimidex EOD; 300mg of DIM ED; and 1000mg of TMG ED. I'm also starting pregnenolone cream, as per Dr. John, this week.
  24. Registered User
    JanSz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Posts
    4,631
    Answers
    0


    Quote Originally Posted by Kanecore View Post
    60mg of T cyp every third day; 100iu of HCG ED; .25mg of Arimidex EOD; 300mg of DIM ED; and 1000mg of TMG ED. I'm also starting pregnenolone cream, as per Dr. John, this week.
    What is the reasoning for both, Arimidex and DIM?
    ---
    What kind of DIM, how would you compare your dose to # of Inolplex pills?
    What is your body weight?
    ---
    What is the reasoning for pregnenolone cream, why not pills?
    ---
    Are you using progesterone cream?
  25. Running with the Big Boys
    hardasnails1973's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Posts
    2,039
    Answers
    0


    Quote Originally Posted by JanSz View Post
    What is the reasoning for both, Arimidex and DIM?
    ---
    What kind of DIM, how would you compare your dose to # of Inolplex pills?
    What is your body weight?
    ---
    What is the reasoning for pregnenolone cream, why not pills?
    ---
    Are you using progesterone cream?
    Dr john is highly against progesteroene cream because using the HCG will pretty do much the same thing as the progesterone cream as well as feeding other pathways as well.
  26. Registered User
    Kanecore's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Age
    43
    Posts
    45
    Answers
    0


    Quote Originally Posted by JanSz View Post
    What is the reasoning for both, Arimidex and DIM?
    ---
    What kind of DIM, how would you compare your dose to # of Inolplex pills?
    What is your body weight?
    ---
    What is the reasoning for pregnenolone cream, why not pills?
    ---
    Are you using progesterone cream?
    I weigh 255lbs at 6 ft,(36in waist, 54 in chest). I played lineman in college for four years and was a cop for 10 years before going back to school so i consider myself in decent shape. I say this not out of selfindulgance, but because bodyfat, especially in a man's mid-section, contains aromatase. The more bodyfat in this area, the more likley T will get converted into E. Decreasing bodyfat is always a good idea.

    I take 150 mg of pure DIM and 500mg of TMG in the morning and 150mg of both at night. I just use Vitamin World DIM because i was the only DIM product I could find in my area. The only ingedient is DIM. I'm going to order another product but I want to ask Dr. John what he recommends. Dr. John told me to take DIM and TMG along with Arimidex because my 4-Hydroxyestrodiol. 4-Hydroxyestradiol along with 16e-Hydroxyestrone are harmful estrogen metabolite. Moreover, my liver must be a little clogged because my Total Es were originally high. Since the liver is responsible for excreting hormone metabolites, it would make sense that one needs to have efficient liver function to have a helathy estrogen/testosterone balance. One cannot assume they need to take DIM and TMG unless it is justified by lab results. My case is particular to my results.

    Dr. John prescribed Pregnenolone Cream because it is more effective than pills and it has a calming effect (nerves, stress, focus). Also, he indicated that it re-establishes hormonal pathways.
  27. Registered User
    pmgamer18's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    1,532
    Answers
    0


    Quote Originally Posted by plymouth city View Post
    Speaking of DHEA, Im curious as to how someone like me can have a higher DHEA-S level(520) than total T level(490).

    Basically, how come Ive got such a massive amount of DHEA and so so T(especially for my age, 27)?
    Cortisol and DHEA come from the Adrenals and this can be a sine your Adrenals are working over time.
    A cut and paste from this site.
    Thyroid and adrenal dysfunction: the diagnosis and treatment of an endemic syndrome
    -----------------------------------------------------------
    Stage I is the stressed phase where, due to illness or other stress, the adrenals mobilise cortisol and DHEA (dehydroepiadrenosterone) to help the body deal with the problem. This is an acute phase; the stress settles and the adrenals settle down.

    Stage II, resistance, is where it all goes on and on and the adrenals enlarge and increase their hormone output on a longer-term basis. This can go on for weeks, months, or even years but eventually they canít take it any more and start to regress into exhaustion, stage III. The degree of exhaustion is reflected in their output and balance of their two chief hormones, cortisol and DHEA, which is where the Adrenal Stress Index (ASI) comes in.

    -----------------------------------------------------------
    Phil
  28. Banned
    plymouth city's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    1,299
    Answers
    0


    Quote Originally Posted by ItsHectic View Post
    Maybe high LH and FSH?
    Im not sure, my LH and FSH werent checked in my bloodwork.

    Bloodwork done at quest

    IGF-1 130 (126 - 382ng)

    DHEA 520 (110 - 500)

    T-4 FREE 1.5 (.8 - 1.8)

    TSH 1.21 (.4 - 5.5)

    ESTRADOIL...43 (10 - 50)

    PSA .3

    T3 FREE 317 (230 - 420)

    TEST, TOTAL 490 (245 - 1836)

    TEST FREE 18.9 (12 - 40)

    TEST, %OF FREE .4 (.2 - .68)
  29. Banned
    plymouth city's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    1,299
    Answers
    0


    Quote Originally Posted by hardasnails1973 View Post
    Are your e2 levels in check?
    No, there not. 43 (10 - 50)

    Its not a estrogen being stored in fat problem either. I carry a 7% BF. I look great, feel so so. Would rather have that the other way.
  30. Banned
    plymouth city's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    1,299
    Answers
    0


    Quote Originally Posted by pmgamer18 View Post
    Cortisol and DHEA come from the Adrenals and this can be a sine your Adrenals are working over time.
    A cut and paste from this site.
    Thyroid and adrenal dysfunction: the diagnosis and treatment of an endemic syndrome
    -----------------------------------------------------------
    Stage I is the stressed phase where, due to illness or other stress, the adrenals mobilise cortisol and DHEA (dehydroepiadrenosterone) to help the body deal with the problem. This is an acute phase; the stress settles and the adrenals settle down.

    Stage II, resistance, is where it all goes on and on and the adrenals enlarge and increase their hormone output on a longer-term basis. This can go on for weeks, months, or even years but eventually they canít take it any more and start to regress into exhaustion, stage III. The degree of exhaustion is reflected in their output and balance of their two chief hormones, cortisol and DHEA, which is where the Adrenal Stress Index (ASI) comes in.

    -----------------------------------------------------------
    Phil

    Great stuff Phil thanks. Basically what may be going on is that Im in the beginning stage - Stage one. Im young.

    Stressed? I am. Im type A to the bone. Hard charging. Its the only way i know how to be. Im starting Bikram Yoga to help me chill out.

    I due believe that my over consumption to caffeine is a problem. Ive already started to work on that problem. Ive cut my dose in half, from 6 cups to 3 a day. I will be dropping that down to zero in the future. I have quit smoking completely as well. I was a social smoker prior. Been smoke free since the new years. I don't drink, havent in a long time, although I used to drink in the past.

    Ive come along way though. I cringe to think what these bloodwork numbers were a few years ago.
  31. Registered User
    JanSz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Posts
    4,631
    Answers
    0


    Quote Originally Posted by Scottyo View Post
    HAN, I am using a simple compounded gel from a local pharmacy. no known brand, but I seem to have no reaction to it. I dont think I am sensitive to perfumes or colognes or anything of that sort.

    I do, however, feel I was incredibly stupid (and taxing on my adrenals) when I used to use A LOT of No-salt and go low sodium otherwise. (p/s ratio screwy). I also used to eat a lot of cassava, even the skins (another no-no). So they may have really wigged me out on top of everything else we talked about.

    But I dont seem to react to sulfa or sulfur foods any worse.
    Dr Mercola is selling cassava, he is supposedly health guru??
    http://www.mercola.com/products/cocoa_cassava_bar.htm
  32. Registered User
    JanSz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Posts
    4,631
    Answers
    0


    Quote Originally Posted by Kanecore View Post
    I weigh 255lbs at 6 ft,(36in waist, 54 in chest). I played lineman in college for four years and was a cop for 10 years before going back to school so i consider myself in decent shape. I say this not out of selfindulgance, but because bodyfat, especially in a man's mid-section, contains aromatase. The more bodyfat in this area, the more likley T will get converted into E. Decreasing bodyfat is always a good idea.

    I take 150 mg of pure DIM and 500mg of TMG in the morning and 150mg of both at night. I just use Vitamin World DIM because i was the only DIM product I could find in my area. The only ingedient is DIM. I'm going to order another product but I want to ask Dr. John what he recommends. Dr. John told me to take DIM and TMG along with Arimidex because my 4-Hydroxyestrodiol. 4-Hydroxyestradiol along with 16e-Hydroxyestrone are harmful estrogen metabolite. Moreover, my liver must be a little clogged because my Total Es were originally high. Since the liver is responsible for excreting hormone metabolites, it would make sense that one needs to have efficient liver function to have a helathy estrogen/testosterone balance. One cannot assume they need to take DIM and TMG unless it is justified by lab results. My case is particular to my results.

    Dr. John prescribed Pregnenolone Cream because it is more effective than pills and it has a calming effect (nerves, stress, focus). Also, he indicated that it re-establishes hormonal pathways.
    Vitamin World
    Cannot find anything searching for DIM
    what name they use?
    Dr did not specify any particular brand of DIM or quantity?
  33. Registered User
    pmgamer18's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    1,532
    Answers
    0


    Quote Originally Posted by plymouth city View Post
    Great stuff Phil thanks. Basically what may be going on is that Im in the beginning stage - Stage one. Im young.

    Stressed? I am. Im type A to the bone. Hard charging. Its the only way i know how to be. Im starting Bikram Yoga to help me chill out.

    I due believe that my over consumption to caffeine is a problem. Ive already started to work on that problem. Ive cut my dose in half, from 6 cups to 3 a day. I will be dropping that down to zero in the future. I have quit smoking completely as well. I was a social smoker prior. Been smoke free since the new years. I don't drink, havent in a long time, although I used to drink in the past.

    Ive come along way though. I cringe to think what these bloodwork numbers were a few years ago.
    You never know I am a type A and proud of it what do you do for a living. I did anything and everything retired as an Engineer from Chry. in Alburn Hills Mi.
    Phil
  34. Banned
    plymouth city's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    1,299
    Answers
    0


    Quote Originally Posted by pmgamer18 View Post
    You never know I am a type A and proud of it what do you do for a living. I did anything and everything retired as an Engineer from Chry. in Alburn Hills Mi.
    Phil
    I work as a server in fine dining. I love it. I like people, I like to talk, Im a night owl and Im constantly on the go, so its perfect for me. Great cash while I finish business school at Eastern Michigan.

    My dad worked at Chry as a line rat for 30 years. Had the biggest arms on a human being under 150lbs Ive ever seen in my life. Its in our blood to be type A ya know Its sad to see whats happening to our economy up here. I love michigan with every cell in my body, I still think its the most beautiful place in the world, but I'll probably have to leave once college is up.
  35. Registered User
    Kanecore's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Age
    43
    Posts
    45
    Answers
    0


    Quote Originally Posted by JanSz View Post
    Vitamin World
    Cannot find anything searching for DIM
    what name they use?
    Dr did not specify any particular brand of DIM or quantity?
    I'm going to ask Dr. John what kind of DIM he reccommends.

    The brand I take was the only brand that was immediately available to me. I'm sure it's not the best.
  36. Registered User
    pmgamer18's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    1,532
    Answers
    0


    Quote Originally Posted by plymouth city View Post
    I work as a server in fine dining. I love it. I like people, I like to talk, Im a night owl and Im constantly on the go, so its perfect for me. Great cash while I finish business school at Eastern Michigan.

    My dad worked at Chry as a line rat for 30 years. Had the biggest arms on a human being under 150lbs Ive ever seen in my life. Its in our blood to be type A ya know Its sad to see whats happening to our economy up here. I love michigan with every cell in my body, I still think its the most beautiful place in the world, but I'll probably have to leave once college is up.
    Tell me about it I was a line rat for 6 months at a stamping plant on the fender line 390 / hr. I up graided into skilled trades and had no feeling in my hands for months.

    Michigan will come back it allways does.
    Phil
  •   

      
     

Similar Forum Threads

  1. Replies: 11
    Last Post: 05-08-2012, 11:39 PM
  2. Replies: 9
    Last Post: 01-28-2012, 11:48 AM
  3. Matrix or others - Does using an AI put stress on the Adrenals?
    By superone in forum Male Anti-Aging Medicine
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 10-24-2008, 10:04 PM
  4. How does Arimidex affect the adrenal glands?
    By MetalMX in forum Male Anti-Aging Medicine
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 07-31-2008, 06:33 AM
  5. Replies: 20
    Last Post: 12-07-2002, 03:02 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Log in

Log in