Anabolics and heart rhythm

[Punkrocker]

Hey guys so I posted on here before about heart palpitations or PVCs. I have recently been experiencing PVCs on a daily basis now they seem to be happening more in the morning but they are quite frightening. I went to my primary doctor on two separate occasions and was a short I would be okay and I even wore a 24-hour Holter monitor which the results should be back in a couple days. On Sunday I got a few very strong palpitations so I decided to go to the walk in clinic in which they brought me to the ER. While I was in the ER I had multiple strong palpitations and they gave me a couple of EKGs and then they put me on a heart monitor and took some blood to check my electrolytes and other clotting factors and other sorts of blood tests that relate to heart health. All my blood tests came back normal and the EKGs and heart monitors did show palpitations but the doctor said they were not the dangerous kind and in fact benign. They performed one more test which was an ultrasound of my heart basically to look at it to see if they could notice anything strange in which they told me my heart looked good and normal. At this point I am just waiting for the results of the Holter monitor and next week I will go in for an echocardiogram which is basically I guess the same as the ultrasound but with a little bit more detail. From all the tests they have done with the monitors the EKG the ultrasound Etc they are telling me that everything looks good and I'm healthy and PVCs and palpitations can happen to anybody and they are benign and once I get the echocardiogram I will know totally totally for sure. Although this news seems encouraging I am losing my mind and feel terrified with these palpitations. I am 30 years old almost 31 and have never had to deal with something like this and I am wondering if the handful of Cycles I have done are causing this. I've never taken Trend or anything crazy just a higher dose of test like 500 mg and a little anavar here and there and some eq. I need some words of encouragement please I'm freaking out over here lol

 

[Nac]

Try not to freak out. Anxiety will only encourage symptoms. Try and look at your situation objectively, rather than emotionally:

1) youre getting all the best non-invasive testing done. If the specialists conclude from this that youre all good, you can be confident you are at no more risk of a myocardial infarction or any other cardiac event than any other person on the planet.

2) Id assume you had troponin tested. You wouldve been told if this was out of range. It isnt, so you can be confident you havent had a heart attack nor has your heart sustained any damage/cell death recently.

3) your holter monitor will let the specialist know what "burden" the PVCs are posing. Id almost guarantee its low, totally acceptable, and further evidence your condition is non-threatening.

4) youre not in a minority. Most people get PVCs, or some type of arrhythmia. What differs is the burden, and whether they are conscious of them occuring. Most people are never aware of them.

5) there are numerous practical measures you can take to try and minimise symptoms. Supplements too. Its a bit of hit or miss, but worth it if youre so inclined to experiment.

6) its possible AAS is perpetuating symptoms. More likely that it would potentially generate atypical cardiac hypertrophy or artherosclerosis, though. But this stuff will tend to get picked up on EKG, or especially the echocardiogram.

Trust the testing.

 

[Punkrocker]

Try not to freak out. Anxiety will only encourage symptoms. Try and look at your situation objectively, rather than emotionally:

1) youre getting all the best non-invasive testing done. If the specialists conclude from this that youre all good, you can be confident you are at no more risk of a myocardial infarction or any other cardiac event than any other person on the planet.

2) Id assume you had troponin tested. You wouldve been told if this was out of range. It isnt, so you can be confident you havent had a heart attack nor has your heart sustained any damage/cell death recently.

3) your holter monitor will let the specialist know what "burden" the PVCs are posing. Id almost guarantee its low, totally acceptable, and further evidence your condition is non-threatening.

4) youre not in a minority. Most people get PVCs, or some type of arrhythmia. What differs is the burden, and whether they are conscious of them occuring. Most people are never aware of them.

5) there are numerous practical measures you can take to try and minimise symptoms. Supplements too. Its a bit of hit or miss, but worth it if youre so inclined to experiment.

6) its possible AAS is perpetuating symptoms. More likely that it would potentially generate atypical cardiac hypertrophy or artherosclerosis, though. But this stuff will tend to get picked up on EKG, or especially the echocardiogram.

Trust the testing.

Wow man thank you very much that was very informative and it actually did help me feel better. They should have the Holter monitor results in the next couple of days and in the meantime I have been trying to drink more fluids. I have noticed that I have been getting these more in the mornings and as the day goes on they start to go away so I'm figuring it could be due to dehydration I'm hoping.

 

[Nac]

I tend to notice them more in the morning, too. My hydration and electrolytes are on point, so it did have me wondering if there was a hormonal factor here (cortisol...e2...dht...). Through experimentation Ive found this to be inconclusive.

I do have to be on top of e2 control; if my e2 gets a little high PVCs tend to increase. But, Im reluctant to attribute their occurence (for me at least) solely to e2. My e2 goes out of range during a blast but my PVCs dont necessarily increase. This suggests to me its possibly the e2:tt ratio that is more relevant.

You use fish oil?

 

[Punkrocker]

I tend to notice them more in the morning, too. My hydration and electrolytes are on point, so it did have me wondering if there was a hormonal factor here (cortisol...e2...dht...). Through experimentation Ive found this to be inconclusive.

I do have to be on top of e2 control; if my e2 gets a little high PVCs tend to increase. But, Im reluctant to attribute their occurence (for me at least) solely to e2. My e2 goes out of range during a blast but my PVCs dont necessarily increase. This suggests to me its possibly the e2:tt ratio that is more relevant.

You use fish oil?

Yeah I take 6 grams of fish oil daily I think my E2 is in range usually when it gets high I get some serious anxiety so I don't think it is my estrogen

 

[Nac]

6gm is quite alot, how long you been taking that much? What made you try that much?

By 6gm do you mean epa+dha content?

 

[Punkrocker]

6gm is quite alot, how long you been taking that much? What made you try that much?

I've been taking that much maybe for a few months now because my hematocrit is borderline High and I would like to keep my blood on the thinner end just in case. My doctor will not give me a phlebotomy because I'm not out of range and I cannot donate at the American Red Cross until October. I have a hemoglobin of around 17 and my hematocrit is around 50%. So I like to go heavy on the fish oils just in case

 

[Nac]

Is that 6gm of epa+dha content?

 

[Punkrocker]

Is that 6gm of epa+dha content?

Yes sir

 

[Nac]

Yes sir

Okay. Couple things Ill note based on my own research and experience. Ultimately any action or not is of course your call.

Generally, 3gm epa/dha is recommended as the upper limit. Certainly no more than 4gm. In your case this could be even more relevant because some people find fish oil aggravates PVCs.

Now, some people find fish oil helps relieve symptoms. Im one of those. But, Ive never dosed more than 4gm for a length of time.

Its quite possible fish oil is an aggravator for you, either at any dose, or once a threshold is surpassed. Id recommend you consider this possibility.

Its understandable you want to be proactive with your high-end hcrit/rbc levels. But, maybe instead of megadosing supplement A, dose it more reasonably and add another aid. Naringin and nattokinase are both viable options.

Again, Id urge you to research fish oil dosing limits for yourself, and consider at least trying a lower dose (50%) for a period to assess.

 

[Punkrocker]

Okay. Couple things Ill note based on my own research and experience. Ultimately any action or not is of course your call.

Generally, 3gm epa/dha is recommended as the upper limit. Certainly no more than 4gm. In your case this could be even more relevant because some people find fish oil aggravates PVCs.

Now, some people find fish oil helps relieve symptoms. Im one of those. But, Ive never dosed more than 4gm for a length of time.

Its quite possible fish oil is an aggravator for you, either at any dose, or once a threshold is surpassed. Id recommend you consider this possibility.

Its understandable you want to be proactive with your high-end hcrit/rbc levels. But, maybe instead of megadosing supplement A, dose it more reasonably and add another aid. Naringin and nattokinase are both viable options.

Again, Id urge you to research fish oil dosing limits for yourself, and consider at least trying a lower dose (50%) for a period to assess.

Ok, I'll start that tonight! Thank you again for the input. I didn't even think about the fish oil

 

[Nac]

Ok, I'll start that tonight! Thank you again for the input. I didn't even think about the fish oil

Yeah, it can be quite surprising how much of an impact seemingly innocuous things can potentially have, for better or worse.

Also, I know its only natural to find your own experiences overwhelming. But Ive spent a fair bit of time at forums where the members are PVC sufferers, and dude there is alot of folks who have it far, far worse than us. Like, not being able to sleep at all due to strong episodes. Constant episodes (I get maybe a dozen a day that I even feel). Lots dont respond to any remedial attempts at all. I really feel for those guys.

 

[Punkrocker]

Yeah, it can be quite surprising how much of an impact seemingly innocuous things can potentially have, for better or worse.

Also, I know its only natural to find your own experiences overwhelming. But Ive spent a fair bit of time at forums where the members are PVC sufferers, and dude there is alot of folks who have it far, far worse than us. Like, not being able to sleep at all due to strong episodes. Constant episodes (I get maybe a dozen a day that I even feel). I really feel for those guys.

Yeah that would be terrible. Actually on Sunday morning I was awokened by one which was horrible but I guess I'm not getting them like crazy. But I'm getting them more frequent now than ever and that's why I'm freaking out. I used to only get them once and a while and now it's. Become literally every day more and more which is starting to make me think something is breaking down or whatever, but so far the tests are showing good signs so I just gotta chill.....

 

[Nac]

Yip. If your heart was suffering necrosis the bloodtests wouldve shown it. For some reason there is an electrical misfiring; this is different to actual tissue death. Structurally your heart is likely mint. But the tests will confirm this.

I will guarantee things will calm down once you get those results. Hopefully for you, like me, they can be further reduced by something simple like appropriate omega3 intake via fish oil.

 

[Punkrocker]

Yip. If your heart was suffering necrosis the bloodtests wouldve shown it. For some reason there is an electrical misfiring; this is different to actual tissue death. Structurally your heart is likely mint. But the tests will confirm this.

I will guarantee things will calm down once you get those results. Hopefully for you, like me, they can be further reduced by something simple like appropriate omega3 intake via fish oil.

Yeah I hope so man. This sucks. I'm scared that it's just gonna randomly stop lol. I understand that this is an illogical situation, but these PVCs bring on anxiety and once that starts, logic goes right out the window

 

[Nac]

Yeah I hope so man. This sucks. I'm scared that it's just gonna randomly stop lol. I understand that this is an illogical situation, but these PVCs bring on anxiety and once that starts, logic goes right out the window

Ive been through the exact same thinking man. You just have to remember, your condition does not pose an immediate, acute threat. You wouldntve been discharged from ED otherwise.

 

[FRITZBLITZ]

I tend to notice them more in the morning, too. My hydration and electrolytes are on point, so it did have me wondering if there was a hormonal factor here (cortisol...e2...dht...). Through experimentation Ive found this to be inconclusive.

I do have to be on top of e2 control; if my e2 gets a little high PVCs tend to increase. But, Im reluctant to attribute their occurence (for me at least) solely to e2. My e2 goes out of range during a blast but my PVCs dont necessarily increase. This suggests to me its possibly the e2:tt ratio that is more relevant.

You use fish oil?

I have them in the morning sometimes. They are not at all regular, as in predictable to chem, supp,food, intake or anything. I know that my dreams cause a lot of anxiety and I believe that the small amount of adrenaline left over from dreams may cause them. I can usually get them under control by breathing in 5 count, hold 5 count, exhale slow 5 count, rest 5, and inhale again.

 

[FRITZBLITZ]

Yeah I hope so man. This sucks. I'm scared that it's just gonna randomly stop lol. I understand that this is an illogical situation, but these PVCs bring on anxiety and once that starts, logic goes right out the window

Another thing you can do is exersise and get your heart rate up. It sounds like a bad idea since you feel like your on the verge of a heart attack but having your body control the pace of your heart can help.

 

[Dz23]

Try not to freak out. Anxiety will only encourage symptoms. Try and look at your situation objectively, rather than emotionally:

1) youre getting all the best non-invasive testing done. If the specialists conclude from this that youre all good, you can be confident you are at no more risk of a myocardial infarction or any other cardiac event than any other person on the planet.

2) Id assume you had troponin tested. You wouldve been told if this was out of range. It isnt, so you can be confident you havent had a heart attack nor has your heart sustained any damage/cell death recently.

3) your holter monitor will let the specialist know what "burden" the PVCs are posing. Id almost guarantee its low, totally acceptable, and further evidence your condition is non-threatening.

4) youre not in a minority. Most people get PVCs, or some type of arrhythmia. What differs is the burden, and whether they are conscious of them occuring. Most people are never aware of them.

5) there are numerous practical measures you can take to try and minimise symptoms. Supplements too. Its a bit of hit or miss, but worth it if youre so inclined to experiment.

6) its possible AAS is perpetuating symptoms. More likely that it would potentially generate atypical cardiac hypertrophy or artherosclerosis, though. But this stuff will tend to get picked up on EKG, or especially the echocardiogram.

Trust the testing.

Wow nac that **** tight af.

I admire how you responded to that post with such rationale and compassion for the cause

 

[Dz23]

Hey guys so I posted on here before about heart palpitations or PVCs. I have recently been experiencing PVCs on a daily basis now they seem to be happening more in the morning but they are quite frightening. I went to my primary doctor on two separate occasions and was a short I would be okay and I even wore a 24-hour Holter monitor which the results should be back in a couple days. On Sunday I got a few very strong palpitations so I decided to go to the walk in clinic in which they brought me to the ER. While I was in the ER I had multiple strong palpitations and they gave me a couple of EKGs and then they put me on a heart monitor and took some blood to check my electrolytes and other clotting factors and other sorts of blood tests that relate to heart health. All my blood tests came back normal and the EKGs and heart monitors did show palpitations but the doctor said they were not the dangerous kind and in fact benign. They performed one more test which was an ultrasound of my heart basically to look at it to see if they could notice anything strange in which they told me my heart looked good and normal. At this point I am just waiting for the results of the Holter monitor and next week I will go in for an echocardiogram which is basically I guess the same as the ultrasound but with a little bit more detail. From all the tests they have done with the monitors the EKG the ultrasound Etc they are telling me that everything looks good and I'm healthy and PVCs and palpitations can happen to anybody and they are benign and once I get the echocardiogram I will know totally totally for sure. Although this news seems encouraging I am losing my mind and feel terrified with these palpitations. I am 30 years old almost 31 and have never had to deal with something like this and I am wondering if the handful of Cycles I have done are causing this. I've never taken Trend or anything crazy just a higher dose of test like 500 mg and a little anavar here and there and some eq. I need some words of encouragement please I'm freaking out over here lol

Punkrocker, I too have been in the same boat as you. Sounds to me like you are having anxiety attacks and the issue could be psychological.

Docs may want you to try some beta blockers short term.

I recommend meditation and no punk rock before 12pm.

You sound like you are in good hands brother

 

[Punkrocker]

I just wanna let all of you guys know that I really appreciate the fact the you take time out of your day to help ease my stress and answer my questions and show concern. I really love you guys and you have no idea how much you guys are helping me keep my sanity. Thank you so much!

 

[FRITZBLITZ]

I just wanna let all of you guys know that I really appreciate the fact the you take time out of your day to help ease my stress and answer my questions and show concern. I really love you guys and you have no idea how much you guys are helping me keep my sanity. Thank you so much!

I tried to throw my 2 cents in but Big Upps to NAC man he really addressed the issue from all angles. I know this will get worked out but do hope you feel better ASAP. I'm sure you probably already know this but avoid all stimulants. I'm not sure that was covered.

 

[Punkrocker]

I tried to throw my 2 cents in but Big Upps to NAC man he really addressed the issue from all angles. I know this will get worked out but do hope you feel better ASAP. I'm sure you probably already know this but avoid all stimulants. I'm not sure that was covered.

Yeah I've definitely chilled out with the caffiene and have been taking magnesium and l-theanine for stress and drinking alot of water. My echo cardiogram is next week.

 

[FRITZBLITZ]

Yeah I've definitely chilled out with the caffiene and have been taking magnesium and l-theanine for stress and drinking alot of water. My echo cardiogram is next week.

Like NAC said you'll be getting the best care possible, but be prepared for your cardiogram to come back normal and even though this feels like it's life threatening it may be just that; a feeling that comes a goes. Another trick that kinda goes along with box breathing or raising your heart rate to normalize it is if the palpatations seem very deep and hard try flexing every muscle in your body at once for 10 seconds. It's so hard to do it not only physacally helps but mentally focuses your mind on the flex

 

[celc5]

I was gonna ask if you took ZMA when someone mentioned dreams. The magnesium causes nightmates and anxiety for me.

When I've done some quick searches, most people who have side effects from magnesium are taking it at higher dosages. But I can't take it all. I wonder if magnesium may be contributing to mini panic attacks?

 

[FRITZBLITZ]

I was gonna ask if you took ZMA when someone mentioned dreams. The magnesium causes nightmates and anxiety for me.

When I've done some quick searches, most people who have side effects from magnesium are taking it at higher dosages. But I can't take it all. I wonder if magnesium may be contributing to mini panic attacks?

I don't have magnesium dreams but PTSD nighmares and I have to throw back a Clonapin almost every morning the second I wake. That's how much dreams can affect your chemestry.

 

[dondon]

Try checking iodine levels, I bought kelp drops and it literally gave me the best clarity I've felt since I was a teen. We're so deficienct in this trace mineral and it's hardly ever tested. I also bought trace minerals concentrace, I add 40 drops to a gallon of distilled water and that has made major improvements in my overall health. Sometimes it's the little things we take for granted. You can simply be missing vital minerals and that's what it sounds like to me, irregular heart rhythms are mostly always mineral deficiencies and that's another thing we don't get enough of because our soil is depleted and our water sucks. 60% of the human body is water. Hope this helps.

 

[Punkrocker]

Try checking iodine levels, I bought kelp drops and it literally gave me the best clarity I've felt since I was a teen. We're so deficienct in this trace mineral and it's hardly ever tested. I also bought trace minerals concentrace, I add 40 drops to a gallon of distilled water and that has made major improvements in my overall health. Sometimes it's the little things we take for granted. You can simply be missing vital minerals and that's what it sounds like to me, irregular heart rhythms are mostly always mineral deficiencies and that's another thing we don't get enough of because our soil is depleted and our water sucks. 60% of the human body is water. Hope this helps.

Wow fantastic! I never would have thought of that. Thank you

 

[Punkrocker]

Alright boys I'm back! Don't know why it took me this long to respond....my echocardiogram came back normal so structurally my heart is normal. I still get these damn palpitations though. They don't freak me out as much but I do hate them. Since I work as a trash man, I pretty much have an opportunity to do cardio whenever I want so yesterday I started charging down the road and flinging barrels super fast HIIT style and I felt a hard thump in my chest(palpitation) which made me mad so I kept running harder lol. I'm still here but these things piss me off. Summer is around the corner and I wanna do a cycle. Something light like anavar and EQ or upping the test with anavar. I'm scared a cycle will make my palpitations go into hyperdrive. What do you guys think?

 

[Jobu777]

If you are taking in a lot of caffeine that will exacerbate PVCs. A lot of people have success taking daily magnesium supplements. Everyone has them at some point, some can feel them and some have that fish flopping in the chest feeling.

 

[Cgkone]

Try checking iodine levels, I bought kelp drops and it literally gave me the best clarity I've felt since I was a teen. We're so deficienct in this trace mineral and it's hardly ever tested. I also bought trace minerals concentrace, I add 40 drops to a gallon of distilled water and that has made major improvements in my overall health. Sometimes it's the little things we take for granted. You can simply be missing vital minerals and that's what it sounds like to me, irregular heart rhythms are mostly always mineral deficiencies and that's another thing we don't get enough of because our soil is depleted and our water sucks. 60% of the human body is water. Hope this helps.

Cancer rate increases and the government cracking down on iodine go hand in hand.
At least that's what the lady at the health food shop says