Should I TRT

[officefat]

Regular Doc says i don't need it. Local "Men's Clinic" says I'm a good candidate.

33, 180lbs, 5'10" roughly 16% bodyfat, Hypothyroid treated w/ 150mg ED levothyroxine

SBHG: 31
Test Serum: 310 ng/dl in clinic test & 399 ng/dl Lab test
LH: 3.2 mIU/ml
Estradoil: 29.2 pg/nl
RBC: 4.8 x10e6/uL
Hemoglobin: 15 g/dl
Hematocrit: 44%

He noted in hand writing free test was 7.58 but not sure where that came from.
Last year my Test Serum was 650 ng/dl & Free Test 17 (at my physicians office).

Men's Clinic perscription:
weeks 1-2: 200mg/wk Test Cyp, .5mg x2/wk Anastrozole
weeks 2-6: 200mg/wk Test Cyp, .5mg x2/wk Anastrozole, 500IU x2/wk HCG
Due for Labs on week 7 in May.

I literally felt libido sky rocket from nothing in the first couple weeks, stronger erections (full staff instead of 3/4 mass), morning wood again every day, every week my lifts are getting better (185x8 to 205x10)... Its seriously awesome, but I still not sure if I want to TRT all my life. I thought maybe I'd cruis for 6 weeks to the next test, then blast for 8 weeks and PCT but now I feel like I might be a solid candidate given recent changes. My numbers seem low to average from what I've read, but not awful. Just hoping to hear experiences of others. What do you think?

 

[officefat]

 

[kisaj]

This is why I ****ing hate clinics.

 

[officefat]

This is why I ****ing hate clinics.

So you think it's BS on the clinic?

 

[kisaj]

Money is all they care about and had no reason to throw you on TRT.

 

[The Matrix]

You get these numbers easily into the 500's when you correct other factors. Secret to getting testosterone up is to find out why its low in the first place. You raise it indirectly not directly is the key. With the process we have being developing guys with secondary hypgonadism should be able to hit 500-700 square wave while keep e2 in check. Still needs further research but few guys are achieveing this.

 

[jcam222]

200 mg of Test Cyp a week is NOT legit TRT, its a dr writing a low dose cycle for you. I am not being judgemental as I have done plenty of cycles and well beyond that dosing lol, just being honest with you from a medical perspective.

 

[kisaj]

But it sure makes the customer come back sooner to spend more money. **** your health, this is about profits.

 

[officefat]

I've seen your post around all the TRT threads. Your suggestion is to find a competent endo that is well versed in male hormone therapy, natty sups, or...?

 

[officefat]

200 mg of Test Cyp a week is NOT legit TRT, its a dr writing a low dose cycle for you. I am not being judgemental as I have done plenty of cycles and well beyond that dosing lol, just being honest with you from a medical perspective.

I've been digging around the forums and 200mg/wk T cyp is pretty common from what I'm seeing. there's a lot of folks saying exactly 200mg. If its just a clinic writting me a script for a low dose cycle, I'm cool with that and would treat it as such and PCT off rather but I feel way ****ing better man. like.... the old me.

You get these numbers easily into the 500's when you correct other factors. Secret to getting testosterone up is to find out why its low in the first place. You raise it indirectly not directly is the key. With the process we have being developing guys with secondary hypgonadism should be able to hit 500-700 square wave while keep e2 in check. Still needs further research but few guys are achieveing this.

All my low t "symptoms" are gone now, week 6, but still struggling w/ the idea of using this clinic. What is your suggestion? Find a competent Endo, natty sups (I've tried w/ some short term success), or ???

 

[kisaj]

I've seen your post around all the TRT threads. Your suggestion is to find a competent endo that is well versed in male hormone therapy, natty sups, or...?

You want a competent endo. And a competent endo will laugh at the notion of 200 mg a week for TRT.

 

[The Matrix]

Are these clinics addressing the issue or masking the problem?. I see more often they are masking the problem.

 

[sammpedd88]

I've been digging around the forums and 200mg/wk T cyp is pretty common from what I'm seeing. there's a lot of folks saying exactly 200mg. If its just a clinic writting me a script for a low dose cycle, I'm cool with that and would treat it as such and PCT off rather but I feel way ****ing better man. like.... the old me.



All my low t "symptoms" are gone now, week 6, but still struggling w/ the idea of using this clinic. What is your suggestion? Find a competent Endo, natty sups (I've tried w/ some short term success), or ???

Don't know what posts you're reading but 200 mgs is not a common dose at all, especially a starting dose. Don't fool yourself. More is not better in the TRT world.

 

[kisaj]

Often I think it is finding what you want to read.

 

[kenpoengineer]

Dose is dependent on the person and all that goes with that (ie body weight, metabolism, endocrine system, etc). The only way to determine dosage is by trial and error. Start at a lower dose, say 50 mg every 3.5 days, get bloodwork and increase or decrease as necessary. The bloodwork is the feedback you need.

 

[sammpedd88]

I second what kenpoengineer said. More is not better. Don't get caught up in wanting high levels. You have to find what works for you and like it's been said before starting with 200mgs is not a starting point. It's way too high to start with. 100 msg is a great, and pretty much a standard starting point. Going over 100mgs causes issues such as increased E2, high RBC and hematocrit to name a few. Use 50 mgs every 3.5 days for three months, then have a complete lab work up done. Make sure you do the lab work on the day you are supposed to inject, but have the blood drawn before you inject. You should also have your labs done as early in the morning as possible for a accurate test results. You've asked for advice, now the ball is in your court. We don't want to see you fail. We are here to help you and give what advice we can.

 

[Todd Garner]

I can't picture taking 200mgs, I've been on 75mgs per week for about 6 weeks and between shots I was at 770 Total T. Thats up from two test showing 101 and 153 total T. Also on 1 mg of Anastrozole once per week.

 

[officefat]

I've had a pretty hard labido crash this week after dropping to 100mg. Curious to see where I was at last wed when I get my labs back.

 

[darkblue1]

If you are doing good and feeling good why do you want to go for TRT. Enjoy life without TRT

Regular Doc says i don't need it. Local "Men's Clinic" says I'm a good candidate.

33, 180lbs, 5'10" roughly 16% bodyfat, Hypothyroid treated w/ 150mg ED levothyroxine

SBHG: 31
Test Serum: 310 ng/dl in clinic test & 399 ng/dl Lab test
LH: 3.2 mIU/ml
Estradoil: 29.2 pg/nl
RBC: 4.8 x10e6/uL
Hemoglobin: 15 g/dl
Hematocrit: 44%

He noted in hand writing free test was 7.58 but not sure where that came from.
Last year my Test Serum was 650 ng/dl & Free Test 17 (at my physicians office).

Men's Clinic perscription:
weeks 1-2: 200mg/wk Test Cyp, .5mg x2/wk Anastrozole
weeks 2-6: 200mg/wk Test Cyp, .5mg x2/wk Anastrozole, 500IU x2/wk HCG
Due for Labs on week 7 in May.

I literally felt libido sky rocket from nothing in the first couple weeks, stronger erections (full staff instead of 3/4 mass), morning wood again every day, every week my lifts are getting better (185x8 to 205x10)... Its seriously awesome, but I still not sure if I want to TRT all my life. I thought maybe I'd cruis for 6 weeks to the next test, then blast for 8 weeks and PCT but now I feel like I might be a solid candidate given recent changes. My numbers seem low to average from what I've read, but not awful. Just hoping to hear experiences of others. What do you think?

 

[officefat]

I wasn't feeling good. I had no labido, I would loose an erection as soon as stimulation stopped and I was only putting out because I know the girlfriend has needs .I was tired all the time, and I easily piled on body fat on what should be a caloric deficit (1200-1500 cals). I put on about 12lbs of fat in the last year. Since I started TRT, labido is solid, fatigue better, not feeling down like "what's the ****in point" anymore and I'm back up to 2000 cals without any fat gain. Pretty sure I've lost a few pounds of fat.

It definitely helps but reading some of the posts here got me thinking about alternatives.

 

[sammpedd88]

If you are doing good and feeling good why do you want to go for TRT. Enjoy life without TRT

He wasn't feeling good. His test levels were low. That's why he started TRT in the first place but is on a crappy protocol. I agree people need to find out why their test is low but some guys have to be on TRT. It's not a choice is a fact that to have a normal life these guys will need TRT.

 

[officefat]

Got my 6th week labs back

baseline => TRT Results
Test Serum: 399 => 826 ng/dl
Estradoil: 29.2 => 37.3 pg/n
Hematocrit: 44% => 47.8%

New Prescribed Protocol
0.75mg x2/wk Anastrozole
110mg x2/wk Test Cype
500IU x2/wk HCG (2 months on, 1 month off)

weeks 1-5, I was pinning 200mg test cyp and in week 6 I only did 100mg T-cyp. Blood for the above lab was taken exactly 7 days after the 100mg shot in week 7.

Last week (week 7) I tried to stick to 100mg for the 2nd week in a row but felt down and libido was suffering. I decided to do another 100mg T-cyp during the weekend and still don't feel back to were I was in weeks 3-5.

Need to schedule a visit w/ the endo still.

 

[Todd Garner]

Am I seeing this right? You came in at 826 total T after only pinning 100mg Test Cyp and then your doc doubled the dose? Going to guess Im looking at it wrong.

 

[officefat]

He added 20mg because I told him I wanted to pin twice a week and was feeling a pretty big roller coaster between shots. Technically, first shot is 100mg and 3 days later 120mg.

I didn't mention that I cut the dose in half the week before the lab because, well... I wanted extra to cruise and blast. I didn't expect to feel like garbage on 100mg/wk.

 

[kisaj]

You have got to quit playing around. You need to stabilize and let things settle into place or you will forever be chasing things, and keeping secrets about dosing is only going to compound the situation.

 

[sammpedd88]

You have got to quit playing around. You need to stabilize and let things settle into place or you will forever be chasing things, and keeping secrets about dosing is only going to compound the situation.

Couldn't be said better!!

 

[napalm]

You have got to quit playing around. You need to stabilize and let things settle into place or you will forever be chasing things, and keeping secrets about dosing is only going to compound the situation.

This, stop chasing numbers. You'll drive yourself nuts.

And 826 seems a little low for 100 of cyp.

100 puts me well over 1000. How many days post injection were your labs drawn?

 

[officefat]

This, stop chasing numbers. You'll drive yourself nuts.

And 826 seems a little low for 100 of cyp.

100 puts me well over 1000. How many days post injection were your labs drawn?

7 days after the 100mg injection.

 

[napalm]

7 days after the 100mg injection.

Ok, that makes sense then. That's a pretty high trough dude. You must have been 1200-1300 at your peak. I felt like total a.ss at those levels. My sweet spot is 700-800.

 

[darkblue1]

He wasn't feeling good. His test levels were low. That's why he started TRT in the first place but is on a crappy protocol. I agree people need to find out why their test is low but some guys have to be on TRT. It's not a choice is a fact that to have a normal life these guys will need TRT.

In olden days we did not have any TRT. How did they survive? these TRT products are all to make more money. Marketing strategies. Nothing else. Is it heart failure or what to have life long TRT?
I was on TRT for 2-3 months and then stopped it. Doctor also told me its up to you.Though my TRT levels were less, he said you can be on TRT or not its your choice.He did not recommend it though.Now I am perfectly fine after stopping it . It has been 6 years I stopped using it.

 

[officefat]

Just wanted to follow up. Obviously the clinic was there to sell a prescription and not treat the person. I ran the dosage a little hot (330mg/wk) for 12 weeks and PCT'd w/ HCG and Clomid. Just got my numbers back from week 6 post cycle, 2 weeks after stopping clomid, and my T was 1119 on the Lab Corp range of 300-1200. That is up significantly from March (399). It's actually higher than when I was running 200mg/wk of test (826).

For anyone out there debating TRT, I just want to recommend that you try clomid or HCG & Clomid before going full blown TRT. Also note that I was suppressed for 6 months and made a recovery, albiet my e2 is through the roof @ 56. I'll start taking Anastrozole again and should have ran it through PCT in hindsight.

TRT/Cycle
HCG 500IU x2 per wk week 1-8
Anastrozole 05.mg x2 per week 1-12
Test-cyp 200mg week 1-12

HCG 250IU x2 per wk 12-19
Anastrozole 075.mg x2 per week 12-24
Test-cyp 330mg week 12-24

PCT
I ran HCG 1000IU on first shot and then 250IU EOD week 24, 25, 26
Week 27, I started 50mg clomid daily and ran for 30 days

Hope that's helpful to someone debating TRT

 

[Bodiebuilders]

Thats good things to hear .
And the way you feel is better now then with trt?

 

[sammpedd88]

In olden days we did not have any TRT. How did they survive? these TRT products are all to make more money. Marketing strategies. Nothing else. Is it heart failure or what to have life long TRT?
I was on TRT for 2-3 months and then stopped it. Doctor also told me its up to you.Though my TRT levels were less, he said you can be on TRT or not its your choice.He did not recommend it though.Now I am perfectly fine after stopping it . It has been 6 years I stopped using it.

How did they survive? Most didn't. Low T is linked with several illnesses, the most common is heart disease. If you were on TRT then stopped and are fine, well you didn't need it to start with.

 

[officefat]

I feel pretty good. libido is a little weak compared to TRT but still getting morning wood most days and libido is much better than March. I'm hoping that bringing the estrogen down will bring up the libido. I'm pretty happy to find out clomid is an optional alternative to TRT. @ 1100+ 2 weeks after stopping clomid, I'm thinking I may not need a small daily dose but time will tell.

 

[officefat]

I've been taking an AI for 2 weeks now and my T leveled off to 800 and my e2 has come down to 25. These were the goals of TRT! Pretty happy

 

[sammpedd88]

I've been taking an AI for 2 weeks now and my T leveled off to 800 and my e2 has come down to 25. These were the goals of TRT! Pretty happy

That's awesome! Stick to your current protocol for a while. You begin to tweak it if needed such as adding DHEA, pregnenolone, and vitamin D. Get your levels tested first before you start taking any of these. Good luck and keep us posted!

 

[kisaj]

I've been taking an AI for 2 weeks now and my T leveled off to 800 and my e2 has come down to 25. These were the goals of TRT! Pretty happy

Nice. Pretty much perfect from a number standpoint.